25. Moisés Caicedo

[robsblubot 3,528]

On 25/11/2023 at 04:24, Vesper said:

 

Reassuring that we are not Brighton just yet. 😆

6 hours ago, TheHulk said:

As some others mentioned think the price tag is hanging on him, he looks hesitant many times. Think he gonna look better in a few months.

He's just young. Buying them that young, 21, has a cost.
He was very very lucky to not have seen a second yellow a min 57 and 59 against Brighton. Ref turned a blind eye twice and handed a yellow to a Brighton player for asking for the yellow.

[MoroccanBlue 5,318]

Apparently he wasn't even carded at all yesterday. 

[robsblubot 3,528]

9 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

Apparently he wasn't even carded at all yesterday. 

hmm you are right, he wasn't. Announcers were on and on about it. 😕 
That makes it shocking he did not get carded, but also explains his rash tackles at the time.

Still think the PK was super soft tho. 😅

Edited December 4, 2023 by robsblubot

[Magic Lamps 11,668]

pretty much a one season wonder. He is bang average and just regressed to his normal level here. Never wanted him. Sometimes he looks tidy in possession, puts in  a nice tackle here and there. But long phases of the game just pass him by. Plus he has 1-2 atrociously bad turnovers per game. Some of which have cost us goals.  Those he seems unable to get out of his game. All markings of a mediocre footballer. At this point, he has a long way to go to prove me wrong. 

[Thor 2,421]

1 hour ago, Magic Lamps said:

pretty much a one season wonder. He is bang average and just regressed to his normal level here. Never wanted him. Sometimes he looks tidy in possession, puts in  a nice tackle here and there. But long phases of the game just pass him by. Plus he has 1-2 atrociously bad turnovers per game. Some of which have cost us goals.  Those he seems unable to get out of his game. All markings of a mediocre footballer. At this point, he has a long way to go to prove me wrong. 

Typical outlandish statements. 
 

We look miles better when he plays. 

[TheHulk 1,882]

Unfair with him a bit, he didn't have a proper pre season and was put straight in after all that clubs war, he started horrendous but has improved his level ever since.

I'll start getting worried next season if he doesn't improve but so far others worry me more. Kante at his age was playing in Ligue 2.

Edited December 6, 2023 by TheHulk

[King Kante 1,500]

My biggest problem with Caicedo is his positional awareness. I am fortunate to have my season ticket up in a very good position in the East Upper, so I am able to keep an eye on position and formations a lot - previously I was in the MHL were it is a lot harder to see the patterns. 

What strikes me about Caicedo are two things. 

1) Is that he is incredibly prone to chasing the ball and giving no regard to what is around and behind him. This then leaves gaps that Enzo or James (when he is playing) have to rush into to not leave us exposed to counters - although this then leaves gaps elsewhere, hence why we keep conceding goals on the counter. 

2) Is the amount of help he needs from Enzo and the defensive line to pick up his position. I kid you not, Enzo, Silva and James, spend a vast amounts of time shouting and pointing to him when we are out of possession to fill his position as he has picked up an odd position on the field or started rushing out for no reason. I would honestly say, someone is doing this to him every 2-5 minutes depending on what the opposition are doing. 

One piece of analysis I saw on him that kind of outlined what I am saying is the MotD analysis of the City game. They pointed out how on the third goal he left Silva in acres of space chasing the ball for no reason. He did that throughout that game. Another example in that game of his ball chasing was before there pen, where he wiped out James as he didn't seem aware that James had the better position to attack/clear the ball. 

 

[MoroccanBlue 5,318]

He chases everything with hardly any discipline. This needs to be coached. 

[Fernando 6,483]

A little raw but I still think him and Enzo are going to get better as time passes on. 

With Poch coaching I expect things to improve. Let's not forget he is only 21, and with Enzo they will grow together and chemistry will improve a lot. 

[robsblubot 3,528]

Exactly. We need to know what we bought.

Yes, he was expensive (hardly his fault), but we bought a project, and a project he is.

I did not expect an immediate impact from him, so I'm not one bit disappointed. We need to show patience with these young players, especially the very young, like Caicedo.

[SomethingSomething 17]

6 hours ago, robsblubot said:

Exactly. We need to know what we bought.

Yes, he was expensive (hardly his fault), but we bought a project, and a project he is.

I did not expect an immediate impact from him, so I'm not one bit disappointed. We need to show patience with these young players, especially the very young, like Caicedo.

Tbh for 100m midfielder you fucking better be a top player already and not just a project.

Its not Caicedo fault nor Poch. Its a mistake from board for paying too much on player that isnt worth that, picking a target that doesnt tick any box. Super expensive, not polished. 

He may be world class one day but you just dont pay that for a talent. 

Everytime someone pays big on talent reminds me of Felix. Even if he fulfills potential, thats just covering what was expected for the fee and on top of that you have to wait for years. Chance is he flops and that chance is way bigger than success leaving you with headache and wasted years.

[OneMoSalah 8,783]

Apparently he was the best midfielder in the PL last season (or so he was according to half of this forum), now he is a project? Fuck off. 

Piss poor again tonight alongside his partner and not for the first time they’ve been all over the shop. 

Both are young players but still, it is unacceptable to say they are projects when we are talking about a World Cup winner who cost £105m and a supposed top midfielder who cost £115m, both of who couldn’t even do the basics for their position or look half arsed tonight. Same with most of them. 

If they had done the basics and lacked the quality yes different story but they didn’t even do the basics, didn’t look arsed. Absolute joke.

If this level of performance is acceptable for the coach or the players then I cannot wait for this season to end. Another waste of a season as we continue to drift off in to becoming a mid table team. 

Edited December 7, 2023 by OneMoSalah

[Magic Lamps 11,668]

44 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

Apparently he was the best midfielder in the PL last season (or so he was according to half of this forum), now he is a project? Fuck off. 

Piss poor again tonight alongside his partner and not for the first time they’ve been all over the shop. 

Both are young players but still, it is unacceptable to say they are projects when we are talking about a World Cup winner who cost £105m and a supposed top midfielder who cost £115m, both of who couldn’t even do the basics for their position or look half arsed tonight. Same with most of them. 

If they had done the basics and lacked the quality yes different story but they didn’t even do the basics, didn’t look arsed. Absolute joke.

If this level of performance is acceptable for the coach or the players then I cannot wait for this season to end. Another waste of a season as we continue to drift off in to becoming a mid table team. 

Enzo has always been inconsistent but we have seen him and know what he is capable of. Obviously we overpaid by 60m but he had just played the tournament of his life and we needed a Jorginho replacement.
Caicedo on the other hand is just a fraud. Ppl on here cheery-picked stats of his to paint a BS picture he was ‚dominating‘ PL. truth his he is and always has been a run of the mill average player who goes missing when the going gets tough. He was shoved around the field for Brighton cos he is just a pair of legs but unable to nail down a position. 
core of the problem is that our board and the ppl in charge of scouting and evaluating talent are just as clueless as the hype boys on twitter or some on this forum who big up up every kid who puts in decent tackle or scores a screamer one time. 

[DDA 9,689]

Not living up to even 50% of what we paid for him. Absolutely dogshit. 

Pull your fucking finger out or fuck off when Lavia is back.

[robsblubot 3,528]

3 hours ago, SomethingSomething said:

Tbh for 100m midfielder you fucking better be a top player already and not just a project.

Its not Caicedo fault nor Poch. Its a mistake from board for paying too much on player that isnt worth that, picking a target that doesnt tick any box. Super expensive, not polished. 

He may be world class one day but you just dont pay that for a talent. 

Everytime someone pays big on talent reminds me of Felix. Even if he fulfills potential, thats just covering what was expected for the fee and on top of that you have to wait for years. Chance is he flops and that chance is way bigger than success leaving you with headache and wasted years.

Sure but it is what it is. The club for whatever strange reason decided to go for all these young players and all at once -- spending a lot in the process. I don't understand the reasoning, unless it's not a footballing reason.

I just can't act surprised about something I said very early in the Chelsea Transfer channel, which tbh was quite obvious to me. That these players current ability was below our immediate needs. 🤷‍♂️

[ulvhedin 508]

18 hours ago, Fernando said:

A little raw but I still think him and Enzo are going to get better as time passes on. 

With Poch coaching I expect things to improve. Let's not forget he is only 21, and with Enzo they will grow together and chemistry will improve a lot. 

Right now I am not so sure about Poch 'coaching' - we are about 15 games in the season, and players still look like they are playgin for the first time together.

[King Kante 1,500]

42 minutes ago, ulvhedin said:

Right now I am not so sure about Poch 'coaching' - we are about 15 games in the season, and players still look like they are playgin for the first time together.

Hard to tell to be honest, owing to our squad being so young, it could be they just don't have enough game management experience to execute what he is telling them. 

[Strike 7,249]

As bad as he looked last night, he was outnumbered in midfield.