The Mourinho Thread

[didierforever 7,349]

It isn't over yet, although the team must get back on track immediately, otherwise the crown is out of reach, that's right!

There is still the FA Cup, Curling Cup and the Champions-League.

Would you consider after winning one of this competitions or reaching the quarter finals in the Champions-League the season a failure?

I can only speak for myself, but cup is cup or the madness in the Champions-League and it has to be a good season,

on one condition: qualifying for the Champions-League next season!

That's a must because of economic reasons.

lets be honest. we are 11 points off and given what we are attackingly, we are never gonna be as free scoring as city, so we literally need to make a 12 point gap. so the PL is over.

yes, these competitions are there.

QF in CL would be nothing. getting a top 4 after winning the PL walking the PL, last season, we conceded the PL defence in 5 games. no progression. there is no progression in our way of play. there is no progression in integrating youth.

whats the point of a top4 place with the same team as last year after winning the PL, and then regressing so poorly. if we had taken out mikel/ramires and integrates mvg/pasalic, i would have been fine. akes, bamfords, rlcs given a chance, then it would be good. but there is not a single thing that i feel we would be "progressing" in if we simply get a top4, qf in CL and a cup.

[GodZola 630]

I shortened you post, hope you don't mind.

In last game Mourinho decided to play Mikel next to Matic, the intention is clear.

It's broken and not easy to fix...

Not at all fella, let me ask you this, would you play Mikel alongside Matic in our current predicament? I wouldn't let him in my Sunday league team let alone in a PL fixture! The decision to play Mikel is bizarre in my book.

It's not just who plays alongside Matic that's the problem, the offensive players have to work so much harder when we haven't got the ball.

[Clockwork 1,794]

There you go.

Short term extremist view (last season) = current situation now.

In life you reap what you sow.

We failed to address the issues last season, and are now reaping the rewards this season.

That's the general gist of Mourinho complaints - his failure to see the bigger picture and put us in a 'progressive' position. We seem to be 'regressing' at an alarming rate.

This

If i can simply name the biggest issue with Mou is his lack of foresight and extremely short term oriented. When he came here instead of trying to build a sustainable successful side, Mou came here looking for instant results. Well he got his instant results now we are facing his actions.

If there is one position that perfectly describe his short comings is how he handled Ivanovic and Flipe Luis. The fact is we would not have our biggest culprit Ivanovic if Mou took a proactive approach to the position, and saw that long term Azpi and Luis is better solution going forward. But Mou saw we were getting results, and could not think beyond that.

[Laylabelle 9,536]

Just need to get a run going,pick up points and ready our selves for the usual xmas crappyness

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

Just need to get a run going,pick up points and ready our selves for the usual xmas crappyness

We're in a crisis. We're leaking goals and creating nothing. We're close to the relegation zone. You make it sound like there's a switch we can turn off and on and we magically start playing well again.

[Tomo 21,751]

Yes but if we are going to put up with bad season I would at least like to see good Fútbol or the intention of improvement, some youth development and someone not as controversial.

For the 3 seasons we are having with Mourinho it can easily be done by someone like pellegrini or klopp without all that noise.

Nothing this guy has done cannot be match by someone else.

Early days but it signs are good so far in one regard with Kennedy and RLC, the other one needs work on mind

[Tomo 21,751]

We're in a crisis. We're leaking goals and creating nothing. We're close to the relegation zone. You make it sound like there's a switch we can turn off and on and we magically start playing well again.

Cream will rise eventually, its a horrible situation right now, but we won't be next to relegation for long, whether performances will improve is doubtful, but results will sooner rather than later.

[Laylabelle 9,536]

We're in a crisis. We're leaking goals and creating nothing. We're close to the relegation zone. You make it sound like there's a switch we can turn off and on and we magically start playing well again.

we ain't gana stay there.Better not anyway if so history repeats and all.. May struggle for top 4 but it's a long way to go and anything can happen.The likes of Man U,Liverpool, Arsenal at some point have started like this some point before.If changes were made we could start playing well again or at least half decent.Drop the crap and he needs to stop putting faith in clearly the wrong lot

It was clear after the 2nd half of last season and pre season there were issues but seemed quickly shrugged off or put down to its only pre season..it really ain't.

[Special Juan 28,156]

Our play has been so scripted and readable for so long it's hard to see exactly how, and when it will change. I certainly can't see a grind out 1-0 result coming anytime soon due to defensive frailties, and nor can I see a 2/3-0 win coming anytime soon either.

Players have been massively under-performing but in all this JM is culpable for simply not dropping these players who have under-performed for weeks now.

Jose, you claim to be 'The Special One' lets see why, and lets see some 'Balls'

[zolayes 14,489]

Tactically speaking, Is there any reason to believe the bad spell and the terrible football won't continue? I'm not interested what Jose is or is not admitting. He is a man under pressure and his pressers just get more pointless and irrational after each bad result.

I am totally lost as to what our tactics are . I see no pattern or consistency in what we are TRYING to do .. Seems just go on the pitch and hope something good will

happen ...

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

we ain't gana stay there.Better not anyway if so history repeats and all.. May struggle for top 4 but it's a long way to go and anything can happen.The likes of Man U,Liverpool, Arsenal at some point have started like this some point before.If changes were made we could start playing well again or at least half decent.Drop the crap and he needs to stop putting faith in clearly the wrong lot

It was clear after the 2nd half of last season and pre season there were issues but seemed quickly shrugged off or put down to its only pre season..it really ain't.

Answer this honestly. Does Mourinho have any sort of history of being able to drag his clubs out of a quagmire?

[GodZola 630]

This this and this.

I don't think he has had as bad starts but im sure Fergie oversaw runs as bad as this

Think someone flagged this up earlier in the thread, could of even been you Tomo? Fergie himself said he had to change the way Utd started the season cus Jose totally out foxed him in his first tenure, whilst that's not totally relevant to our current crisis it's something he had to address, it was indeed around that period that his team was struggling, he knew that he had to rebuild again & was given the time & patience to do so - Jose gave a list of players to the board he wanted back in April, he recognised that we needed to reinforce his squad, Utd were rewarded by backing Fergie, he didn't become a poor manager overnight & nor has Jose, of course he needs to get his shit together but he should be given wholehearted commitment from the board.

The board had 4 months, 4 KIN MONTHS to get their shit together & we end up with some late scrambled FAILED bids. Its pretty clear he isn't or should I say doesn't have the final say on transfers which to me is dangerous route to go down IMHO.

[Stingray 9,441]

What bothers me is that we also forego on the CL ticket we earned last year. If we suck this year, what use was last year (besides the title-which was awesome). I can not really laugh if we would exit the CL prematurely, lose to the Arse, etc.

That is why problems need to be adressed now. Its a bias to think we should just continue. Heck, it even has a name! The Sunk Cost bias (Google it peeps) , thinking we cannot ditch Mou because of the history. It will drive us into problems and make our top players go away.

Sunk cost, in my experience the end of corporations, maybe also clubs.

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

I am totally lost as to what our tactics are . I see no pattern or consistency in what we are TRYING to do .. Seems just go on the pitch and hope something good will

happen ...

Hazard has said severally that Mourinho just tells him to go on the pitch and basically create his own play. Use his imagination. Work his own magic so to speak. I remember Robben also saying this about Mourinho as well. I'm sure it's the same for our other attackers. No need to speculate, you can see it in the way we play when we go forward. Chaotic and clueless.

Mourinho is famed for his team's defensive organisation but it seems he has little to offer at the other end of the pitch. Now even our defense is as porous as anything. Despite the fact we defend deeper and commit more bodies in defensive situations than any one of our top 4 rivals.

[Tomo 21,751]

Think someone flagged this up earlier in the thread, could of even been you Tomo? Fergie himself said he had to change the way Utd started the season cus Jose totally out foxed him in his first tenure, whilst that's not totally relevant to our current crisis it's something he had to address, it was indeed around that period that his team was struggling, he knew that he had to rebuild again & was given the time & patience to do so - Jose gave a list of players to the board he wanted back in April, he recognised that we needed to reinforce his squad, Utd were rewarded by backing Fergie, he didn't become a poor manager overnight & nor has Jose, of course he needs to get his shit together but he should be given wholehearted commitment from the board.

The board had 4 months, 4 KIN MONTHS to get their shit together & we end up with some late scrambled FAILED bids. Its pretty clear he isn't or should I say doesn't have the final say on transfers which to me is dangerous route to go down IMHO.

It wasn't me that flagged it up but I've read about if before, in times gone by United always use to gear up to build their way into a season then hit the top gear after new year, but after the back to back titles Fergie completely changed his pre season routine gearing up for a fast start to keep up with us, tbf to the man he always accepted challenges and never shied away from them, he was always adapting that is why he was so successful.

That could be the case, tbh I think they have hit some sort of compromise where Jose can name players and they will try to get them (Stones) and the board will still sign their youth players, where some will go into first team.

This is defiently the trickiest stage of Jose's career, I think he is at a similar stage that Fergie was at circa 03-06(despite last season's title) where people United fans included thought he lost it but he came back with a bang, similar things happening now with Jose, let's hope he makes a similar comeback.

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

Think someone flagged this up earlier in the thread, could of even been you Tomo? Fergie himself said he had to change the way Utd started the season cus Jose totally out foxed him in his first tenure, whilst that's not totally relevant to our current crisis it's something he had to address, it was indeed around that period that his team was struggling, he knew that he had to rebuild again & was given the time & patience to do so - Jose gave a list of players to the board he wanted back in April, he recognised that we needed to reinforce his squad, Utd were rewarded by backing Fergie, he didn't become a poor manager overnight & nor has Jose, of course he needs to get his shit together but he should be given wholehearted commitment from the board.

The board had 4 months, 4 KIN MONTHS to get their shit together & we end up with some late scrambled FAILED bids. Its pretty clear he isn't or should I say doesn't have the final say on transfers which to me is dangerous route to go down IMHO.

Mourinho has been given everything by the board. With the players he has at his disposal, he should be finishing in the top two this season and reaching at least the semi-finals of the Champions league. If anything, we've been left with a stick thin squad of players, thanks to his unwillingness to make use of his entire squad. De Bruyne, Mata, Filipe Luis all gone. Remy, a striker we signed for 10 million last season barely gets a game. Moses never even given a chance. Moses was beasting it for West Ham last night and impressed massively in pre-season but was rewarded with being loaned out. Don't blame the board, blame Jose.

[Tomo 21,751]

Mourinho has been given everything by the board. With the players he has at his disposal, he should be finishing in the top two this season and reaching at least the semi-finals of the Champions league. If anything, we've been left with a stick thin squad of players, thanks to his unwillingness to make use of his entire squad. De Bruyne, Mata, Filipe Luis all gone. Remy, a striker we signed for 10 million last season barely gets a game. Moses never even given a chance. Moses was beasting it for West Ham last night and impressed massively in pre-season but was rewarded with being loaned out. Don't blame the board, blame Jose.

Fair point with the rest but Moses is a clear case of absence making the hear grow fonder.

Pre season doesn't mean anything else Marin will be here, and Moses has always been a mid table player (in before the table jokes) and the two chances he has hadto dine at the top table he was average (his season here) and absolutely attroutious (Liverpool), with Hazard, Pedro, Willy, Oscar here and Kennedy looking set to get a fair number of minutes, there's no room for him here.

[GodZola 630]

It wasn't me that flagged it up but I've read about if before, in times gone by United always use to gear up to build their way into a season then hit the top gear after new year, but after the back to back titles Fergie completely changed his pre season routine gearing up for a fast start to keep up with us, tbf to the man he always accepted challenges and never shied away from them, he was always adapting that is why he was so successful.

That could be the case, tbh I think they have hit some sort of compromise where Jose can name players and they will try to get them (Stones) and the board will still sign their youth players, where some will go into first team.

This is defiently the trickiest stage of Jose's career, I think he is at a similar stage that Fergie was at circa 03-06(despite last season's title) where people United fans included thought he lost it but he came back with a bang, similar things happening now with Jose, let's hope he makes a similar comeback.

Not sure about the compromise mate, we seem too fixated on making a few quid nowadays, that's evident with our current policy on loan players. Not withstanding the Cech transfer where Jose vehemently stated that he wanted to weaken Arsenals squad if they wanted Cech but was dealt a double whammy by the gutless board.

Looking from the outside in, the board only started reacting when it was too late. Not sure why we seem to be complying with FFP cus City had their knuckles rapped then just splashed the cash again after a sudden relax from Pratini! Van Gaal has spent well in excess of £300m, whilst I understand we're not going to get all of Jose list, we should of got 1 quality signing this summer as a minimum.

You're spot on regards Fergie though, José has not been in this position before, its time for him to show his mettle, he's been left with a squad he wanted to strengthen, so time to show he really is the special one!

Confidence plays a massive part in football & I think tomorrows game has come at the right time for us, I hope Jose shakes things up - one good performance could kick start our season.

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

Fair point with the rest but Moses is a clear case of absence making the hear grow fonder.

Pre season doesn't mean anything else Marin will be here, and Moses has always been a mid table player (in before the table jokes) and the two chances he has hadto dine at the top table he was average (his season here) and absolutely attroutious (Liverpool), with Hazard, Pedro, Willy, Oscar here and Kennedy looking set to get a fair number of minutes, there's no room for him here.

Moses in his 1st season at Chelsea scored more goals than Willian has done in almost 100 games for Chelsea. If Moses is a mid-table player, then ideally Willian shouldn't be Chelsea material. But he starts every game. Moses with his direct style of play is a player that could offer us a different dimension but was never given a chance. I pointed out Moses just to show the lack of fairness Mourinho shows to some players and his willingness to completely ostracize them from the squad, to the detriment of the squad. Just like with De Bruyne, Mata, Filipe Luis and Remy.

[Styles 9,790]

Hazard has said severally that Mourinho just tells him to go on the pitch and basically create his own play. Use his imagination. Work his own magic so to speak. I remember Robben also saying this about Mourinho as well. I'm sure it's the same for our other attackers. No need to speculate, you can see it in the way we play when we go forward. Chaotic and clueless.

Mourinho is famed for his team's defensive organisation but it seems he has little to offer at the other end of the pitch. Now even our defense is as porous as anything. Despite the fact we defend deeper and commit more bodies in defensive situations than any one of our top 4 rivals.

Mourinho is more of a motivator and less of a tactician - he doesn't really do anything special or innovative.

It's probably why his style of management is so effective in the short-term and less so over the long-term.