Mikel John Obi

[didierforever 7,349]

He 'had to have said something' did he? You don't know that for fucks sake.

Players can't do what Mikel did and he's fucking lucky to have just got three games if we're being totally honest.

As for Clattenburg, the authorities found he had no case to answer and the club accepted that. Keeping on implying that he did say something when you've got absolutely no proof is just stupid.

so our players and club are so stupid and vengeful towards a ref who cost us one game that

a) we threaten him after the match going into the ref's locker room.

b.)making it completely public by not only saying it to the press but also lodgging an official complaint to FA.

i know sometimes that we should not read much in between the lines but we should not be so naive that it borders to being plain idiotic and stupid.

there are many cases in which the "guilty" guy walks without much harm but that does not mean he is totally innocent. infact do u actually believe that clattenburg dint say anythin and that our players just thought "we got scrwed by jim today so lets go and screw his life". well if u do then well u should not call other people stupod for fuck's sake.

[The only place to be 11,313]

so our players and club are so stupid and vengeful towards a ref who cost us one game that

a) we threaten him after the match going into the ref's locker room.

b.)making it completely public by not only saying it to the press but also lodgging an official complaint to FA.

i know sometimes that we should not read much in between the lines but we should not be so naive that it borders to being plain idiotic and stupid.

there are many cases in which the "guilty" guy walks without much harm but that does not mean he is totally innocent. infact do u actually believe that clattenburg dint say anythin and that our players just thought "we got scrwed by jim today so lets go and screw his life". well if u do then well u should not call other people stupod for fuck's sake.

You do realise that Mikel didn't contest the charge don't you?

As for the Clattenburg incident, we may never know what exactly was said but we know what could be proven and that's really all that matters. You have absolutely no evidence to suggest Clattenburg did anything wrong. What Mikel did, regardless of the extenuating circumstances, was wrong. You can't go and confront refs in their rooms after matches. It's one of the most important things in the game in my opinion and any player doing so should be punished heavily.

Three games was light. As for the options you mentioned, you left out the idea that Ramires misunderstood something Clattenburg said to Mikel.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

^^

Can we please drop it. It's a crisis that has finally passed, do we have to relive it?

[Laylabelle 9,300]

Hopfully this is the end of it all now...that is until Clattenburg is a ref in one of our games and its all dragged back up again....

[Kez 2,727]

You simply can't storm into the referees dressing room shouting the odds without knowing facts. This ban is totally deserved and he's lucky it's only 3 games. Now lets move on from this farce, caused us nothing but problems.

[Blue Armour 4,168]

That's complete nonsense, really...

So for you 'Macazar' has to be feeded by Mikel who has to get past the midfield line on 20 yards to give the ball in hands ? Because "it doesn't takes away a body upfront" that's dumb.

There's absolutely no relation with Benitez's change that is a good thing. The instruction is to protect the full backs to imrove the defensive positioning (there's slight improvement in terms of how to cope with the given defensive situations). The CONSEQUENCE is that we attack via fast break, that highlights several things:

• With defensive duties to fulfil, Hazard/Mata can't appear that bright attacking
  
• There's more ground to cover before going into dangerous positions
  

We've a knackered team, so obsiously the tiredness and it's impact is put under the spotlight on fast break situations and some transitions (such as the game vs Fulham).

There's improvement to do in terms of defending the situations (that's still a bit of last season when we still conceded a lot of chances). But the current better positinoning allows the DP to pick 2nd balls on crosses and find quicker the wing players

Is Mikel the white Lampard ? Vidal inserts and shots in Lampard's zone. There's much more of an issue there as that's precisely the situation where one of the two players of the double pivot has to come out on the holder.

Yes that sounds pretty dumb, and no that still isn't what I was talking about.

I didn't ask Mikel to go anywhere. I just want him to stop pondering on the ball during the buildup. When he ponders on the ball the attackers are forced to track back. I don't want them to track back, I want them to stay forward, and Mikel to pass to them when they come into a decent position. That way the shape of the attack doesn't change.

Is Mikel the white Lampard ?

I don't understand you're saying here..But anyway, you're saying Vidal was playing the box-to-box role Lampard plays in? Yes that was obvious from the highlights, and I know he does play that role. Ramires went into the box marking another attacker...There are two unmarked attackers (including Vidal) arriving into the box...What does Mikel do? He just jogs back, ball-watching and not paying attention to Vidal.. When the opposition is in my third of the pitch, I would expect my players to be more aware of their surroundings and make all possible attempts to stop the attack..and Mikel did not do that in that instance.

[didierforever 7,349]

You do realise that Mikel didn't contest the charge don't you?

As for the Clattenburg incident, we may never know what exactly was said but we know what could be proven and that's really all that matters. You have absolutely no evidence to suggest Clattenburg did anything wrong. What Mikel did, regardless of the extenuating circumstances, was wrong. You can't go and confront refs in their rooms after matches. It's one of the most important things in the game in my opinion and any player doing so should be punished heavily.

Three games was light. As for the options you mentioned, you left out the idea that Ramires misunderstood something Clattenburg said to Mikel.

dude y do u keep saying the same things over and over again. i have already accepted that mikel should have been banned and even if clattenburg was proved guilty, mikel still would have got a ban.

so tell me y would mikel contest the ban?

as for the evidence argument, well i have said this in my last 2 posts, lets use our common sense more than what the FA has proven or not proven.

[The Skipper 20,593]

Yes that sounds pretty dumb, and no that still isn't what I was talking about.

I didn't ask Mikel to go anywhere. I just want him to stop pondering on the ball during the buildup. When he ponders on the ball the attackers are forced to track back. I don't want them to track back, I want them to stay forward, and Mikel to pass to them when they come into a decent position. That way the shape of the attack doesn't change.

I don't understand you're saying here..But anyway, you're saying Vidal was playing the box-to-box role Lampard plays in? Yes that was obvious from the highlights, and I know he does play that role. Ramires went into the box marking another attacker...There are two unmarked attackers (including Vidal) arriving into the box...What does Mikel do? He just jogs back, ball-watching and not paying attention to Vidal.. When the opposition is in my third of the pitch, I would expect my players to be more aware of their surroundings and make all possible attempts to stop the attack..and Mikel did not do that in that instance.

You can't really expect Mikel, or anyone in his position, to solely be responsible to get the ball forward.

All an opposition manager would have to do to counter that is to keep pressure on Mikel and blocking his lane of vision and that would completely nullify the front 4 as they would rarely get the ball.

[Magic Lamps 11,453]

Person A accuses Person B of a crime. The FA decide who they like better. Take the case this is person B. Then instead of investigating the case, they decide to punish Person A even though there was no charge against him and search for some evidence to ground that. Then they announce that verdict, no matter if it has anything to do with the case. Get that now. That's how justice works in English football. When the judicial site interacts with the indictment and the defense side directly. Saves time and money. Great stuff, guys.

[Blue Armour 4,168]

You can't really expect Mikel, or anyone in his position, to solely be responsible to get the ball forward.

All an opposition manager would have to do to counter that is to keep pressure on Mikel and blocking his lane of vision and that would completely nullify the front 4 as they would rarely get the ball.

I can agree with that. That is a good reason for our attackers to drop deep, although I still feel he lingers on the ball too much,.. waiting for the attackers to come very close to his position before he makes the pass.

[Blue Armour 4,168]

So you ask Mikel to find his team mates vertically something like 20 yards away ? First of all it requires an execllent execution, Mikel's accurate enough. But that's still not enough. The receiver of the pass would be back to goal, having to control a genuine cinderblock (only option to get past through opponents).

You want illustrations or examples ?

Here's one:

You want another one ? Wolves' couple of goalscoring chances in COC came after Romeu attempted creative stuff from the deep to players back to goal who had for only choice that to give the ball away, unaware of what happen in their back.

I'm speaking about Juve's first goal at Stamford Bridge. See Lampard escaping any criticism is just fantastic considering how Mikel was blamed for a so called mistake. But anyway we're used to

Nice illustrations, but I was referring to instances like in this picture:

For this particular example, there was no real problem as Ramires had moved forward when Hazard dropped deep. Thus the attacking shape was preserved. But there are instances where Mikel ponders with the ball too long, making the forward players drop back to make the pass Mikel could have made. This is detrimental in situations where we are on the back-foot/ chasing a game.

[Blue Armour 4,168]

Could you give me the video or something ? Or a broader image ? What minute is it (I've the game on mt PC) ?

The image is from the 58-59'th minute of the W-ham game.

[LDN Blue 7,903]

This game definitely proved Mikel's importance in the squad. There was simply no stability in front of the defensive line. I maintain that we played awful and had Sunderland been more clinical and had a proper attacking force (Wickham was virtually non-existent), we could've had another West Ham-type defeat on the cards.

[Blue Armour 4,168]

This game definitely proved Mikel's importance in the squad. There was simply no stability in front of the defensive line. I maintain that we played awful and had Sunderland been more clinical and had a proper attacking force (Wickham was virtually non-existent), we could've had another West Ham-type defeat on the cards.

Tbh for west Ham, we had Mikel in front of the defense and that still didn't help much. I think the real reason for today's problems was that neither Oscar or Ramires are natural holding mids.

[The Skipper 20,593]

Tbh for west Ham, we had Mikel in front of the defense and that still didn't help much. I think the real reason for today's problems was that neither Oscar or Ramires are natural holding mids.

Yeah, neither are natural DMs so it's definitely going to be lopsided.

[Muzchap 8,966]

Here's the full situation.

Moses, Ramires, Torres and Mata are rooted and/or unavailable. Hazard dropping is a good thing but that's not compensated by a run through space.

Only Azpilicueta will unleash a run forward. Hazard will play to Mata then Azpi, Azpi will give to Mata whose chipped pass will be cleared because it wasn't clearly for Torres (whose run wasn't sharp) nor Azpi.

Basically that was a pass before an assist (or key pass) if Azpilicueta could have crossed the ball

I don't see how that's Mikel's fault.

I still give you credit for cutting the initial image to give the feeling Mikel is a pensioner in wheelchair who cannot pass the ball. Fair play to you.

Uh uh disagree - Mikel has about 4 options there

Simplest one being to Torres who can lay off for either Mata or Moses on the overlap...

I love your pictures, but like Art, there's lots of interpretations

Mine is - Mikel needs to go to specsavers - he has no vision...

Him + Romeu might work though, but thanks to injury we won't find out

[Corner 456]

Uh uh disagree - Mikel has about 4 options there

Simplest one being to Torres who can lay off for either Mata or Moses on the overlap...

I love your pictures, but like Art, there's lots of interpretations

Mine is - Mikel needs to go to specsavers - he has no vision...

Him + Romeu might work though, but thanks to injury we won't find out

I actually would have agreed with you on this last season, but I think he has made massive improvements this season with his passing and vision. His role in the team has changed and he has adapted really well, in my opinion anyway.

Didn't Di Matteo actually start with Mikel + Romeu alongside each other against Swansea? It didn't seem to work well in that game, but the whole team played fairly badly that day. It might be worth another shot.

[Corner 456]

I just disagree with that word, Mikel didn't improved, he was simply able to unleash his passing range much more than he could in his former restricted role.

There's a massive difference between the role and the abilities, isn't that cristal clear ?

Well, it's hard to tell whether he had the ability to do so all along or not as he was playing in a different role. All we can do is speculate about that. Either Mikel had the passing ability he has shown this season all along but was simply restricted by the role he was playing, or he has had to adjust to playing a new role in the team and improve his passing range and abilities. It's hard to differentiate between the two really. Either way, Mikel is showing more vision this season and his passing range is a lot longer than before.

And yes, of course there's a massive difference between the role and someone's abilities, I never said otherwise. That's just common sense.