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The Skipper

20. Callum Hudson-Odoi

Started by The Skipper,

264 posts in this topic
1 hour ago, manpe said:

Sarri said he wanted 2 wingers on the bench. Willian/Pedro and CHO, problem solved. What the fuck is Moses still doing here riding the bench and blocking the path of CHO? He's an average winger and not a full-back, he only fitted Conte's system and that's it. Need to get rid and promote CHO to his place.

Guess Sarri sees Hazard/Willian for the LW and Pedro/Moses for the RW, hence no CHO so far? 

For now, Sarri gets bit of a pass with regards to matchday squad selection. We're playing only one game per week at the moment and the players are still adapting to his methods. Will wait till September and see what he does when the League Cup and Europa League come into the equation. His squad management from that period onward will be telling.

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22 hours ago, manpe said:

Sarri said he wanted 2 wingers on the bench. Willian/Pedro and CHO, problem solved. What the fuck is Moses still doing here riding the bench and blocking the path of CHO? He's an average winger and not a full-back, he only fitted Conte's system and that's it. Need to get rid and promote CHO to his place.

I think like been mentioned its maybe for experience. Moses has it and CHO still needs to develop and get a bit more but hes shown in pre-season he can operate at a high enough level. Moses is not gonna be a starter but hes going to make a decent squad player for cup games and Europa games in all honesty. Hes hardly outstanding but again, the likes of him, Cahill, Zappacosta, all these guys who are perhaps average or worse will get adequate minutes and will deliver against lower opposition or the Europa Games so its not exactly a bad use of the squad.

We all want to see Hudson-Odoi play and I think he will but Sarri is probably banking on experience to get him through the first 6 or 7 games and for his methods to settle in, he said he needed time so lets give him the chance to build something up and then maybe integrate some other guys like Callum who I think will feature regularly under him in the cup/europa games along with Moses and Cahill. I also expect Ampadu to get the same sort of chance in these games.   

Also Sarri isn't exactly known for rotating. So to keep somebody like CHO or Ampadu on the bench every week when they could be playing u23s as well as training with the first team is a bit of a risky move, youngsters need game time, I know u23 isnt a good standard but its sensible to have Cahill/Moses on the bench who will 9 times out of 10 never come on than those 2 young guys, perhaps disheartening them by using them so sparingly off the bench and not letting them play regularly with the u23s. 

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15 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

I think like been mentioned its maybe for experience. Moses has it and CHO still needs to develop and get a bit more but hes shown in pre-season he can operate at a high enough level. Moses is not gonna be a starter but hes going to make a decent squad player for cup games and Europa games in all honesty. Hes hardly outstanding but again, the likes of him, Cahill, Zappacosta, all these guys who are perhaps average or worse will get adequate minutes and will deliver against lower opposition or the Europa Games so its not exactly a bad use of the squad.

We all want to see Hudson-Odoi play and I think he will but Sarri is probably banking on experience to get him through the first 6 or 7 games and for his methods to settle in, he said he needed time so lets give him the chance to build something up and then maybe integrate some other guys like Callum who I think will feature regularly under him in the cup/europa games along with Moses and Cahill. I also expect Ampadu to get the same sort of chance in these games.   

Also Sarri isn't exactly known for rotating. So to keep somebody like CHO or Ampadu on the bench every week when they could be playing u23s as well as training with the first team is a bit of a risky move, youngsters need game time, I know u23 isnt a good standard but its sensible to have Cahill/Moses on the bench who will 9 times out of 10 never come on than those 2 young guys, perhaps disheartening them by using them so sparingly off the bench and not letting them play regularly with the u23s. 

I do hear what youre saying mate

But right now we are in a delicate place with CHO.

theres no doubting to anybody into football the kids got 'it' and should be a very big player in the future. Hes been told this from an early age.

but as it stands his contract expires same time as Edens and tho hes apparently been offered a 5 year extension, just like Eden hes not seemingly in a rush to sign it.

He needs to be made felt that hes wanted. That we need him and he holds an important part in our future.

Theres no doubt in my mind a big important club will come kissing his arse, telling him everything he wants to hear and he will be off!

Nobody can tell me that theres no way that we couldn't give CHO playing time in this system.

We have seen just how much the steam goes out of players in this system. And just how well bringing on fast fresh legs in the 2nd half is a big help.

We could easily bring him on as cover for Pedro. whether we are winning or not.

It would give him the training needed, keep him fit, show him we want him and would be a big help to us.

I'm normally of the opinion that experience comes before youth but in this case I'm all for us using him now.

 

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35 minutes ago, Unionjack said:

I do hear what youre saying mate

But right now we are in a delicate place with CHO.

theres no doubting to anybody into football the kids got 'it' and should be a very big player in the future. Hes been told this from an early age.

but as it stands his contract expires same time as Edens and tho hes apparently been offered a 5 year extension, just like Eden hes not seemingly in a rush to sign it.

He needs to be made felt that hes wanted. That we need him and he holds an important part in our future.

Theres no doubt in my mind a big important club will come kissing his arse, telling him everything he wants to hear and he will be off!

Nobody can tell me that theres no way that we couldn't give CHO playing time in this system.

We have seen just how much the steam goes out of players in this system. And just how well bringing on fast fresh legs in the 2nd half is a big help.

We could easily bring him on as cover for Pedro. whether we are winning or not.

It would give him the training needed, keep him fit, show him we want him and would be a big help to us.

I'm normally of the opinion that experience comes before youth but in this case I'm all for us using him now.

 

Toss him in at striker when Morata comes off

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34 minutes ago, DDA said:

Is there anybody able to explain why the fuck Sarri isn't using CHO?? The most electifying player in pre season. 

Sarri is not a fan of rotation unless he has to. Sarri obviously highly rates some players who most of us think are absolute dross. Willian and Luiz and Morata (less so on the Sarri positive rate level for Morata,, but its not like we have a great plan B at striker) at the top of that list. He also doesn't seem to rate some, such as (gggrrrrr) AC (wtf, there is ZERO chance Luiz is a better CB than AC is now, ZERO, on this one thing I will not back down from), Emerson (Alonso has played great, so I am not exactly pissed off), CHO, Ampadu  Bats (which i cannot wrap my head around, but many here don't like him) Zappacosta, and then the correctly not rated (and should have been sold) Drinkwater, RLC (should be on loan), Moses, Cahill; Fabregas, Musonda (what a disappointment he has been) and Abraham (ditto, hugely underwhelming).

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3 hours ago, DDA said:

Is there anybody able to explain why the fuck Sarri isn't using CHO?? The most electifying player in pre season. 

 

2 hours ago, Vesper said:

Sarri is not a fan of rotation unless he has to. Sarri obviously highly rates some players who most of us think are absolute dross. Willian and Luiz and Morata (less so on the Sarri positive rate level for Morata,, but its not like we have a great plan B at striker) at the top of that list. He also doesn't seem to rate some, such as (gggrrrrr) AC (wtf, there is ZERO chance Luiz is a better CB than AC is now, ZERO, on this one thing I will not back down from), Emerson (Alonso has played great, so I am not exactly pissed off), CHO, Ampadu  Bats (which i cannot wrap my head around, but many here don't like him) Zappacosta, and then the correctly not rated (and should have been sold) Drinkwater, RLC (should be on loan), Moses, Cahill; Fabregas, Musonda (what a disappointment he has been) and Abraham (ditto, hugely underwhelming).

As much as i would have liked Hudson on the bench a bit more context is needed, Mbappe made 14 appearances in the same academic age CHO is now, Messi only made 9.

A solid 15 games each for him and Ampadu in all comps will represent progress, it's next season Sarri will really need to look at serious integration of both. Wouldn't be against a suitable loan move in Ethan's case but Callum needs to be the one that skips that process. 

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He will have the Carabao cup and EL to start and as well as that the usual injury issues we have to fill in. As it stands we cant be dropping Pedro, he's our best finisher and has started the season very well. Hazard is back and cemented in the side so it really only leaves the one slot on the right, and the slot is available for Pedro, Willian and CHO.

If he doesn't get chance to start in any of the competitions I mentioned then I would personally start to worry, but too early yet.

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10 minutes ago, Tomo said:

 

As much as i would have liked Hudson on the bench a bit more context is needed, Mbappe made 14 appearances in the same academic age CHO is now, Messi only made 9.

A solid 15 games each for him and Ampadu in all comps will represent progress, it's next season Sarri will really need to look at serious integration of both. Wouldn't be against a suitable loan move in Ethan's case but Callum needs to be the one that skips that process. 

Everything I have seen from Ampadu tells me he is ready to go now, this year, at top flight football. I would have very little worries if he was starting an EPL game or a Euro league games for us. He has FAR more in concentration level than Luiz, the CB disaster waiting to happen. A TRUE shame CHO is not a natural RW as I do not rate Willian unless we are talking up his value in that goddamn failed swap for Martial or the stupid move to not accept £65m from Barca for him, and then buy Malcom (who only cost Barca £37m) or went truly big and snatched up Bailey) nor can Pedro go for 50 games at his age. CHO could surely grab more minutes that way (as a RW). I would even try to run him as false nine or a straight up striker, as he has often played there in lower comps.

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4 hours ago, DDA said:

Is there anybody able to explain why the fuck Sarri isn't using CHO?? The most electifying player in pre season. 

Pre-season is not a league football, its complete different thing.

Keep calm, for now we're playing one game-a-week, and there's no need to rotate so much, there will be Europa League, League Cup etc. Think if he's get 10-15 apperances this season (off the bench & in starting lineup) it'll be quite good experience for him.

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7 hours ago, DDA said:

Is there anybody able to explain why the fuck Sarri isn't using CHO?? The most electifying player in pre season. 

Ahead of who? Pedro? Hazard? He isn't using him because everyone else has done good so far. Its obvious. 

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39 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

Ahead of who? Pedro? Hazard? He isn't using him because everyone else has done good so far. Its obvious. 

Try him at striker or a false 9, he has played it before. I would test it in an early cup tie, maybe in the second half with a big lead. Try it for a half or so, if it doesn't work, at least we know. I think Sarri has a gambler streak in him (he smokes like a chimney, thats rolling dice for sure, lol)

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4 hours ago, Vesper said:

Everything I have seen from Ampadu tells me he is ready to go now, this year, at top flight football. I would have very little worries if he was starting an EPL game or a Euro league games for us. He has FAR more in concentration level than Luiz, the CB disaster waiting to happen. A TRUE shame CHO is not a natural RW as I do not rate Willian unless we are talking up his value in that goddamn failed swap for Martial or the stupid move to not accept £65m from Barca for him, and then buy Malcom (who only cost Barca £37m) or went truly big and snatched up Bailey) nor can Pedro go for 50 games at his age. CHO could surely grab more minutes that way (as a RW). I would even try to run him as false nine or a straight up striker, as he has often played there in lower comps.

Oh stop! People like you would be the first to moan if we started the young guys and lost a game. The fact is, experience will trump youth at the moment because our young players aren't at that level yet. Like others have said, there will be cup games where they will likely be used in rotation, but to expect either Ampadu or Hudson-Odoi to start for us in a league game is mental. Hazard already occupies Hudson-Odoi's strongest position. I don't think he'll be anywhere near as effective as Pedro on the other side either seeing as he is predominantly right footed, unlike Pedro who can play well with his weaker foot too. 

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45 minutes ago, It's too big said:

Oh stop! People like you would be the first to moan if we started the young guys and lost a game. The fact is, experience will trump youth at the moment because our young players aren't at that level yet. Like others have said, there will be cup games where they will likely be used in rotation, but to expect either Ampadu or Hudson-Odoi to start for us in a league game is mental. Hazard already occupies Hudson-Odoi's strongest position. I don't think he'll be anywhere near as effective as Pedro on the other side either seeing as he is predominantly right footed, unlike Pedro who can play well with his weaker foot too. 

In another post I said a cup tie for a half with CHO as a false nine or even at striker. Ampadu could handle a league game. I completely disagree with you on that.

You lost the argument when you went with the old 'people like you' ad hominen. You know nothing about me that warrants that verbiage. 

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21 hours ago, DDA said:

Is there anybody able to explain why the fuck Sarri isn't using CHO?? The most electifying player in pre season. 

Believe me, I've been thinking about this a lot and its frustrating to me as well,....more so considering we're the only club in the top 5 that doesn't have at least one England international guaranteed to start every game,...

But I understand Sarri's difficulty in this case: Only 7 subs to be named in the PL match day squad.. 1 FB, 1 CB, 1 GK, 1 ST, 1 Winger, 1 CM, 1 CM/Winger.

In the case where we have 2 wingers on the bench, 1 of those positions will be MOST definitely taken up by Pedro/Willian (no arguing around this one, even if some people argue against it,... its a fail-safe). The 2nd winger spot, (again available only if Sarri opts to not take a backup CM), could be taken up by CHO. And honestly I would prefer CHO over say, Moses, for that one. But again, this is ONLY if Sarri chooses to keep an extra winger for the matchday squad.

Considering how unlikely it is for him to start a PL game right now, I've accepted two things (hopefully):

1. Sarri still wants to get the larger team used to his style of play. The more gelled the other players are with the style of play, the easier it will be for players like CHO and Ampadu to slot in and out. (Of course, you could argue that right now, CHO and Ampadu have played in Sarri's system longer than many of the other players in the squad)

2. CHO and Ampadu will be starters on our B team, which we will have to use more often than not, considering the number of games we will be involved in this season. They should realistically get plenty of game time if that's the case, and will increase the chances of making the PL squad on occasion.

 

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I do understand alot of what people are saying but comon, we aren't talking about Kakuta here. CHO is already a better player than Willian. I don't give a flying fuck if anybody disagrees. I see it for myself. He should be in the squad over Willian. End of.

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24 minutes ago, DDA said:

I do understand alot of what people are saying but comon, we aren't talking about Kakuta here. CHO is already a better player than Willian. I don't give a flying fuck if anybody disagrees. I see it for myself. He should be in the squad over Willian. End of.

Im sorry but it's not as straight forward as that, there's a reason very few 17 year olds play regular top flight football, even god like talents like Messi, Mbappe and Hazard made around 10-15 appearances at the same age.  You could say Messi at 17 was better that Ludovic Guily, but the latter was getting the game time.

I would wager CHO and Amps will be top two in terms of the 17-18 academic age group lads with first team minutes in Europe this season.

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