Isco

[Rmpr 8,977]

The one thing that I really hate about that post is when he said we don't want another AM only because we already have plenty.

Believe me if we can get Messi instead of isco, I will say I don't give a damn if we have 8 AM, get him

Yeah, but Messi is one of a kind, definetly not Isco.

[communicate 2,703]

Yeah, but Messi is one of a kind, definetly not Isco.

Lol ya, like I said in a post a few page back. The only reason that you should consider getting another player in packed position is when you can get a huge upgrade in that position.

Like what SAF did when he bought RVP, clearly he is a huge upgrade over welbeck even though in the long term this actually can benefit us because it hinder welbeck development. I thought welbeck partnership with rooney was outstanding last year

[kellzfresh 7,229]

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

Leif said it perfectly. We should get him or someone of his quality. We are not overloaded with AM's at all. Marin is...well, I think he confuses himself. At this club he'll never be anything more than a wide player. Get this guy in instead of Taison.

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

Stats can be a little misleading at times. I'm not going to wax lyrical about how great he is as I haven't seen enough of his games to make a full judgement. But I have seen his games in the UCL and he was by far the stand out performer, every match. From what I've seen, he reminds me of a hybrid between Messi and Iniesta. Fantastic dribbling ability and incredible control. I haven't seen him much in the league, but it seems he hasn't performed to the same level.

As I said, the stats you mentioned can be misleading. If I was to tell you another player in Spain averages only 1.4 key passes per game and is dispossessed 2.7 times per game (Isco 2.8 times), would you know who I'm talking about? Lionel Messi. If I was also to tell you another player averages only 1.8 key passes per game and is dispossessed 2 times per game, would you know who I'm talking about? Andres Iniesta. Don't get me wrong, I agree that his shooting can be wasteful, but his decision making will improve with age. I'm sure if Isco was playing with better players (No disrespect to Malaga's players), he would perform better. After all, Malaga's top goalscorer has only hit 5 goals this term, and after Messi there is a host of Barca players on 5 goals. It's easy to look at the assist count and say that the player isn't doing what he's supposed to be there for.

I honestly think all this talk of where he would play would be irrelevant if Guardiola and Isco were to come to Chelsea. If Pep were to use the same blueprint he used at Barca I wouldn't be surprised if Isco is used how Messi is at Barca.

I agree that stats can be misleading, but they do have some value. Yes, Iniesta and Messi only have slightly more key passes per game than Isco, but Iniesta has 11 assists and Messi has 27 goals and 6 assists. Isco has 4 goals and 1 assist. The problem I have with him statistically, is that he's not even close to being one of the better players on Malaga. Whoscored.com has him as their 9th best player. You say that Isco's stats are poor because of the team he plays on, well Joaquin plays on the same squad , also as an attacking midfielder and has been much better. (4 goals, 4 assists, 3.1 KP per game). Also, Malaga are in 4th in La Liga, they're hardly some crappy side.Now stats can be misleading, but not THAT misleading. In the Champions League, where we've seen him, he's been fantastic, but he's been quite mediocre domestically. Buying someone because they played very well over 4 games is not good enough for me. However, the biggest issue I have with this is twofold. One, we don't need to be buy anymore 20 year olds. We have plenty of youth on the club. We don't need to develop any more. We need players who can be ready to play at their top level the day we buy them. Second, we don't need a central attacking midfielder. Chelsea have spent 80M pounds+ in the last two years on players who play as a #10. We simply don'y need any more. Is Isco an upgrade over Mata, Hazard, or Oscar? No, he clearly isn't. So, what's the point? FFP means we have limited resources and money should be spent buying players at positions of need rather than getting a 4th central attacking midfielder.

[Superblue 6,370]

I agree that stats can be misleading, but they do have some value. Yes, Iniesta and Messi only have slightly more key passes per game than Isco, but Iniesta has 11 assists and Messi has 27 goals and 6 assists. Isco has 4 goals and 1 assist. The problem I have with him statistically, is that he's not even close to being one of the better players on Malaga. Whoscored.com has him as their 9th best player. You say that Isco's stats are poor because of the team he plays on, well Joaquin plays on the same squad , also as an attacking midfielder and has been much better. (4 goals, 4 assists, 3.1 KP per game). Also, Malaga are in 4th in La Liga, they're hardly some crappy side.Now stats can be misleading, but not THAT misleading. In the Champions League, where we've seen him, he's been fantastic, but he's been quite mediocre domestically. Buying someone because they played very well over 4 games is not good enough for me. However, the biggest issue I have with this is twofold. One, we don't need to be buy anymore 20 year olds. We have plenty of youth on the club. We don't need to develop any more. We need players who can be ready to play at their top level the day we buy them. Second, we don't need a central attacking midfielder. Chelsea have spent 80M pounds+ in the last two years on players who play as a #10. We simply don'y need any more. Is Isco an upgrade over Mata, Hazard, or Oscar? No, he clearly isn't. So, what's the point? FFP means we have limited resources and money should be spent buying players at positions of need rather than getting a 4th central attacking midfielder.

Going on that basis Toronto, how would you feel about Sneijder? I know his wages are absurd but lets say we could find an agreement (for example a similar wage packet to the outgoing Lampard), do you think he would be a better fit?

IMO he would at this moment be an upgrade as unlike Hazard and Oscar, he is much more polished (the finished product) and experienced. He would represent a player with tons of experience and trophies won but at 28 should still have a good 3-4 years playing at the top level.

If we could bring his wages down a little then to get a player seemingly on a free who is a £20-25m player and big name must surely be at least considered.

[bababoom 4,478]

I'm disappointed, i opened this expecting more news...

[Rmpr 8,977]

I actually found it an interesting read and liked what you had to say bar the caring about Leif homo part. I just couldn't resist sorry mate

It did came out gay after re-reading it. HAHAHA!

Fixed!

[BlueLyon 9,359]

People saying "No" to Isco because we have Marin, Moses, Piazon (lol), whoever - they genuinely make me question how much they know about football. This post will make me sound so cocky, big headed, or just like a dickhead - but seriously... you need your head checked if you don't want the best Spanish player of his generation to join this team.

It's honestly sickening how so many of you want to settle for mediocrity like we're Arsenal or Tottenham.

I do not give a flying fuck about Marin. You don't turn down a player like Isco to keep a player who's been shit the last 3 seasons because "he has potential 2 be tha German Messi xoxoxox". He doesn't even play in the same position as Isco! Why are people making that comparison anyway!?

I also want to smack the faces of everyone saying we shouldn't get Isco because we have Piazon lol. Are you serious? GENUINELY are you serious? How on earth do people believe Piazon is some magical 'Kaka' player? He doesn't play the same position as Kaka, is FAR away from the senior national team, and the only thing he's done of note for us is winning a penalty and getting an assist against an Aston Villa side which we had already destroyed before he came on.

"Top teams don't have 2 or more quality players for each position" - Bayern Munich say "hello". Juventus say "hello". Real Madrid say "hello".

It honestly infuriates me (the mentality of some people on here). I'm positive that some of the same people saying "We shouldn't get Isco because we have Marin/Piazon" (neither of which even play in the same fking position as him) would turn down Messi because "we just signed Ba and our central midfield is a bigger priority."

The opinion that "having 3 or 4 top class players in one position means other areas lack that same quality and will suffer" is the worst thing I've ever heard. How big is a squad? Around 25 players? How is having 3 or 4 top quality AM's going to affect one of the richest club's central defence? Someone try and explain that to me using sense and not hypotheticals.

Also, above I read something about would I rather have Ba as our only striker while buying Isco and Schurrle - err, what? We have both Ba and Torres at the club. Us paying £15m for Isco instead of £11m for that Taison guy is hardly going to affect our chances of getting another striker in anyway if Torres leaves (finally). No idea what the Schurrle comment was about.

Also, signing the player who's tipped to potentially being the best attacking midfielder in the world in a few years time does not affect at all whether we get more 'truly great centre backs' or not. What was that comment about Barcelona having so much attacking talent that Villa can't get into the team and they have 'no central defenders'? Haven't they been the world's best team for a few years now, no? So that comment was pretty much invalid unless it was said to actually support the idea of getting Isco.

Jeez.

Finally, do people not remember that Mata was actually good on the left wing last season? Do people not remember that Hazard is right footed? Do people not realise that, in theory, we could have Mata as a left winger who tracks back, Isco in the centre behind the striker, and Hazard as a winger who tracks back? That would leave Oscar as our only back-up/rotation option on the bench. People must stop seeing things so black and white. There are many ways this could go. That trio could potentially be one of the best attacking combos seen in the last decade. (No long articles about how Moses must start because he offers more 'balance' please.) Those 3 would be incredible at retaining possession. Assuming we then get a DLP like Benat (for example), keeping possession would be a breeze. If you keep possession, you rarely have to defend. (Of course I'm not suggesting that Mata/Hazard would have no defensive responsibilities at all,though.)

Note:

Marin = Winger, and one of the most disappointing players in the Bundesliga before joining us. Piazon = 2nd Striker/Winger, who mainly gets this praise because he looks appearance-wise similar to Kaka and is from Brazil. Moses = Winger. De Bruyne = Central Midfielder capable of playing in the hole.

So how many attacking midfielders do we have when Hazard & Mata are already playing on the pitch? Oscar? The one who most of you are saying "will play in the double pivot"? Whoah. That's showing great depth at attacking midfield isn't it? Stuff of champions that is right there.

Jesus fucking fuck because of the people who think like you always just buying new players becuase they can, we never produce OUR players. Sure Piazon is not good enough yey but he is fuckin 18!?! With Isco in there is chance he will never develop in good player because of lack play time. If we hadnt have Oscar, Marin, Moses,..I would gladly take Isco, but we have what we bought and should play them. Isco is first team player and here there is no place for him in starting 11. Mind that Im not saying Isco shouldnt come because Marin is better or whatever, but for fuck sake, we need to start playing our own young players, not just buying others. City and Real have 10 times larger squads. but tell me, why are Barca and United more balanced? Because they dont jump on bandwagon and jerk off on every fucking player in europe like you, but actualy buy wise and produce their own players. Cleverly was shit long time, if United bought Modric, Cleverly would never break through, now he is becoming their important player.

Stop with this we are chelsea blah blah we aint arsenal blah blah...In that case we need experience and not more youth.

As club we are in transition, 3rd in PL out of CL and Extremely unconsistant because of young team we have.

[JDY 1,290]

I agree that stats can be misleading, but they do have some value. Yes, Iniesta and Messi only have slightly more key passes per game than Isco, but Iniesta has 11 assists and Messi has 27 goals and 6 assists. Isco has 4 goals and 1 assist. The problem I have with him statistically, is that he's not even close to being one of the better players on Malaga. Whoscored.com has him as their 9th best player. You say that Isco's stats are poor because of the team he plays on, well Joaquin plays on the same squad , also as an attacking midfielder and has been much better. (4 goals, 4 assists, 3.1 KP per game). Also, Malaga are in 4th in La Liga, they're hardly some crappy side.Now stats can be misleading, but not THAT misleading. In the Champions League, where we've seen him, he's been fantastic, but he's been quite mediocre domestically. Buying someone because they played very well over 4 games is not good enough for me. However, the biggest issue I have with this is twofold. One, we don't need to be buy anymore 20 year olds. We have plenty of youth on the club. We don't need to develop any more. We need players who can be ready to play at their top level the day we buy them. Second, we don't need a central attacking midfielder. Chelsea have spent 80M pounds+ in the last two years on players who play as a #10. We simply don'y need any more. Is Isco an upgrade over Mata, Hazard, or Oscar? No, he clearly isn't. So, what's the point? FFP means we have limited resources and money should be spent buying players at positions of need rather than getting a 4th central attacking midfielder.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Whoscored.com also has Mikel and Moses ranked as Chelsea's 15th and 16th best players respectively. They also have Torres as our 4th best player. Now statistically Torres hasn't done too bad, but we all know from watching him week in week out how frustrating he still is, despite scoring more goals. The point I was trying to make is using statistics can be very useful, but they shouldn't be treated as the holy grail to make a judgement on how a player is performing.

I agree that 4 games isn't enough warrant spending £15m on a promising player, but I'm sure the club will have better judgement in this regard. For the record, did you also see him play in the Olympics for Spain? He was God awful, but then again the whole Spain team was. It reminds me of the people who said Chelsea shouldn't buy Oscar based off him performing well against 'poor' players in the Olympics. In that case Isco and co would be no-hopers.

On to your last point, I agree that the club has to be smart when buying players and take into account what we actually need. I'd much rather us sign a player like Benat as we're in desperate need for a player like him. Signing Isco for me has Guardiola written all over it. As I mentioned before, he might not be signed for the no.10 role.

[Leif 6,006]

Jesus fucking fuck because of the people who think like you always just buying new players becuase they can, we never produce OUR players. Sure Piazon is not good enough yey but he is fuckin 18!?! With Isco in there is chance he will never develop in good player because of lack play time. If we hadnt have Oscar, Marin, Moses,..I would gladly take Isco, but we have what we bought and should play them. Isco is first team player and here there is no place for him in starting 11. Mind that Im not saying Isco shouldnt come because Marin is better or whatever, but for fuck sake, we need to start playing our own young players, not just buying others. City and Real have 10 times larger squads. but tell me, why are Barca and United more balanced? Because they dont jump on bandwagon and jerk off on every fucking player in europe like you, but actualy buy wise and produce their own players. Cleverly was shit long time, if United bought Modric, Cleverly would never break through, now he is becoming their important player. Stop with this we are chelsea blah blah we aint arsenal blah blah...In that case we need experience and not more youth. As club we are in transition, 3rd in PL out of CL and Extremely unconsistant because of young team we have.

You're not supposed to play your own players *just* because you produced them. Anyone who doesn't support Chelsea can clearly see that this 'amazing potential' Piazon 'has' is a myth.

He's barely 'ours' anyway. We just bought him from Sao Paulo lol

Cleverley has never been 'shit'. Only a casual football follower would think such nonsense. Did you ever watch him at Wigan by any chance? Hm? Watford?

Barcelona and Manchester United are balanced because they don't change their manager every season - not because they don't 'jerk off on every fucking player in europe' (name 1 other player I've been pushing for us to buy btw to back that statement up please.)

United produce their own players? Who in their team came from their academy? Evans who made his debut half a decade ago, Giggs who was playing before quarter of this forum was alive, Welbeck, Scholes who needs a walking stick, Cleverley and Fletcher. You make it sound as if you can compare their youth usage to Barcelona's. Laughable.

Cleverley is NOT United's "important player" hahahahahaha. Rooney, RVP, Scholes, Giggs, Vidic, Rio, De Gea - all more important to them than him.

Are you saying you want to pass by the chance to sign the best Spanish player of his generation and use Piazon instead just because we bought him and he's played with our reserves for a season or so?

We're Chelsea - Not Barcelona or Manchester United. You tell me to stop with the Arsenal comparison after comparing us to 2 teams. Lolwut. I've no idea how long you or anyone else on here have supported the club, but if it's not been long, I'm really sorry to break this to you - With our current owner, we will never have that format of producing our own players and using them lots in our senior team. Please just understand that. It is not happening. You see how Real Madrid work? That's how Roman wants this club to work - only with Barcelona-style football seen on the pitch.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

You're not supposed to play your own players *just* because you produced them. Anyone who doesn't support Chelsea can clearly see that this 'amazing potential' Piazon 'has' is a myth.

He's barely 'ours' anyway. We just bought him from Sao Paulo lol

Cleverley has never been 'shit'. Only a casual football follower would think such nonsense. Did you ever watch him at Wigan by any chance? Hm? Watford?

Barcelona and Manchester United are balanced because they don't change their manager every season - not because they don't 'jerk off on every fucking player in europe' (name 1 other player I've been pushing for us to buy btw to back that statement up please.)

United produce their own players? Who in their team came from their academy? Evans who made his debut half a decade ago, Giggs who was playing before quarter of this forum was alive, Welbeck, Scholes who needs a walking stick, Cleverley and Fletcher. You make it sound as if you can compare their youth usage to Barcelona's. Laughable.

Cleverley is NOT United's "important player" hahahahahaha. Rooney, RVP, Scholes, Giggs, Vidic, Rio, De Gea - all more important to them than him.

Are you saying you want to pass by the chance to sign the best Spanish player of his generation and use Piazon instead just because we bought him and he's played with our reserves for a season or so?

We're Chelsea - Not Barcelona or Manchester United. You tell me to stop with the Arsenal comparison after comparing us to 2 teams. Lolwut. I've no idea how long you or anyone else on here have supported the club, but if it's not been long, I'm really sorry to break this to you - With our current owner, we will never have that format of producing our own players and using them lots in our senior team. Please just understand that. It is not happening. You see how Real Madrid work? That's how Roman wants this club to work - only with Barcelona-style football seen on the pitch.

Ok I give you right this time around, still disagree on some stuff you said but dont call people that because they have different opinion than you that they dont follow Chelsea or football for long time, its stupid.

And how do you imagine Isco 'the greatest player of his generation in spain' to be rotation player here? Clearly he has biggest potential in his generation in spain, but we will see if he will live up to expectations. Isco can play in front three at chelsea, where Mata and Hazard already have places. Oscar was playing as third player, but it didnt work so Isco cant be on pitch the same time as Mata and Hazard. That means he will be on bench here. That means he will be unhappy and wont fill the potential. That means he wont be greatest player in spain of his generation.

[The Skipper 20,593]

The main reason I can't see us signing Isco for is the fact that he wouldn't get enough minutes to develop. He'd have to play week in week out for him to realise his potential, and I can't see that happening here tbh.

[The only place to be 11,313]

With our current owner, we will never have that format of producing our own players and using them lots in our senior team. Please just understand that. It is not happening.

You're wrong about what the club wants to do. They actually want a 'conveyor belt of talent' and we're actually reaching a point where the talent level is good enough to make that a reality.

[communicate 2,703]

You're not supposed to play your own players *just* because you produced them. Anyone who doesn't support Chelsea can clearly see that this 'amazing potential' Piazon 'has' is a myth.

He's barely 'ours' anyway. We just bought him from Sao Paulo lol

Cleverley has never been 'shit'. Only a casual football follower would think such nonsense. Did you ever watch him at Wigan by any chance? Hm? Watford?

Barcelona and Manchester United are balanced because they don't change their manager every season - not because they don't 'jerk off on every fucking player in europe' (name 1 other player I've been pushing for us to buy btw to back that statement up please.)

United produce their own players? Who in their team came from their academy? Evans who made his debut half a decade ago, Giggs who was playing before quarter of this forum was alive, Welbeck, Scholes who needs a walking stick, Cleverley and Fletcher. You make it sound as if you can compare their youth usage to Barcelona's. Laughable.

Cleverley is NOT United's "important player" hahahahahaha. Rooney, RVP, Scholes, Giggs, Vidic, Rio, De Gea - all more important to them than him.

Let say we sign isco. He is 20 clearly need plenty of playing time to grow. We can only play 2 am at once. Even barca play with 2. Like you said let us forget about marin,piazon and kdb. Now we have 4 young players playing for 2 position. All of them need playing time to grow. Are you going to rotate them every game ? And let us asume mata will start most of the game for us. So it means 3 young players battling for 1 position. Nobody will be happy and their progress will be stagnant

[Jase 43,479]

Apart from Daily Mirror, did the Spanish media actually report anything about this over the weekend?

Have yet to see any real concrete sources linking us to getting Isco.

[Jase 43,479]

http://metro.co.uk/2013/01/08/chelsea-and-tottenham-suffer-isco-setback-with-malaga-unwilling-to-sell-3343338/

Chelsea and Tottenham have been dealt a huge setback in the January transfer window, with Spanish side Malaga insisting they will reject all bids for in-demand midfielder Isco.

Spurs have been long-term admirers of the 20-year-old and Chelsea have upped their interest in recent weeks, while Manchester United were also thought to be keen on bringing him to England.

But Malaga, who currently sit fourth in La Liga, say they are determined to keep hold of their highly rated playmaker despite the economic plight of the club, as they look to continue their excellent form in their maiden Champions League campaign.

Last week, Malaga were banned from European competition for one season by Uefa after failing to pay bills, but will not be lured into selling any of their star players in cut-price deals, as they did over the summer when Arsenal snapped up Santi Cazorla for £16m.

The Spanish outfit face FC Porto in the last 16 of the Champions League, with Isco proving a key player as they topped Group C ahead of AC Milan, Zenit St Petersburg and Anderlecht.

The Under-21 international has scored six goals in 22 outings for his club this term, most recently netting in their 3-2 win over Real Madrid just before Christmas.

[JDY 1,290]

Apart from Daily Mirror, did the Spanish media actually report anything about this over the weekend?

Have yet to see any real concrete sources linking us to getting Isco.

Balague just said it's highly unlikely that he will leave anytime soon, and is looking to sign a new contract with a bigger release clause.