The English Football Thread

[Kojo 4,676]

No I haven't.

I'm not talking about today's game

Kalou has scored a couple 'wundergoals'. Should Hazard 'come back' once he's got the same amount?

IRONIC.

Hazard has scored much better goals than Kalou, Kalous best goal was against Inter Milan in CL quaters, and even that was bad keeping from Cesar.

It's only more Ironic, cause I'm not too honest.

[Ollie 4,400]

He's obviously doing a Brendan Rodgers impersonation.

[Rmpr 8,977]

Hate to interject, but during his time here (including Europe) Oscar has played 19 games in the middle in his preferred position. Granted, not all those games were him playing as a starter, but Coutinho has been coming off the bench too.. and even playing out wide like Oscar has.

If we take Europe out of the equation, Oscar has played (and started I believe) 11 times through the centre in the Premier League - 8 more than Coutinho (3) has.

Oscar (30) has played 3 times the amount of Premier League games that Coutinho (10) has. They've both played around the same amount percentage-wise of games through the centre as opposed to other positions on the pitch.

Coutinho has played as second-striker 5 times, left-attacking-midfielder 2 times and through the middle only 3 times. Yet with him being swapped around positions so much it can still be argued that in his short time here, Coutinho has impressed more than Oscar. This seems to show that Coutinho is more versatile than Oscar.

Oscar has 2 goals in 30 Premier League appearances, while Coutinho has 2 goals in 10 Premier League appearances.

Oscar has 4 assists in 30 Premier League appearances. Coutinho has 4 assists in 10 Premier League appearances.

Oscar has contributed with some "wundergoals" and some welcomed pressing of the opposition which is admirable from a player in his position, but he's really offered little else. He averages under 2 shots a game, where-as Coutinho averages just over 2 shots a game.

In conclusion, it would seem that if we go by stats, Coutinho is currently equal to if not better than Oscar at club level.

If we simply go by what we see, it's all wide open for debate since everyone's perception is different.

Post the 11 times where he has started and post what Coutinho actually did to impress you. It doesnt help to do a big post saying absolutely nothing, with no football arguments other than just stats about how many games one has played and how many assists and goals each have...

What about distance covered, tackles, passes, possession recovery, etc?

Also, this is Oscar first year of European football in a troubled season for out team. Coutinho shows up in small games when the score is already in Liverpool's side. He did not started the season, when Liverpool and Rodgers were still in adaptation process, one that Oscar had to go through.

Do a little memory exercise...Can you please tell me how did Coutinho's first 2 years went?

[Leif 6,006]

Coutinho actually did to impress you

In 10 Premier League games, he's directly contributed to 6 goals. I'm impressed by that considering he's 20 and it's his first season in the league.

big post saying absolutely nothing

Just because you don't agree with something doesn't mean it has no merit or substance.

with no football arguments other than just stats

I'm not arguing, and I specifically said that there's other ways to judge other than stats at the end. Most people on here like to go by stats, so I presented them stats. Stats often go someway towards showing how good/bad a player is. You know, how you were using stats in the Neymar thread?

Also, this is Oscar first year of European football in a troubled season for out team. Can you please tell me how did Coutinho's first 2 years went?

Not much better. But we're not comparing how they both did in their 1st seasons in a top league or anything. The debate was simply "Who is currently better".

[Leif 6,006]

What about distance covered

The amount of distance you cover has nothing to do with whether you're good or not. If that were the case, Ramires >>> Zidane.

I presented the stats which are often used to reflect an attacking-midfielder's abilities.

[Tomo 21,685]

Newcastle were an embarrisement, how the fuck did they finish above us last season?

[Rmpr 8,977]

In 10 Premier League games, he's directly contributed to 6 goals. I'm impressed by that considering he's 20 and it's his first season in the league.

Just because you don't agree with something doesn't mean it has no merit or substance.

No, it has no substance because you posted nothing more than goals and assists. Football isnt solely about that, for you to be able to score, someone must do the dirty work. Coutinho doesnt help the team as much as Oscar does and most of his goals and assists were with the game already in Liverpool's hand!

I'm not arguing, and I specifically said that there's other ways to judge other than stats at the end. Most people on here like to go by stats, so I presented them stats. Stats often go someway towards showing how good/bad a player is. You know, how you were using stats in the Neymar thread?

There is no problem in using stats. For instance, Peace. uses a lot of stats, but he goes to explain and give a background to it (football arguments). You just threw some random stuff and thought to be making a hell of an intellingent intervention, lol.

Not much better. But we're not comparing how they both did in their 1st seasons in a top league or anything. The debate was simply "Who is currently better".

Not much better? LMAO!

Coutinho was a complete and utter failure, he was benched in almost all of their games. He took 1.5 year to score his second goal. Even more impressive, he was even loaned to Espanyol in a position where Inter is not even full of competition!

[Rmpr 8,977]

The amount of distance you cover has nothing to do with whether you're good or not. If that were the case, Ramires >>> Zidane.

I presented the stats which are often used to reflect an attacking-midfielder's abilities.

The distance one runs is part of a handful of stats that translates to how good the work rate of a certain player is. I didnt ask for it alone, with no meaning behind it!

You took one little thing and made a full post out of it. Smart!

[Jase 43,479]

Newcastle were an embarrisement, how the fuck did they finish above us last season?

Because the Newcastle last season is much better than this season and we are much better now than we were last season...

[Leif 6,006]

Coutinho doesnt help the team as much as Oscar

And Ramires helps our team and does the 'dirty work' more than Iniesta does at Barcelona. What's your point?

You just threw some random stuff

You keep insulting people and people's posts. If you can't comprehend or accept something as fact or opinion there's nothing I can do about that. It's not random though. Saying that Coutinho is better because I prefer his hair is random. You bringing up the distance they travel is random, for example.

he was even loaned to Espanyol in a position where Inter is not even full of competition!

What? Schelotto, Palacio, Kovacic, Alvarez and Cassano have all been rotating in that position (Cassano less-so than the others) this season. That is full of competition. Should I now call your post shit?

[Rmpr 8,977]

And Ramires helps our team and does the 'dirty work' more than Iniesta does at Barcelona. What's your point?

You keep insulting people and people's posts. If you can't comprehend or accept something as fact or opinion there's nothing I can do about that. It's not random though. Saying that Coutinho is better because I prefer his hair is random. You bringing up the distance they travel is random, for example.

What? Schelotto, Palacio, Kovacic, Alvarez and Cassano have all been rotating in that position (Cassano less-so than the others) this season. That is full of competition. Should I now call your post shit?

Go play football dude, maybe you learn somethings!

[Leif 6,006]

The distance one runs is part of a handful of stats that translates to how good the work rate of a certain player is.

Yeah, but at what point was that even being discussed before you brought it up? No one was or is having a debate over work-rate. You're nit-picking out little bits to try and start arguments in yet another thread.

[Leif 6,006]

Go play football dude, maybe you learn somethings!

Can someone elaborate on this pathetic and immature reply/personal attack/whatever he's been doing all day to Skunk and now myself?

[Rmpr 8,977]

Yeah, but at what point was that even being discussed before you brought it up? No one was or is having a debate over work-rate. You're nit-picking out little bits to try and start arguments in yet another thread.

The point is that you would not make such atroucious points, that is all...

You know that I am right about you only posting the stats that backs Coutinho and that you gave no arguments at all, you simply copied and pasted the goals and assists from the internet. Now, you start posting comparissons about Ramires and Iniesta out of nowhere and post random footballers names to make it as if Coutinho had any good competition in Inter (whereas Oscar has Mata playing ahead of him).

You either give arguments to sustain whatever stat you use or you simply dont use!

[Rmpr 8,977]

Can someone elaborate on this pathetic and immature reply/personal attack/whatever he's been doing all day to Skunk and now myself?

How is your fake twitter going?

[Leif 6,006]

You either give arguments to sustain whatever stat you use or you simply dont use!

Where were your arguments about Neymar being as good as you say he is? "HE HAS WUN COPA'S ON HIS OWN!!!". Don't be a hypocrite now.

The point is that you would not make such atroucious points, that is all...

I think the majority of your posts are shit, if not all, but that doesn't mean I think they have atrocious* points, does it? You make valid, but shit points. You may disagree with what I say, but well thought-out and presented articles & facts are not atrocious when compared to your own 'sarcastic' posts which you cling to so dearly.

You know that I am right

Remember how you said your 'agenda' against me was (partly) due to me (in your opinion) thinking higher of myself than I should? *cough*

How is your fake twitter going?

I'm not offended by this. In fact I'm glad you've posted this, as you've just shown the forum your true colours.

[Rmpr 8,977]

Where were your arguments about Neymar being as good as you say he is? "HE HAS WUN COPA'S ON HIS OWN!!!". Don't be a hypocrite now.

To the discussion that was being argued, yes!

This only turned to what it has because you were not capable of asking my questions in the first place. My first couple of posts were not offensive at all!

Had you simply given me intelligent arguments to the debate, this would have taken a much better course. Exactly like you did with Kojo, couldnt attack his points...

I think the majority of your posts are shit, if not all, but that doesn't mean I think they have atrocious* points, does it? You make valid, but shit points. You may disagree with what I say, but well thought-out and presented articles & facts are not atrocious when compared to your own 'sarcastic' posts which you cling to so dearly.

Then simply say I make shit points and you would like new ones, so simple!

Remember how you said your 'agenda' against me was (partly) due to me (in your opinion) thinking higher of myself than I should? *cough*

First, all I said is that I am right at this specific argument (that you posted stats without backing them up). Second, the fact you dont play football does influence, there is no debate here, you must play the sport to learn some aspects of the game.

I'm not offended by this. In fact I'm glad you've posted this, as you've just shown the forum your true colours.

I am caucasian!

[Leif 6,006]

you must play the sport to learn some aspects of the game.

Remind me - How many professional games has Andre Villas-Boas played again? Unless of course, as I assume, you mean just play it in general etc, in which case you shouldn't assume I haven't or don't play.