Super Frank Thread

[Jase 43,479]

15 minutes ago, Nicco said:

Says who? Pretty sure Guardiola would've killed the game 2 days ago if he went up a man, this crap needs to stop. Frank Lampard singlehandely transformed our average, bad defense to a none existing one in the span of a few months, that alone is a sackable offense, I don't give a fuck about his excuses and his zonal defense crap if it doesn't work change it but this guy makes the same stupid mistakes. He talks about Emerson leaving his post in that counter attack like it's normal to have all players in the opposite field with a narrow 1-0 lead.

Guardiola would have killed the game if he went up a man? Clearly someone forgot about Camp Nou 2012.  

I find it amusing that you criticize the players for not being good enough and at the same time, moan about Lampard not being able to finish games off. Yes, Lampard has made mistakes but how exactly is it his fault that the players are so bad that they can't convert chances? It's as though Lampard was controlling the players from the sideline!

Also, you're kidding yourself if you think Guardiola would do better with this squad. He had a better squad than us now when he first joined Man City but still struggled that season, struggled to deal with set pieces, struggled to deal with counter attacks, even had to endure people calling him 'Fraudiola'! And oh he finished in the Top 4 that season, just 3 points ahead of the team in 5th!

Honestly, I don't know what's the point of you and Mana (plus one or two others) constantly coming here and moan about Lampard, moan about the same things over and over and over again, even on days when we do not play! Do you guys really have that much free time? No chance Lampard will be sacked when Sarri survived the historic 4-0 and 6-0 losses and even when Top 4 looked all but gone in the league. Hell, there haven't been any reports of Lampard getting the sack, compare to Sarri this time last season. So seriously, can you just spare us from your endless moaning!? 

[Nicco 927]

13 minutes ago, Jason said:

Guardiola would have killed the game if he went up a man? Clearly someone forgot about Camp Nou 2012.  

I find it amusing that you criticize the players for not being good enough and at the same time, moan about Lampard not being able to finish games off. Yes, Lampard has made mistakes but how exactly is it his fault that the players are so bad that they can't convert chances? It's as though Lampard was controlling the players from the sideline!

Also, you're kidding yourself if you think Guardiola would do better with this squad. He had a better squad than us now when he first joined Man City but still struggled that season, struggled to deal with set pieces, struggled to deal with counter attacks, even had to endure people calling him 'Fraudiola'! And oh he finished in the Top 4 that season, just 3 points ahead of the team in 5th!

Honestly, I don't know what's the point of you and Mana (plus one or two others) constantly coming here and moan about Lampard, moan about the same things over and over and over again, even on days when we do not play! Do you guys really have that much free time? No chance Lampard will be sacked when Sarri survived the historic 4-0 and 6-0 losses and even when Top 4 looked all but gone in the league. Hell, there haven't been any reports of Lampard getting the sack, compare to Sarri this time last season. So seriously, can you just spare us from your endless moaning!? 

Actually comparing our team from 2012 to this trash Arsenal team, fucking hilarious that team had more quality in the right finger than this entire shithouse Arsenal team has, let alone winning mentality.

Yes Lampard should've controlled the game from the sideline it's his fucking fault they drop the intensity, stop pretending he is doing anything to motivate them or that's not his job to do.

I don't give a fuck about Sarri's historic losses, Lampard lost to like 3-4 relegation fodders all in bad forms and consecutive loses pilling up, Bournemouth and Newcastle with half the first team injured. Lampard apologists are the worst.

[Tomo 21,733]

1 hour ago, Atomiswave said:

I want him to stay and do super well but in the end his still a rookie and have so so much to learn. Maybe it comes with time and money well spent.

But its worrying what we are seeing.....forget plan B, what is plan A? What is the system and structor? Cuz I see none of that. We still do not have a first 11, every player gets chopped and changed so often.

Same bloody mistakes all season with no remedy....basics all out the window. Yes we have suffered with injuries, we have average players or spent ones but that does not excuse not having a system.

This will be so tough on FL and I feel for him.

We all signed up for this, we are transfering between ageing players and academy players. We will out football Ajax in Amsterdam one week and lose to a team we shouldn't the next (paraphrasing). It's par for the course.

We are I think 7 points below what we were this time last season and 3 behind what we were with the same fixtures, that's decent going when you consider Hazard has gone and Rudiger has been out most of the season.

And yes there's some decisions he needs to stop making but there's also been cases of rectifying mistakes pretty quickly. For example, no more of the 100mph stuff we saw in the opening against Leicester which left us knackered at the end, soon as he realised he screwed up at Arsenal he changed things and they couldn't get a sniff.

And yes I do believe there are signs of encouragement despite the struggles of late, here are some bullet points as to why I think so (I will probably template this as I feel it will be needed a few more times this season).

- He's had us winning three big away games (Ajax, Arsenal, Spurs) after more than two years not winning a single one, and ALL three of them were in a lot part down to his tactics/adjustment's. You could even say four at a push by including this very good Wolves team that scalp the top six as a hobby.

- We went toe to toe with two of the best sides in PL history. Liverpool had to park the bus to escape the Bridge with three points, this was finished article Liverpool vs young players and a manager five games into top flight football. We lost the games due to them being more experienced and clinical but the fact we actually went toe to toe with them and competed at this stage was outstanding.

- When it's come off it's been really good. Watford away especially was an absolute delight to watch.

- He has improved players. Tomori looked like he was finding his level in the Championship until Frank got hold of him, Kova looks a different player this season, Pulisic has started producing numbers that he wasn't really known for, Tammy and Mount are better all round players, Willian is probably having his best season with the club.

- We are vastly underperforming our XG rates at both ends, which as God frustrating as it is currently, is a promising indication things will get better. XG is as accurate a foreshadower of things to come as it's possible to get.

Am I happy with everything he's done? No, I'm particularly vocal at my irritation of the Jorgi/Kova/Mount midfield being broke up prematurely (which in my opinion had cost us atleast 7 points) and i do expect evolvement year on year (less and less of the naiveity we can sometimes see) but all things considered (transfer embargo, losing Hazard, trying to rebuild a core with academy players, all in sundry thinking we'd be lucky to finish top half) he's doing a fine job and I've seen more than enough encouragement there's a potential top coach there.

[Tomo 21,733]

5 minutes ago, Nicco said:

Lampard apologists are the worst.

As are people with agendas.

If you think Lampard is not the man to take us forward fair enough (and ideally bring forward a thought provoking analysis as to why which quite frankly is the least I thought you'd be doing since you feel so strongly about it), but you've been so unobjective you can't even bring yourself to praise the Ajax win.

[Nicco 927]

9 minutes ago, Tomo said:

As are people with agendas.

If you think Lampard is not the man to take us forward fair enough (and ideally bring forward a thought provoking analysis as to why which quite frankly is the least I thought you'd be doing since you feel so strongly about it), but you've been so unobjective you can't even bring yourself to praise the Ajax win.

Some of you are so deep into his bullshit you genuinely don't even admit anymore the referee gifted us a win against Ajax and a draw, it's like you look at the result and pretend the context doesn't even matter anymore, but when we had more possession at City and Liverpool you suddenly talk about context, as I said some of the Lampard defence squad are literally clutching at straws lately. His entire CL campaign was a joke we played like shit in all matches except Lille first match, the only one we deserved more was the first match against Valencia but I'm not sure we would've qualified if decisions didn't went our way. I will never defend this guy until I actually see something positive in our play except the routine he is playing youth!

[Jase 43,479]

7 minutes ago, Nicco said:

Actually comparing our team from 2012 to this trash Arsenal team, fucking hilarious that team had more quality in the right finger this entire shithouse Arsenal team has, let alone winning mentality.

So, first it's how Lampard can't kill teams off and now it's the quality comparison?  

7 minutes ago, Nicco said:

Yes Lampard should've controlled the game from the sideline it's his fucking fault they drop the intensity, stop pretending he is doing anything to motivate them or that's not his job to do.

How do you know Lampard isn't doing anything to motivate the players? Do you have a source? Have you been in the dressing room? 

How can you moan about the players not being good enough and at the same time, moan about Lampard not being good? 

15 minutes ago, Nicco said:

I don't give a fuck about Sarri's historic losses, Lampard lost to like 3-4 relegation fodders all in bad forms and consecutive loses pilling up, Bournemouth and Newcastle with half the first team injured.

Like Sarri didn't have his fair share of embarrassing losses! 

16 minutes ago, Nicco said:

Lampard apologists are the worst.

As are those with anti-Lampard agendas. 

[Tomo 21,733]

Just now, Nicco said:

Some of you are so deep into his bullshit you genuinely don't even admit anymore the referee gifted us a win against Ajax and a draw, it's like you look at the result and pretend the context doesn't even matter anymore, but when we had more possession at City and Liverpool you suddenly talk about context, as I said some of the Lampard defence squad are literally clutching at straws lately. His entire CL campaign was a joke we played like shit in all matches, the only one we deserved more was the first match against Valencia but I'm not sure we would've qualified if decisions didn't went our way. I will never defend this guy until I actually see something positive in our play except the routine he is playing youth!

Point proven!

You can have a fortunate decision to for you and still deserve to win, for example we were robbed of two penalties against Inter Milan in the CL in 2010 but we were still outplayed by Inter and fully deserved to go out.

We may have got a bit lucky with that Promes decision in Ajax (but we've also had shitty decisions to against us in games like Azpi disallowed goal against Liverpool, but that doesn't suit the narrative I guess) but the point is we went away to a teams stadium who have been playing the football we're trying to adopt for the most part of their entire history and outplayed at their own game.

Critisizing recent performances is fair game, even saying you feel he's won't be the right man to take us forward isn't exactly an outrageous opinion to have. However the bottom line is, you are claiming there's been next to nothing positive or encouraging about the season whatsoever, which is (quite frankly) agenda driven horseshit.

[Nicco 927]

Just now, Jason said:

How do you know Lampard isn't doing anything to motivate the players? Do you have a source? Have you been in the dressing room? 

How can you moan about the players not being good enough and at the same time, moan about Lampard not being good? 

 

Do I need a source to watch our matches every week and see it's the same crap for months now? Except the odd match like Tottenham where they probably motivated themselves based on our rivalry the rest has been the same meal, just rise and repeat. I don't even need to watch the matches anymore you can literally predict the outcome that's how predictable and sad we've been lately.

Just because I moan about 2-3 players doesn't mean the entire team is crap. What happened to Lamptey after his good debut, where is Tomori after doing a decent job, how did James mysteriously get injured, why the fuck did Mason Mount start against Newcastle after Barkley's good game in the cup, why the fuck isn't he playing Giroud instead of useless Batshuay, list can go on and on. Kante looks like a pub player, no manager ever achieved this feat but Lampard did.

[Atomiswave 6,072]

27 minutes ago, Tomo said:

We all signed up for this, we are transfering between ageing players and academy players. We will out football Ajax in Amsterdam one week and lose to a team we shouldn't the next (paraphrasing). It's par for the course.

We are I think 7 points below what we were this time last season and 3 behind what we were with the same fixtures, that's decent going when you consider Hazard has gone and Rudiger has been out most of the season.

And yes there's some decisions he needs to stop making but there's also been cases of rectifying mistakes pretty quickly. For example, no more of the 100mph stuff we saw in the opening against Leicester which left us knackered at the end, soon as he realised he screwed up at Arsenal he changed things and they couldn't get a sniff.

And yes I do believe there are signs of encouragement despite the struggles of late, here are some bullet points as to why I think so (I will probably template this as I feel it will be needed a few more times this season).

- He's had us winning three big away games (Ajax, Arsenal, Spurs) after more than two years not winning a single one, and ALL three of them were in a lot part down to his tactics/adjustment's. You could even say four at a push by including this very good Wolves team that scalp the top six as a hobby.

- We went toe to toe with two of the best sides in PL history. Liverpool had to park the bus to escape the Bridge with three points, this was finished article Liverpool vs young players and a manager five games into top flight football. We lost the games due to them being more experienced and clinical but the fact we actually went toe to toe with them and competed at this stage was outstanding.

- When it's come off it's been really good. Watford away especially was an absolute delight to watch.

- He has improved players. Tomori looked like he was finding his level in the Championship until Frank got hold of him, Kova looks a different player this season, Pulisic has started producing numbers that he wasn't really known for, Tammy and Mount are better all round players, Willian is probably having his best season with the club.

- We are vastly underperforming our XG rates at both ends, which as God frustrating as it is currently, is a promising indication things will get better. XG is as accurate a foreshadower of things to come as it's possible to get.

Am I happy with everything he's done? No, I'm particularly vocal at my irritation of the Jorgi/Kova/Mount midfield being broke up prematurely (which in my opinion had cost us atleast 7 points) and i do expect evolvement year on year (less and less of the naiveity we can sometimes see) but all things considered (transfer embargo, losing Hazard, trying to rebuild a core with academy players, all in sundry thinking we'd be lucky to finish top half) he's doing a fine job and I've seen more than enough encouragement there's a potential top coach there.

At our best we have been very good imo and the right path but man they are so so in between. Mostly its just repeated mistakes now with seemingly no remedy. His tactics leave alot to be desired but at the same time has done tactcial changes to our benefit.....Again he is on a learning curve himself. He needs to be more astute, he should have sat back a bit and play safe when 10 man arsenal was all over us, and then hit on the break, but thats easy to say in hindsight I know but still. Even klopp after all these years and transfers dont go gung hoo anymore. And FL def needs to be more vocal on the sidelines otherwise the players think what they are doing is ok, he cant look like a man waiting on the bus when we need him most. If by next season the same mistakes and issues are still there then he is done.....lets hope its not the case.

[ZAPHOD2319 4,477]

If anyone said in preseason that we would have a 6 game lead in 4th place in the last week of January, they would have been laughed at. Lampard's team is ahead of expectations. It is a roller coaster ride, but we all knew that would be the case from preseason. 

Saying we should sack a manager that has a team higher in the standings than expected is bizarre to me. 

[Atomiswave 6,072]

It would be ridiculous to sack him and unfair, I for one just hope and wish he finds a way to rid the stubborn mistakes.

[Nicco 927]

1 hour ago, ZAPHOD2319 said:

If anyone said in preseason that we would have a 6 game lead in 4th place in the last week of January, they would have been laughed at. Lampard's team is ahead of expectations. It is a roller coaster ride, but we all knew that would be the case from preseason. 

Saying we should sack a manager that has a team higher in the standings than expected is bizarre to me. 

We aren't in the Top 4 because of Lampard, lets make that clear because some like to twist it like Lampard is doing good because of his league position, any other season and we would be outside the Top 6 easily, there is a big reason there are 10 points between us and the 14th place. Lampard is incredibly lucky our other rivals are just as much of a mess as us, definitely one of the worst PL season I've ever seen in terms of quality, entertaining maybe in terms of closeness and how tight it is.

I'm pretty sure most here watch every rival game in hopes they lose points instead of thinking Lampard can get us Top 4 because that's the sad reality.

[Superblue 6,370]

1 hour ago, Atomiswave said:

At our best we have been very good imo and the right path but man they are so so in between. Mostly its just repeated mistakes now with seemingly no remedy. His tactics leave alot to be desired but at the same time has done tactcial changes to our benefit.....Again he is on a learning curve himself. He needs to be more astute, he should have sat back a bit and play safe when 10 man arsenal was all over us, and then hit on the break, but thats easy to say in hindsight I know but still. Even klopp after all these years and transfers dont go gung hoo anymore. And FL def needs to be more vocal on the sidelines otherwise the players think what they are doing is ok, he cant look like a man waiting on the bus when we need him most. If by next season the same mistakes and issues are still there then he is done.....lets hope its not the case.

At what point exactly were 10 man Arsenal 'all over us'?! I think any team would rightly push for the second goal in that situation.

Massive mistakes were made for the goals but I don't hold Lampard accountable for them. If some of our players need hand holding to prevent such naive mistakes such as not following positional instructions at set pieces and not kicking the ball out of play for time and game management then they will not last much longer here.

[Jase 43,479]

24 minutes ago, Mana said:

Exactly. Chelsea has been playing in relegation form just under 2 months. Lampard isn't doing good, it's the footballing gods that keep reviving Lampard from losing that top 4 spot. Just like the footballing gods are helping Liverpool.

It's up to the footballing gods on when they finally stop giving Lampard lifelines.

We get it, you think Lampard is doing a shit job, that he's lucky the other teams are shit and we are lucky to be in the Top 4 bla bla bla. Do you fellas have anything else to talk about here other than your endless/incessant moaning about Lampard? 

[Superblue 6,370]

19 minutes ago, Mana said:

Exactly. Chelsea has been playing in relegation form just under 2 months. Lampard isn't doing good, it's the footballing gods that keep reviving Lampard from losing that top 4 spot. Just like the footballing gods are helping Liverpool.

It's up to the footballing gods on when they finally stop giving Lampard lifelines.

We've been in pretty poor form that's obvious, but the 16 teams below us have barely got any closer to us.

We're in 4th place on merit because we strung an excellent run of wins together earlier in the season. If the teams below us are incapable of doing the same then they don't deserve to get above us.

To be honest, we're in transition and have a lot of work to do, but the league as a whole is probably the poorest it's been in years, the top two obviously excluded and we're clearly benefiting from that at the moment. 

But footballing gods? Bloody hell, we might as well talk about fairies and unicorns coming up to Lampard's window and spraying some magic dust on him when he's in bed at night!

[Nicco 927]

2 minutes ago, Jason said:

We get it, you think Lampard is doing a shit job, that he's lucky the other teams are shit and we are in the Top 4 bla bla bla. Do you fellas have anything else to talk about here other than your endless/incessant moaning about Lampard? 

Funny comment considering Sarri was threated way worse last season and you didn't seem to mind his thread bashing.

[Jase 43,479]

Just now, Nicco said:

Funny comment considering Sarri was threated way worse last season and you didn't seem to mind his thread bashing.

Perhaps it was worse but this scenario? It's 100000% worse because it's the same 2-3 people moaning about the same thing over and over and over again, NON-STOP and those people only seem to be doing that and pop up to do that when things go shit. 

[Tomo 21,733]

46 minutes ago, Mana said:

Exactly. Chelsea has been playing in relegation form just under 2 months. Lampard isn't doing good, it's the footballing gods that keep reviving Lampard from losing that top 4 spot. Just like the footballing gods are helping Liverpool.

It's up to the footballing gods on when they finally stop giving Lampard lifelines.

I've just had a look at your posting history and you've posted more in the last week than you did during the entirety of our winning run.