Declan Rice

[OneMoSalah 8,783]

2 hours ago, Jason said:

Maybe the club will somehow manage to pull off this deal by the end of the transfer window but it is almost bewildering that we do not seem to have a Plan B or an alternative option for the defensive midfielder position. If we end up not getting Rice, then what? Are we just gonna be happy with a half decent-half arsed midfield for another season again? Seems daft that we are seemingly putting all eggs into the Rice basket. 

100% agree. 

Same as the John Stones situation under Jose. Which for a club of our stature, similarly like United with Sancho, is pretty pathetic - even more so if we don't get him and either go for an equivalent to a Papy signing in that position which scares me or don't get someone at all. If we cannot get him we need a reasonable plan B or plan C. Thomas Partley has a 45m release clause and is twice the player in my eyes. Plus if we do sell Jorginho we are going to need someone in this ilk to replace him who can dictate a game and play through the lines from deeper positions, Thomas is a lot better on the ball and has the physicality, mobility and tenacity you'd want from someone there I feel.

I think if is a purely defensive minded midfielder we were after, its a shame Javi Martinez is the wrong side of 30 because he could do a very good job for us for 2 seasons yet I reckon but he has only got eyes on returning to Bilbao and is probably at an age where he isn't a viable option for us - despite getting Thiago Silva who obviously is better quality but Martinez is only 32 I think and has life in him yet. Even then, Wilfried Ndidi is arguably better than Rice and a definite improvement with the ball, why haven't we been linked to him if we are after a youngish DM with PL experience and still potential to grow?

It baffles me that we seem to be so set on trying to sign only English players at a huge cost. I know we haven't just done so this window but we have signed Chilwell for a fee of over 50m. We were linked with Nick Pope, Lewis Dunk, Ben White, Jadon Sancho and Declan Rice still etc. I don't know where its coming from be it the board or the manager but there is so many better players out their for better value - some bargains perhaps if you look hard enough - that would fill some of these roles. The other side also, we urgently don't lack HG players now. Reece, Andreas, Fiyako/Fikayo - never get the spelling right -, Ben, Mason, Callum, Tammy, Billy, Ruben if he stays, that's what 9? I mean if Partley wasn't possible or Ndidi wasn't a viable option or any of the other however many DMs out there okay I can see the want for Rice but I can't believe he is a first choice and only choice for us right now - it may have worked for Chilwell but it won't necessarily work for us getting Rice, clearly the desire to leave West Ham isn't as much as it was for Ben to leave Leicester.

Its also a bit off topic but its not as if Frank can turn around and say if the seasons not gone as he'd have hoped or come January or the end of it he hasn't been backed with the players he wants or be as frustrated as he was last January at the lack of incomings. Who was the last manager to have been given a window as good as this in terms of recruitment? Jose the season we won the league with him? Even then Costa and Cesc were the only ones who played regularly along with the return of Courtois. In terms of recruitment this is our best window in years and years based on the quality we've taken in. With or without a DM. 

[Tomo 21,733]

On 01/10/2020 at 6:07 PM, Jason said:

Maybe. But judging by the persistent rumors, you would think that Rice is the only defensive midfielder available in the world. It's clear that we have issues in midfield and yet despite having done well to sort out the issues at the back and in attack with new signings, we're leaving the midfield remain problematic. 

But if he's our first choice and there's clear encouragement we can get him at some point (which there is as we've heard as much from Declan himself) doesn't it make sense to wait and take the short term hit instead of blocking a squad place?

We only need to look as recently back as January to know the potential shortfalls of panicking on a plan B, imagine where we'd be right now had we panicked and signed Gedson, Bergwijn and Dembele in January?

[oldportblue 547]

hope we don’t settle for a back-up option and instead wait to sign rice later this winter or next summer...


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[Jase 43,479]

7 hours ago, Tomo said:

But if he's our first choice and there's clear encouragement we can get him at some point (which there is as we've heard as much from Declan himself) doesn't it make sense to wait and take the short term hit instead of blocking a squad place?

We only need to look as recently back as January to know the potential shortfalls of panicking on a plan B, imagine where we'd be right now had we panicked and signed Gedson, Bergwijn and Dembele in January?

You would not be wrong there if Rice is the best defensive midfielder in the world but he isn't. It is debatable whether he is even the best option out there. Plus, it's not as if the other options are useless or that their club want to insert a buy back clause.

Take a short term hit? If West Ham don't want to sell now, what makes you think they will sell in January? If we don't get him now, we'll very likely have to wait till next summer and given our midfield problems right now, can we afford to wait until then? Are we gonna spend the next 7-8 months complaining about the stupid mistakes, the midfield setup etc over and over again and watch it cost us chances of winning games and maybe even challenge for trophies? 

How is this the same as panic buying in January? We already knew for the longest time possible that the midfield is a problem for us and we have had the whole summer to address the issue but we haven't. If we don't get anyone in now, chances are we won't buy anyone till next summer and we'll see and complain about the same old problems repeatedly over the season. 

[Tomo 21,733]

8 minutes ago, Jason said:

You would not be wrong there if Rice is the best defensive midfielder in the world but he isn't. It is debatable whether he is even the best option out there. Plus, it's not as if the other options are useless or that their club want to insert a buy back clause.

Take a short term hit? If West Ham don't want to sell now, what makes you think they will sell in January? If we don't get him now, we'll very likely have to wait till next summer and given our midfield problems right now, can we afford to wait until then? Are we gonna spend the next 7-8 months complaining about the stupid mistakes, the midfield setup etc over and over again and watch it cost us chances of winning games and maybe even challenge for trophies? 

How is this the same as panic buying in January? We already knew for the longest time possible that the midfield is a problem for us and we have had the whole summer to address the issue but we haven't. If we don't get anyone in now, chances are we won't buy anyone till next summer and we'll see and complain about the same old problems repeatedly over the season. 

He doesn't have to be the best defensive midfield player in the world and he's personally not my #1 choice as my preference is a regista but if he's been identified by the club as the long term option then we'll going to wait it out like we did the other targets.

For example there's rumours about us going in for Partey last minute, that will in my opinion be a mistake as he's use to playing two man midfield for a team that cede possesion against anyone half decent, a similar profile of player in Kante struggling to adapt from that type of football to possesion orientated game in a three man midfield is partly why we entered the market for a DM in the first place. 

[Jase 43,479]

12 minutes ago, Tomo said:

He doesn't have to be the best defensive midfield player in the world and he's personally not my #1 choice as my preference is a regista but if he's been identified by the club as the long term option then we'll going to wait it out like we did the other targets.

Pretty sure Rice is a Lampard target as opposed to the club's, going by the stories out there.

14 minutes ago, Tomo said:

For example there's rumours about us going in for Partey last minute, that will in my opinion be a mistake as he's use to playing two man midfield for a team that cede possesion against anyone half decent, a similar profile of player in Kante struggling to adapt from that type of football to possesion orientated game in a three man midfield is partly why we entered the market for a DM in the first place. 

Partey or not, it's almost irresponsible that we don't seem to have other alternatives and are throwing all the eggs into one basket. Unless West Ham get relegated, there's no guarantee either that they will change their stance on Rice next summer given he's on a long term contract there and Rice isn't even doing anything to try and force the move, regardless of what he has said in interviews etc. 

[NikkiCFC 8,041]

 

[killer1257 3,282]

 

I really do not know why he loves Rice so much lol

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[oldportblue 547]

I really do not know why he loves Rice so much lol

 

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because he’s an amazing young player who is captain at 21, good technically and has good physicality (something we need), is used to the PL, is a great leader, already in the England starting XI, fits our exact needs in terms of dm/cb and is a lifelong chelsea fan too... seems pretty obvious to me lol

 

 

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[robsblubot 3,528]

Yeah not sure starting for England means that much. England has got some good players for sure, but the midfield in particular is as far from the elite as it has ever been. (sorry)

Have to be honest here and Rice does not look good enough on the ball. He also does not seem to be quick enough esp considering his young age. I can imagine him losing some pace and becoming a very limited player - prob even permanently moving to CB.

Just hope that our scouts (and Frank) know what they are doing here.

 

[DANILA 290]

Stay away. At this point we actually need players with more experience; We could almost play our starting XI in a U23 league lol 

[Atomiswave 6,072]

1 hour ago, DANILA said:

Stay away. At this point we actually need players with more experience; We could almost play our starting XI in a U23 league lol 

Yeah thats true, but thats because we are building for the future, once we add a few more players in and they gel and click then we are rolling.

[Jase 43,479]

The club will try to go for Rice again in January, according to The Athletic...

https://theathletic.com/2173219/?source=twitteruk

Chelsea are hoping Declan Rice will ignore any efforts by West Ham to convince him to sign a new contract because they are planning to make another attempt to sign him in January, writes Simon Johnson.

Rice was wanted by Chelsea in the last transfer window, but the west London club never made an official bid because they were unable to sell the players required to raise the extra funds.

Chelsea spent in excess of £200 million on Hakim Ziyech, Kai Havertz, Timo Werner, Ben Chilwell and Edouard Mendy, while Thiago Silva joined as a free agent.

Due to the size of that outlay, Chelsea didn’t have the cash to buy Rice as well, especially as West Ham manager David Moyes warned it would take “Bank of England” money for any deal to happen.

The Athletic understands that two permanent transfers of first-team squad players had been put in place which would have brought in enough capital to allow Chelsea to make an offer for Rice. But both fell through days before the October 5 deadline so things were put on hold.

Rice has been in fine form this season and West Ham are concerned Chelsea’s interest has not gone away.

The 21-year-old, who has already made 106 Premier League appearances, has a contract at the London Stadium until 2024, but West Ham want to discuss fresh terms and offer a significant pay rise to ensure he stays.

It will still be difficult for Chelsea to sign Rice in the new year, especially as West Ham have made a promising start to the campaign. But they believe the England international, who would be eligible to play for them in the Champions League, should they reach the knockout phase, can be convinced to make the switch should a fee be agreed. Outgoings could once again be an important factor.

As The Athletic revealed in September, coach Frank Lampard wants Rice to be the first-choice holding midfielder as well as a possible option at centre-back. N’Golo Kante started in the holding role in Saturday’s 3-0 win at Burnley but is not seen as a long-term option in that position. Lampard sees the former Leicester man as either the more adventurous central midfielder in a two or on the right of a three.

[Fernando 6,483]

Yes please. 

Lampard is building a good team. 

Regardless if in the future he leaves the club, he is doing an amazing job of building the squad with these buys. Much better then Conte, Sarri, Mourinho Mark 2. 

[killer1257 3,282]

If Rice comes, we need to sell Ampadu. Would be a waste of his time to be at this club

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[Puliiszola 519]

2 hours ago, killer1257 said:

If Rice comes, we need to sell Ampadu. Would be a waste of his time to be at this club

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Not sure. He can be a good no.2 plus a 3rd/4th choice CB.

If we get rice we will have Rice, kante, Kovacic, ampadu, gilmour, Gallagher, mount, Kai, barkley, rlc, jorginho as the mid options. 

FL will need to make some really tough decisions on whom to sell and keep

[killer1257 3,282]

Not sure. He can be a good no.2 plus a 3rd/4th choice CB.
If we get rice we will have Rice, kante, Kovacic, ampadu, gilmour, Gallagher, mount, Kai, barkley, rlc, jorginho as the mid options. 
FL will need to make some really tough decisions on whom to sell and keep

I don't rate him as a CB from what I have seen. Only in a back three, he might have a chance in my opinion.
As a DM, I rate him highly.

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[King Kante 1,500]

4 hours ago, Puliiszola said:

Not sure. He can be a good no.2 plus a 3rd/4th choice CB.

If we get rice we will have Rice, kante, Kovacic, ampadu, gilmour, Gallagher, mount, Kai, barkley, rlc, jorginho as the mid options. 

FL will need to make some really tough decisions on whom to sell and keep

Those numbers are insane. I would say if Rice is signed it will be curtains for: Barkley, Jorgi, Kova/Kante and Gallagher (who I could see being sold with a buy back.) That would give: Kante/Kova, Rice, Ampadu, Kai, Mount, RLC and Gilmour, which is still 7 players for essentially 3 roles. Although as Rice and Amapdu can moonlight in CB it would maybe not be too bad. 

The problem however, like Summer, would be finding buyers. Gallagher in this situation would probably not be too much of an issue as in my above suggestion he would essentially be a glorified loan. Barkley would probably be easy to shift due to his passport and okish form for Villa (although I wouldn't expect top dollar.) Kante/Kova and Jorgi would be issues due to their style or play, wages and fees.