Oscar

[Korea 734]

What is this. are these the list of players that stunk out the place for 6 months playing regularly and managed to bounce back? I'm not following.

Yep.

However, at Chelsea, Jose didn't rotate the players at all, while in the other squads they did....

So....

[The Mak 4,459]

Than what would you suggest?

Sell Oscar and let hazard/cesc lead the press for Jose? In La Liga, Jose might of said Ozil is the best 10 in the world, but anyone that watch RM knows that Ozil was a defensive liability and that Mourinho started to play him on the right side because of it.

I would suggest Oscar start playing better and more consistently in the coming season. If he doesn't he should be shipped on and replaced for the 15/16 season. Simple really.

Ozil may have been a defensive liability, but he created a lot and that is the main role for a No. 10. In the same vein, there's only so long you should persist with a 'defensive no. 10' who creates very little.

[bluesman2610 1,227]

Out off all current AM that are to be called WC atm Messi, Ronaldo , Ribery or Robben none them bar Messi was consistent at a younger age. Robben found his in Munich Ribery too Ronaldo took 3 years in the EPL before he began to show true WC ability. I don't understand why we have such a short fuse for young players but complain we don't give them a shot. Modern day football is too fickle when in the past young players would be given time to fight out of the funk now its what have you done for me lately if it isn't anything of note then "sell him" or "he is overrated".. We as fans want our players to be loyal to us but we can't give them the same respect because there is always another player who will come and replace them.

[Korea 734]

I would suggest Oscar start playing better and more consistently in the coming season. If he doesn't he should be shipped on and replaced for the 15/16 season. Simple really.

Ozil may have been a defensive liability, but he created a lot and that is the main role for a No. 10. In the same vein, there's only so long you should persist with a 'defensive no. 10' who creates very little.

Ozil is the best 10 and flourished at RM. However, at Arsenal he doesnt and brits call him the flop of the year and was getting benched and subbed out quite a bit....

When your manager tells you to play a role, you play that role... Jose and Scolari gives a role for Oscar to play. People seem to think Oscar plays the same role as Mata does, but he doesnt. The tactics are completely different for both players.....

Put hazard/willian/cesc in the role jose gave oscar, lets see if they can last a full season playing that demanding of a role...

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

The first thing Oscar needs to do is hit the gym for a summer. He's too lightweight and its effecting his form and fitness for a season. The game is moved towards pace and power and if your fitness isn't there, you will struggle to find a consistent level. Comparing him to others is ridiculous though, his temperament is completely different. He works extremely hard in his role as 10 and you can see why everyone loves him.

[Korea 734]

The first thing Oscar needs to do is hit the gym for a summer. He's too lightweight and its effecting his form and fitness for a season. The game is moved towards pace and power and if your fitness isn't there, you will struggle to find a consistent level. Comparing him to others is ridiculous though, his temperament is completely different. He works extremely hard in his role as 10 and you can see why everyone loves him.

This is true.

This happen to Ozil, Silva, Mata and Robinho was really good at City for a short period of time in the beginning...

I think Oscar belongs in La liga, moreso than epl.

[lionsden 4,689]

Yep.

However, at Chelsea, Jose didn't rotate the players at all, while in the other squads they did....

So....

Do tell when these players played as poorly as oscar for 6 months of regular playing time because I cannot recall. isco and Gotze are not even starters and there's no way Countinho,Lucas and pedro played consistently badly for 6 months so try again. I follow European football very well so try again and find better examples.

[Korea 734]

Do tell when these players played as poorly as oscar for 6 months of regular playing time because I cannot recall. isco and Gotze are not even starters and there's no way Countinho,Lucas and pedro played consistently badly for 6 months so try again. I follow European football very well so try again and find better examples.

Gotze has been bad for quite a long time now which includes munich+germany nt. Isco played 32 games this season for RM and has the same amount of goals as Oscar....

Coutinho got replaced by Sterling..

Lucas got a few games and was never able to beat out Lavezzi/cavani for a starting position.

You follow european football on your skysports feed.. So

[Tomo 21,681]

People have to stop blaming managers for everything. The team lost 7-1 at home. No team, with any formation should ever lose like that. People are complaining that Willian didn't start or why Fed plays or other changes. It would have made no difference. Brazil was destroyed. You think Scolari said "Hey Luiz, go walk around central midfield and don't mark your man?". "Hey Fernandinho, give the ball away to the opposition every chance you get?" Managers ultimately make very little difference overall. If a team loses 1-0, you can point to some tactical mistake or sub that seemed strange (which people still do too often) but at 7-1? It's 99% the players fault. They were, to a man, atrocious and they have to take responsibility for that.

I agree to some extent, but managers actually make a hell of a difference, if any set of supporters should know that it is us.

Scolari is a awful manager, if we didn't have a group of experienced serial winners in or around their prime's he would have ruined us, as soon as Rafa showed how to counter his tactics every one else followed suit and he had no answer.

[The Mak 4,459]

Ozil is the best 10 and flourished at RM. However, at Arsenal he doesnt and brits call him the flop of the year and was getting benched and subbed out quite a bit....

When your manager tells you to play a role, you play that role... Jose and Scolari gives a role for Oscar to play. People seem to think Oscar plays the same role as Mata does, but he doesnt. The tactics are completely different for both players.....

Put hazard/willian/cesc in the role jose gave oscar, lets see if they can last a full season playing that demanding of a role...

You can argue that players are assigned roles based on their strengths and we know what Oscars strengths are and creating is not currently one of them. The same way when we see Fabregas as no. 10 we'll see a completely different animal.

I believe creativity comes instinctually ala Hazard, Fabregas, Mata etc. and I haven't seen anything to convince me Oscar can touch their levels of creativity. If he could, he wouldn't be asked to be so defensive. Putting it another way, he is currently being asked to play like Ramires and I think that is more so because his offensive limitations rather than anything else...

[drog.ba 239]

This is what I'm afraid of. In the 2012 season it was 'tired because of the Olympics', last season it was 'tired because of the Confederation Cup/focusing on the WC' and now next season it seems it will be 'tired/ needemotionally drained because of the World Cup'.

How long do the excuses go on for? How do you excuse a player for going missing for nearly half a season or never really doing enough offensively? He's still a professional football player and gets rest/extra rest like other players who have also played in tournaments. I don't think the excuses can last forever and I think even some of the Brazilian member here would agree with me. He needs to have a much better season this season in my eyes. No more excuses.

I still think he should be benched for a period before we immediately ship him off, whether to give him or rest or as he's out of form, then judge him after that. Hopefully he'll focus on his Chelsea not Brazil now, if not maybe next summer send him to PSG to join Luiz

Hopefully Mourinho works on his positioning, he is either too far from the central midfielders - but doesn't link well with the striker, or drops far too deep where he can't have an attacking impact. Ends up drifting out of games

[Korea 734]

You can argue that players are assigned roles based on their strengths and we know what Oscars strengths are and creating is not currently one of them. The same way when we see Fabregas as no. 10 we'll see a completely different animal.

I believe creativity come instinctually ala Hazard, Fabregas, Mata etc. and I haven't seen anything to convince me Oscar can touch their levels of creativity. If he could, he wouldn't be asked to be so defensive.

Thats true.

However, sometimes roles are assigned for the better of the team and to let other players shine..

Perfect you bring up Cesc, because cesc was never used properly at Barca nor Spain NT. The Barca fans all wanted Cesc to be sold this season, similar to how you guys are reacting to Oscar.

Hazard for Belgium was not Hazard for Chelsea FC. Same players, 2 different roles and tactics. Obviously, hazard is their best dribbler on their team, however, the offense never/hardly ran through hazard and he was required to play a more traditional winger role, which hazard is not.

You can make a huge list of players at Barca, where their role was not to their strengths and was for a particular someone to reap most of the glory...

[bluesman2610 1,227]

You can argue that players are assigned roles based on their strengths and we know what Oscars strengths are and creating is not currently one of them. The same way when we see Fabregas as no. 10 we'll see a completely different animal.

I believe creativity come instinctually ala Hazard, Fabregas, Mata etc. and I haven't seen anything to convince me Oscar can touch their levels of creativity. If he could, he wouldn't be asked to be so defensive.

Disagree cause none of the player you mentioned have his ability to win back possession as well as Oscar in advanced positions like he does. Which again maybe Oscar strongest trait as well as tactical awareness but playing those players in the position Oscar plays leaves us vulnerable down the middle and that is part of the reason Jose chooses to play a hard work AM in there like Oscar or Willian rather than Hazard or Mata

[lionsden 4,689]

Disagree cause none of the player you mentioned have his ability to win back possession as well as Oscar in advanced positions like he does. Which again maybe Oscar strongest trait as well as tactical awareness but playing those players in the position Oscar plays leaves us vulnerable down the middle and that is part of the reason Jose chooses to play a hard work AM in there like Oscar or Willian rather than Hazard or Mata

Why waste £19m on him when Ramires could have done the same thing. This team doesn't need a defensive AM rather a creative one as creativity is our biggest issue apart from lack of quality finishers (hopefully Costa fixes that) and he adds no value to the team in that regard.

And how many top teams deploy an AM primarily for their defensive skills bar a couple of big matches in the UCL. Attacking midfielders are suppose to be creative by trade and role.

[Dion 2,476]

This is what I'm afraid of. In the 2012 season it was 'tired because of the Olympics', last season it was 'tired because of the Confederation Cup/focusing on the WC' and now next season it seems it will be 'tired/emotionally drained because of the World Cup'.

How long do the excuses go on for? How do you excuse a player for going missing for nearly half a season or never really doing enough offensively? He's still a professional football player and gets rest/extra rest like other players who have also played in tournaments. I don't think the excuses can last forever and I think even some of the Brazilian member here would agree with me. He needs to have a much better season this season in my eyes. No more excuses.

To be fair the excuse of not enough rest could go on because he didn't have the same rest as most other players since the Olympics. I'm not some sort of specialist but I think it's widely known that a player we'll usually lose a lot of muscle, fat reserves and form by the end of the season due to the amount of matches and training he goes through during the year. And he'll use the period of rest and beginning of a season to rebuild his reserves and muscles. The curve usually goes like: beginning of the season gaining form and muscle again; around mid-season they're at their peak of physical form and slowly decline until the end of the season. Oscar has been working tirelessly with little break to rest for years now. I am more disappointed with him than anyone here, seeing that I've followed him since his youth team days and I'm not seeing much improvement in offensive skills, if anything sometimes it seems he got worse. In part probably because of tougher opposition but he looks less confident too. He looks way too shy and scared on the ball. Despite any tactics or instructions he may be given I wanna see him do better offensively and this is the last season I'm willing to wait. If he doesn't perform regularly all season at least on par with the good performances he's had in the beginning of the season and under the management of RDM I'm giving up, just ship him somewhere else and try to cash on it because maybe he's just no supposed to be, at least not at Chelsea or EPL, maybe he's gonna have more luck elsewhere and he won't be hurting us or himself anymore.

His defensive work is fine and really welcome but it means jack shit when his passing, vision or creativity isn't any better than a regular defensive midfielder.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

All you guys like Lionsden and The Mak need to take a step back and look at the situation before you start jumping to conclusions unnecessarily. Oscar just completed his 2nd full year in Europe for his 3rd manager. He never had a full training camp here and clearly didn't have the fitness levels required to play in Jose's midfield for an entire season. Is that so hard to grasp? That he didn't prepare well enough for the demands of Mourinho?

He is a fantastic player who was running on E long before the season was over. If he comes back this year incapable of coping with the demands, then and only then will you have a case. Jose also benched Schurrle at the beginning of the year because he wasn't fit enough to play for Chelsea.

[The Mak 4,459]

Thats true.

However, sometimes roles are assigned for the better of the team and to let other players shine..

Perfect you bring up Cesc, because cesc was never used properly at Barca nor Spain NT. The Barca fans all wanted Cesc to be sold this season, similar to how you guys are reacting to Oscar.

Hazard for Belgium was not Hazard for Chelsea FC. Same players, 2 different roles and tactics. Obviously, hazard is their best dribbler on their team, however, the offense never/hardly ran through hazard and he was required to play a more traditional winger role, which hazard is not.

You can make a huge list of players at Barca, where their role was not to their strengths and was for a particular someone to reap most of the glory...

Disagree cause none of the player you mentioned have his ability to win back possession as well as Oscar in advanced positions like he does. Which again maybe Oscar strongest trait as well as tactical awareness but playing those players in the position Oscar plays leaves us vulnerable down the middle and that is part of the reason Jose chooses to play a hard work AM in there like Oscar or Willian rather than Hazard or Mata

I only say these thing because of the needs of the team. Chelsea's needs are different to Barcelona's etc. What was most troubling last season was our inability to break-down defences of smaller teams who sit back.

What good is a no. 10 who's 'good at winning the ball in advanced position' when a lot of the teams who face hardly attack us? Shouldn't he have something else in his locker? He is a no. 10 after all?! But even when we faced the big teams, Mourinho preferred Willian as 10! So he is ineffective at breaking down smaller teams yet when we face a team who attack us he isn't used?! Why is that? These are the difficult questions at the moment...

Overall, yes; Mourinho has asked him to perform a certain job but that does not mean he is exempt from creating hardly anything when we need it against defensive opposition.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

Why waste £19m on him when Ramires could have done the same thing. This team doesn't need a defensive AM rather a creative one as creativity is our biggest issue apart from lack of quality finishers (hopefully Costa fixes that) and he adds no value to the team in that regard.

And how many top teams deploy an AM primarily for their defensive skills bar a couple of big matches in the UCL. Attacking midfielders are suppose to be creative by trade and role.

I'm confused? Did Oscar not also score 8 prem league goals on a goal starved team? I believe he was only behind Eto'o and Hazard who was also on penalty duty... You're embarrassing yourself dude.