Nemanja Matic

[Rapkun 668]

Matic was poor the last two games.

He was exceptional against city in several games, he was good in europe, against liverpool etc.

Cut the crap and stop bandwagoning Schneiderlin just because we played southampton last weekend and Schneiderlin had better game than Matic who was way below his standards.

That said Scheiderlin is quality player, but not better than Matic. Just not.

And if we are going for a more defensive CM to pair Matic and Cesc, I hope we go for someone in mould of Vidal then. Faster and mobile, b2b with allround quality.

Matic, Schneiderlin and Cesc would be slowest and most immobile midfield of the top sides. Zero creativity. Ut would be good if they parked inside penalty area and defend for 90min though.

But some of us want to see more from our team. Thats why we bough Hazard, Oscar, Willian, Costa, Cesc etc.

Good in europe? He was terrible both times against PSG. First leg our midfield had no intensity and no mobility. We could only regain possession deeper in our own half. The second leg, he was decent in the first half but as soon as Oscar was subbed (no pressing) he was being outplayed by Verratti/Matuidi. I could even make a case for the Sporting and Maribor away games, where he allowed them the space to counter. the liverpool games honestly, you could've chosen a better example than those especially in the cup. 34 year old Gerrard was more mobile than Matic and won every challenge, the Sterling/Coutinho duo was running past him like he was non existent. He also got dragged out of position several times trying to track them and opened spaces for Liverpool to exploit.

Now my point is not that Matic is bad, far from that. I think he's a good player. but he's not that world class DM people are making him out to be. He's far too slow and immobile. He lacks the tactical awareness to compensate for it too and he forgets to cover for the marauding Ivanovic or gets caught trying to dictate the tempo like he was doing on a consitant basis at the start of the season. Lack of pressing upfront terribly affect his game and he can't steal too many balls when it happens. I think the tactical aspect has a lot to due with the fact that he was previously an attacking midfielder, and generally I feel about Matic that he's more of a deep playmaker like Fabregas rather than a pure n6. His offensive side of the game is really good, and its showing against the lower sides. but I think we need something different against the top sides to have a chance at winning an european trophy.

I didn't suggest a midfield of Fabregas Matic Schneiderlin. I said I would rather have Schneiderlin next to Cesc because I think he's a better defensive midfielder.

[manpe 10,861]

I said I would rather have Schneiderlin next to Cesc because I think he's a better defensive midfielder.

Fair enough that's your opinion. I would rather find someone else to partner Matic though, not Fabregas. There is absolutely no reason to replace Matic, that would be imo unnecessary bordering on idiotic. He's been one of our most influential player since we signed him. Matic isn't only a rudimentary defensive midfielder as well, he is incredibly useful in attack too. At times he resembles more a box-to-box midfielder than a standard DM.

Long story short: Replacing Matic with Schneiderling would be stupid.

[Rapkun 668]

Fair enough that's your opinion. I would rather find someone else to partner Matic though, not Fabregas. There is absolutely no reason to replace Matic, that would be imo unnecessary bordering on idiotic. He's been one of our most influential player since we signed him. Matic isn't only a rudimentary defensive midfielder as well, he is incredibly useful in attack too. At times he resembles more a box-to-box midfielder than a standard DM.

Long story short: Replacing Matic with Schneiderling would be stupid.

I wouldn't mind it either if we had a dynamic creative midfielder like Modric, Verratti instead of Fabregas. but we signed him now and its very unlikely that we go for another player. and to be fair to him, he delivered assists and he's improving his defensive side of the game.

What I find really worrying though, is that we tried to play Fabregas higher in europe. and the weaknesses of Matic got the better of him. I'm afraid Matic Ramires in the pivot is still not the answer.

[Blue Colored Sky 1,807]

I'm the only one who noticed how ridiculous one-footed is Nemanja Matic ? Seriously, I can't compare another midfielder at this level with him. He feels pain whenever he has to play with his right foot. He can break fluids of an attack and also when he does his driving runs forward when the ball rolls to his right, the power action is as good as dead. I find it very problematic. When he finally uses it, the pass has less accuracy and power, even the simple, short one.

Maybe you shouldn't read my post, because when once you noticed this, your view will change and you will be uncomfortable with this ...

[Special Juan 27,424]

Maybe you shouldn't read my post, because when once you noticed this, your view will change and you will be uncomfortable with this ...

What the hell have I just read.

[Tomo 21,733]

So a bit off bad form from Matic and we are talking about replacing him

I know the grass is greener on the other side is a strong philosophy here but this just takes the piss.

[CurlyHairLikeLuiz 1,625]

So a bit off bad form from Matic and we are talking about replacing him

I know the grass is greener on the other side is a strong philosophy here but this just takes the piss.

What? Where?

Seriously. I haven't read the thread

[Myself 793]

I wouldn't mind it either if we had a dynamic creative midfielder like Modric, Verratti instead of Fabregas. but we signed him now and its very unlikely that we go for another player. and to be fair to him, he delivered assists and he's improving his defensive side of the game.

What I find really worrying though, is that we tried to play Fabregas higher in europe. and the weaknesses of Matic got the better of him. I'm afraid Matic Ramires in the pivot is still not the answer.

What. The. Fuck?

[Rapkun 668]

So a bit off bad form from Matic and we are talking about replacing him

I know the grass is greener on the other side is a strong philosophy here but this just takes the piss.

My initial point was that Schneiderlin was better than Matic. If I had the choice to pick, which I don't and which no one on here have, I would choose him over Matic. I'm not suggesting we should sell him or anything, just that there are better players out there. There's nothing wrong with that, as there is nothing wrong with thinking we don't have the best players in every position.

I'm not basing my thoughts on the last couple of games only. As I said in my other post, I think he struggles with fast players. It was always there, and it's looking more obvious against the better sides.

What. The. Fuck?

Anything wrong with that statement?

[iseah100 5,612]

Anything wrong with that statement?

It's wrong...

[LAM09 6,744]

My initial point was that Schneiderlin was better than Matic. If I had the choice to pick, which I don't and which no one on here have, I would choose him over Matic. I'm not suggesting we should sell him or anything, just that there are better players out there. There's nothing wrong with that, as there is nothing wrong with thinking we don't have the best players in every position.

I'm not basing my thoughts on the last couple of games only. As I said in my other post, I think he struggles with fast players. It was always there, and it's looking more obvious against the better sides.

If you're not French, you must be in a world of your own. Morgan is a decent DMF, but Matic is a class above IMO.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

So a bit off bad form from Matic and we are talking about replacing him

I know the grass is greener on the other side is a strong philosophy here but this just takes the piss.

On the other hand, a run of excellent performances and he's the best in the world! We football fans are truly a unique breed...

[Rapkun 668]

It's wrong...

He had the part where I said dynamic player over Fabregas in bold. I'd understand if he didn't agree with the whole post.

[The Skipper 20,593]

Schneiderlin is a better DM than Matic? My word.

Why do you even think so? Can you back that up?

[Rapkun 668]

Schneiderlin is a better DM than Matic? My word.

Why do you even think so? Can you back that up?

I'm assuming you didn't read any of my posts..

Anyway, I think defensively he's better. He's more mobile than Matic which allow him to step an extra yard or so to cut a pass. He can keep pressing the players with a higher intensity. He doesn't have as much trouble dealing with fast players as do Matic, and he can steal balls despite lack of pressing upfront. In terms of attacking ability, Nemanja is definitely better no doubt but I don't think Schneiderlin is bad at it.

Can you tell me why do you all think he's so extrordinary? Some people here even label him as the best DM in the world. I just don't see it.

[lionsden 4,689]

I see where Rapkun is coming from. defensively Matic is actually limited in the sense that He lacks the pace to keep up with fast players (it's no coincidence he's struggled badly this season against players with pace at times) and in the absence of pace, a DM needs to have a Godly/makelele like awareness and position to be flawlessly and consistently effective, which he doesn't have and not many DM's including the elite ones have it either. His ability on the ball and strength are his biggest attributes.

[The Skipper 20,593]

I'm assuming you didn't read any of my posts..

Anyway, I think defensively he's better. He's more mobile than Matic which allow him to step an extra yard or so to cut a pass. He can keep pressing the players with a higher intensity. He doesn't have as much trouble dealing with fast players as do Matic, and he can steal balls despite lack of pressing upfront. In terms of attacking ability, Nemanja is definitely better no doubt but I don't think Schneiderlin is bad at it.

Can you tell me why do you all think he's so extrordinary? Some people here even label him as the best DM in the world. I just don't see it.

Sorry I disagree with this a lot. Basically you are trying to insinuate that because Schneiderlin is more athletic (or faster) than Matic (mind you Matic obviously isn't in athletic) that he automatically becomes the better DM, and I think that's just not the right way to look at it at all.

Sure, Matic hasn't been in blistering form recently so it's easy to forget that he does read the game very well and that the timing of his challenges are fantastic. How many times has Matic broken up dangerous play for us resulting in fantastic counter attacking opportunities? Earlier in the season people were saying that he was the best player in the league and they weren't too wrong - he was playing that well.

It's very easy for you to come out and say something like this now he's been average for a few games on the trot but honestly, the only thing Schneiderlin trumps Matic in is probably speed, apart from that, Matic is hands down better in every single category, and I've watched a lot of Schneiderlin. Schneiderlin is definitely one of the better DMs in the league but no one in the PL can touch an on form Matic - when he's defensively fantastic and makes interceptions galore whilst still contributing massively to our offensive game by starting off the moves immaculately.

People were calling Matic one of the best, if not the best DM in the world when he was really playing well and on form, and honestly there's nothing wrong with that because he was playing at an extremely high level. I didn't see you commenting on it then - so again I say... It's very easy for you to come out and say it when he's recently been average.

[Rapkun 668]

Sorry I disagree with this a lot. Basically you are trying to insinuate that because Schneiderlin is more athletic (or faster) than Matic (mind you Matic obviously isn't in athletic) that he automatically becomes the better DM, and I think that's just not the right way to look at it at all.

Sure, Matic hasn't been in blistering form recently so it's easy to forget that he does read the game very well and that the timing of his challenges are fantastic. How many times has Matic broken up dangerous play for us resulting in fantastic counter attacking opportunities? Earlier in the season people were saying that he was the best player in the league and they weren't too wrong - he was playing that well.

It's very easy for you to come out and say something like this now he's been average for a few games on the trot but honestly, the only thing Schneiderlin trumps Matic in is probably speed, apart from that, Matic is hands down better in every single category, and I've watched a lot of Schneiderlin. Schneiderlin is definitely one of the better DMs in the league but no one in the PL can touch an on form Matic - when he's defensively fantastic and makes interceptions galore whilst still contributing massively to our offensive game by starting off the moves immaculately.

People were calling Matic one of the best, if not the best DM in the world when he was really playing well and on form, and honestly there's nothing wrong with that because he was playing at an extremely high level. I didn't see you commenting on it then - so again I say... It's very easy for you to come out and say it when he's recently been average.

I don't post too often despite being here for around 2 years, and tbh I only posted because someone said we looked better when Matic was subbed, which is true IMO. Ramires being more athletic had a lot to do with it. I always rated Schneiderlin as a player and he was having arguably the best performance from a rival player at the bridge this season. Feel free to think I'm using this as a chance to downplay Nemanja. I like him but I just don't think he's as good as you describe him.

I disagree about his displays at the start of the season. I thought he did alright, certainly better than now but nothing that would make him the best DM in the world. I still remember during the first couple of games, when he was too advanced for his position and tried to dictate our play like would Pirlo in a midfield of 3, back then he left a huge gap between the midfield and the back four. The center backs were more exposed and we looked more vulnerable to counter attacks. It's no coincidence we conceded more goals during that period. Jose and the team probably worked on that aspect of his game because he is more disciplined now and less adventurous. His lack of mobility however was and still is there, that wasn't exclusively in the second part of the season. He looked less comfortable playing against better sides and faster players. Schneiderlin being more athletic than Matic isn't everything, of course but I don't think Matic is very good in his positioning. He can intercept the ball when there's pressing infront of him or when his physical abilities allow him to but he can't be reliable against a good opposition.

At the end of the day this is only my opinion so you're free to disagree, and quite frankly I can't see this debate going anywhere so we will probably have to agree to disagree.