The English Football Thread

[Vesper 28,864]

Nicky Butt: ‘If a manager gets sacked we should be able to call our loan player back’

https://theathletic.com/1583299/2020/02/05/nicky-butt-manchester-united-manager-sacked-loan-players/

Nicky Butt has called for the rules around youth loans to be revised, arguing that the likes of Manchester United should be able to recall a player if the club they are on loan to sack their manager.

Butt is head of first-team development at United and speaks with the same unflinching commitment to the cause that he displayed while playing in midfield for the club, which is why he feels there are areas for improvement in the modern game — such as allowing players to move at any point in the season.

At present, loan players can only be signed during summer or winter windows, but Butt believes these parameters unnecessarily limit those under the age of 20 from gaining valuable first-team experience. The previous system, altered before the 2016-17 season, enabled clubs in the Football League and below to sign players on emergency loans in two periods outside of regular transfer windows on deals ranging between 28 and 93 days in duration. World governing body FIFA changed the rules to protect the “sporting integrity of competitions”.

Butt feels that given the uncertainty over managerial tenures, parent clubs should gain greater control over players they have nurtured for a number of years and the regulations should allow for greater flexibility, particularly if the manager of the loan club leaves.

It is a view Sir Alex Ferguson famously acted on when recalling three United players from a loan with Preston North End after the dismissal of his son Darren in December 2010. Ritchie de Laet, Joshua King, and Matty James went back to United — but those were exceptional circumstances and usually loaning clubs have no recourse in the event of a change of manager. At present a loan can be cancelled only if both clubs agree, though a player could not then join a new club until the next window.

“It’s crazy, the window,” Butt tells The Athletic. “It used to be pretty much all year round until a few years ago, and as soon as those changes came in place it had an effect of stopping players going out. I would suggest that the rule-makers look at that.

“We try and make that process as smooth as possible. There are times when you’ve got to rush them, because time runs out, they are the rules.

“It is hard. I believe the rules should be if a manager gets sacked, you can call a player back, because the next manager could be someone who doesn’t like the player and he’s [the player] stuck there for a year.

“You spend a fortune developing players up to 19 — from seven years of age, playing every week — and then you send them out on loan and all your control is gone. Because regardless of what people say, nobody can promise they will play every game. If they’re not playing well, they’re not going to play, it’s a fact. It’s not as easy as people think. It has to be really thought out.”

James Garner was one United player looking at a loan last month, but ultimately the talented 18-year-old midfielder is staying at Carrington to continue his development around Ole Gunnar Solskjaer’s first-team squad.

Butt continues, generally: “Loans come when you’ve exhausted the reserves, you’ve burnt it up for a season, and it’s become too easy for you. But you’re not quite in the first-team dynamic. ‘OK, go get some men’s football, see how you develop’, come back and you’re in the first team or you make a career elsewhere.

“That’s something you can’t just go and do like that within a week, you have to plan it. That is part of my role, with Les Parry [United’s loans manager]: find the right club, with the right beliefs.

“Is it a club that sacks three managers a season? Because that’s no good for any of our players. You don’t know what manager is going to come next.

“Is it a club that will play young players, and will let them make a couple of mistakes and not just drop them straight away.

“Do they play the right way of football? Do we need a player to go on loan to get them to learn more stuff that they don’t get here, in academy football? Heading the ball, real 50-50 challenges, physicality? Or is it a player who needs to go out and play in a technical league? It is something we look at all the time.”

Butt is speaking before the FA Youth Cup tie against arch rivals Leeds United at 7pm on Wednesday, which is expected to draw thousands to Old Trafford. Leeds have been granted 1,800 tickets and it promises to be a new atmosphere for many of the young men on the pitch.

Butt himself played against Leeds in the final of the 1993 FA Youth Cup, alongside Paul Scholes, David Beckham, and Gary and Phil Neville, in front of a 30,000 crowd. “They beat us and it was a disaster, we expected to win it twice in a row,” Butt says. “Without being big-headed we were a really good team and it was rare we lost. It was a tough one to take.”

Leeds won that final 4-1 over two legs, a year after the Class of ’92 had become United’s first winners of the competition since a 1964 side including George Best.

Wales midfielder turned TV pundit Robbie Savage played in those games against Leeds 27 years ago and his son Charlie has a chance to feature on Wednesday night. As does Harvey Neville, son of former United stalwart and now England Lionesses manager Phil. Charlie Wellens, son of Richie, the Swindon Town manager and a former United contemporary of Butt’s, is expected to appear.

United have not won the FA Youth Cup since 2011 and while Butt maintains that developing players is the primary aim, lifting silverware cannot be overlooked as part of the process.

“The first game we played in the FA Youth Cup was really bad, we just scraped through,” he says of his own playing days. “I remember Eric Harrison [the legendary academy manager] going mad at us, saying, ‘The expectation is for you to win this.’

“I think that’s healthy, having expectation on players sometimes, especially in modern football. There is a time when you’ve got to show you’re capable of winning under the spotlight. To develop players, we know we have to put them out of their comfort zone. The FA Youth Cup is the time to say, ‘Show me what you got.’”

Butt will be watching from the stands on Wednesday and has a clear idea of what he would like to see from the youngsters in red.

“You want players who are going to be brave on the ball, accept the ball under pressure. Do what they do in training every day, work hard, drive themselves when it’s going wrong. If they go 1-0 down, how do they react? Is it arms in the air, ‘Not my fault!’, or do they go and take the challenge on board?”

Butt is warming to his theme and it is compelling to listen to. He slumps his shoulders to make a point.

“I hate seeing players react like that when they get 1-0 down,” he says. “Real players try even harder when they’re 1-0 down. Don’t shirk under any of the nonsense in a game, the bookings, the reactions.

“If they are winning, one, two goals, do they start showboating, being silly, not be respectful? Or do they keep driving, getting three goals, four goals, five goals?

“Are they challenging the opposition to have a go at them? Are they challenging their own players? You get a lot of academy players who don’t really speak to each other. They need to be able to have a go at each other, then put it to bed at the end of the game. There are lots of things on my mind.”

 

[Vesper 28,864]

Championship may need to break away from EFL to attract audience it deserves

One way for the second tier to get the global attention it deserves would be to slim down in a repackaged league system

https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2020/feb/06/championship-wider-audience-football-league

Cedars Art Production has been making well-received Middle Eastern films and television dramas since the 1950s but it was not until three years ago that the Lebanese company realised its full potential. Everything changed when Al Hayba was showcased at Cannes. The TV series, set in a fictional, smuggling-funded mountain village near ancient Baalbek, blended action, romance, feudal politicking, emotional intelligence and bewitching scenery. Netflix executives spied an international hit and acquired streaming rights.

Underpinned by themes sufficiently universal to resonate with globally diverse audiences, the Arabic soundtrack was given English, French, Spanish and Chinese subtitles. Soon Al Hayba’s lead actors, Taim Hasan and Nadine Njeim, were appearing in sitting rooms across North America, Europe and east Asia. For Cedars Art the stars had aligned. An ideal confluence of strong product and growing international appetite bridged the gulf between niche and mainstream.

If only English football’s power brokers are brave enough, a similarly transformative “Al Hayba” moment could see a rebranded Championship establish itself on an infinitely bigger stage than its current, largely parochial platform. This seems a perfect time for the second tier’s anyone-can-beat-anyone human drama to be properly appreciated, at home and abroad. Admittedly narrowing the daunting chasm separating the Premier League and the old second division while widening the latter’s overseas appeal will take more than a trip to Cannes. Championship clubs need to divorce themselves from the English Football League, slim down and join a neatly trimmed top flight in a glossily repackaged, two-division Premier League, renamed PL One and PL Two.

At present falling into the Championship feels like dropping off the edge of the world. PL Two would change that – albeit at a cost. Collateral damage could hit hard lower down an EFL ladder cut adrift and although pain invariably accompanies gain, the transition period would require careful management. Even so, the answers to necessarily hard questions could provide surprisingly sustainable long-term solutions. Does League Two really need to be fully professional? Might it and the National League benefit from merging before splitting into northern and southern divisions? Should neighbouring clubs share grounds and training facilities?

Moreover, once the makeover was complete, PL Two’s new clout could reawaken the much-diminished enthusiasm of many television and newspaper executives for England’s lower leagues. Despite European crowd surveys showing that, in some recent seasons, only the Premier League and Bundesliga have attracted more fans to games than England’s second tier, the Championship has been under-reported by a national media in thrall to the top flight. Yet a frequently overlooked division is studded with skill and excitement.

snip

 

[NikkiCFC 7,955]

This guy is a genius  😂

[Vesper 28,864]

3 hours ago, NikkiCFC said:

This guy is a genius  😂

lol, his Kane is good because I still want to punch him in the face

[Vesper 28,864]

Everton  v Crystal PalaceHD Streams

http://www.sportnews.to/sports/2020/premier-league-everton-vs-crystal-palace-s1/

https://www.totalsportek.com/everton/

 

[Jase 43,479]

If Everton win today, they will be only 5 points behind us, albeit having played a game more. Tells you how shit this season is. 

[Vesper 28,864]

3 minutes ago, Jason said:

If Everton win today, they will be only 5 points behind us, albeit having played a game more. Tells you how shit this season is. 

Zaha has looked pathetic all season

what a waste

[Vesper 28,864]

lol

Pickford the shitbox with a howler

1 1

[Vesper 28,864]

the state of EPL goalkeeping is HORRIFIC overall

 

[Vesper 28,864]

2 1

Richarlison roasted Cahill

[Vesper 28,864]

Undercover reporter films anti-Semitic Chelsea fans making Nazi salutes, singing about 'Yids' and imitating a gas chamber in Lille... as new BBC film exposes the staggering growth of racism in football

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-7969417/Chelsea-fans-caught-making-Nazi-salutes-singing-Yids-imitating-gas-chamber.html

snip

Three of the most sickening incidents featured took place in France on October 2 last year, the day Frank Lampard's side beat Lille 2-1 in the Champions League.

Although the behaviour of Chelsea supporters was not made public at the time, an undercover reporter captured the shameful scenes as fans took over the French city.

In one clip, Blues supporters can be seen outside singing an anti-Semitic song about their London rivals, Tottenham.

A group of supporters are heard chanting: 'We hate Tottenham - Yids! We hate Tottenham - Yids!', with two individuals appearing to make Nazi salutes.

In another clip, a fan can be seen leading a song about former Spurs striker Martin Chivers while riding a train.

The lyrics are: 'Chivers was a Jew. The thing between his eyes was twice the normal size. Yiddo, Yiddo, Yiddo.' 

 

 

ffs 

[Laylabelle 9,359]

Yep saw that. Lovely bunch that lot!! What a load of narrow minded nobs.

Also find it interesting in a way only one club...Watford players chose to speak out about their experiences. 

[NikkiCFC 7,955]

Embarrassing from our fans. Our owner is Jew ffs. The guy who gave them everything! 

I don't understand them going nuts for £10 more for ticket as well. 

[Laylabelle 9,359]

39 minutes ago, NikkiCFC said:

Embarrassing from our fans. Our owner is Jew ffs. The guy who gave them everything! 

I don't understand them going nuts for £10 more for ticket as well. 

The ticket thing I get. You dont up the set price because it happens to be Liverpool. It's just greed. They didnt charge more for Notts forest and wouldnt have done for Shrewsbury. As this is Liverpool it will sell out. Shouldnt been seen as a way to make more.

Every club has its idoits..ours seem to be public!!

 

[Laylabelle 9,359]

Man city vs West Ham called off

[Jase 43,479]

Sheffield United only TWO points behind us. TWO. POINTS. BEHIND. 

[Laylabelle 9,359]

Oh there they are

 

[Atomiswave 6,072]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

Sheffield United only TWO points behind us. TWO. POINTS. BEHIND. 

What a crap season this has been, most big clubs utterly off it, City going backwards and a pool that have it way too easy and gets help on top, this is indeed the season for them to win it and God forbid go unbeaten. Has been very boring imo.