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MrBlueGuy

Next Manager?

Started by MrBlueGuy,

5,540 posts in this topic
9 hours ago, Jason said:

 

Is there a convincing argument as to why Sarri should stay based on what he's doing THIS season? Most, if not all, of the arguments I have seen are basically backing the manager for the sake of it.

The most convincing argument i can make for Sarri is that if he stays on, we will more likely to see a much needed revamp of the squad. If a new manager comes in, the players will definitely get a fresh start and a new beginning. 

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Just now, Clockwork said:

The most convincing argument i can make for Sarri is that if he stays on, we will more likely to see a much needed revamp of the squad. If a new manager comes in, the players will definitely get a fresh start and a new beginning. 

Revamping the squad is one thing but are we seriously gonna be happy with a stubborn manager and basically a one trick pony?

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6 minutes ago, Jason said:

Revamping the squad is one thing but are we seriously gonna be happy with a stubborn manager and basically a one trick pony?

Depends what Sarri can bring to the table when he has his players

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1 minute ago, Jason said:

Revamping the squad is one thing but are we seriously gonna be happy with a stubborn manager and basically a one trick pony?

No and i am far from being a Sarri backer, but i look at this way i personally see the squad a bigger issue and maintain that Sarri is not the right manager. For me at least there is the foundation for the next guy. I consider the current squad a bigger issue than Sarri. 

 

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Just now, MoroccanBlue said:

Depends what Sarri can bring to the table when he has his players

Sarri has already shown he's a stubborn man and only knows one way of doing things, despite not having the players that suit his style. If he's not willing to adapt now, he's not going to do so in the future. Assuming he stays and gets his players, I'm almost certain we'll still criticize him for being stubborn, inflexible, predictable etc. The likes of Mourinho, Conte etc all had players their suit them in the past and we still criticized them for the some of the things we do with Sarri now.

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2 minutes ago, Clockwork said:

No and i am far from being a Sarri backer, but i look at this way i personally see the squad a bigger issue and maintain that Sarri is not the right manager. For me at least there is the foundation for the next guy. I consider the current squad a bigger issue than Sarri. 

It's ironic you mentioned laying the foundation when Sarri continues to play the old guys and not the younger players who should be the future of the team. I think more than anything, we need a Director of Football.

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8 minutes ago, Jason said:

Revamping the squad is one thing but are we seriously gonna be happy with a stubborn manager and basically a one trick pony?

Change is needed and it definitely wont be easy.

There is a huge air of complacency from top to bottom at the club, board to manager to players.

For me, Sarri should get to see the season out, stubborn or not. He has more about him than Villas-Boas, who many have compared him to, and quite frankly as I mentioned in another thread, this changing manager every year or whatever is clearly not sustainable anymore. Its works for 12 months then its same again. A serious reboot is needed all across the club lol. People wanted attractive football when we won playing uglier under Jose and Conte. Roman included. Its not been good recently but its one of them where if we change again its like starting from scratch, papering over the cracks, pinning all the blame on the manager as opposed to everyone from board level to the players. No planning or no consistency. Sarri wants revolution as opposed to an evolution, clearly, although its not working. Even if he doesnt see this season out, its clear that it is desperstely needed. 

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9 minutes ago, Jason said:

Sarri has already shown he's a stubborn man and only knows one way of doing things, despite not having the players that suit his style. If he's not willing to adapt now, he's not going to do so in the future. Assuming he stays and gets his players, I'm almost certain we'll still criticize him for being stubborn, inflexible, predictable etc. The likes of Mourinho, Conte etc all had players their suit them in the past and we still criticized them for the some of the things we do with Sarri now.

Which if it comes to that point, it would be justifiable to sack him. 

As clockwork mentioned, I see far too many average players on the team that hold us back vs Sarri's tactics. 

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Just now, MoroccanBlue said:

Which if it comes to that point, it would be justifiable to sack him. 

As clockwork mentioned, I see far too many average players on the team that hold us back vs Sarri's tactics. 

Which if it comes to that point? :lol: Sarri hasn't shown anything THIS season to suggest we should give him THAT long! He admitted that he doesn't know how to motivate the players and then said how he doesn't know what's the problem with us right now! Seriously, is there a convincing argument out there as to why Sarri deserves to stay based on what he's doing THIS season? So many want him to stay just for the sake of backing the manager, especially after what's happened! :doh: 

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If Sarri has to go then everyone has to go along with him else nothing will change ... the manager is always the fall guy for us while everyone around enjoys the circus. 

Has Sarri done enough, no ... he has been too rigid but then he hasnt received any support on the field as well off the field. 

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10 hours ago, kellzfresh said:

'Some players have privately started to complain that everything is “too tactical” and that there is now an overload of instructions that they can’t keep up with. Others wonder whether this squad is actually tactically intelligent enough to really learn this'. (Miguel Delaney, Independent)

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/manchester-city-chelsea-fc-result-final-score-goals-maurizio-sarri-job-next-a8773131.html

I think we need a new manager that doesn't do too much tactics so that our players can cope. Too much tactics is not good for the players, a new, preferably defensive manager is needed so that they can understand and move forward.

/s

And yet we are comparing our team to the likes of City and Liverpool...The players themselves admit that they are not capable of following the many instructions Sarri gives them so i can't see any of them playing for someone like Guardiola who is very similar to Sarri in this regard. They are not WC and the lack of football intelligence is one of the key factors that are stopping them from becoming such. 

I am sure Willian is one of those who are complaining - he is the best example of the things i said above.  He has all the qualities but his football IQ is below average.Compare him to his fellow Brazillian  - Firminho, and you can see why the latter, despite being the less technical and the less naturally gifted player, is thriving under Klopp.

Hazard maybe falls in this category too. He is a phenomenal player who just wants to play "his football". He was perfect for the counter-attacking football when the whole attack was centered around him and the ball was at his feet all the time but Sarri requires a lot of off-the-ball movement and a lot of  runs in behind the opponent's deffence and Eden is clearly struggling. 

Alonso is just mediocre and his record prior to Chelsea speaks for itself - he has 6500 minutes of top flight football and 2257 minutes in Championship. And he was fucking 26 at the time of his arrival! At the same age Azpi, Hazard and Moses had  19500, 21380 and 7500 minutes, respectively. 

 

IMO the lack of a suitable striker and the "false 9" experiment ruined the flow of our season and fucked-up the confidence we were having. 

Sarri has his fair share of blame but the striker thing was  solely on the board. He is stubborn and I don't like it at all but can you name a manager who is not? He hasn't won anything but he was never in charge of a team capable of winning anything besides Napoli where the priority was the league. And he twice came close to winning it in his three years there but Juventus were too good and had the financial advantage over Napoli. He helped Higuain breaking the Seria A goalscoring record. We beat Arsenal, City, Liverpool and Tottenham which showed that he can compete with the best. Not consistenly, but it's a start. Last season we were a joke against City - yes, in both games we conceded only one goal, but the "football" we played was never gonna give us a chance to compete with City and Liverpool. Mourinho's recent fiasko at United is the clear example that we live in the era of proactive football ans this is the direction we should follow.

BTW,Jose had a similar first season at United but he was backed by their board.

 

 

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Apart from the fact I never wanted Sarri here and that I dislike his brand of football we have to ask ourselves is it acutally worth it? Changing the identity of the club without investing the necessary money will take years of no success. And if we manage it we might be already years behind because we are hellbent on achieving a kind of football that has long been found out. Football progresses, we are still trying to reenact something that has been successful 10 years ago but is unlikely to continue to do so. If we really stick to Sarri then good fucking luck ever winning a major title again. He has never done so and never will simply, set aside his style of play, he is an average manager. Only average managers are that stubborn, unflexible and predictable. You can't tell me that failing over and over again with the same bullshit tactics is going in the right direction or rebuilding our identity or bs like that. We are making 0 progress. He has long been found out and just fails to accept that. Even if we want to play more attacking football (which for 95% of games we have been doing for 20 years now) we need a better manager with a similar style. However, it is still not to late to abort the experiment and go back to signing a counter-attacking coach who knows how to make a team defend.

On a final thought, do you really think Sarri has any tricks left? Maybe we already play his kind of football. At least I don't think we are getting any closer. Maybe what we are seeing is all he has and he is just banging on about how the players dont get his football to keep his job. What if the first 6 weeks of the season we already had adopted his style perfectly and just have been found out since? Just sit a player on jorinho, attack the flanks and if we somehow make our way out from the back, pack the box and chelsea wont score.I honestly thinkt that is a possibility.

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9 hours ago, Jason said:

It's ironic you mentioned laying the foundation when Sarri continues to play the old guys and not the younger players who should be the future of the team. I think more than anything, we need a Director of Football.

Who is the old player that you are talking about? Willian and Pedro over CHO, I have talked about this for a while. 

RLC over Barkley and Kovacic. I don't think Kovacic and Barkley are old

Unless you are talking about Zappacosta over Azpi

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12 hours ago, Magic Lamps said:

Apart from the fact I never wanted Sarri here and that I dislike his brand of football we have to ask ourselves is it acutally worth it? Changing the identity of the club without investing the necessary money will take years of no success. And if we manage it we might be already years behind because we are hellbent on achieving a kind of football that has long been found out. Football progresses, we are still trying to reenact something that has been successful 10 years ago but is unlikely to continue to do so. If we really stick to Sarri then good fucking luck ever winning a major title again. He has never done so and never will simply, set aside his style of play, he is an average manager. Only average managers are that stubborn, unflexible and predictable. You can't tell me that failing over and over again with the same bullshit tactics is going in the right direction or rebuilding our identity or bs like that. We are making 0 progress. He has long been found out and just fails to accept that. Even if we want to play more attacking football (which for 95% of games we have been doing for 20 years now) we need a better manager with a similar style. However, it is still not to late to abort the experiment and go back to signing a counter-attacking coach who knows how to make a team defend.

On a final thought, do you really think Sarri has any tricks left? Maybe we already play his kind of football. At least I don't think we are getting any closer. Maybe what we are seeing is all he has and he is just banging on about how the players dont get his football to keep his job. What if the first 6 weeks of the season we already had adopted his style perfectly and just have been found out since? Just sit a player on jorinho, attack the flanks and if we somehow make our way out from the back, pack the box and chelsea wont score.I honestly thinkt that is a possibility.

So how has Pep's football not been found out? How about Gegenpress under Klopp? What about Spurs and Poch not been found out? I don't believe we've been found out. I do, however, believe the club brought in Sarri without a clear plan. They knew it would take him time and some investment in players he wants. It would likely take two transfer windows to bring in all the players to play his style. Unlike City though, Pep already had an attacking mentality at the club. This defensive mindset our club has had all these years, with hire and fire mentality, as well as poor recruitment is coming back to bite us in the ass. Pep Guardiola apparently told Roman that he would need 10 new players if he came to Chelsea. 

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1 minute ago, It's too big said:

So how has Pep's football not been found out? How about Gegenpress under Klopp? What about Spurs and Poch not been found out? I don't believe we've been found out. I do, however, believe the club brought in Sarri without a clear plan. They knew it would take him time and some investment in players he wants. It would likely take two transfer windows to bring in all the players to play his style. Unlike City though, Pep already had an attacking mentality at the club. This defensive mindset our club has had all these years, with hire and fire mentality, as well as poor recruitment is coming back to bite us in the ass. 

because they are better managers. They change things, they rotate, they don always make the same subs and most importantly the players they chose their system is build around are world class and not easily marked. Sarri chose to build his squad around a player who is just as average. This is why Sarri is a shit coach. He chose to build his system around one single position, one single average player. Pep build his around a bunch of world class player you can not simply mark out of the game as you can easily do with Jorginho. Klopp ist tactically super flexible. His teams can park the bus, press high, low, play with crosses, shots from distance, one touch double-passing and he makes his teams work hard. Sarri fails at all of this.

So the final system, if it is too hard to change our identity, why change it at all? Of all English clubs we won the most titles in the last 10,15 years with a mentality and a tactical identity that was defensively-solid and counter-attacking oriented at times. But that is not the whole story. AS a big team we have always dominated most matches. Even in the big matches. You can dominate without having posession. At our peak we shut out maybe the best side ever, Peps Barcelona, completely and never lost a game vs them. We dominated the best ever ManUtd side whenever we played them and beat them more often than not (only lost in pens usually). We were always pragmatic. Shaping tactics to suit the occasion/oppositon is how you do it in modern football. Pep and Klopp do so. Maybe they make you think that they play always the same system and style like Sarri but in fact they don't you can see that from watching them fucking documentaries. Sticking to Sarri and to an illusion of attacking football will be this club's downfall, even more so with the inept board we have.

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13 minutes ago, It's too big said:

So how has Pep's football not been found out? How about Gegenpress under Klopp? What about Spurs and Poch not been found out? I don't believe we've been found out. I do, however, believe the club brought in Sarri without a clear plan. They knew it would take him time and some investment in players he wants. It would likely take two transfer windows to bring in all the players to play his style. Unlike City though, Pep already had an attacking mentality at the club. This defensive mindset our club has had all these years, with hire and fire mentality, as well as poor recruitment is coming back to bite us in the ass. Pep Guardiola apparently told Roman that he would need 10 new players if he came to Chelsea. 

There are weaknesses in Klopp and Peps teams, getting intobehind the fullbacks who advance high. Always has been. 

 

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