Super Frank Thread

[Jase 43,479]

51 minutes ago, Fernando said:

I still back Lampard. 

To me this season was always a write off and I had no expectations for top 4. 

As we might still do it is still a miracle for me.

Next season we should improve from this season. 

Writing off a season is one thing but improvement needs to be shown. The manager and players shouldn't just get a free pass.

Earlier in the season, we saw good things but since the November international break, we have been hopeless. All the good things that we did in the early months of the season have gone out of the window and the same problems have persisted for months, with little signs of improvement.

I want Lampard to succeed as the manager here but given our problems this season, those that he can control and fix, have continued for ages, it's worth wondering whether he's just out of his depth. If our poor form continues till end of the season, don't be surprised if the board just pull the trigger on him. Unfortunately for Lampard, he doesn't have previous success like Klopp/Guardiola to get some benefit of the doubt. Lampard needs to earn the patience between now and May if we are to continue with him. 

[Vesper 28,786]

On 18/02/2020 at 0:48 AM, MoroccanBlue said:

Take the couple more signings and multiply it by 4. That is how many new signings we need to compete. 

I admit this a full FM level post and also this is impossible to do in even 2 summers probably but here goes

The need to go go go go's:

this is  not counting the rotten dregs out on loan, they are a given that they need to be binned ASAP

 

these are all on the main roster atm, and it would NOT be hard at all to sell them ALL this summer

the problem is the buys to replace

but EVERY one of these truly needs to be binned and fast, I will give Mount and Jorginho one more season to see if they fit in the long range plans

OUT

Willy Caballero    
Kurt Zouma   
Andreas Christensen    
Emerson    
Marcos Alonso 
N'Golo Kanté  <<< a shadow of what he was, always injured, soon 30, and a true square peg in a round hole, Sarri destroyed him in multiple ways, unless we are sacking Lamapard and schizophremically slamming back to defensive, counter attacking model, Kante simply makes ZERO sense to be kept, and we risk shitting away tens of millions of quid by holding onto him  
Ross Barkley  
Marco van Ginkel    
Lewis Baker   
Danilo Pantic   
Willian   
Pedro
Michy Batshuayi    
Olivier Giroud  

 

this leaves

  
Kepa   (he is unsaleable atm, unless we are willing to take a £65-70m loss due to a massively reduced fee and also eating around half  or so of his last 5 years contractually due salary of £50m
Antonio Rüdiger    
Fikayo Tomori    
César Azpilicueta  we are obviously going to keep him until he is worthless in terms of resale value, that said, he should NEVER play at LB again, it is suicidal and big reason Lamps quite likely will get sacked, he is close to the worst LB in the league when he plays there, he is unbelievably poor in the offensive flow, he wrecks us. He also needs to be stripped of his captaincy, as he is a shit leader. He means well, but he is a negative on net, other than as a ageing backup RB
Reece James    
Jorginho  
Conor Gallagher 
Mateo Kovacic  <<  our best player this year on full balance, madness that Lampard benched him for so long, and jammed in an out of form, incompatible, and injured Kante
Ruben Loftus-Cheek <<< we all had best hope he can recover from his horrific injury
Billy Gilmour   <<<< I would loan him out, he needs playing time
Mason Mount  <<< poor poor after the beginning false dawn, one more year and then out via a sale with a buyback or loan him out
Callum Hudson-Odoi   
Christian Pulisic  
Hakim Ziyech
Tammy Abraham  <<<< he is looking like a backup option atm, to the new CF we will hopefully bring in, 3 league goals in the past 3 and a half months is a pathetic return

assuming Gilmour is loaned out, that leaves 14 left on the main, 15 if you count a 3rd string GK like Jamie Cumming

so here would be my 10 buys (yes I know it is impossible to go in one window or  maybe even 2 summer windows and a January 2021 window but we sure as fuck had best try) 

GK IF we go strictly for a backup buy, the best pick would be Sven Ulreich, then Martin Dubravka. IF we are going for a full time or split starter with an eye on eventually selling Kepa, there are many good ones: Thomas Strakosha, André Onana, Alex Meret, Predrag Rajkovic, Mike Maignan, Dean Henderson, Odysseas Vlachodimos, Juan Musso, Bartlomiej Dragowski, David Soria, Koen Casteels, Matvey Safonov, (20yo, 21 in exactly a week, so more of a long term prospect), Tomas Vaclik

CB Raphaël Varane, work out a deal with RM involving Kante, I do not care if thsi is crazy, if we want a truly WC commanding CB, here he is, use Kante whilst we still can

CB Declan Rice (I see his future at CB, he is a great player and ex Chels, plus can give cover at DMF, I do not care what the haters say)

LB Theo Hernandez  Chilwell at £80m or more is madness, especially as that cock blocks selling both of our shitters due to the way the numpty board thinks

LB Alex Telles (Emerson sales basically covers thsi cost or pretty near)

DMF Thomas Partey (£41m release clause is a steal) or Denis Zakaria  (I am not sold on soumare, but if he is as good as the baord thinks, I will not freak out here) I REALLY would buy Camavinga, but the baord will not do it, he will probably go to RM or Barca or PSG and perhaps become the best DMF in the world, grrrrr

AMF Grealish, a MUST for me, as Ziyech is going to be a full time starter at RW I think

Winger Boga (yes, I hear the howls now, as I am giving up on Sancho, but SEE BELOW and IF NO Sancho then Ziyech changes the equation, and I think we are better off with Ziyech AND Grealish and Boga (plus another £55-60m or so left over for other positions like Rice at CB/DMF) than with just Ziyech and Sancho, whose combined cost  for just the two is around £170m

CF Werner is going to the Dippers, so that leaves Lautaro (the board will not drop £92m or more on him) Dembele (first choice left) or Victor Osimhen

CF (3rd string) Josh Maja

 

cost (and I will net out Varane for Kante as a net zero cost just for argument's sake)

around £330m to £360m, depending on who we buy off that list for goalkeeper and a couple other options

 

after the Ziyech buy, we have about £160m left from ALREADY done sales revenue

now add up my sales

around £175m from JUST the ones listed above in the out part (do not even get me started on the insane amount of cash shit away from the none sales of Willian, etc, plus the reduced revenue from non timely sales of just that group listed, (which would make the toal we would have gotten from that group alone about £300m, not £175m, thanks board!!!)

that leaves a kitty so far of £335m

so it covers all or damn near all the buys on my list

plus we still have

England    GK    Nathan Baxter (to Ross County until 30 June 2020)
England    GK    Jamal Blackman (to Bristol Rovers until 31 May 2020)
England    DF    Jake Clarke-Salter (to Birmingham City until 31 May 2020)
England    DF    Josh Grant (to Plymouth Argyle until 31 May 2020)
United States    DF    Matt Miazga (to Reading until 31 May 2020)
England    DF    Richard Nartey (to Burton Albion until 31 May 2020)
Ghana    DF    Baba Rahman (to Mallorca until 30 June 2020)
Italy    DF    Davide Zappacosta (to Roma until 30 June 2020)
France    MF    Tiémoué Bakayoko (to Monaco until 30 June 2020)
England    MF    Danny Drinkwater (to Aston Villa until 30 June 2020) <<< good luck with getting anything for him!!!!
Brazil    MF    Kenedy (to Getafe until 30 June 2020) <<<< not sure what is going on here, as his contract expires in June
Nigeria    MF    Victor Moses (to Inter Milan until 30 June 2020)
Belgium    MF    Charly Musonda (to Vitesse until 30 June 2020)
Brazil    MF    Nathan (to Atlético Mineiro until 30 June 2020)
Brazil    MF    Lucas Piazon (to Rio Ave until 30 June 2020)
England    FW    Izzy Brown (to Luton Town until 31 May 2020)

left to sell, as NONE of those were counted in any sales revenues listed above

those add up to around £100m or so in total give or take 10 to 20m quid

so IN THEORY

if we dumped all, and did not buy Boga (other than a nice profit from his impending sale), we even could jam a Sancho buy and ALL the rest listed

and basically spend either nothing to a max of £40, 50m net

my maths are solid, and I am being very conservative, other than the wishful Kante for Varane swap, which I rate at a zero net anyway, so no cost effect to the bottom line

will that all happen? Of course not, as....... BOARD, who have stalled, let shit build up, and shit away over £300m and counting just since summer 2017 (and that is NOT counting the Kepa disaster)

but it could

 

the 25 man roster it would have yielded

Sancho included, as I did show how to pay for him as well

GK Kepa (and he can be sold after next season if he truly is fucked for good, and we just decide to eat the loss, there will always be better keepers out there)

GK Sven Ulreich

GK Jamie Cumming

CB Varane

CB Rice (and DMF as well)

CB Rudiger

CB Tomori

LB Theo Hernandez (technically we could, especially with no Sancho buy, but even WITH it, buy Chilwell here and still make it work as long as Chilwell price is somewhat sane and we liquidate the dregs 100%)

LB Telles

RB Reece

RB Azpi

DMF Thomas Partey or Soumare (both can play CMF as well)

DMF Jorginho (can be swapped out eventually if he is simply not compatible)

CMF Kovacic

CMF Gallagher 

CMF/AMF RLC

AMF Grealish

AMF/CMF Mount (can be sold and upgraded if he truly shits out long term)

LW Sancho (or Boga if we fail on Sancho, but lets say Sancho is somehow pulled in)

LW CHO

RW Ziyech (AMF as well)

RW Pulisic

CF Dembele (sorry Werner peeps, he aint coming, especially if we shit away CL)  or we dice roll with Osimhen, who I actually think has a higher upside than Dembele perhaps, and would be cheaper

CF Tammy

CF Josh Maja

 

give THAT team to Poch

and we are back in the chips fo realio, even the dippers would have to beware, the cunts

it is so deep, overall a great balance of youth and vets, extremely flexible, etc

 

 

 

 

[OneMoSalah 8,776]

7 hours ago, killer1257 said:

 

 

I can't really say anything about Sheffield, but Traore from Wolves is way better than Willian and Mount. Traore is the best dribbler in the League by far and stats show that. Take Traore out of the Team and their counter striking would not been as effective as it is now. Bale carried Spurs back then and when he was gone, it took then some years go get back. When Ronaldo left Real, Real was garbage at first. Now, with some new Signings they look ok. Lamps did not even get one signing to improve our team. In the Summer, our team got worse when our best Player left and our Second best got injured.

Also, if we had their Coach, we may concede less, but also score less goals also. People would go crazy then. Also, their Coach had way more time to implement his ideas and probably made Signings to play his way

Lamps makes mistakes. Don't get me wrong, but I don't see a coach that would get us Top 4 easily with that Squad. Keep in mind that Tammy, our best goalscorer, would be loaned out if Mou was our Coach. James would also be not in the squad


Gesendet von meinem SM-G920F mit Tapatalk
 

 

There is more to Wolves than Traore, that is just an arrogant view on them.

If you watch some of their games, youll see that Ruben Neves and Moutinho are the heartbeat of that side and both are very good MF players who could play at a higher level, more so Neves now Moutinho is older and his time has probably passed to play at a bigger club.

Raul Jimenez has scored 20 goals this season in all competitions. Diego Jota is also a very capable player who has scored regularly since being there.

Rui Patricio is a hugely experienced GK who has lots of international experience and also a Euro winner.

Jonny Otto is a player who is making a name for himself and been kn the Spain NT squad too.

Then you have their manager who is getting more and more plaudits every year after difficult spells in Porto and Valencia.

[Jase 43,479]

Our league form since the November international break...

[Vesper 28,786]

1 hour ago, Fernando said:

I still back Lampard. 

To me this season was always a write off and I had no expectations for top 4. 

As we might still do it is still a miracle for me.

Next season we should improve from this season. 

that logic doesn't hold up at all

as the 'no chance or slim chance at 4th' was predicated on many of the other teams be much improved

now that they have not shown to be that at all

and given that we had a large lead we have now shit away

and given the HORRIFIC loses to pure shit teams, so many

and given our SHIT form at home

Lampard is on very thin ice and if he loses the next 5 games, simply has to be sacked

he has been a very middling manager so far

given our overall results

we are rapidly regressing, not improving

[MoroccanBlue 5,296]

Becoming infuriating hearing his interviews. Just recycled nonsense. 

 

[Special Juan 27,424]

Damn right he is under pressure, and rightly he should be, and is for me.

This isn't a party, this is football management and the simple fact of this is he picks the team and sets them up to play. 

If things do not improve quickly he's gone.

[Iggy Doonican 4,186]

As I've said earlier fans are letting their heart rule their head when it comes to Lampard that table that Jason posted makes horrific reading. Fact is if the last 14 games were the start of the season Lampard would be gone or under immense pressure. Lack of goals and lack of clean sheets if we lose to Spurs who will be out with their two best forwards on Saturday those mumerings will get louder.

[DDA 9,690]

There is no point in speculating over Frank's future until next season. He was given a pass this year. 

[Special Juan 27,424]

Just now, DDA said:

There is no point in speculating over Frank's future until next season. He was given a pass this year. 

The talk is quite real, in fact after last night he is under some serious pressure. This isn't something that can be as simple as putting the head under the pillow, it's happening. I want FL to succeed here but this is football management and if things do not pick up quickly it will not be ignored, I promise you.

[Iggy Doonican 4,186]

5 minutes ago, DDA said:

There is no point in speculating over Frank's future until next season. He was given a pass this year. 

No such thing I'm afraid even for Lampard. Spurs is massive on Saturday and could be a pivotal point in the season. None of us are expecting to beat Bayern Munich just hoping it's not a caning like Spurs got.

[Tomo 21,733]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

Writing off a season is one thing but improvement needs to be shown. The manager and players shouldn't just get a free pass.

Earlier in the season, we saw good things but since the November international break, we have been hopeless. All the good things that we did in the early months of the season have gone out of the window and the same problems have persisted for months, with little signs of improvement.

I want Lampard to succeed as the manager here but given our problems this season, those that he can control and fix, have continued for ages, it's worth wondering whether he's just out of his depth. If our poor form continues till end of the season, don't be surprised if the board just pull the trigger on him. Unfortunately for Lampard, he doesn't have previous success like Klopp/Guardiola to get some benefit of the doubt. Lampard needs to earn the patience between now and May if we are to continue with him. 

I still think we've had some good games during this poor run.

Outplaying Tottenham, Arsenal away (after half hour), Burnley home (should have been 6), Arsenal home (yes it was a fucking ball ache to blow two points Vs ten men but we absolutely dominated the game in terms of terrortory that was probably the most dominant we've ever been against Arsenal at home bar the 6-0).

There has to be season by season progression (ie if next season is the same results and especially performance wise I will have no defense against calls for his sacking infact I'd likely be on that train myself) but I think overall we've been given enough encouragement to go on despite a wretched run of late.

[Iggy Doonican 4,186]

16 minutes ago, Tomo said:

Arsenal home (yes it was a fucking ball ache to blow two points Vs ten men but we absolutely dominated the game in terms of terrortory that was probably the most dominant we've ever been against Arsenal at home bar the 6-0).

Oh come on if you can't dominate territory against ten men then you're all kinds of shit. Having possession of the ball means fuck all if we lose out to champions league by two points it will be little comfort saying oh well at least we dominated possession against Arsenal. We should have slaughtered them bottom line is we didn't.

[Jase 43,479]

13 minutes ago, Tomo said:

I still think we've had some good games during this poor run.

Outplaying Tottenham, Arsenal away (after half hour), Burnley home (should have been 6), Arsenal home (yes it was a fucking ball ache to blow two points Vs ten men but we absolutely dominated the game in terms of terrortory that was probably the most dominant we've ever been against Arsenal at home bar the 6-0).

There has to be season by season progression (ie if next season is the same results and especially performance wise I will have no defense against calls for his sacking infact I'd likely be on that train myself) but I think overall we've been given enough encouragement to go on despite a wretched run of late.

I know we have had our struggles against the smaller teams this season but adding Burnley in there seems rather generous. We dominated Arsenal because they played over an hour with 10 men and even then, I hardly recalled seeing us create much from open play or Leno had to make spectacular saves. It also got all rather desperate in the end when Lampard had to throw Batshuayi in late on and not to mention, both of our goals came from set pieces (which seems to be the only way we're ever gonna score these days). 

That leaves only Spurs and Arsenal away for me. And as much as there's some good things seen during this bad run, there's also the bad things seen in this period. As games go by, the negatives are outweighing the positives and that's not a good thing.

[Henrique 9,133]

3 hours ago, Fernando said:

I still back Lampard. 

To me this season was always a write off and I had no expectations for top 4. 

As we might still do it is still a miracle for me.

Next season we should improve from this season. 

Mediocre season in terms of overall quality, home defeats to Southampton and Bornemouth, losing to Newcastle in the last minute after dominating the game, failing to beat 10 men Arsenal at home.  It doesnt matter if you didnt expect a top 4, it was on the sight and he had to win those games.

Poor squad management and lack of clear direction. The only positive thing about Lampard right now is having the balls to bringing young players. 

[Laylabelle 9,351]

30 minutes ago, Jason said:

I know we have had our struggles against the smaller teams this season but adding Burnley in there seems rather generous. We dominated Arsenal because they played over an hour with 10 men and even then, I hardly recalled seeing us create much from open play or Leno had to make spectacular saves. It also got all rather desperate in the end when Lampard had to throw Batshuayi in late on and not to mention, both of our goals came from set pieces (which seems to be the only way we're ever gonna score these days). 

That leaves only Spurs and Arsenal away for me. And as much as there's some good things seen during this bad run, there's also the bad things seen in this period. As games go by, the negatives are outweighing the positives and that's not a good thing.

Agree that's the problem I have with the Arsenal game. We dominated.. that's lovely. Except they scored 2 goals with 10 men. They scored with both chances. We looked clueless in parts. It's a pattern that has become familiar. 

I'd rather not dominate the game and win! Which is what teams keep doing. Less shots.. less ball but oh theyve won.

[Atomiswave 6,072]

4 hours ago, Tomo said:

The start of the season, people took the piss out of our squad, laughed at any thought of even a top four challenge and claimed we'll be lucky for top half (with most saying/implying they would be quite content with that aslong as youth were playing and there were some signs of encouragement to build on, a vow which has surprise surprise turned out to be bullshit).

Its never that easy, never will be. Progress must be made in order to asses if its woth it or not. And none of us believed all our rivals will be just as crap, we though they were gonna be better, the landscape has changed since then. Getting top4 was well reasonable since the start imo, thats how shit our rivals have been. That gap is gone now, we have been practically in top4 all season, and if we lose it its thanks to us not our rivals. We are better than this, we have been in relegation form for so many months now, same mistakes keep happening no matter wha they are. Sorry this is not good enough. I would happily have him here if I could see Progress, or at least the mistakes being remedied. He may just still do it but its not looking likely.

[Superblue 6,370]

5 hours ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Not one of our managers has given a toss about bringing through young players Lamps had no choice in the matter. I can't see our next manager being anything but a pragmatic, experienced safe pair of hands.

Whilst I wouldn't try arguing that this wouldn't happen, because previous history by the board suggests there is a good chance of that, I think it would be a huge mistake if we took that step.

We've spent the last 2 seasons buying players and trying to change a philosophy and style of play from a more defensive, pragmatic brand to a more open and offensive style.

If we move back to a more pragmatic manager, he'll be left with a team split in half of young players more suited to an offensive brand and the other half of older heads clearly in decline who suit a defensive brand. We'll be back to square one again and another couple of years away from getting near the top teams. A big summer window that allows us to bring another four or five players suited to this style of football and ship more of the deadwood out will be huge.

If Lampard was to go, then the next manager has to be of a similar ilk to Lampard and Sarri with regards to philosophy and identity, and also be prepared to continue coaching and developing younger players as around a third of our first team squad now is players aged 22/23 and younger.

I don't rate him as highly as some do on these forums but as an example if Lampard was sacked, and it was a choice of somebody like Poch or somebody like Allegri or Simeone then I'd go with Poch 100% because he'd be the most suited to try and follow through with what the club has already started over the last couple of seasons.