Non-Chelsea Transfer Pub

[OhForAGreavsie 5,898]

7 minutes ago, Spike said:

 

What!? You actually believe none of those players fit within the philosophy at Barcelona? They fit like a glove, it's uncanny how perfect those players are for that team, they haven't been shoved into any team. If you think they Barcelona bought Suarez and Neymar because of their fame, then you are dead wrong. Barcelona signed two superstars that are absolutely perfect for their team, which is completely different from say a club like Real Madrid that signs players purely on the waves they make on the media. 

 

I'm talking about buying 'good' players regardless of whether they are superstars or not. My argument in that initial post is that if you buy quality then whether they are superstars or not isn't going to matter. Barca didn't buy Ibra because they thought he was a superstar, they bought him because they thought he was better than what they had. Just because they were not proved entirely correct does not mean their motives shoud be recategorised. They just got it right with Suarez and slightly wrong with Ibra. Exact same motives however.

[Spike 12,049]

4 minutes ago, OhForAGreavsie said:

I'm talking about buying 'good' players regardless of whether they are superstars or not. My argument in that initial post is that if you buy quality then whether they are a superstar or not is not going to matter. Barca didn't buy Ibra because they thought he was a superstar, they bought him because they thought he was better than what they had. Just because they were not proved entirely correct does not mean their motives shoud be recategorised. They just got it right with Suarez and slightly wrong with Ibra. Exact same motives however.

I think you have misunderstood every single post I've made. I honestly believe you are debating against a point I never made.

My original post was a criticism of buying players simply because they are famous or perceived as world class without considering how they fit within a team, philosophy and formation. You said 'tell that to Barcelona' when that is something Barcelona doesn't do.

No, you are completely wrong on the Ibrahimovic and Suarez transfers. Ibrahimovic was bought to be a Plan B; in other words to provide a different approach to offence, not because he was 'better' than what they had. Suarez however was the missing forward they needed for their starting XI. The underlying motivation is completely different.

[OhForAGreavsie 5,898]

9 minutes ago, Spike said:

I think you have misunderstood every single post I've made. I honestly believe you are debating against a point I never made.

My original post was a criticism of buying players simply because they are famous or perceived as world class without considering how they fit within a team, philosophy and formation.

But who does that though? Who looks at a player and thinks, he's completely wrong for us but he's a superstar so lets buy him? Chinese or MLS clubs maybe and what's more they are right because what they need from a player is different to the requirements of key clubs in Europe.

[Spike 12,049]

1 minute ago, OhForAGreavsie said:

But who does that though? Who looks at a player and thinks, he's completely wrong for us but he's a superstar so lets buy him?

Real Madrid. Have you ever read about Perez? Do you know of the story concerning his Head Scout and Kaka? His head scout at the time was pushing for Perez to authorise a transfer for Kaka, Real Madrid at the time had connections with Sao Paulo and had rights to buy him but Perez refused stating something along the lines of 'Get back to me when he [Kaka] is worth $50,000,000 to the world'. 

Are you unaware of the two Galacticos policies?

[OhForAGreavsie 5,898]

1 hour ago, Spike said:

Real Madrid. Have you ever read about Perez? Do you know of the story concerning his Head Scout and Kaka? His head scout at the time was pushing for Perez to authorise a transfer for Kaka, Real Madrid at the time had connections with Sao Paulo and had rights to buy him but Perez refused stating something along the lines of 'Get back to me when he [Kaka] is worth $50,000,000 to the world'. 

Are you unaware of the two Galacticos policies?

That's still not buying them because they are superstars. It's buying them when they are superstars. There's a difference you'll agree.

That behaviour is in furtherance of the club's philosophy and, in its own terms, makes sense. Real aim to exploit their position at the apex of the transfer market to minimise their risk, as they see it. Just as I say we should not shop for ready made superstars because we don't quite have the pull to attract the genuine article, Real reason that they are the big beasts in the market so they don't need to take punts. Where we must try to find the soon will be a star player, they choose to wait until the player is established and, in their view, proved. They calculate that they can afford that policy, that it will ultimately mean they waste less money than they otherwise might and that their spending will be offset by the extant commercial value of the players they acquire.

You talk about shopping with a philosophy, that is their philosophy. What's more it works. They have for long periods been a better team than Barca. It's only Barca's unrepeatable crop of in house monsters who have tipped the balance. Those monsters are are already growing old.

[bellion 170]

What's wrong with buying ready-made superstars?  That's how success has come to all the big clubs for decades and it's the best formula provided the budget is there.

Any fan with a brain cell or two would rejoice if the club bought Gareth Bale, Neymar or Laporte which would add instant quality and lift the squad morale.

Buying or loaning has-beens like Pato and never-weres like Papy & Hector and having quality players leave the club due to no CL competition will only ensure a bottom half future or even become relegation strugglers. 

 

[bellion 170]

2 hours ago, OhForAGreavsie said:

That's still not buying them because they are superstars. It's buying them when they are superstars. There's a difference you'll agree.

That behaviour is in furtherance of the club's philosophy and, in its own terms, makes sense. Real aim to exploit their position at the apex of the transfer market to minimise their risk, as they see it. Just as I say we should not shop for ready made superstars because we don't quite have the pull to attract the genuine article, Real reason that they are the big beasts in the market so they don't need to take punts. Where we must try to find the soon will be a star player, they choose to wait until the player is established and, in their view, proved. They calculate that they can afford that policy, that it will ultimately mean they waste less money than they otherwise might and that their spending will be offset by the extant commercial value of the players they acquire.

You talk about shopping with a philosophy, that is their philosophy. What's more it works. They have for long periods been a better team than Barca. It's only Barca's unrepeatable crop of in house monsters who have tipped the balance. Those monsters are are already growing old.

My fear is that Chelsea won't even shop for an up-and-coming player like when we bought Hazard as the Board seems to have clamped down on such transfers. 

Also, the scouting has been very hit-and-miss when it comes to spotting potential gems i.e. Salah, Cuadrado, Schurlle, etc.

On top of that, there is the very real risk of losing our best players in Hazard, Costa and Willian due to not having qualified for CL next season. 

Damn the bloody Board if they push the team to drop into the bottom half because they want to save a few more pennies!

[jasonnorin 1]

Just in, Chelsea may have contacted AC Milan over a potential transfer move for Gianluigi Donnarumma.

[Blue Colored Sky 1,807]

11 hours ago, OhForAGreavsie said:

 

Personally I don't think our problem has been the category of player we have signed, our problem is the quality. It matters not if a new arrival if reputedly World class or regarded as a nobody. What matters is how good a player he is. Get that right and not much else is going to matter. As Real Madrid's bosses say, it's the expensive superstars that work out to be the best value for money.

That said I have long held the view that we should not pay superstar fees for anyone. I say this because of the belief that such players would be wanted by one of the clubs higher up the food chain and they would always prefer joining one of those teams over Chelsea. If we get 'em it's because none of the dream clubs want them badly enough and if they are not wanted there's a reason for that. In terms of recruits for the first team, we seem to be addicted to names. Names are known quantities. They either have the requisite quality and the dream clubs will nab them or they don't and we'd be wasting our money anyway.

.

How you can say that knowing that Bayern transfer record is mere 40m€ (31m£ at current rate) ? They actually spend more than 30m€ only 2 times I think. And they're part of dream clubs.

 

 

[BlueTillIDie 0]

Any one know much about this kid? http://www.footballwhispers.com/players/paulo-dybala?to=chelsea 

[Yeboii 1,844]

21 minutes ago, BlueTillIDie said:

Any one know much about this kid? http://www.footballwhispers.com/players/paulo-dybala?to=chelsea 

The next big thing apparently

[MefiX19 1,092]

23 minutes ago, BlueTillIDie said:

Any one know much about this kid? http://www.footballwhispers.com/players/paulo-dybala?to=chelsea 

He is fucking beast

[OhForAGreavsie 5,898]

1 hour ago, BlueTillIDie said:

Any one know much about this kid? http://www.footballwhispers.com/players/paulo-dybala?to=chelsea 

Last April, before he moved to Juve, I posted this: -

On 17/04/2015 at 1:53 PM, OhForAGreavsie said:

I'm seriously under qualified to comment having seen so little of this bloke but I do like what I have seen. In my opinion we urgently need a technically gifted striker because I believe that's something we miss badly. Jose likes to talk about a squad that offers different solutions; Dybala would certainly be different to anything we have now.

And then this: -

On 19/04/2015 at 5:22 PM, OhForAGreavsie said:

Watched Dybala today. He set up both goals in a 2-1 win, hit the woodwork and was MoTM. I like this bloke and we need a player like him. If we land him I'll be pleased.

 

[Sideshow Luiz 2,310]

On 2/15/2016 at 5:38 PM, OhForAGreavsie said:

But who does that though? Who looks at a player and thinks, he's completely wrong for us but he's a superstar so lets buy him? Chinese or MLS clubs maybe and what's more they are right because what they need from a player is different to the requirements of key clubs in Europe.

Madrid are the kings of that.  They fall in love with the flavour of the month then ask the manager to shoe horn them in.

[Sideshow Luiz 2,310]

On 2/15/2016 at 5:50 PM, Spike said:

Real Madrid. Have you ever read about Perez? Do you know of the story concerning his Head Scout and Kaka? His head scout at the time was pushing for Perez to authorise a transfer for Kaka, Real Madrid at the time had connections with Sao Paulo and had rights to buy him but Perez refused stating something along the lines of 'Get back to me when he [Kaka] is worth $50,000,000 to the world'. 

Are you unaware of the two Galacticos policies?

It's great for the rest of football though.  Just wait until Madrid offload someone because they bought a replacement they didn't need.

Robben, Higuain, Ozil, MAKELELE

That's just off the top of my head.

[The Skipper 20,593]

17 minutes ago, Sideshow Luiz said:

It's great for the rest of football though.  Just wait until Madrid offload someone because they bought a replacement they didn't need.

Robben, Higuain, Ozil, MAKELELE

That's just off the top of my head.

Di Maria, Sneijder... There's quite a few. 

[Sideshow Luiz 2,310]

1 minute ago, The Skipper said:

Di Maria, Sneijder... There's quite a few. 

I didn't include Di Maria because he went for quite a hefty fee.  Forgot about Sneijder.  After leaving Madrid, Sneijder had a legitimate claim to having the best year of any footballer in 2010.  CL winner at Inter, then the WC Final.

Just looked up the fees.  Ajax -> Madrid 27M EUR.  2 years later, Madrid -> Inter 15M EUR.

It was quite a busy 2009 window for Madrid, lot's of in's.  The direct replacement would be Kaka though.  65M.

They also bought Ronaldo, Benzema, and Alonso.  Shipped off Robben that summer too (25M).  That is a very busy window for the club shop.

[Special Juan 27,439]

Sell Hazard for big dollars, then use this money to strengthen up both midfield and defence.