closed Chelsea 0-3 Bayern Munich

[Jase 43,479]

17 minutes ago, Kun Aguer0 said:

you can't swap Kante for Varane on football manager (not to mention real life)

TBF, I managed to swap a 30-year-old Jorginho + 70 million for a 24-year-old Frenkie de Jong on FM...

[Vesper 28,864]

23 minutes ago, Jason said:

What makes you so sure that Sancho and Werner won't fall foul to our "injury curse" if they come here? 

Regarding Abraham, never mind his recent injury problems (barely missed any games last season with Villa), I just don't think he's good enough for us if we want to get to where we want to. 

Tammy has scored THREE league goals since November 9th

not good enough

 

[Jase 43,479]

Just now, Vesper said:

Tammy has scored THREE league goals since November 9th

not good enough

6 goals in his last 23 games, I believe.

Had chances to score tonight but bottled the opportunities to attack balls coming into the penalty area.  

[MoroccanBlue 5,306]

None of our youth deserve to be at the Euros. I hope James isn’t either. They can focus on improving during the entire summer now they know the intensity both the PL and CL bring. 

[Vesper 28,864]

Just now, Jason said:

6 goals in his last 23 games, I believe.

Had chances to score tonight but bottled the opportunities to attack balls coming into the penalty area.  

I said league goals though

I am not sure if he is good enough to be our lead striker

if he is not

then that is another position we are fucked at

I am so depressed at the state of the team overall

I hate our board with the passion of a thousand burning suns

 

[Tomo 21,733]

1 hour ago, Mana said:

 

Dead serious that not getting top 4/5 is the difference between not getting Sancho and co. We won't be able to afford these guys and we may in the end extend Willian's contract.

Real, Barca or Bayern entering the race is 10000000x a bigger danger to any Sancho deal than not getting CL football.

[Jase 43,479]

3 minutes ago, Vesper said:

I said league goals though

I am not sure if he is good enough to be our lead striker

if he is not

then that is another position we are fucked at

I am so depressed at the state of the team overall

I hate our board with the passion of a thousand burning suns

3 league goals since Nov 9. 6 goals in last 23 games. Neither make great reading, TBF.

He works hard and puts himself about, I'll give him that but I just don't think he has the quality if we want to achieve big things. Maybe he'll get there one day but at the moment, he's not really shown enough that he's THE striker for us to trust for the next 6-7 years etc. 

[Pizy 18,368]

Player for player (when we have everyone fit, that is) I don't think Bayern are a million miles better than we are. They've got a couple of world class players in key positions, yes, but the rest are solid but not spectacular.This isn't the Real Madrid, Barca, or Bayern of recent years where they've got a worldie in every position.

 The biggest differences I see are the speed and confidence in which they zip their passes around knowing that their teammates can control it and also the mentality from every player. There's a big time swagger and confidece you can see. From minute one they looked like they knew they'd boss us and did just that.

So, yeah. We desperately need not only more technically excellent players to replace the Barkley's, Azpi's, Alonso's, etc but players that are grown men with some cajones. Players who don't look totally out of place against this level of opposition. You flip on the TV and some of our players stick out like a sore thumb. Like this level is way above them.

[cosmicway 1,326]

5 minutes ago, Pizy said:

Player for player (when we have everyone fit, that is) I don't think Bayern are a million miles better than we are. They've got a couple of world class players in key positions, yes, but the rest are solid but not spectacular.This isn't the Real Madrid, Barca, or Bayern of recent years where they've got a worldie in every position.

 The biggest differences I see are the speed and confidence in which they zip their passes around knowing that their teammates can control it and also the mentality from every player. There's a big time swagger and confidece you can see. From minute one they looked like they knew they'd boss us and did just that.

So, yeah. We desperately need not only more technically excellent players to replace the Barkley's, Azpi's, Alonso's, etc but players that are grown men with some cajones. Players who don't look totally out of place against this level of opposition. You flip on the TV and some of our players stick out like a sore thumb. Like this level is way above them.

We have n't played against Real for many years.
But we were outplayed by Bayern much more than Barca managed to outplay us, or PSG in recent seasons.

[Iggy Doonican 4,186]

Bad atmosphere tonight really flat pre match in the boozers and in the ground because we all know we just can't compete at this level anymore. Europa league last year turn up usually a comfortable win concentrate on the Sunday PL game. We are miles from competing at the highest level in the premier and champions league Europa league is our level and the sooner fans except that the better.

We all expected hands on our hearts to get beaten tonight but the difference between playing the same team against an injury ravaged Spurs and a European powerhouse like Bayern Munich is is frankly laughable.

[Magic Lamps 11,655]

7 minutes ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Bad atmosphere tonight really flat pre match in the boozers and in the ground because we all know we just can't compete at this level anymore. Europa league last year turn up usually a comfortable win concentrate on the Sunday PL game. We are miles from competing at the highest level in the premier and champions league Europa league is our level and the sooner fans except that the better.

We all expected hands on our hearts to get beaten tonight but the difference between playing the same team against an injury ravaged Spurs and a European powerhouse like Bayern Munich is is frankly laughable.

Tbf we are injury ravaged ourselves. Pulisic, Kante, RLC are 3 of our most important players. 
Plus this is probably by far the poorest Chelsea team in the 17 years I have been following this club. I do not think this is the end for us. Most players are young and the ones who are older are not that good that we will miss them much when they leave. A couple of shrewd signings like the Ziyech one and we will be back on track. Lampard is not a Good Coach yet and he seems to be a slow learner as well but he will eventually learn. He has shown that he can adapt tactically and gives youth a chance even though they don’t seem to be developing much under him just yet. 
europa league was way to easy for us last season and we basically walked the competition without playing our best team up until the semis. 
i think 1st ko round under the best 16 teams in Europe is exactly our level and it’s nothing to be ashamed of given the circumstances of transfer ban and years of mismanagement by the board. Onwards and upwards. kTBFFH

[Iggy Doonican 4,186]

1 minute ago, Magic Lamps said:

Lampard is not a Good Coach yet and he seems to be a slow learner as well but he will eventually learn.

Time to use a cliche is not of the essence let's be honest we are miles away from putting in a performance like Bayern did  We saw a European powerhouse tonight we are in their slipstream of them and all the top teams in Europe. Winning the Europa League last year as good as it was especially taking the piss out of so many Gooners that's our level.  There's a chasm in class between us and Europe's elite and anyone who  thinks buying a few players in the Summer will right the wrongs is delusional.

[Superblue 6,370]

1 minute ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Time to use a cliche is not of the essence let's be honest we are miles away from putting in a performance like Bayern did  We saw a European powerhouse tonight we are in their slipstream of them and all the top teams in Europe. Winning the Europa League last year as good as it was especially taking the piss out of so many Gooners that's our level.  There's a chasm in class between us and Europe's elite and anyone who  thinks buying a few players in the Summer will right the wrongs is delusional.

2 title wins under Mourinho and Conte in recent years have papered over cracks that have been there really since the core of the old guard got moved on over 2012 - 2013. The mess of the summer 2017 window and the who's who of poor buys compounded everything.

I don't agree that Europa is our level because we walked it last season but our level currently is about what Arsenal's was 10 years ago, i.e. top 4 and get out the Champions League group. That step up in quality once the knockout rounds came along was always too much for Arsenal and it's too much for us at present. We either work our way back up from that, or we head down the same path of Arsenal who have continued to regress further.

It's going to take a lot of time and patience to work back to the top, both in the boardroom and in the stands. The young players in our squad need a couple of seasons to truly assess their levels of development and how far they can go (you only have to look tonight to Gnabry who 4 years ago couldn't get in the West Brom team that it's too early to make a definitive assessment on 20, 21 year old players) and as you pointed out, we need more than a summer window to address everything. A strong summer window however will make a big difference, we're not suddenly going to be challenging for the Champions League, but we can make some strong progress. 

The key over the next couple of seasons will be to get into the Champions League spots with the additional revenue and added attraction for higher level talent. We've been far too inconsistent with this in recent seasons and that needs to be that starting point from which to build from.

 

[Tomo 21,733]

1 hour ago, Superblue_1986 said:

It's going to take a lot of time and patience to work back to the top, both in the boardroom and in the stands. The young players in our squad need a couple of seasons to truly assess their levels of development and how far they can go 

I wouldn't bother, me pointing out this exact same thing to him has led to about a weeks worth of abuse.

[chippy 342]

1 hour ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Time to use a cliche is not of the essence let's be honest we are miles away from putting in a performance like Bayern did  We saw a European powerhouse tonight we are in their slipstream of them and all the top teams in Europe. Winning the Europa League last year as good as it was especially taking the piss out of so many Gooners that's our level.  There's a chasm in class between us and Europe's elite and anyone who  thinks buying a few players in the Summer will right the wrongs is delusional.

Yep, we are way off the pace and need way more than just a few good signings this summer. Imho, almost an entirely different team from the bang average lot that played tonight.  

[King Kante 1,484]

44 minutes ago, Superblue_1986 said:

2 title wins under Mourinho and Conte in recent years have papered over cracks that have been there really since the core of the old guard got moved on over 2012 - 2013. The mess of the summer 2017 window and the who's who of poor buys compounded everything.

I don't agree that Europa is our level because we walked it last season but our level currently is about what Arsenal's was 10 years ago, i.e. top 4 and get out the Champions League group. That step up in quality once the knockout rounds came along was always too much for Arsenal and it's too much for us at present. We either work our way back up from that, or we head down the same path of Arsenal who have continued to regress further.

It's going to take a lot of time and patience to work back to the top, both in the boardroom and in the stands. The young players in our squad need a couple of seasons to truly assess their levels of development and how far they can go (you only have to look tonight to Gnabry who 4 years ago couldn't get in the West Brom team that it's too early to make a definitive assessment on 20, 21 year old players) and as you pointed out, we need more than a summer window to address everything. A strong summer window however will make a big difference, we're not suddenly going to be challenging for the Champions League, but we can make some strong progress. 

The key over the next couple of seasons will be to get into the Champions League spots with the additional revenue and added attraction for higher level talent. We've been far too inconsistent with this in recent seasons and that needs to be that starting point from which to build from.

 

I do not disagree with this but also think it is slightly generous. I would not say we are a top 4 side. A large reason for us being there currently is due to the spectacular underperformance of Utd, Spuds a Le Arse who all have better squads than us. Further I do not trust our board whatsoever with transfers (although to be fair they are probably better than the other three which says more about the boardrooms in the PL rather than ours.) 

Tonight for me showed that there are currently only two players that are currently fit that can deal with this level of opposition and that is Christensen (who does have faults still) and Kovacic. Mount and James get passes due to age and willingness but the rest were miles off.

Further, whilst such areas as CF, LB, GK etc will be looked at my biggest worry is CM. For me our CM as a collective is awful as we are always easily bullied, overrun, have a lack of goals/assists and lack muscle. CM is meant to be the engine of any team and ours are all small, lack attacking nous in the final third and are mainly un-athletic. People talk about RLC being some sort of saviour but the guy is always injured and even when fit does zero work off the ball. For me the sooner we can get someone like a SMS the better. 

[shrenshah 186]

1 hour ago, chippy said:

Yep, we are way off the pace and need way more than just a few good signings this summer. Imho, almost an entirely different team from the bang average lot that played tonight.  

Current squad, the only starters i can see are Ziyech, Reece and maybe Abraham

 

We need 8 new players

[cosmicway 1,326]

Let's face it, we were played off the pitch and even before they scored it looked pretty hopeless.
In the last seven-eight years our champions league exits were to Inter Milan, Atletico, PSG twice and Barcelona.
Every time we put up a fight, even against Barca two years ago when Courtois was nutmegged twice.
This time we could not put up a fight and this is what makes me feel very unhappy - not so much that we are going out to Bayern Munich.
It looks as if we need twenty years to reach their level.
There is only one place to look for the source of the problem and it is the board.