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Marcos Alonso


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1 hour ago, Jason said:

He was much better in the second half, when we sat deep and focused on attacking down our right - presumably to target Delph at left back - but he was awful in the first half. Kept giving the ball away and was found wanting defensively on numerous occasions. Even got turned inside out easily by Sterling, which would have led to a goal if it weren't for Azpi blocking Sane's shot. His second half performance certainly highlights the issue with him - we had to "cancel" an attacking outlet just to cover his severe lack of pace/weakness. It worked yesterday given the tactics against City but surely, we can't keep persisting with this if Sarri is to achieve his brand of dynamic, attacking football?

Good summation. Plus, I went crazy in 1st half with his bad passing. But yes, 2nd half was better, but at a cost,  like you cohently pointed out.

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He has got to go. Massive weak point on the team. He offers nothing but a random shot, and has not even been scoring with those (see today for perfect example). Woefully slow and a hacker on defence.

Emerson obviously isnt the answer, so we have to go out and upgrade.

Lucas Hernández

Alex Sandro

Alex Telles

Junior Firpo

José Gayà

Raphaël Guerreiro

Wendell

Ferland Mendy

Alejandro Grimaldo

Pick one buy one.

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1 hour ago, Vesper said:

He has got to go. Massive weak point on the team. He offers nothing but a random shot, and has not even been scoring with those (see today for perfect example). Woefully slow and a hacker on defence.

Emerson obviously isnt the answer, so we have to go out and upgrade.

Lucas Hernández

Alex Sandro

Alex Telles

Junior Firpo

José Gayà

Raphaël Guerreiro

Wendell

Ferland Mendy

Alejandro Grimaldo

Pick one buy one.

Unfortunately, I feel like the likes of you and me who are advocating for him to lose his place are in a minority. It's a total deja vu of Ivanovic from the 2nd half of the 14-15 season onwards. I can't help but dread that it would have to take a huge chunk of (back to back) humiliating defeats where his average-ness is illuminated with a billion suns' light, like Ivanovic vs Arsenal at the start of the 16-17 season, that he'll finally be erased from any first XI contention ever again. I don't want it to happen but I can't help but feel that all the teams we are gonna face soon in the league, Leicester, Watford, Crystal Palace, Southampton etc, are gonna contemplate and brainstorm ways to exploit him to the fullest. I remember Pardew mentioning in a pundit job how, when he was at CP, they purposely targeted Ivanovic in that 1-2 win at the start of the 15-16 season.

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I will never understand the idea that alonso is bad because other teams will target his position in defense, which is akin to saying azpi needs to be dropped because he can’t attack. Same position different roles.

ivanovic comparisons are super silly btw (he was an excellent defender at his peak).

now, alonso is indeed playing poorly and very little attacking play has been coming out of his side.

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1 hour ago, kellzfresh said:

If you want to see a proper left back, watch Robertson against Manchester united today. He absolutely skinned them, even Mourinho had to acknowledge.

 

Yes but strange Mourinho said that when, for whatever reason, he didn't adjust his team to stop him...

 

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2 hours ago, Robguima said:

I will never understand the idea that alonso is bad because other teams will target his position in defense, which is akin to saying azpi needs to be dropped because he can’t attack. Same position different roles.

ivanovic comparisons are super silly btw (he was an excellent defender at his peak).

now, alonso is indeed playing poorly and very little attacking play has been coming out of his side.

those are two different things

Azpi being poor on offence at many times is on us, there is little another team will do (except ignore him more) becuase he is bad going forward

Alonso being poor on defence is something the other team will attack, it is a huge problem

he has to go, even before Willian now in my mind

if we use a false nine, then CF doesn't matter so much, BUT we still need a CF, even before booting La Tortuga

Alonso is the biggest defensive structural weak point on the field, he is just horrid

he should have been red carded today, and had other major lapses, plus passed for shit again

but

he hit the post and thus almost scored and now all the fanboys/girls are out coo-cooing over that shit:finger:

 

If Emerson isnt good enough, then we REALLY need to buy an upgrade and quick, before Alonso destroys our season via a series of disasters in games (he came damn close today)

I am so at wits end I would even accept (along with my nine internationals I have posted elsewhere, ALL of whom are loads better than Alonso)

Ben Chilwell 
Kieran Tierney    

as legit buys to give it a go

if either gets to just 80-90% of Roberston's level for Victimpool, they are miles beyond Alonso

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4 hours ago, Vesper said:

those are two different things

Azpi being poor on offence at many times is on us, there is little another team will do (except ignore him more) becuase he is bad going forward

Alonso being poor on defence is something the other team will attack, it is a huge problem

he has to go, even before Willian now in my mind

No, I disagree, they are exactly the same thing. You can't win games without scoring goals, and you can't score goals without attacking in numbers. Azpi is a player the opposition can ignore (like you said), which is not something that can be said of Alonso.

There are many strategies a team and manager can employ to provide cover for an attacking fullback, like the one we use: other FB joins the CB line makings a 3CB system (Azpi is really perfect for it) 

I'm surprised to be honest, because this is very basic on how to balance a team and I've seen it being done since the days of Roberto Carlos who couldn't defend to save his life. Many teams use this combo of one attacking and one defensive FB. Modern times you see this being employed to protect Marcelo, who is prob the worst player at defending I've ever seen play the game. But all attacking fullbacks, however fast they may be, need cover because they will leave spaces behind.

I do see that many here would prefer a more traditional defensive left back, which is fine of course, and yet the same folks like the more attacking way Sarri employs. You can't have it both ways. Not if you stick another Azpi on the left. I'm sure Alonso wouldn't be Mourinho's first choice for LF, but it is Sarri's.

Now if the discussion is that it's worthwhile to give Marcelo freedom, but it isn't so for Alonso, then I'd have to agree that at this time he's not being effective. The same way Hazard goes several games, sometimes half a season without being effective. It happens and for many reasons: form, fitness, sharpness, or team mechanics (some exchange not working or being stopped by the opposition). Once again, that poses a question as to whether Emerson is even good enough to be in the squad.

Concerning your LF suggestion, there might be other left backs that could potentially give more than Alonso (who plays for Spain too btw), but are they attainable? There are no guarantees that they would do a good job for us (diff league team, style, and requirements), let alone do what Alonso has already done (he was an important player in our league win). A player who has already worked well for us needs to be recovered, not shipped out.

Yeah I don't know what to tell you... he is going nowhere. He just signed a new deal...  

 

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4 hours ago, Jason said:

Robertson is a solid player but let's not exaggerate things here...

Not many PL fullbacks better than Robertson tbf. And the form hes in especially, one of the better performing ones in Europe. Solid is downplaying him as a player. 8m pounds he cost too...

As a Scot, good to see a Scottish player featuring every week at a big club in the PL. Still remember seeing him and Stuart Armstrong lining up for Dundee Utd a good few seasons ago.

 

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1 hour ago, Robguima said:

No, I disagree, they are exactly the same thing. You can't win games without scoring goals, and you can't score goals without attacking in numbers. Azpi is a player the opposition can ignore (like you said), which is not something that can be said of Alonso.

There are many strategies a team and manager can employ to provide cover for an attacking fullback, like the one we use: other FB joins the CB line makings a 3CB system (Azpi is really perfect for it) 

I'm surprised to be honest, because this is very basic on how to balance a team and I've seen it being done since the days of Roberto Carlos who couldn't defend to save his life. Many teams use this combo of one attacking and one defensive FB. Modern times you see this being employed to protect Marcelo, who is prob the worst player at defending I've ever seen play the game. But all attacking fullbacks, however fast they may be, need cover because they will leave spaces behind.

I do see that many here would prefer a more traditional defensive left back, which is fine of course, and yet the same folks like the more attacking way Sarri employs. You can't have it both ways. Not if you stick another Azpi on the left. I'm sure Alonso wouldn't be Mourinho's first choice for LF, but it is Sarri's.

Now if the discussion is that it's worthwhile to give Marcelo freedom, but it isn't so for Alonso, then I'd have to agree that at this time he's not being effective. The same way Hazard goes several games, sometimes half a season without being effective. It happens and for many reasons: form, fitness, sharpness, or team mechanics (some exchange not working or being stopped by the opposition). Once again, that poses a question as to whether Emerson is even good enough to be in the squad.

Concerning your LF suggestion, there might be other left backs that could potentially give more than Alonso (who plays for Spain too btw), but are they attainable? There are no guarantees that they would do a good job for us (diff league team, style, and requirements), let alone do what Alonso has already done (he was an important player in our league win). A player who has already worked well for us needs to be recovered, not shipped out.

Yeah I don't know what to tell you... he is going nowhere. He just signed a new deal...  

 

Completely disagree. You once again are logically incoherent. You are conflating tactical setups with raw athletic performance. I don't care if Alonso attacks or not. He isnt even that good at that. What he also is though is too fucking slow (far slower than Roberto Carlos was or Marcelo is) and shit on defence to warrant starting for our team, no matter what tactical set up is played, unless we went to a back 3 with an additional two wingbacks, ie. Conteball. 

That isn't happening and every single one of my LB options would be an upgrade over Alonso. I am so sick of the twisted up versions of 'horses for courses' arguments about how bloody special the EPL is and that it is impossible to compare players in other leagues. It is simply not true.

What is true is that Alonso is shit and needs to go go go. He will end up an anchor round Sarri's neck that helps get him the sacking, mark my words.

I am not changing my mind on this anytime soon. I predicted this before we even we even hired Sarri, as the odds of the next manager sticking with a wingback system were slim to none.

We will see who is right by the end of the season. He damn near cost us 3 points today against a shit team. It will happen again. His passing has been atrocious as well the last several games, so do not try and say I am framing this as an exclusively defensive ineptitude-centred argument. 

Bottom line, once again Roman and the board massively fucked up by giving a lazy, slow sod of a player a massive new contract. He is stealing a living. Blunders like this are now unfortunately par for the course. What well and truly pisses me off is Sarri trying to play us all for mugs by claiming that Alonso is almost (and may well soon be) the best left back in the world. No one who knows a goddamn thing about footie thinks that. It is ludicrous on its face.

Cheers

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