Super Frank Thread

[Tomo 21,751]

19 hours ago, Henrique said:

The problem I have with your opinion about Lampard is that you always come up with "yes, he is making mistakes", but at the end of the day you just dismiss most of his mistakes. For example, Lampard's biggest flaw so far is his inability to build solid defensive system, and people pointed that our defense is the same as last season (bar Luiz), but we have conceded war more goals and we look way more vulnerable, then you come up with this narrative: we looked more solid at the defense last season because Sarri played a "risk averse" football, while Lampard has this "attacking firing first" philosophy.

Lampard lack of solid defensive system has nothing to do with "attacking firing first" thing. The team concedes a LOT of goals from set-pieces, and that has nothing to with what you pointed. Lampard is not as courageous and audacious as you made him look. Yesterday the team was playing with 5 at the back (very different from Conte's strategy, because Conte played with 3 at back but with wingbacks instead of fullbacks) and yet conceded 5.

Sarri made a better job at building a defensive system, as simple as that.

It's context. If you look back to my posts last year I gave Sarri the benefit of the doubt for our attacking woes then same way I am Lampard with the defense, we simply don't have the squad to make both look good simultaneously.

Of course next year excuses are out, if we're conceding 50 plus league goals with a keeper and (hopefully) LB of his choice and (by the looks of things) Kante playing as DM then it will be on him and only him.

[pHaRaOn 2,131]

1 hour ago, Henrique said:

I think most people agree with me on this subject...

I'm sure a lot of people will agree with you. Still, what exactly gave you a positive vibe at the end of last season?

[Vesper 30,083]

'Frank has to learn': Klopp hits out at Lampard as 'arrogance' row intensifies

Liverpool manager tells Lampard to leave issues at final whistle
Lampard regrets language used but not defending his team

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/jul/24/frank-has-to-learn-klopp-hits-out-at-lampard-as-arrogance-row-intensifies

Jürgen Klopp has told Frank Lampard he should learn to leave his arguments on the pitch as the row over the “arrogance” of the Liverpool bench during their win against Chelsea intensified.

Lampard maintains that Liverpool’s coaching staff “crossed the line” with their behaviour at Anfield on Wednesday, although the Chelsea manager says he regrets using bad language during a touchline row with Klopp.

Footage of the incident showed an incensed Lampard losing his cool during a dispute with Klopp and Liverpool’s bench, repeatedly telling them to “fuck off”. The Chelsea manager was irate after Mateo Kovacic was penalised for the free-kick that led to Trent Alexander-Arnold’s goal and Pepijn Lijnders, Liverpool’s assistant manager, leapt from the dugout demanding punishment.

Lampard’s ire was directed mainly at Lijnders, with the pair also exchanging words in a post-match clinch. But it was the later claims of arrogance from the Chelsea manager that have angered Klopp, who insists managerial disputes should finish on the final whistle.

“You cannot hit me with something like that – or my bench with something like that – because we are not arrogant,” the Liverpool manager said on Friday.

“Frank was in a really competitive mood and I respect that a lot. You can pretty much, from my point of view, say what you want in a situation like that. For me, it’s after the game. It’s completely over. I have said a lot in the past because it is pure emotion. He came here to win the game or get a point to make sure of Champions League qualification. I respect that a lot.

“But what he has to learn is to finish it with the final whistle and he didn’t do that. Speaking after it like this is not OK. Frank has to learn. He has a lot of time to learn, he is a young coach. But he has to learn. During a game words are used – no problem at all. But at the final whistle, all the things he said … we are not arrogant. We are pretty much the opposite of arrogant in a moment like this.

“If you have arguments, you say something and you want to hurt the other person. That is how it is. No problem. The final whistle? Close the book, finish the book. That is what I don’t like.”

Lampard, however, is adamant that Liverpool’s behaviour was disrespectful and he will always passionately defend his side. “I’ve seen the video and I was obviously there, in terms of the language I used I do regret that,” he said.

“These things get replayed a lot on social media and I’m aware of that, I’ve got two young daughters on social media. So I regret that. In terms of regretting having passion to defend my team, no. I could have maybe handled it slightly differently to keep that language in. I wasn’t upset with the celebrating of the Liverpool team. Far from it. Liverpool should celebrate as much as they want.

“With the season they’ve had they can celebrate like they did after the game, like they can celebrate every goal they score. Like they celebrated when they won the league a month ago and like they’re talking about celebrating one more time with their fans.

“I would have had a beer with Jürgen Klopp and toasted what they’ve done this year. But there were things on the line I didn’t like from their bench. Not Jürgen Klopp, people behind the bench which I felt crossed the line and that’s what got me agitated. But it’s done. Emotions run high among most managers, players and fans in this game. I regret the language and move on.”

Chelsea, who will qualify for the Champions League qualification if they draw their final league game with Wolves on Sunday, could have N’Golo Kanté available. Kanté has missed the past five games with a hamstring injury.

 

 

[DANILA 290]

arrogant and cocky f*cks, half their squad was unknown 3 years ago

[Puliiszola 519]

5 hours ago, Henrique said:

I think most people agree with me on this subject...

Lol

[bigbluewillie 1,930]

On 7/22/2020 at 10:31 PM, Vybz Kartel said:

Personally I think he needs to be sacked for Pochettino, his a average manager at most imo. He will never really take us anywhere because he can't coach defending. 

Oh what sack Lamps and bring in a serial failure.

You do realise that we are still in transition and will be for at least another season, so get used to it.

Will you and the other knockers not get it into your heads Lamps is doing his best with what was dumped in his lap, wait and see what happens when he brings in his players in.

Also if anyone had told me 4th place and a FA cup final a start of the season then i'd ripped their hand off.

[Vesper 30,083]

9 hours ago, DANILA said:

arrogant and cocky f*cks, half their squad was unknown 3 years ago

yep, more than half (and this does show what a good manager Klopp is btw)

in summer 2017

this is what they were coming off of

Alisson Roma backup keeper (who I was screaming to buy based off what I had seen then and been told by my Brasilian mates)

VVD coming off injury plagued year at SOTON

Joe Gomez youth team barely had gotten a sniff at the dippers

Joël Matip injury plagued first season at the dippers, some were already calling or his head

Dejan Lovren  often was the target for their fans, injury plagued poor season overall

Roberston, coming off an oki, but hardly great season at Hull

TAA youth team mostly, 162 league minutes (in his defence, you could already see he was a baller, but hardly well known)

Fabinho coming off the Mbappe team was known, but was hardly considered the star there

Jordan Henderson coming off back to back very injury plagued (26 and 27 games only, all comps) years, many at Anfield were calling for his head

Milner  played all season out of position as a right footed LB, was getting major stick

Georginio Wijnaldum coming off a decent first year at the dippers

Naby Keïta coming off a great debut season at Leipzig, but your average fan here had probably never heard of him

Adam Lallana coming off his best (and hardly great -8 goals) season at the dippers, and even then, it has injury-plagued, and he never really recovered

OX 2016-17 was his best season ever at Arse, but missed almost the entire next year with a bad injury, never really hit that level again (and was still a year removed from the dippers) he was a well known player at least

Mane  coming off his first season (injury plagued-I think we see a pattern here) at the dippers, but you already could see he was a star (13 goals, all EPL, in 29 games, all comps (27 in the EPL), the next season he went WC

Salah  coming off the Roma season that earned him the Victimpool transfer, still, very much NOT  super famous YET player (that occured his crazy 2017-18  44 goal season, which he will never duplicate, I think)

Xherdan Shaqiri  a 4 goal all comps blahhhh at Stoke

Divock Origi coming off a decent, but not great year at the dippers, was loaned out in summer 2017 to Wolfsburg

Roberto Firmino coming off a decent, but hardly WC season at the dippers, although you could see he was a baller

 

so yes 15 (basically the entire core of the team except for Mane, Winajdum, and Firmino) of them were not even there yet or had hardly played or were loaned out or were meh or injured (Henderson especially if you count injuries AT the dippers) or played out of position (Milner)

[Tomo 21,751]

48 minutes ago, Mana said:

It’s obvious that Lamps won’t be sacked regardless of what happens this season now, even if the very worse case scenario happens.

Lets be honest, Lamps was never fit to wear that Chelsea suit before he joined us. But despite his failures at Derby, the board saw something in him (mostly because he’s a club legend but something else...) and what we are today is because the board took a gamble with Lampard THIS early.

Out of curiosity what position and points total do you think this squad (which you compared unfavorably to even Arsenal at the start of this season) should be hitting?

[Tomo 21,751]

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[Vesper 30,083]

11 minutes ago, Tomo said:

Out of curiosity what position and points total do you think this side (who you compared unfavorably to even Arsenal at the start of this season) should be hitting?

I know this wasn't directed at me, but I had us down for 74 to 76 points at the end, and 3rd or 4th

now taking the blown games (draws and wins) and then subtracting out some of the wins/draws that surprised me

then further cutting that point total in HALF (to be conservative) I come up with 12 points shit away

so

add 12 to 63

75 (ie a draw with Wolves gives us 76, so right spot on my target)

ergo, we shit away net 12 points or so from both my pre season projection AND reality

those 12 lost points often came down to 5 players who are the most to blame (plus Lamps)

4 of them super disappointing (as I had hope)

KEPA (ffs) AC, Zouma, Rudiger, and then Emerson (not shocking he was shit, just shocking how shit he was, and forced Azpi to play LB (thus crushing our offence on the left until Pulisic blew up) when Alonso (a pleasant surprise) could not have a go

the others not listed either played oki or are youth or are coming off injuries, plus a few who just are nt right for the team (like Jorginho)

bonus bad news

Kante being rammed in (this is on Lamps) to wrong position far to often and constantly being injured

I think that is a fair take, and some of those losses and draws were just HORRID (the 2 West Ham games, the Bournemouth loss at home, the Bournemouth draw, and especially the last kick of game loss to NUFC, <<<< there is 14 points dropped right there not even counting any of the other cock-ups (and BTW, I did NOT include the Manure 4 nil, the Everton smashing of us, nor the SU loss, as shit happens with a young team on occasion, and the games were not really close and finally remember I cut my total shit-away points in half anyway, just to be realistic)

[OneMoSalah 8,883]

Regarding the points and looking at the losses and draws we have this season, I think we could have had another 12-14 points at least. While I know it doesn’t always work like that I do feel we missed an opportunity with some of these which is disappointing and not ideal. Before the season started I felt top 4 should of definitely been achievable regardless of the manager and still think if we had an Allegri or even Sarri we would of gotten more points with this squad. Even under Conte that second year finishing 5th was a disappointment. 
 

it is a process though and I think now next season we have to get another 12-18 points on top of this seasons total at least. I dont think theres many excuses for next year even with the backline because the offensive players coming in has got me thinking we will be more clinical, particularly Werners arrival. He should get like 15 goals next season. Plus Ziyech can get on the scoresheet and Pulisic will kick on again. It may not make us title challengers and the defence will also be a reason as to why if it isn’t significantly improved or sorted on, there is enough optimism  for us to get more points. 

[Vesper 30,083]

13 hours ago, Fernando said:

There was nothing positive about Sarri. 

 

he added to the UK GDP via tobacco sales