Sarri But Not Sarri Thread

[Atomiswave 6,072]

2 hours ago, communicate said:

I don't know how Pep improve Fernandinho. He started to play that discipline role under Pellegrini. 

Luiz ? Luiz was fantastic when we won the league playing in back 5. That is the key. It has nothing to do with improvement. He has always been error prone. You just have more cover with back 5.

Sarri has done wonder with Cho especially defensively. Still not great but much2 better. The same with rlc, tactically much improved. 

Honestly with Kovacic, I don't know. He has tons of talent but I think he is more suited to deeper role than in attacking cm role. 

At the end of the day mate, Conte did more in the tactical sense, positioning, motivation, hunger and desire than Sarri ever will at our Club. Can you imagine if we actually backed him with his players? He understood what Chels was about, thats why he instantly bonded with the fans and we loved his passion, and the players ate all that up and gave their all.

[OneMoSalah 8,616]

10 hours ago, Tomo said:

If he was surrendering to fans, then why isn't Kante at DM?

I think he started playing league games because he improved his discipline off the ball (which is important when the other winger is Hazard).

Exactly.

Do people really think a stubborn manager bowed to fan pressure with CHO or RLC even? I really dont think so. I look at our 2-0 v City with Willian and Pedro and at the time I doubt CHO would of been as effective in the defensive phase as he was v Liverpool for instance.

And as you said Kante would be DM (although hes never played as a sitter in a 3 man MF in the PL except first 4 games under Conte) as well if it was down to fan pressure. Also if Sarri really did bow to fan pressure 'to save his job' Jorginho, Kovacic and Alonso would have also been dropped months and months ago. He also probably would have swapped from 433 to 4231 if this was the case.

RLC wasnt regular due to fitness and back problems. CHO probably needed to learn and improve off the ball in the other phase which the difference is night and day because weve all seen how cruical full backs are at the top level these days and nulifying them helps, as weve found out on many occasions like when Atletico dumped us out the CL seasons ago with Filipe Luis (I think) getting a massive assist after Hazard didnt track him and even Luke Shaw yesterday providing that assist through being unmarked. Dont think the whole fan and media going on about it made a huge difference, I doubt he even took huge notice of it. 

Someone as stubborn as Sarri or even in the past Conte and Mourinho, is/were hardly gonna give in to the media or the fans, regarding Callum or any other player in the past. Maybe Callums transfer request put pressure on Sarri to show him he wanted him to stay by playing him but I cant see the fans and media (who are tossers with agendas) having as huge an influence as some may believe in terms of coaching and picking teams or squads. I doubt many football clubs and managers are bothered about what the press has to say in footballing terms. 

If we were winning chances are nobody would of gave a shit anyway. Just like at the start of the season. Fans have opinions but I doubt a manager is going to be hugely bothered whether or not they are angry that he isnt playing player X or Y, even with the style has he changed despite the fuck Sarriball chanting shit? No, not one bit. Fans are fans and managers are managers. For instance do you think Pep gives into City fans or English media wanting to see Foden play more? Probably not. 

Think despite the poor season he will be here next season. If its another shite season then its fair to say sacking Conte was a big mistake but again this time last year the Conte thread was effectively the same, 'why does he not play Emerson?', 'wheres Luiz?', 'hes gonna drive players out of the club', 'the football is boring and shite to watch...', 'why did he sell Chalobah to sign Bakayoko?' etc etc. I think its clear regardless of manager, regardless of philosophy that the squad is a bigger concern. Realisitically 3 "bad" seasons in 4 or 5 years. Same core bulk of players minus Courtois, Terry, Cesc, Costa and Matic and a few others. Some of them have declined, some of them have lost their hunger, some probably arent good enough and some probably dont/didnt want to be here at the start of the season. 

[Jase 43,479]

28 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

Exactly.

Do people really think a stubborn manager bowed to fan pressure with CHO or RLC even? I really dont think so. I look at our 2-0 v City with Willian and Pedro and at the time I doubt CHO would of been as effective in the defensive phase as he was v Liverpool for instance.

And as you said Kante would be DM (although hes never played as a sitter in a 3 man MF in the PL except first 4 games under Conte) as well if it was down to fan pressure. Also if Sarri really did bow to fan pressure 'to save his job' Jorginho, Kovacic and Alonso would have also been dropped months and months ago. He also probably would have swapped from 433 to 4231 if this was the case.

RLC wasnt regular due to fitness and back problems. CHO probably needed to learn and improve off the ball in the other phase which the difference is night and day because weve all seen how cruical full backs are at the top level these days and nulifying them helps, as weve found out on many occasions like when Atletico dumped us out the CL seasons ago with Filipe Luis (I think) getting a massive assist after Hazard didnt track him and even Luke Shaw yesterday providing that assist through being unmarked. Dont think the whole fan and media going on about it made a huge difference, I doubt he even took huge notice of it. 

Someone as stubborn as Sarri or even in the past Conte and Mourinho, is/were hardly gonna give in to the media or the fans, regarding Callum or any other player in the past. Maybe Callums transfer request put pressure on Sarri to show him he wanted him to stay by playing him but I cant see the fans and media (who are tossers with agendas) having as huge an influence as some may believe in terms of coaching and picking teams or squads. I doubt many football clubs and managers are bothered about what the press has to say in footballing terms. 

Okay, let's pretend CHO's game time, especially in the Premier League, didn't conveniently increase after the fans' protest in that Cardiff game or fans/media pressure to play CHO after his England performances in the last international break...

From the start of February till mid-March - the international break - CHO played only 267 in 8 games and started only 2 of them - both in the Europa League. After the international break or rather, after the protest at Cardiff, CHO suddenly played 275 minutes in just 5 games and started 4 consecutive league games.  

And oh, Sarri also suddenly plays CHO/Loftus-Cheek in a following game when rumors of him getting the sack start to crank up. Almost as if he was trying to appease the fans and save his job...

28 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

Also if Sarri really did bow to fan pressure 'to save his job' Jorginho, Kovacic and Alonso would have also been dropped months and months ago. He also probably would have swapped from 433 to 4231 if this was the case.

Sure, but were those noises as loud as giving CHO, Loftus-Cheek more game time? 

[OneMoSalah 8,616]

2 minutes ago, Jason said:

Okay, let's pretend CHO's game time, especially in the Premier League, didn't conveniently increase after the fans' protest in that Cardiff game or fans/media pressure to play CHO after his England performances in the last international break...

From the start of February till mid-March - the international break - CHO played only 267 in 8 games and started only 2 of them - both in the Europa League. After the international break or rather, after the protest at Cardiff, CHO suddenly played 275 minutes in just 5 games and started 4 consecutive league games.  

And oh, Sarri also suddenly plays CHO/Loftus-Cheek in a following game when rumors of him getting the sack start to crank up. Almost as if he was trying to appease the fans and save his job...

Sure, but were those noises as loud as giving CHO, Loftus-Cheek more game time? 

So you are saying Sarri, stubborn in everything many have said he is, thought playing 2 x u23 year old Englishmen was the only way to appease the fans and save his job???? And if we lost all those games they played in would us fans of been happy because they still played? A good run of results were the only thing that saved his job. Yes certain players (CHO, RLC and Emerson) minutes increased and other players played less but I think your making more of it than what it is. Callums transfer request probably put more pressure on Sarri to use him than the fans or the media. He could and should of played more earlier in the season (Ruben too) but theres no doubt hes more disciplined and Ruben looks more fitter (probably fittest hes been in his career) and offering more than he ever has in terms of goals/asists. Even Ross Barkley arguably fitter than hes ever been although irrelevant.

Fans can love or hate a manager for selections but if he is getting results would a club be as worried? Everyone has an opinion thats football but for a manager at any club its a result based business. If Sarri was getting results regardless of team selection it wouldnt of mattered. The sack rumours came after a spell of poor form, we won 4 on the bounce or whatever and they went away. Regardless of his starting 11. The whole CHO situation for me was a huge byproduct of the media and fans being frustrated about bad results more than anything as well as England starting him in the international break. If we hadnt had that dip nobody would of been fussed if he had played 23 minutes or 8 games in that period. Or if Ruben had played. Even with the playing style if we had won convincingly playing shite, people would be praising the team for being able to grind out results.

This is Chelsea, the manager getting sacked is always a rumour at some point in the season. Contes future was heavily speculated upon after that Arsenal and Liverpool losses in his first season, which were like 4 games into the season. Sarri was "getting sacked" in month X or Y and after the cup final v City if we lost. Doesnt matter for whatever reason or that, it always comes around when the clubs in poor form, he didnt save his job by playing 2 youngsters, he saved his job because the team won games. 

[AK-3001 286]

I love how the coach gets blamed for an injury to a player that wasn't a fitness issue. Oh btw, it's the same coach that was being blamed for not playing the same player earlier in the season himself. The coach just can't get a break, can he?

 

I don't want Sarri to go, mostly because I know and have seen his Napoli side and know what he's capable of doing. Also, the present Napoli side under Ancelotti is nowhere close to Sarri's Napoli side of 3 years back with mostly the same players bar Jorginho. 

 

I also struggle to understand, what more do you want from manager with this squad? I get it you can blame Sarri for Higuain signing cause he wanted him, but the current crop of players, they're just not good enough to pose a title challenge. The best we could hope for was a Top 4 finish anyway, if we get it, it's a good season re Objectives. 

 

Also, just stop this chopping and changing of managers. Look at the Top 3 in the league. All of them have a long twerm project in place, stop the quick fixes and have a project in place. It was always going to be difficult turning a side that was suited to a 3 at the back formation to a 4 at the back posession based style. The full backs we have, every one of them, is not suited to the current system. Our CM looks decent, our attack is dire as hell. CHO produced in Europa but not doing it in league. It's all about Hazard and it's msotly down to the quality of the players, rather than the tactics of the manager. 

 

As Pep said at his time in Barcelona, "My Job is to get the players with the ball in the Final Third, the rest is upto them to create."

[Jase 43,479]

4 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

So you are saying Sarri, stubborn in everything many have said he is, thought playing 2 x u23 year old Englishmen was the only way to appease the fans and save his job????

Essentially, you're trying to say that a stubborn person is immune to fear? Since when those two go hand-in-hand? Why then did CHO's game time conveniently increased after that Cardiff game?

4 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

And if we lost all those games they played in would us fans of been happy because they still played? A good run of results were the only thing that saved his job.

Given the circumstances, fans would rather lose when the manager tries out new players, players from the academy rather, players who can improve rather than keep on playing bang average players, players who are out of form. 

4 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

Yes certain players (CHO, RLC and Emerson) minutes increased and other players played less but I think your making more of it than what it is. Callums transfer request probably put more pressure on Sarri to use him than the fans or the media.

I'm making more than what it is? If that's the case, then tell me why exactly that CHO's game time went up after that Cardiff game? Funny thing about that transfer request is that it did force Sarri's hands and it did but only in January. Once that transfer window closed, it was back to what we saw before that until that Cardiff game

4 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

Fans can love or hate a manager for selections but if he is getting results would a club be as worried? Everyone has an opinion thats football but for a manager at any club its a result based business. If Sarri was getting results regardless of team selection it wouldnt of mattered. The sack rumours came after a spell of poor form, we won 4 on the bounce or whatever and they went away.

The sack rumors did go away after getting some wins on the bounce but it also came after Sarri started playing CHO and Loftus-Cheek more than usual this month. When he didn't play them, we were not winning games, playing dull football and were going nowhere with the XI that got us into all this mess to begin with.

4 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

This is Chelsea, the manager getting sacked is always a rumour at some point in the season. Contes future was heavily speculated upon after that Arsenal and Liverpool losses in his first season, which were like 4 games into the season. Sarri was "getting sacked" in month X or Y and after the cup final v City if we lost. Doesnt matter for whatever reason or that, it always comes around when the clubs in poor form, he didnt save his job by playing 2 youngsters, he saved his job because the team won games. 

But it's not just the sacking rumors with Sarri, is it? We've had two occasions this year alone where the fans loudly protested against him and the last time such thing happened with us was when Benitez was the manager and we all knew he was never going to succeed long term here. No manager is going to succeed long term at any club if the fans are openly against that fella. 

[Atomiswave 6,072]

11 hours ago, AK-3001 said:

I love how the coach gets blamed for an injury to a player that wasn't a fitness issue. Oh btw, it's the same coach that was being blamed for not playing the same player earlier in the season himself. The coach just can't get a break, can he?

 

I don't want Sarri to go, mostly because I know and have seen his Napoli side and know what he's capable of doing. Also, the present Napoli side under Ancelotti is nowhere close to Sarri's Napoli side of 3 years back with mostly the same players bar Jorginho. 

 

I also struggle to understand, what more do you want from manager with this squad? I get it you can blame Sarri for Higuain signing cause he wanted him, but the current crop of players, they're just not good enough to pose a title challenge. The best we could hope for was a Top 4 finish anyway, if we get it, it's a good season re Objectives. 

 

Also, just stop this chopping and changing of managers. Look at the Top 3 in the league. All of them have a long twerm project in place, stop the quick fixes and have a project in place. It was always going to be difficult turning a side that was suited to a 3 at the back formation to a 4 at the back posession based style. The full backs we have, every one of them, is not suited to the current system. Our CM looks decent, our attack is dire as hell. CHO produced in Europa but not doing it in league. It's all about Hazard and it's msotly down to the quality of the players, rather than the tactics of the manager. 

 

As Pep said at his time in Barcelona, "My Job is to get the players with the ball in the Final Third, the rest is upto them to create."

Mate, Seria A is not EPL.......its not even the same galaxy, just because he did alright with Napoli does not mean he will do well here. What more we want from Sarri you say? How about some flexability, change of formation and tactics, how about you dont play the same players no matter how out of form they are, he stil has not understood what is needed in epl. he doesnt even have the sight or balls to change a defender for an attacker when a result is needed, everybody is reating us like an open book game after game. Sure I dont want to change and chop managers so often.......but keeping Sarri just for that sake is pure idiocy. You keep a manager when you can see progress, some form of play that can grow and its there to see, this season has been awfull, most boring spineless footy I myself have seen from Chels. I see none of what makes Chelsea, Chelsea. Soft and without will and desire. Im willing to bet money with you that if he stays, we wont be 1 click better. Actually worse, cuz all our rivals will be boosting themselves.

[OneMoSalah 8,616]

12 hours ago, Jason said:

Essentially, you're trying to say that a stubborn person is immune to fear? Since when those two go hand-in-hand? Why then did CHO's game time conveniently increased after that Cardiff game?

Given the circumstances, fans would rather lose when the manager tries out new players, players from the academy rather, players who can improve rather than keep on playing bang average players, players who are out of form. 

I'm making more than what it is? If that's the case, then tell me why exactly that CHO's game time went up after that Cardiff game? Funny thing about that transfer request is that it did force Sarri's hands and it did but only in January. Once that transfer window closed, it was back to what we saw before that until that Cardiff game

The sack rumors did go away after getting some wins on the bounce but it also came after Sarri started playing CHO and Loftus-Cheek more than usual this month. When he didn't play them, we were not winning games, playing dull football and were going nowhere with the XI that got us into all this mess to begin with.

But it's not just the sacking rumors with Sarri, is it? We've had two occasions this year alone where the fans loudly protested against him and the last time such thing happened with us was when Benitez was the manager and we all knew he was never going to succeed long term here. No manager is going to succeed long term at any club if the fans are openly against that fella. 

In my eyes a manager who wouldnt change tactics, formations, drop Jorginho or Alonso at virtually any costs in the first 6 months is hardly gonna let fan unrest and fear of the sack force his hand with 2 young players and if this is the case he shouldnt be managing at the top level. Simple as that. Even if he gets sacked he woulf surely rather go out trying his way? He was brought in to change the style, not promote youth which has never been successfully done in the last 20 years here. Managers have got to do their thing, make their own decisions, if they are going to be heavily influenced by media or fans or whatever whats the point in them being the manager if they cant make their own judgement calls? Or arent confident in their ideas? 

Callum, Ruben, Emersons playing time being more frequent in these times were merely a coincidence with the whole sack rumours and the protests stemmed from bad results first and foremost, as well as take into consideration how poor Alonso, Kovacic/Barkley and Pedro/Willian were playing as well. Basically, playing Ruben and Callum didnt "save his job" which I think would be ridiculous to even claim, maybe it made the fans happier (fans should support the team regardless and if nobody seen an average transitional season coming then I would be speechless) but his goal is to get the team to win games, winning games makes fans happier and makes players more confident. Winning games 100% saved his job. 

Even then if he doesnt get CL this season chances are he will be sacked and it wont even matter. If he bowed to fan pressure regarding 2 players why hasnt or didnt he bow to disrest from fans and media about Kantes position, Jorginho, Alonso this season? Makes absolutely zero sense. Theres a reason why managers are paid huge sums of money to take the responsibility, create teams and do whatever else. If Sarri is going to bow to fan pressure regarding selections he might as well resign because that for me is ridiculous, managers have years of courses and experiencez to get to where they are if they cannot make their own judgements calls they arent fit for the job.

Even if we dont finish top 4 or get the CL, is Callum and Ruben playing more frequently gonna help his case when the club, where the ambition and pressure has always been huge, review the season or consider replacing him? It will not make any difference at all. Which is why I dont think the fan unrest about not using those two earlier will not have been a factor in him selecting them or retaining his job.

Honestly think fan protests were a bit stupid, yes weve been shite but it was enivitable and has been on the cards for years. If it was Conte or Mourinho and not Sarri would those 2 lack of playing time for them be an issue? Youd honestly think we were Ajax when people complain about not using RLC or CHO earlier in the season every week. We arent. The last player before Christensen (who has been the most regular academy player here in recent seasons) to have been fully integrated was John Terry. I find it ridiculous that fans who were obviously frustrated as we all were with results are going to use that excuse to mention 2 young players who in all reality havent improved our season much in the bigger scheme of things. If they had been influential in securing us top 4 yes people would have a point but theyve played in games where nothing has really changed. For instance, Ruben was great v Liverpool but we still lost 2-0.... another matter if people think those 2 playing earlier on in the season would have made a big difference in terms of how the seasons panned out they are deluded because weve not had a good goal scoring CF all season and weve struggled to keep clean sheets... also if CHO not playing was an issue what about Ampadu? Nobody has said a word. It was just a by product of frustration based on results.

[the wes 7,212]

We deserved to win and I want to win the final - Sarri

 

https://www.goal.com/en/news/we-deserved-to-win-and-i-want-to-win-the-final-sarri/1xuexb9iaxyg91lvx6vxa21mff

 

[Fulham Broadway 16,424]

Think he got it right last night. The bloke is in his first season. A season in which he was hired late, so he had no prep time and a shortened pre-season. A season in which many of the players had a shortened pre-season due to the World Cup. AND he was tasked with completely overhauling our style of play away from defensive football and moving to possession based attacking football. If you would have suggested to fans at the start of the season that we would be in 4th place this season with a shot to win the Europa most would have taken that for a success. But once you decide you hate Sarri, that consumes all logic.

 There is the wider issue of social media fuelling extreme opinions and everything having to fit a particular narrative, with no middle ground anymore. No one is 100% great and 100% crap.

He’s far from perfect but he is what he is, and this would be a tricky job for anyone at the moment.

[MoroccanBlue 5,211]

His tactical inflexibility, particularly when we are losing, is my only concern of him. 

But then again, it goes back to the argument, who out there available, is better?

[killer1257 3,282]

23 minutes ago, Mana said:

If Sarri manages to get top 4 and EL, I’ll move from Sarri Out to on the fence.

Because he clawed his way out from what was looking like an embarrassing season to achieving 2 big targets.

So if he does achieve those, I won’t be pissed if Sarri stays. But the question mark over him still remains. Will he be able to take Chelsea to the next level? Or it’s going to the same old shite.

We only would get into the Top 4  because  Arsenal, United and Spurs are as bad as we are...

[Nicco 927]

The Sarri haters are getting pathetic, I don't even feel pleasure reading the comments in the Live Commentary anymore.

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

He has us in 3rd. He deserves a lot of credit for that.

[Vesper 27,383]

1 minute ago, MrExcalibur100 said:

He has us in 3rd. He deserves a lot of credit for that.

situational m8

we have tossed away 26 points in games we should have won

[Laylabelle 9,305]

Waiting till the end of the season to give him credit credit especially as we could've been comfy in this position and silly points dropped here there and everywhere means we're still not yet.

Lets get over the finish line first. 

[Vybz Kartel 1,613]

Sarri has his flaws but it's not all his fault, most of our problems he inherited. I'm hoping we get a good window in and see were he can take us, I genuinely think we are 2 proper fullbacks, a proper CB and decent striker away from being a world class team. At times we have been exquisite during the season

[Vybz Kartel 1,613]

7 hours ago, Mana said:

If Sarri manages to get top 4 and EL, I’ll move from Sarri Out to on the fence.

Because he clawed his way out from what was looking like an embarrassing season to achieving 2 big targets.

So if he does achieve those, I won’t be pissed if Sarri stays. But the question mark over him still remains. Will he be able to take Chelsea to the next level? Or it’s going to the same old shite.

This is were we need a proper DoF to help him recruit quality players we are lacking like LB, RB, RW and CF