The Mourinho Thread

[Blue Colored Sky 1,807]

Giggs, Scholes, Neville came in at a different generation, that was before the money and popularity of the league. failure of youth adaption is more of a England issue, then specific clubs or managers for that matter.

This is Mourinho thread and Mourinho managed like 1/3 of his managerial career in England. He had a problem in bringing youth whenever he has been.

[LAB 1,030]

Perfect subs and half time talk obviously, but can't be forgiven for the unlimited trust to Iva and GC i'm afraid. Especially Iva.

Just bench him Jose for once! Just try it ffs!

[Henrique 9,133]

For me its clear only a disaster will avoid the League trophy at the end of the season.

But I think its really weird that some people just don't accept any kind of criticism after a victory or because the team is 6 points clear on top of the league with one game in hand. Its really hard to imagine this team enjoying a long term success without major changes.

Its the greatest challenge of Mourinho's career. In last 10 years Mourinho managed clubs that only needed small adjustments. Chelsea in 2004 was a side that reached UCL semi-final and was runner-up in PL. Gudjonsen, Cole, Bridge, Damien Duff, Gallas, Makelele, Lampard and Terry were there before Jose. Inter de Milao was the best team in Italy for seasons. 9 out of 14 players used in UCL Final in 2010 were playing for the Italian club before Jose arrived. The same happened in Madrid, where he failed.

When Mourinho got back, Chelsea was a Europa League side, and struggled to be a top 4 side in PL. A team full of unproven and decadent players.

I'm not sure Jose is the right man to build teams. He is a winner, not an engineer. Last season he realized players like KDB, Mata and Luiz were not "Mourinho players". Instead of changing some of his dogmas, or taking time to teach his players a new way of playing football, he favored the mediocrity of Ivanovic, Cahill, Azpillicueta, Willian and Ramires. In January window he went to buy Matic, a limited and conservative DM.

His back four were created in a difficult momento of the season. Months later he was saying the back four was the team strongest point...in defense we need a completely overhaul. Terry was not even an untouchable player anymore during 2011/2013 period. Mourinho decided he was as good as in 2005, and now he is one of our players that started 100% of PL games this season. He is not as good as 2005. Ivanovic must find another club next season, or must become squad player. Cahill has always been mediocre. Azpilicueta is not even a great RB, but become Mourinho favorite LB (!!!!).

Ramires was player of the season in 2011/12 season, was very important in 12/13, but he belongs to past. His performance this season has been a disgrace. Willian is a solid squad player, he will never be a protagonist. Costa need some kind of competition. He has 18 goals, the 2nd team top scorer is Hazard with only 10.

This team need more dynamism in the midfield. Matic is very limited to one specific kind of game. Fabregas is a shy player. He won't decide any big match by himself.

Next season to be honest I think United will be a very dominant team, they are definitely the most solid team in this second leg of the season. They improved during the tournament, while our team seems to play worst game after game.

Mourinho returning in a moment when the team was full of attacking and exciting players seemed to announce years of dominance, but I'm really afraid the PL trophy this year might be an exception, not the rule.

[kellzfresh 7,229]

Never mind coaching attacking football, I want to know why are we doing things that are very un-Mourinho.

- Our defence has gone to pieces in 2015 and yet nothing has changed. We've been making the same mistakes over and over and over again.

- For a side filled with tall and big physical players, we aren't scoring enough from set pieces. In fact, we can't even take a proper corner/free kick without hitting the first man! We need to study Atletico Madrid.

- Can't barely score from counter attacks despite having some quick players. Can't even remember the last time we scored from a counter!

Those aspects are usually the 3 strongest points of any Mourinho team and yet, we don't even resemble any of them right now.

This exactly. Weird

[zolayes 14,489]

@ Henrique ...You have made a lot of valid points

[Spike 12,049]

Agreed with everything except labelling Azpilicueta as 'mediocre'.

[Henrique 9,133]

@ Henrique ...You have made a lot of valid points

as usual...

[Spike 12,049]

as usual...

Modesty is free.

[Henrique 9,133]

Agreed with everything except labelling Azpilicueta as 'mediocre'.

mediocre is a misused word. I said Azpilicueta is an ordinary player. He is not special by any means. thats why I said he is mediocre.

[nicol 2]

hazard 11 goals i think

[Spike 12,049]

mediocre is a misused word. I said Azpilicueta is an ordinary player. He is not special by any means. thats why I said he is mediocre.

Fair enough. Yeah, I guess you are right, he is an ordinary player but solidarity and reliability are rare in fullbacks.

[nicol 2]

then Henrique nobody is good bar Costa

[Joker10 946]

This is Mourinho thread and Mourinho managed like 1/3 of his managerial career in England. He had a problem in bringing youth whenever he has been.

Mou certainly not great at bringing youth. I know this.

But he one 1/3 of the equation and saying it is only him is an issue.

England doesn't have a great structure to bring up youth players, this is why England in general lacks talent. Chelsea, There needs to be a gap between U21 leagues and first team. Loan system is not reliable, since you are at the mercy of other clubs to develop your players.

Chelsea fans is another great issue. I don't think Chelsea fans in general have the stomach for the highs and lows that comes with introducing youth players. You can't think that RLC or any other youth player can put in solid/good performance on a regular basis, a lot of learning process there is going to be times they are going to suck and they may cost you points. Also noting that players like RLC, Boga or Ake do not give you the best chance to win right now, with the money Chelsea have we can certainly buy establish players to play back up or play their minutes. But the upside of using youth players, is that knowing or hoping you have a better player in the future and gem. Some think RLC gives us a better chance to win then Ramires or Mikel, that is certainly not true but i do see the benefit of RLC in the future by playing him now. So there is a trade off, i don't believe Chelsea fans have the patience but i certainly do know that Chelsea fans like the idea of giving youths a try.

[Fernando 6,743]

For me its clear only a disaster will avoid the League trophy at the end of the season.

But I think its really weird that some people just don't accept any kind of criticism after a victory or because the team is 6 points clear on top of the league with one game in hand. Its really hard to imagine this team enjoying a long term success without major changes.

Its the greatest challenge of Mourinho's career. In last 10 years Mourinho managed clubs that only needed small adjustments. Chelsea in 2004 was a side that reached UCL semi-final and was runner-up in PL. Gudjonsen, Cole, Bridge, Damien Duff, Gallas, Makelele, Lampard and Terry were there before Jose. Inter de Milao was the best team in Italy for seasons. 9 out of 14 players used in UCL Final in 2010 were playing for the Italian club before Jose arrived. The same happened in Madrid, where he failed.

When Mourinho got back, Chelsea was a Europa League side, and struggled to be a top 4 side in PL. A team full of unproven and decadent players.

I'm not sure Jose is the right man to build teams. He is a winner, not an engineer. Last season he realized players like KDB, Mata and Luiz were not "Mourinho players". Instead of changing some of his dogmas, or taking time to teach his players a new way of playing football, he favored the mediocrity of Ivanovic, Cahill, Azpillicueta, Willian and Ramires. In January window he went to buy Matic, a limited and conservative DM.

His back four were created in a difficult momento of the season. Months later he was saying the back four was the team strongest point...in defense we need a completely overhaul. Terry was not even an untouchable player anymore during 2011/2013 period. Mourinho decided he was as good as in 2005, and now he is one of our players that started 100% of PL games this season. He is not as good as 2005. Ivanovic must find another club next season, or must become squad player. Cahill has always been mediocre. Azpilicueta is not even a great RB, but become Mourinho favorite LB (!!!!).

Ramires was player of the season in 2011/12 season, was very important in 12/13, but he belongs to past. His performance this season has been a disgrace. Willian is a solid squad player, he will never be a protagonist. Costa need some kind of competition. He has 18 goals, the 2nd team top scorer is Hazard with only 10.

This team need more dynamism in the midfield. Matic is very limited to one specific kind of game. Fabregas is a shy player. He won't decide any big match by himself.

Next season to be honest I think United will be a very dominant team, they are definitely the most solid team in this second leg of the season. They improved during the tournament, while our team seems to play worst game after game.

Mourinho returning in a moment when the team was full of attacking and exciting players seemed to announce years of dominance, but I'm really afraid the PL trophy this year might be an exception, not the rule.

Good points but we will find out next season.

I made a point how this season feels exactly like City last season.

They won the Capital One and PL but with a very unconvincing display.

Then this season instead of improving they regress.

So it will be a wait and see mode for next season. Do we improve or regress?

[Tomo 21,754]

I disagree. apart from the 92 class. These are list of youth that Fergie promoted into the first team and went on to nudge huge amount of games under their belt. Wes brown, Fletcher,Oshea,Cleverly, da silva twins and Welbeck.

And others like Gibson, Macheda et al were given opportunities but later moved on when it became clear they weren't good enough. If that's not impressive for an absolutely elite team with even bigger pressure to challenge for trophies than us then I don't know what is.

O shea and Brown were roughly about the same time as Fletcher, after that there wasn't too many, the only ones really promoted from scratch (as in promoted without any real first team expierence) were the twins, happy to be proved wrong if I've missed someone. United still have a better record than us to suggest otherwise would be moronic, but I do feel they are a bit overrated in that aspect due to the class of 92.

Although re Brown, O Shea, we should start using the academy to fill the squad especially with FFP and HG rules, Jack Cork could have been our O Shea in that regard.

[Tomo 21,754]

Good points but we will find out next season.

I made a point how this season feels exactly like City last season.

They won the Capital One and PL but with a very unconvincing display.

Then this season instead of improving they regress.

So it will be a wait and see mode for next season. Do we improve or regress?

City have made the same mistake we did in 2010 and they did themselves in 2012 and failed to refresh the squad with any real quality and got too comfortable.

Mourinho isn't the type of manager to rest on his laurels, if we lift the league in May he will be plotting back to back titles during the celebrations.

[Fernando 6,743]

City have made the same mistake we did in 2010 and they did themselves in 2012 and failed to refresh the squad with any real quality and got too comfortable.

Mourinho isn't the type of manager to rest on his laurels, if we lift the league in May he will be plotting back to back titles during the celebrations.

Well you said it, all depends what we do this transfer window.

If we do more buys like Willian and Cuadradro then expect to have the same outcome.

But if like Costa and Fabregas then good.

[Blue Colored Sky 1,807]

England doesn't have a great structure to bring up youth players, this is why England in general lacks talent. Chelsea, There needs to be a gap between U21 leagues and first team. Loan system is not reliable, since you are at the mercy of other clubs to develop your players.

Very much agree with this.

Chelsea fans is another great issue. I don't think Chelsea fans in general have the stomach for the highs and lows that comes with introducing youth players. So there is a trade off, i don't believe Chelsea fans have the patience but i certainly do know that Chelsea fans like the idea of giving youths a try.

Nah, what Chelsea fans ? After the club failed to bring a youth through in the last 17 years (!!!) if someone can't show a little patience in bringing an Academy boy, then he's nothing short of glory-hunter. I'd leave them to be honest. Let's focus on real fans then. Bringing player through has way more dividends than just goals, assists, filling HG quota and saving money for FFP, they're bread and butter of the club, the way to keep an identity, it's a higher cause if you ask me.

That's why I'd rather shake my head around some Lewis Baker pass than Oscar or Willian.

And please, let's not hyperbole this thing again, we're talking about roughly 800-1000 minutes for ONE youth player in a season when you play over a 5000 minutes, being surrounded by all international players, FFS if you can't find a way to give that time to ONE youth player then you don't try hard enough.

[MrBlueGuy 1,552]

Well you said it, all depends what we do this transfer window.

If we do more buys like Willian and Cuadradro then expect to have the same outcome.

But if like Costa and Fabregas then good.

Don't know...I don't want players who go missing for the last 4 months of the season. More like Hazard would do.

[kellzfresh 7,229]

We finally scored 3 goals this year. I thought it wasn't possible again