David Luiz

[Tomo 21,681]

I know he hasnt been in great form of late but....

Excuse me? what the hell are you doing bringing facts into it? only myths are allowed on this thread

[Mouri_Matic 560]

Any one feels he might get arrogant more by the day and as a result start to laid back a bit more? His explosiveness seems to have been gone this season, now he looks very different from the one we signed 2 years ago. While he is a bit better defensively, he is also so much more laid back. Remember that Fulham game where he gave away a penalty at the last min? Now 2 weeks ago he made a careless error against Cardiff and don't seem to give a fuck anymore. Same with again Newcastle despite not being directly at fault.

Maybe that Barca bid this summer has changed his mind and attitude, now he thinks because Barca want him he is automatically one of the best CB in the world and it doesn't matter if he is dropped, if he wants to leave other big teams will come in for him anyway. Also a few weeks ago I think he came out and said he got nothing to prove, everyone knows who David Luiz is. That is Ronaldo esque arrogance, remember Luiz had never been a complete world class defender, he was just a joy to watch because of his passion and commitment, now without these 2 things he is useless as he is not even good at defending which is the most important thing for a defender.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/chelsea-defender-david-luiz-tells-jose-mourinho--i-dont-need-to-prove-anything-8839253.html

[bababoom 4,478]

Deserves to be dropped, been so poor this season. Cahill may not be as talented as Luiz but he's far more reliable.

[The only place to be 11,313]

I know he hasnt been in great form of late but....

How many of those games were in midfield?

Whilst I'm not going to get to hung up on whoscored and their ratings system, let's put his 7.03 rating into context.

Terry - 7.4 (this season)

Oscar - 7.24

Cahill - 7.06

Luiz - 6.5

Discussing these ratings is a little pointless at times, but even by that measure he's had a severe downturn in form and looks like being dropped for a second time in the space of a few weeks. And there are plenty of fans who are pissed off about that bottled challenge.

[Barbara 15,149]

He probably had a kick up the arse after Cardiff, how many kicks up the arse does he want?

how many as necessary because you don't find a CB with his potential in every corner and once you have to chance to polish a player like him that's what you do. How many chances were Mata, Hazard, Cole, Lampard given this season despite playing shit at occasions? Were they making the same kind of mistake as Luiz? Some were. Cole didn't even bother to try to catch up his opponent in a few times he was overran, he has the least amount of tackes - successful or not - among all our defenders (he has less than Oscar!). Mata should have been more objective, but instead preferred the fancier pass and is yet to have a top class performance for us this season, Hazard only recently decided to turn up to matches, although he seems to be pondering about taking another break. The nature diverges a bit, and while with Cole and Lampard I blame Mourinho's stubbornness and also lack of much better replacements, Mata, Hazard and Luiz are kept because Mourinho thinks he needs to polish those players into what they need to be molded to. Mourinho is looking at the long term...

Maybe Luiz won't start tomorrow, but give what was our main problem Saturday and what he did in the pitch 95% of time, I'm not sure he had the kind of performance Mourinho had a problem with. I'm positive Mata won't start and I'm not entirely convinced Hazard will. Cole and Lampard shouldn't, but how much does Mourinho trust Mikel and Bertrand? I wouldn't be surprised by seeing Azpilicueta as a LB again. Oscar and Torres may be dropped as well, but whether he's dropped tomorrow or not, I see Mourinho insisting with Luiz despite of his mistakes in the long run because not only Luiz has rare technical quality in his position, but especially because Mourinho cherishes a lot that kind of defensive player - the kind that is technical and build instead of raffling the ball by trying to get rid of it as soon as possible.

Also his mistakes aren't costing our matches... the same can't be said about a few other players... yes, he cost us goals this seasons, others cost us points... we need a bit of patience.

What I think Mourinho will do and I completely support him is: he'll play Cahill in the big matches - like tomorrow - and he'll stick with Luiz in EPL especially given the oppositions we're facing until Christmas. As Luiz progresses, Cahill will be less used in the big matches until he's back into the player he is: a squad member. If Luiz can't improve in a whole season, then I see us going for another CB next summer, but Mourinho won't give up on him as fast as you think (or implied) he should. He'll give him plenty of chances and kicks in the arse and will exhaust his efforts with him.

[The only place to be 11,313]

how many as necessary because you don't find a CB with his potential

He's 26.

We don't talk about players like Ramires and Mikel in terms of potential. Luiz should be approaching his prime and yet he's still prone to switching off and making boneheaded decisions. At what point do you stop expecting him to grow up and accept that he is who he is?

Maybe we should listen to the man himself when he says, I don’t need to prove anything. Everyone knows who David Luiz is

[Tomo 21,681]

He's 26.

We don't talk about players like Ramires and Mikel in terms of potential. Luiz should be approaching his prime and yet he's still prone to switching off and making boneheaded decisions. At what point do you stop expecting him to grow up and accept that he is who he is?

Maybe we should listen to the man himself when he says, I don’t need to prove anything. Everyone knows who David Luiz is

When Lucio was 27 he was getting his pants pulled down by Didier Drogba and Joe Cole in a CL quarter final, a few years on he was arguably the best defender in the world for a treble winning Inter team.

[kellzfresh 7,226]

How many of those games were in midfield?

Whilst I'm not going to get to hung up on whoscored and their ratings system, let's put his 7.03 rating into context.

Terry - 7.4 (this season)

Oscar - 7.24

Cahill - 7.06

Luiz - 6.5

Discussing these ratings is a little pointless at times, but even by that measure he's had a severe downturn in form and looks like being dropped for a second time in the space of a few weeks. And there are plenty of fans who are pissed off about that bottled challenge.

I just found it though. I think it was made before the newcastle game.

That midfield run he had, we won a lot of games with him there but no one likes him there so we've dumped it. He's had some bad games but i really want him to get back his last season form, it will be a massive bonus for us.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

I realy liked him because of his fighting spirit and commitment to Chelsea, it looks like he doesnt care anymore. If that is the case, he can leave...

[Mouri_Matic 560]

When Lucio was 27 he was getting his pants pulled down by Didier Drogba and Joe Cole in a CL quarter final, a few years on he was arguably the best defender in the world for a treble winning Inter team.

Yeah FOR ONE SEASON LOL then after that he gone shit again, is that what you want from Luiz too? Lucio was never a world class player, he was just a decent player who had an exceptional season, after Jose is gone he reversed back to his horrible form and now no one even know where he is anymore.

[Tomo 21,681]

Yeah FOR ONE SEASON LOL then after that he gone shit again, is that what you want from Luiz too? Lucio was never a world class player, he was just a decent player who had an exceptional season, after Jose is gone he reversed back to his horrible form and now no one even know where he is anymore.

He got better after that season and ended up with being one of the key elements to the treble winning season in 2010 for Inter, considering he was 33 after that season it is kind of understandable that he declined after.

[Mouri_Matic 560]

He got better after that season and ended up with being one of the key elements to the treble winning season in 2010 for Inter, considering he was 33 after that season it is kind of understandable that he declined from that season onwards.

Like I said he only had one good season for Inter and it was that 09-10 season, after Jose is gone he is horrible again and you just reminded yourself there, if he is the best at 33 years old are we gonna wait for Luiz to become 31-33 to be the best CB in the world? If that is what everyone here called potential then I would rather the club sell him for £40m and buy a Mangala who is younger and have more potential.

[JDY 1,290]

He got better after that season and ended up with being one of the key elements to the treble winning season in 2010 for Inter, considering he was 33 after that season it is kind of understandable that he declined from that season onwards.

Dante was a horror show at Gladbach to, at 29 he was one of the finest ball playing defenders around & led Bayern to the treble. Barzagli was terrible in Germany in his mid to late 20s. Exceptional at Juve in his 30s.

Defenders generally tend to peak later than other outfield positions. There's no problem saying Luiz still has potential to be 1 or 2 levels up from where he is at the moment.

[Barbara 15,149]

He's 26.

We don't talk about players like Ramires and Mikel in terms of potential. Luiz should be approaching his prime and yet he's still prone to switching off and making boneheaded decisions. At what point do you stop expecting him to grow up and accept that he is who he is?

Maybe we should listen to the man himself when he says, I don’t need to prove anything. Everyone knows who David Luiz is

his problem is mainly in the mentality. He has the tools, the skills, the intuition which are things that can't be taught. So giving him stability (in his play) and working his head is easily possible to do at 26. When I say potential I'm talking about stability. When we needed him the most last season he was there saving our arses while Ivanovic and Cahill were leaving all kind of messes behind them.

I believe he can mature and get passed his mistakes because while he's 26 he's young and I don't think any of his previous managers worked a lot on him about that. They just trusted him and overlooked his occasional messes. Mourinho isn't like that and he'll try to fully develop him.

As for the ratings, whoscored shouldn't be used for fuck, they're useless and I can't believe people even bother with that. But in the two matches prior to the Cardiff match Luiz was our best player in the pitch by the long mile. He also had other great matches before those two. And then he messed up and he's struggling and he isn't in form. But he will be given as many chances as needed, Mourinho is much more patient than fans - as he should. It's clear our philosophy will be based in a lot of pressing and there are few CBs (not even Terry btw) who can anticipate and intercept better than Luiz because of his bold and aggressive defending. Mourinho will wear out his attempts to give Luiz stability because if he can work past his instability issues, he'll be one of the key players in Mourinho's team and Mourinho knows it. That's why during summer transfer speculation he was shy to say say Mata would stay, but went out of his way to say Luiz weren't for sale and complimented him more than once.

If Mourinho fails (or better said, Luiz fails) he will look for a better player to replace Luiz. Cahill isn't and will never be the kind of player Mourinho needs or wants in the starting XI. Among all those terrible performances by Luiz you saw Mourinho complimenting Cahill only once - in the English NT.

[Tomo 21,681]

If Mourinho fails (or better said, Luiz fails) he will look for a better player to replace Luiz. Cahill isn't and will never be the kind of player Mourinho needs or wants in the starting XI. Among all those terrible performances by Luiz you saw Mourinho complimenting Cahill only once - in the English NT.

That's the nail on head. There's no denying Luiz is on poor form right now and would probably have seen a fair bit of bench time if an in form Alex was still around, but Cahill is just not good enough to be anything more than a decent squad player.

[Henrique 9,133]

This topic us full of pointeless posts. Now there ia this silly talk: he does not care anymore.

People used to say Luiz problem was that he liked to go forward, and sometimes he was way too ruthless, so he put himself in situation to get red cards.

Now that he is not doing that anymore people are saying he doesnt care anymore. Typical.

[The only place to be 11,313]

his problem is mainly in the mentality. He has the tools, the skills, the intuition which are things that can't be taught. So giving him stability (in his play) and working his head is easily possible to do at 26.

I completely disagree. I think you're completely underestimating the importance of mentality in sportsmen. Luiz is blessed with tremendous physical attributes - the kind that John Terry could only dream about. But JT has the mentality, will to win, bollocks, whatever you want to call it that has made him a great player. He's not going to beat players for pace, but he'll outfight them and he won't give up (although he's not perfect). Luiz needs to start showing that now, not 12 months down the line because he won't be here if that's the case.

If Mourinho fails (or better said, Luiz fails) he will look for a better player to replace Luiz. Cahill isn't and will never be the kind of player Mourinho needs or wants in the starting XI. Among all those terrible performances by Luiz you saw Mourinho complimenting Cahill only once - in the English NT.

I don't think you know Mourinho. The one thing Mourinho wants in a player is that he play for his teammates and not let them down. Cahill might not be as technically gifted as Luiz but I've never seen him bottle a challenge or give less than 100% for the shirt, for the club and for the fans in the stands.

Until he can be bothered to show up for the games against Cardiff and Newcastle which aren't as sexy as Barcelona and Man United but still cost the same for the blokes in the ground who support their team week-in and week-out, then he's not going to be in the team.

[Mouri_Matic 560]

This topic us full of pointeless posts. Now there ia this silly talk: he does not care anymore.

People used to say Luiz problem was that he liked to go forward, and sometimes he was way too ruthless, so he put himself in situation to get red cards.

Now that he is not doing that anymore people are saying he doesnt care anymore. Typical.

No it is called passion and commitment. It is just that most people including me is getting annoyed with his LAID BACK ATTITUDE recently as evidently against Cardiff and Newcastle then come his statement that everyone know who he is, if that isn't arrogance then I don't know what is. He looks like he is starting to get ahead of himself and believe he is better than he actually is.