Man Utd 3-1 Chelsea

[Madmax 9,219]

I think United will win the game on Sunday because Chelsea are going through a transitional spell at the moment with their new manager and an evolving team.

Chelsea's biggest problem, as we all know, is how to get Fernando Torres scoring again because unfortunately he has lost the knack and he will have to find it soon or Chelsea's season could be over before it has begun.

Of course as soon as you start to write someone off they prove you wrong, so it wouldn't surprise me if Torres scored at Old Trafford. But even if he did, I cannot see Chelsea winning there.

City are the team for me that can challenge United and certainly not Arsenal. The title will end up in Manchester for sure and it could be City but they still have a way to go, Docherty said.

City need to pair Tevez up front with Aguero, who really is world class, and Tevez is a far better partner for him than Dzeko. They could be contenders with those two up front that's for sure.

As for Arsenal, I don't see them in the top six, not with that defence.

- Tommy Docherty

[Kostas 1,468]

Not necessarly slated but maybe reasoned (it's my honest own opinion). Because it's completely off-topic I did put it in a Spoiler

Their improvement this summer is not really as obvious as a lot of people start to say because although they did recruit well on the paper, when we look closer ; Palacios comes to replace Whitehead who is too inconsistent, Jerome is almost the same profil than Kenwyne Jones and is his backup and Woodgate/Upson comes into 2nd bis or 3rd defenders behind Shawcross and Huth.

But Palacios has a really really poor attacking style, yes he is a good DM but when he has to go forward he is very poor (Mikel seems to be Lampard 2005 beside him ). He would play beside Whelan who has a good passing and a decent distribution but struggles immediatley when he is under pressure. Whelan is able to give good diagonal balls by example but only when the first adverse player is at some distance of him.

Of course, prima facie, managing to pick three players from the huge Tottenham seems to be for Stoke a piece of evidence that they improve drastically. But Palacios is for me the least useless of their signings so far, because he comes to reforce the midfield and kick out Whitehead.

In fact, Woodgate was a massive unknown about his fitness, nothing new. He is lucky not being already injured He is at the best we would consider him, a 3rd choice. And it's the same with Upson who is very lucky, him, that there was a club interested after his last season where he was awful and not commited at all. He is a reforcement, because Abdou Faye, Sonko and Collins left this summer, nothing more.

Upson is one of the wretches that Pulis did carry at Stoke and I have to say he does pretty well with the likes of Etherington or Pennant.

When we look at Peter Crouch's signing, of course he is an full international player and carries an image and reputation. But he is a kind of support striker, a mobile player who did excel without the ball in order to free the space for another players. People may say that if he is so poor with the ball, he perfecly fits Stoke City.

But I have to say that the two last players used to play between the lines were Tuncay and Gudjohnsen and we know how they did success at Stoke... Yes they were not the first choice (it seems very clear that Tuncay was an opportunity offered to Pulis when he came for Huth) or the proper condition to play football ( Guddy... ).

And I really wonder what is the purpose to have a player freeing space for others when you play him with a Jerome/Jones style... Maybe in order to play Crouch and Jon "I miss one control and penalty over two" Walters. But in this plan, Stoke can't play direct football because Crouch is not accurate at all with his header deliveries. So it would become an even less productive football than when they play away without Delap !!

For me Pulis should have look more closer on the market for a creative player in the midfield, I know they are a few ans even less available but he should have enquired for Arteta or maybe Leicester's Andy King...

They have the rythm taken thanks to the European Cup, but their start of the season is not really convincing in terms of play: they did held a draw with us because they enjoyed the fact that the players were not at 100% fit and they did commit a huge number of fouls. Then they earn a draw at Norwich, yes they did manager to have more than 50% of possession but it was because of Hoolahan's absence and it's a goal in their last attempt of the game. After that, WBA's game was a complete hold-up because they were awful in the play... The win against Liverpool is massively allowed by the lack of realism of Liverpool in the last tier although they did domine the game, Stoke is not better than when they are 10 behind in their own half.

The form seems to mean they are really improving, the content is much less to their advantage. For me they are far from the first half of the Prem, these years are make or break for them, they can pass a step or continue to be the physical mid-table team. Now they are near to the second solution rather the first one. Not enough variety and realism in their play. And as it goes, more and more teams would manage to win at the Brittania

We can chat about it in the Englans thread if you want

Your average post length must be thrice the forum average. Keep it up.

[Tomo 21,751]

Here is an interesting take on the Chelsea v manure duel. The most interesting quote of this whole article, "Frank Leboeuf only lost @ ol crapfort once in 5 years". I thought Chelsea didn't have any history

Di Matteo has never lost there so far.

[SeB 1,281]

Your average post length must be thrice the forum average. Keep it up.

I do also operate widely like that on a french forum

[robdog 2,084]

Di Matteo has never lost there so far.

Very interesting. So Robbie D has never lost there as a player & coach???

[LDN Blue 7,903]

Quite optimistic for this game.

It won't be as exciting, because defending will be key. Rooney will be heavily marked, and if that's successful then it will a game we can challenge. I personally think we should pack our midfield with 5-men.

I don't think AVB will, because he won't compromise style for such opponents. He certainly didn't do it at Porto when he came up against teams like Benfica.. So basically:

What I'd like to see

Cech

Ivanovic - Terry - Luiz - Cole

Meireles - Mikel

Ramires - Lampard - Mata

Sturridge

What will happen

Cech

Ivanovic - Terry - Luiz - Cole

Mikel

Miereles - Lampard

Sturridge - Anelka/Torres - Mata

[eldo 868]

Sturridge as ST won't work.

[bluesman2610 1,417]

sturridge looks best coming through the channels not as lone striker up top he doest have the size to go up against man u big centre halves..he is def gifted with the ball at his feet but the way man u applies pressure he couldnt be that effective up front by himself.. i dunno just what i think

[wisey11zola25 142]

CECH

IVANOVIC LUIZ TERRY COLE

MEIRELES RAMIRES

LAMPS

DANNY/NICO MATA

LUKAKU

edited this line up over and over again before posting but after much thought....

Brana- may not have bosingwas pace to keep up with young but he will judge the quick feet better and get a challenge in properly

Luiz- I've heard to many people say he can't start after his defensive error at old trafford last year....BULLSHIT! he's different class and although he needs slight tweaks in defensive positioning with the back up of 2 box to box engines who will keep covering in Meireles and Ramires, the freedom that Luiz can have will work perfectly in both defensive and attacking situations.

Meireles & Ramires- If we want too keep up with a quick footed, quick passing, quick moving force of Rooney,Hernandez,Young,Nani,Anderson...we need to play them at their own game with two players who move a lot and are very physical for their size! definitely a better way of lining -up than dropping Mikel in there to do nothing but play pointless passes and give away cheap freekicks all game.

Lamps- One simple point...you don't go to Old Trafford and leave out a Leader,Motivator and all round experienced legend of the Premier League.

Nico??-- He has impressed me and slotted in well with the 'new' system, he's experienced and hes starting to show a little bit of his old self in the quick change of pace and getting into threatening positions, definitely worth a mention in the line up!

Danny- Complete added flair to the XI, huge confidence, not scared to risk losing the ball to take on a man or have an effort on goal...i originally chose Danny Nico Mata as the front three but ill give my reasons why one of Nico/Danny should/could miss out for my choice of Front-Man.

Lukaku- Vidic is out, Evra will have enough trouble with Nico/Danny and Smalling will have enough trouble with Ash/Mata... leaving Ferdinand and Jones/Evans...Ferdinand has never dealt well with a 'Drogba' like player who is big and can turn quickly and move at pace...as for Jones if he starts...its young talent v young talent....both are confident and i'd fancy Lukaku to bully him a bit on and off the ball to get himself the upper hand and grab himself a goal...If Evans starts...simple tactic..Lukaku needs to sit on top of him at all times...he cannot deal with physical presence without giving away cheap fouls! ROMELU FOR THE START.

This certainly wasn't my first choice of starting XI but ive convinced myself that im talking sense in editing it to this..ill soon find out from your feedback and the game tomorrow if i was right or not! aha!

[robdog 2,084]

- Tommy Docherty

Yeah I read that article too. He said he has been wrong before though

[robdog 2,084]

CECH

IVANOVIC LUIZ TERRY COLE

MEIRELES RAMIRES

LAMPS

DANNY/NICO MATA

LUKAKU

edited this line up over and over again before posting but after much thought....

Brana- may not have bosingwas pace to keep up with young but he will judge the quick feet better and get a challenge in properly

Luiz- I've heard to many people say he can't start after his defensive error at old trafford last year....BULLSHIT! he's different class and although he needs slight tweaks in defensive positioning with the back up of 2 box to box engines who will keep covering in Meireles and Ramires, the freedom that Luiz can have will work perfectly in both defensive and attacking situations.

Meireles & Ramires- If we want too keep up with a quick footed, quick passing, quick moving force of Rooney,Hernandez,Young,Nani,Anderson...we need to play them at their own game with two players who move a lot and are very physical for their size! definitely a better way of lining -up than dropping Mikel in there to do nothing but play pointless passes and give away cheap freekicks all game.

Lamps- One simple point...you don't go to Old Trafford and leave out a Leader,Motivator and all round experienced legend of the Premier League.

Nico??-- He has impressed me and slotted in well with the 'new' system, he's experienced and hes starting to show a little bit of his old self in the quick change of pace and getting into threatening positions, definitely worth a mention in the line up!

Danny- Complete added flair to the XI, huge confidence, not scared to risk losing the ball to take on a man or have an effort on goal...i originally chose Danny Nico Mata as the front three but ill give my reasons why one of Nico/Danny should/could miss out for my choice of Front-Man.

Lukaku- Vidic is out, Evra will have enough trouble with Nico/Danny and Smalling will have enough trouble with Ash/Mata... leaving Ferdinand and Jones/Evans...Ferdinand has never dealt well with a 'Drogba' like player who is big and can turn quickly and move at pace...as for Jones if he starts...its young talent v young talent....both are confident and i'd fancy Lukaku to bully him a bit on and off the ball to get himself the upper hand and grab himself a goal...If Evans starts...simple tactic..Lukaku needs to sit on top of him at all times...he cannot deal with physical presence without giving away cheap fouls! ROMELU FOR THE START.

This certainly wasn't my first choice of starting XI but ive convinced myself that im talking sense in editing it to this..ill soon find out from your feedback and the game tomorrow if i was right or not! aha!

Your midfield might work, but I rather have Bos in there. Funny everyone is jumping behind da messiah as the Best ever, but we have someone on the our team that stopped him. Not only did Bos stopped him, he did so by playing left back True that was the Bos from a couple of years ago, but if Bos has that potential, I don't see why we need to limit him. I say Start Bos!!!

One more thing, IMHO Danny Boy Sturridge would work really good w/ Lukaku. I can see a long ball hit forward & Lukaku heads the ball to Danny Boy's feet. The manure d would be pressured then & things could get hair for them.

[Kojo 4,676]

Quite optimistic for this game.

It won't be as exciting, because defending will be key. Rooney will be heavily marked, and if that's successful then it will a game we can challenge. I personally think we should pack our midfield with 5-men.

I don't think AVB will, because he won't compromise style for such opponents. He certainly didn't do it at Porto when he came up against teams like Benfica.. So basically:

What I'd like to see

Cech

Ivanovic - Terry - Luiz - Cole

Meireles - Mikel

Ramires - Lampard - Mata

Sturridge

What will happen

Cech

Ivanovic - Terry - Luiz - Cole

Mikel

Miereles - Lampard

Sturridge - Anelka/Torres - Mata

Midfield is the key! And it always has been against United, no one can defend fantastic against United if there defending constantly for the full match. Remember when we beat them 2-1 last season? first half Scholes dominated the game, second half essien and lampard played amazing no sloppy passing and defended and attacked spot on, and it was very one sided for us in the second half.

[termninja 5,290]

You guys really enjoy developing new tactics and thinking your head of with lineups...a bit pointless imo because AVB will pick what he wants and everything what you said will remain buried bellow loads of posts here at TC

Just sayin'

[TopDrog 119]

This. Lol at all the people calling for lukaku to start! Even messi didnt get put straight into the el classico

[Badboy 1,526]

You guys really enjoy developing new tactics and thinking your head of with lineups...a bit pointless imo because AVB will pick what he wants and everything what you said will remain buried bellow loads of posts here at TC

Just sayin'

Whole point of a forum mate, we all bring our OPINIONS to the table. :yellow_card:

[Peace. 4,352]

Sturridge as ST won't work.

True. He is more like a second striker, with a free role.

What I'd like to see

Cech

Ivanovic - Terry - Luiz - Cole

Meireles - Mikel

Ramires - Lampard - Mata

Sturridge

First off, did you interchange Terry and Luiz on purpose ?

Usually I like the 4-2-3-1 formation. But I do not think we have the adequate players to play in this formation.

It won't work with Ramires on the right wing. Because this position implies he will have to participate a lot in the attack, will have to cross et al. And we know this isn't this kind of player... Firstly because he hasn't the profil of a winger, secondly because - let's be honest - he hasn't got a good skill at all, his passing and touch are quite average... You'll tell me that he will have a more central and deep role than his position is suggesting, right ? If so, it won't work neither because the right back is Ivanovic, and he is a defensive right back, which means our right side will be blunted, and will provide a low danger to ManU.

Lampard is way to high on the pitch, in my honest opinion. He doesn't have neither the eye for the throught ball, nor is fast enough, nor has the pace, the agility and dribbling skill necessary to play there. Mata is the kind of player who could play there, not Lampard.

And as Eldo has mentioned it, Danni as a lone striker won't work. In my opnion, he is a second striker, who plays around a holding striker.

[termninja 5,290]

Whole point of a forum mate, we all bring our OPINIONS to the table. :yellow_card:

I can also bring my own opinion on the table mate and I know what is the point of the forum.

[BlueLion. 21,491]

It won't happen but what would I do if I was going to Old Trafford?

Cech

Bosingwa - Ivanovic - Luiz - Terry - Cole

Ramires

Mata - Lampard

Anelka - Sturridge

[Drogba11CFC 108]

Townsend's Lineup:

Cech

Bosingwa Ivanovic Terry Cole

Ramires Mikel Lampard

Sturridge Anelka Mata

[nadavTKL 1,787]

What will happen

Ivanovic - Terry - Luiz - Cole

Ivan wont get picked over Bosingwa..

Edited September 17, 2011 by nadavTKL