The Conte Thread

[Panic 57]

7 hours ago, The Skipper said:

Batshuayi is much more of an outlet than Willian. It was just a massive mistake from Conte who doesn’t really like Batshuayi to begin with. He read the game in completely the wrong manner. Willian is dead in the final third. 

I agree. I was both disappointed and confused by the switch, but my post was more about addressing the fact that decision making isn't as clear cut as people make it out. Batshuayi may be more of an outlet than Willian, but for a CF his hold up play is atrocious. You can play Bats and hope for the best, or you can try a different plan.  The manager takes most of the responsibility for today's result, but this isn't the end and I hope people don't express some of the nasty sentiments as they have done in previous losses under Conte. Today was a poor result, but this club can turn it around.

[Styles 9,790]

Outplayed and embarrassed at home in front of the world. So many players looked completely out of their depth and the same goes for Conte too. He was utterly clueless and worst of all, he didn't even try to stop the bleeding.

Honestly, I'm glad the club were reminded of the reality of this team and how far off we are from the elite European clubs. Change only comes when things like this happen. If we won 1-0 we'd hear bullshit about another classic smash and grab which only sets us up for failure in the long run.

[Leif 6,006]

I think it's as simple as bench options.

If you have a solid 2nd-striker to bring off the bench, you feel no worry in putting him on early in the game as Morata comes off. But Bats has shown he isn't full-game in the Premier League material. He's an out of depth option for this. So we reshuffled into a lineup that i'm unsure if we've used before, because there's no other striker in our whole damn squad that the coach likes, and that new lineup was with another out of depth player coming into the conversation, Willian. 

I think only 1 of the bench options was good enough to be in our squad, if we want to be better than we've been, and that's Zappacosta. 

Le board.

[Blusan Alamb 295]

 

[Styles 9,790]

11 minutes ago, Leif said:

I think it's as simple as bench options.

If you have a solid 2nd-striker to bring off the bench, you feel no worry in putting him on early in the game as Morata comes off. But Bats has shown he isn't full-game in the Premier League material. He's an out of depth option for this. So we reshuffled into a lineup that i'm unsure if we've used before, because there's no other striker in our whole damn squad that the coach likes, and that new lineup was with another out of depth player coming into the conversation, Willian. 

I think only 1 of the bench options was good enough to be in our squad, if we want to be better than we've been, and that's Zappacosta. 

Le board.

It's not that simple.

You're completely ignoring the fact that one team played like they have been coached to death and have had a style of play ingrained into them. Meanwhile, the other team looked like a bunch of semi-pros with no idea how to even retain possession for more than 5 passes.

It's a lot deeper than just bench options.

Batshuayi is genuinely terrible by the way. He's a midtable player at best and shouldn't be anywhere near a top European club. I'm not going to kill Conte for not bringing him on, as bad as Willian is I can at least understand the reasoning behind it. It's just a shame Willian produced yet another tragic performance.

[Jase 43,479]

2 hours ago, Blusan Alamb said:

 

One bad result and of course Duncan Castles comes out with BS.

[Jase 43,479]

8 hours ago, Reddish-Blue said:

It's a shame about Llorente, would have been perfect backup for Morata.

Now we're stuck with Michy, who is a decent player but he seems to care more about Twitter than actually improving himself. 

Gotta wonder what Conte makes of Batshuayi's Twitter shenanigans.

[Ledg 643]

The only thing I'm worried atm with him, is that he show stubbornness early into the season, like last year.

It took a couple of bad results for him to change things up, so I hope this time around he'll react faster.

[petre.ispirescu 4,928]

Listen, I think the worst thing about modern football is primarily the lack of respect that fans show towards opposition, making them into missing certain aspects about the football game and think their team is entitled to every trophy.

I'm reading all the comments and once again I feel exactly the same like I was feeling after the Arsenal match when everybody thought Arsenal would come here and get thumped.

Fans (all over the world) nowadays can't see past their own teams and this is wrong. 

We've played Atletico twice under Mourinho and both times it was a complete shitshow. Remember Diego Simeone at that point - he was definitely the most defensive manager in this whole world, but it did not matter for Mourinho. We went to Madrid, played with 5 at the back and had no chance to score and then we came back to London and Mourinho played with six defenders! (Cole, JT, Cahill, Ivanovic, David Luiz, Azpilicueta) and got humiliated by Atletico.

Now a few days back we go to Madrid again and completely dominate Atletico. So Conte has showed us that this team can play attacking football and will do so.

But my point is and this is what I want to emphasize - as much as all the fans hate him and judge him by his last (trophyless) season, Pep Guardiola is a once in a generation manager. 

Is he better than Conte when it comes to defending drills? I don't think so. But is he better in the other half of the pitch? Definitely. And for me the best attacking manager in the world. 

This guy has had a difficult first season, but now he's built a squad to play his way. Chelsea do not have the personnel to beat a Guardiola team at his own game, this is why Conte has chosen to sit back and try to hit on the counter.

This is what Guardiola does - presses high up the pitch, plays with a lot of energy, two passes tops, lots of interchanging and freedom in the last third.

We simply do not have technically gifted players like City does, nor a similar playing style. For me it is no shame we have lost against this City side.

 

 

[It's too big 625]

3 minutes ago, petre.ispirescu said:

Listen, I think the worst thing about modern football is primarily the lack of respect that fans show towards opposition, making them into missing certain aspects about the football game.

I'm reading all the comments and once again I feel exactly the same like I was feeling after the Arsenal match when everybody thought Arsenal would come here and get thumped.

Fans (all over the world) nowadays can't see past their own teams and this is wrong. 

We've played Atletico twice under Mourinho and both times it was a complete shitshow. Remember Diego Simeone at that point - he was definitely the most defensive manager in this whole world, but it did not matter for Mourinho. We went to Madrid, played with 5 at the back and had no chance to score and then we came back to London and Mourinho played with six defenders! (Cole, JT, Cahill, Ivanovic, David Luiz, Azpilicueta) and got humiliated by Atletico.

Now a few days back we go to Madrid again and completely dominate Atletico. So Conte has showed us that this team can play attacking football and will do so.

But my point is and this is what I want to emphasize - as much as all the fans hate him and judge him by his last (trophyless) season, Pep Guardiola is a once in a generation manager. 

Is he better than Conte when it comes to defending drills? I don't think so. But is he better in the other half of the pitch? Definitely. And for me the best attacking manager in the world. 

This guy has had a difficult first season, but now he's built a squad to play his way. Chelsea do not have the personnel to beat a Guardiola team at his own game, this is why Conte has chosen to sit back and try to hit on the counter.

This is what Guardiola does - presses high up the pitch, plays with a lot of energy, two passes tops, lots of interchanging and freedom in the last third.

We simply do not have technically gifted players like City does, nor a similar playing style. For me it is no shame we have lost against this City side.

 

 

I think it's the fact that side isn't filled with elite players/world class players all over the pitch that it fools people into a false sense of security. Pep has them players working well and has improved players like Delph, Stones, Walker even. He knows their strengths and weaknesses and used them to the best of their ability. Delph being used where he was yesterday wasn't due to lack of options on City's part as they could have used one other, but it was deliberate from Pep because he knows Delph's strengths and trusts him to follow the tactics - the same with Walker. However, one positive to take away is even though they could have scored, our defending was top notch for the most part and City only scored through a well placed shot outside the box from KDB, so the positve is we can take away is the defence didn't crumble under any pressure from City despite being under some during the game. 

[AlesJuve 264]

For me Chelsea still has great chances of winning the PL. You have had a very difficult calender in this season's start compared to MU and City. Conte was clear in his analysis.

‘On this issue I have already spoken and to repeat the same opinion is not good. We don’t want to use it as an excuse. To play another massive game two days later you must consider the fatigue in the legs of your players, and it’s impossible to press box to box because after 30 minutes you have no energy.

‘It’s normal when you play three massive games in seven days you must consider this aspect but we needed to take the risk because Morata, for us, is a very important player.’

‘When you play against the type of team who likes to have possession, you have to consider two tactical aspects. You go very high, press and play with great intensity for the whole game, or you must be disciplined to close the space and exploit space in behind their defenders.

‘I think we have to look at ourselves and try to put everything into every game. We did that today. Damage or no damage, we have to go game by game, do our best and then we’ll see at the end of the season how we finish the league. When I see my players have given everything we must be pleased despite the bad result.

‘You have to consider that in seven games we’ve played Arsenal, Tottenham, Man City and Everton. Our start wasn’t so easy. I think we have the points we deserve.’

 

[petre.ispirescu 4,928]

1 hour ago, It's too big said:

I think it's the fact that side isn't filled with elite players/world class players all over the pitch that it fools people into a false sense of security. Pep has them players working well and has improved players like Delph, Stones, Walker even. He knows their strengths and weaknesses and used them to the best of their ability. Delph being used where he was yesterday wasn't due to lack of options on City's part as they could have used one other, but it was deliberate from Pep because he knows Delph's strengths and trusts him to follow the tactics - the same with Walker. However, one positive to take away is even though they could have scored, our defending was top notch for the most part and City only scored through a well placed shot outside the box from KDB, so the positve is we can take away is the defence didn't crumble under any pressure from City despite being under some during the game. 

Spot on mate and one thing I would like to add is that people these days draw conclusions way too early in the season. You win two in a row, hooray we're going to win the league. You lose one, nah we're not good enough, need to rethink everything.

It's like they never learn and it's like this every single season.

Last season at this exact moment Chelsea was losing 0-3 at the Emirates and was trailing City by eight points IIRC. And by the way City was demolating everything in front of them just like they do now. I'm not saying it is surely going to happen the same thing (Chelsea to come from behind and City to start dropping points all of a sudden), maybe City won't even lose a single game this season. But can anybody predict the future? Especially in the EPL? Everything is possible in this league. 

And let's not forget Chelsea have definitely had the worst schedule so far. And on top of that, prior to yesterday's match, Chelsea have played Atletico in Madrid and were coming after an emotional win. I'm not trying to find excuses, no way, although I don't think it would be wrong to talk about the two days rest in between these two massive games.

I mean - with an International break coming up, surely this match could have been moved on Monday night, or at least Sunday night. But Saturday? After finishing the game in Madrid close to midnight on Wednesday?... Whereas Liverpool play on Tuesday night and get to play late on Sunday afternoon...

Look at Real Madrid now - they are currently seven points behind Barcelona. A side led by Messi that could win every match in that two horse league. But nobody is talking about the league being finished already and other crap like we've seen on this forum.

For me the worst thing about the defeat against City is not the result. Or anything related to this game. It's the fact that I saw a lot of United fans taking the piss, some of them saying "can we write Chelsea off now?".

No you can't you fucking bellends. You've played no decent team so far and had the easiest schedule a team could dream of. I hate Liverpool and Spurs with a passion, but my God how I'd wish they beat the shit out of United in the next rounds.

[NiclasCFC 2,582]

2 hours ago, petre.ispirescu said:

Listen, I think the worst thing about modern football is primarily the lack of respect that fans show towards opposition, making them into missing certain aspects about the football game and think their team is entitled to every trophy.

I'm reading all the comments and once again I feel exactly the same like I was feeling after the Arsenal match when everybody thought Arsenal would come here and get thumped.

Fans (all over the world) nowadays can't see past their own teams and this is wrong. 

We've played Atletico twice under Mourinho and both times it was a complete shitshow. Remember Diego Simeone at that point - he was definitely the most defensive manager in this whole world, but it did not matter for Mourinho. We went to Madrid, played with 5 at the back and had no chance to score and then we came back to London and Mourinho played with six defenders! (Cole, JT, Cahill, Ivanovic, David Luiz, Azpilicueta) and got humiliated by Atletico.

Now a few days back we go to Madrid again and completely dominate Atletico. So Conte has showed us that this team can play attacking football and will do so.

But my point is and this is what I want to emphasize - as much as all the fans hate him and judge him by his last (trophyless) season, Pep Guardiola is a once in a generation manager. 

Is he better than Conte when it comes to defending drills? I don't think so. But is he better in the other half of the pitch? Definitely. And for me the best attacking manager in the world. 

This guy has had a difficult first season, but now he's built a squad to play his way. Chelsea do not have the personnel to beat a Guardiola team at his own game, this is why Conte has chosen to sit back and try to hit on the counter.

This is what Guardiola does - presses high up the pitch, plays with a lot of energy, two passes tops, lots of interchanging and freedom in the last third.

We simply do not have technically gifted players like City does, nor a similar playing style. For me it is no shame we have lost against this City side.

 

 

 

24 minutes ago, petre.ispirescu said:

Spot on mate and one thing I would like to add is that people these days draw conclusions way too early in the season. You win two in a row, hooray we're going to win the league. You lose one, nah we're not good enough, need to rethink everything.

It's like they never learn and it's like this every single season.

Last season at this exact moment Chelsea was losing 0-3 at the Emirates and was trailing City by eight points IIRC. And by the way City was demolating everything in front of them just like they do now. I'm not saying it is surely going to happen the same thing (Chelsea to come from behind and City to start dropping points all of a sudden), maybe City won't even lose a single game this season. But can anybody predict the future? Especially in the EPL? Everything is possible in this league. 

And let's not forget Chelsea have definitely had the worst schedule so far. And on top of that, prior to yesterday's match, Chelsea have played Atletico in Madrid and were coming after an emotional win. I'm not trying to find excuses, no way, although I don't think it would be wrong to talk about the two days rest in between these two massive games.

I mean - with an International break coming up, surely this match could have been moved on Monday night, or at least Sunday night. But Saturday? After finishing the game in Madrid close to midnight on Wednesday?... Whereas Liverpool play on Tuesday night and get to play late on Sunday afternoon...

Look at Real Madrid now - they are currently seven points behind Barcelona. A side led by Messi that could win every match in that two horse league. But nobody is talking about the league being finished already and other crap like we've seen on this forum.

For me the worst thing about the defeat against City is not the result. Or anything related to this game. It's the fact that I saw a lot of United fans taking the piss, some of them saying "can we write Chelsea off now?".

No you can't you fucking bellends. You've played no decent team so far and had the easiest schedule a team could dream of. I hate Liverpool and Spurs with a passion, but my God how I'd wish they beat the shit out of United in the next rounds.

Spot on as usual mate, best poster on TC by a mile.

[manpe 10,861]

39 minutes ago, petre.ispirescu said:

It's like they never learn and it's like this every single season.

Last season at this exact moment Chelsea was losing 0-3 at the Emirates and was trailing City by eight points IIRC. And by the way City was demolating everything in front of them just like they do now. I'm not saying it is surely going to happen the same thing (Chelsea to come from behind and City to start dropping points all of a sudden), maybe City won't even lose a single game this season. But can anybody predict the future? Especially in the EPL? Everything is possible in this league. 

Spot on. This post should be quoted every time we lose a game and get tons of overreactions. We have looked good this season and played well, then we get one bad result after the conditions are firmly stacked against us and all of a sudden we are piss poor and Conte is clueless. I predict that as we get a chunk of tough games aside in early season, we'll be cruising later and heaping tons of pressure on Manchester who will lose form eventually like they always do. I think we have what it takes to make a genuine push to retain the title.

[Fernando 6,585]

1 hour ago, manpe said:

Spot on. This post should be quoted every time we lose a game and get tons of overreactions. We have looked good this season and played well, then we get one bad result after the conditions are firmly stacked against us and all of a sudden we are piss poor and Conte is clueless. I predict that as we get a chunk of tough games aside in early season, we'll be cruising later and heaping tons of pressure on Manchester who will lose form eventually like they always do. I think we have what it takes to make a genuine push to retain the title.

Agreed too many knee jerk reaction people that just never learn. 

Like the title is going to be won by October.....

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

Conte got it right tactically and personnel wise against Atletico but got it wrong against City. Swapping Azpi for Moses was odd and sent out a message. Also we definitely need another CF, if Conte is willing to sub on Willian instead of Batshuayi at like 30 odd minutes, it says it all, Batshuayi isn't trusted by Conte. I don't think the schedule helps but we turned up against Atletico and played fantastically, I don't think Man City are that much better than Atletico, albeit different styles, so it was disappointing to lose and not to have created many chances.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

1 hour ago, manpe said:

Spot on. This post should be quoted every time we lose a game and get tons of overreactions. We have looked good this season and played well, then we get one bad result after the conditions are firmly stacked against us and all of a sudden we are piss poor and Conte is clueless. I predict that as we get a chunk of tough games aside in early season, we'll be cruising later and heaping tons of pressure on Manchester who will lose form eventually like they always do. I think we have what it takes to make a genuine push to retain the title.

Absolutely agree. 

But it comes down to the point I couldnt care less about result at the moment. Its also about the way we play. This is what bothers me. We might have lost to atletico, I would applaud players for that match. 

On the other hand, city one was big clusterfuck of everything wrong. Even if we won with fluke goal, I simply dont accept being so weak at home. We allowed them to play their way from get go. Hell even shakhtar and liverpool (before Mane's red card) put in more fight and desire to win. 

I would accept this since it was two days after atletico game, but hey we played same against fcking Arsenal at stamford bridge. Its kindoff embarassing to go into game with such low mentality. 

There is no excuse to play fluid football against good teams in PL. Only two matches I would accept going all defensive are city and spurs away. Every other game, we should play our own way and try to control the game. Possesion, I couldnt care less if city had 70%. Its what we do with those 30. On saturday, we had no plan, no attack, no movement, no idea, no desire. And it was at HOME when the mentality should be sky high after atletico win. But instead we reverted back to defend all game style. Let city run riot on our stadium. 

And dont think for second last season was any different, we were outplayed twice by both spurs and city. Yeah we managed to win three times, but as I said, that only pays when you actualy win. If we hadnt, everyone would agree we got completely outplayed.

Its not realy about our players. They are more than capable of controling the games, but its something else. The mentality has changed within the squad and its been a while for most of players to automaticaly play this way and hope for the best. 

Cant remember how many games have been in past three years when (most) players genuinely could give shit in certain games.

Aside from results, I hope we will one day actualy PLAY against top teams. Thats why atletico game was so enjojable. Not the result. We actualy coped against top top team, that didnt happen in years now.

[Jase 43,479]

1 hour ago, BlueLyon said:

On the other hand, city one was big clusterfuck of everything wrong. Even if we won with fluke goal, I simply dont accept being so weak at home. We allowed them to play their way from get go. Hell even shakhtar and liverpool (before Mane's red card) put in more fight and desire to win. 

I would accept this since it was two days after atletico game, but hey we played same against fcking Arsenal at stamford bridge. Its kindoff embarassing to go into game with such low mentality. 

When on earth did we play the same way against Arsenal like we did at the weekend? Yes, we were passive and negative against City but against Arsenal, we certainly tried to take more initiative. But the main issue was, we came up against an inspired Arsenal (can't believe that actually happened) and we just couldn't break them down. We didn't play well enough to win on that day and we were by no means negative against Arsenal like we were against City.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

50 minutes ago, Jason said:

When on earth did we play the same way against Arsenal like we did at the weekend? Yes, we were passive and negative against City but against Arsenal, we certainly tried to take more initiative. But the main issue was, we came up against an inspired Arsenal (can't believe that actually happened) and we just couldn't break them down. We didn't play well enough to win on that day and we were by no means negative against Arsenal like we were against City.

They were pressing us well and we had problems with that. Obviously we didnt play as negative as against city, but neither was there big desire to win that game. We only put real pressure on them in later stages, but then Luiz got that red card and that was it. It was game at SB and we should have them in full control, but they were as close to winning that game as we did. It wasnt as bad as city, but we could have done much more to win the game, it was realistic to take 3 points. Games like these will decide if we will fight for title.

Never mind we had 3 games without win against them. certainly that one wasnt one-off. We struggle more against them than we did before and the whole point is that we should be improving every season. We didnt have problems except for odd game against them for few years now. But now they started to press us more and we seem unable to handle that.

We have players very capable of playing offensive and attractive football. Against Atletico, I was inspired that Conte made subs indicating we want to win that game. Away at one of best teams in europe. Thats the kind of phylosophy you want. And it paid off. Only to see it all blow to city.

Anyway the season is long. Im curious how we play against spurs, liverpool, city and united.

[Strike 7,489]

On 10/1/2017 at 0:15 AM, Jason said:

How has he not managed the squad better? He hasn't played the same XI for every game, has he? The main issue is our squad lacks quality, like proper genuine quality and Conte chopping and changing the XI is not going to hide that. You look at our strikeforce - take Morata off and we're left with Batshuayi. The attacking players of Hazard, Willian, Pedro hardly scream world class as a whole. Then we have average WBs and somewhat dodgy midfielders, especially when going forward.

Between Atleti on Wednesday and City on Saturday, who were pressing high and energetically, wouldn't you think Pedro or Willian who played little or no part in Spain, should start here?  

Also, when Morata was substituted for Willian, it was too tentative, almost negative for me. I know Batshuayi isn't everyone's good idea of a super sub but he is the best we have right now and bringing Willian on was a sign that Chelsea were there to contain City.

At Atleti, the players on the pitch ran their socks off and that showed on Saturday.