stroey 2,525 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 This lack of respect for Mata is reaching Liverpudlian proportions, and it's disgusting.Mata is just a coward, he just didn't want to stay and fight for his spot. Why should we be respectful towards him? He was the player of the year for 2 years chosen by the FANS, and what did we get in return? He just decided to leave after playing half an year like garbage. He had the most minutes from the 6 AMs after Oscar and Hazard. He could've stayed and win his spot back but he decided to leave. Just a selfish guy with some nice words on his blog which meant nothing after all. edetarod and lucio 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amblève. 4,995 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Mata is just a coward, he just didn't want to stay and fight for his spot. Why should we be respectful towards him? He was the player of the year for 2 years chosen by the FANS, and what did we get in return? He just decided to leave after playing half an year like garbage. He had the most minutes from the 6 AMs after Oscar and Hazard. He could've stayed and win his spot back but he decided to leave. Just a selfish guy with some nice words on his blog which meant nothing after all.Let's forget that Mata was played in a position where he isn't effective at all, that he had to do something that isn't part of his game, that he was in the team one week, and then was benched the next weekend.Oh, and let's forget that he was basically the only reason why weren't as "creative" as Stoke, that he had more win shares than anyone else in those 2 years.This is exactly the "sheep and shepherd" analogy I was talking about in the pub. Rambo, Mufassir08, mediator and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post! zolayes 14,489 Posted July 29, 2014 Popular Post! Share Posted July 29, 2014 I was sorry we sold Mata ,,,,,,,, BUT IM fucking delighted we have Cesc, mtowle182, Korea, Daniel1980 and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korea 734 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I can honestly see jose goingcesc-matic-ramires and dropping either willian/oscar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styles 9,790 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I can honestly see jose goingcesc-matic-ramires and dropping either willian/oscarAgreed. Hopefully Van Ginkel gets some minutes too.A Matic-Fabregas midfield isn't going to work in my opinion. Blue-in-me-Veins 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korea 734 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Agreed. Hopefully Van Ginkel gets some minutes too.A Matic-Fabregas midfield isn't going to work in my opinion.The epl isnt that great in terms of CM combos, however, against chelsea, most teams will counter and neither matic or cesc have great stamina nor pace. But rambo has great pace and stamina and more likely than not will at least foul the player.... Styles and Amblève. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zolayes 14,489 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 The epl isnt that great in terms of CM combos, however, against chelsea, most teams will counter and neither matic or cesc have great stamina nor pace. But rambo has great pace and stamina and more likely than not will at least foul the player....and pick up a red card .. wonderful logic ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korea 734 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 and pick up a red card .. wonderful logic ...No sacrifice no victory......I.e Suarez, haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zolayes 14,489 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 No sacrifice no victory......I.e Suarez, haha.I think you will find picking up a red card brings more defeats than victories Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iseah100 5,612 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Mata is just a coward, he just didn't want to stay and fight for his spot. Why should we be respectful towards him? He was the player of the year for 2 years chosen by the FANS, and what did we get in return? He just decided to leave after playing half an year like garbage. He had the most minutes from the 6 AMs after Oscar and Hazard. He could've stayed and win his spot back but he decided to leave. Just a selfish guy with some nice words on his blog which meant nothing after all.Lol wtf. So a player who was the back to back player of the year and played amazing football is a coward cause he didn't want to fight an average 21 year old playmaker for the starting spot? Lol right. Sidzeret and zolayes 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barbara 15,149 Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 I'm not one to defend Mata's permanence. I think he had to go despite liking him as a person a lot and thinking few players in the world are as creative as he is. But I wouldn't call him a coward. It was a situation he was never going to win. Oscar wasn't the reason why he left (Mata is a better playmaker). He'd never fit the system and there isn't a system in EPL that he can fit without exposing the midfield behind him. He left because of inadequacy and that's different to giving up the fight. It was a lost fight and being the very smart guy we all know he is, he noticed it soon (and so did Mourinho). He leaving was a good thing for all involved, except going to a rebuilding United was a mistake imo. He should have left England, but in case he really wanted to stay, I think he chose the worst possible option among the top teams. Even with van Gaal here, the shortcomings of him as a player and athlete to play the EPL will be the same and a team being rebuilt not only in the management perspective but also with the players - a whole generation is being left behind - makes it all more difficult for him. I think for him personally going to United - even if he was granted more minutes - was worse than staying at Chelsea. Myself, The Skipper, kellzfresh and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post! Dion 2,476 Posted July 30, 2014 Popular Post! Share Posted July 30, 2014 The epl isnt that great in terms of CM combos, however, against chelsea, most teams will counter and neither matic or cesc have great stamina nor pace. But rambo has great pace and stamina and more likely than not will at least foul the player....If teams are waiting for a counter, we have all the time in the world to build plays as long as we keep possession, and a partnership of Matic and Fabregas are the best we have to give us exactly that, pace would be good but not a must - stamina is a must for pretty much any pivot player though. On the other hand, teams that attack and give us counters leave more space behind, their defenses will usually sit a bit higher up for compactness or else they will leave a big gap between midfield and defense. In that kind of situation long passes and through balls are even deadlier than in the first. Pace is absolutely not needed in the pivot for counter-attacks, the players on the receiving end of passes are the ones who must be pacey, the ball can travel faster in a pass than any Ramires or Usain Bolt could do while running in possession.For those reasons I think it works in both situations. Mourinho probably thinks that's possible as well. And he's testing Fabregas there against weak teams in the preseason, sides that are expected to give us a parked bus circumstance, which should provide a rough idea to how it may work. Of course nobody is giving these games much importance and teams who are going to park the bus in the PL are stronger than those we're facing right now, but still. Barbara, iseah100, The Skipper and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomo 21,751 Posted July 30, 2014 Author Share Posted July 30, 2014 This lack of respect for Mata is reaching Liverpudlian proportions, and it's disgusting.Jesus can anyone still have any form if critque of Juan without facing a firing squad, it was tedious enough when he was here. Term-X 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amblève. 4,995 Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Jesus can anyone still have any form if critque of Juan without facing a firing squad, it was tedious enough when he was here.No sane person would consider calling Mata half the player Fabregas is "critique". Zone and Mufassir08 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myself 793 Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Mata is just a coward, he just didn't want to stay and fight for his spot. Why should we be respectful towards him? He was the player of the year for 2 years chosen by the FANS, and what did we get in return? He just decided to leave after playing half an year like garbage. He had the most minutes from the 6 AMs after Oscar and Hazard. He could've stayed and win his spot back but he decided to leave. Just a selfish guy with some nice words on his blog which meant nothing after all.Sorry mate... but that post is just cringeworthy.Mata is a coward for trying to stay and fight for a spot he was never going to win? He was the POTY for two seasons in a row, he clearly loved this club and didn't want to leave, but circumstances weren't good for Mata or Chelsea.. if we kept him, we have a class player rotting on the bench, generally being unhappy, and it hurts to see that especially with someone like Mata. He was never going to play well for a Mourinho team, he lacked the pace, the strength to really. Calling him a coward and making statements like 'why should we be respectful to him' are very nonsensical things to say, especially after all we've done for him and vice versa. iseah100 and Zone 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barbara 15,149 Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 If teams are waiting for a counter, we have all the time in the world to build plays as long as we keep possession, and a partnership of Matic and Fabregas are the best we have to give us exactly that, pace would be good but not a must - stamina is a must for pretty much any pivot player though. On the other hand, teams that attack and give us counters leave more space behind, their defenses will usually sit a bit higher up for compactness or else they will leave a big gap between midfield and defense. In that kind of situation long passes and through balls are even deadlier than in the first. Pace is absolutely not needed in the pivot for counter-attacks, the players on the receiving end of passes are the ones who must be pacey, the ball can travel faster in a pass than any Ramires or Usain Bolt could do while running in possession.For those reasons I think it works in both situations. Mourinho probably thinks that's possible as well. And he's testing Fabregas there against weak teams in the preseason, sides that are expected to give us a parked bus circumstance, which should provide a rough idea to how it may work. Of course nobody is giving these games much importance and teams who are going to park the bus in the PL are stronger than those we're facing right now, but still.I agree with everything you said. But faster players in the pivot (or FBs) would help us make up for our CBs slowness.I don't think Matic and Cesc in the pivot would jeopardize or compromise our defense, but Terry is very slow and Cahill isn't that fast either. If we're in the receiving end of a counter-attack with through balls, we could be in a precarious position. We don't need to necessarily play Ramires in those matches - if anything those are the matches we'll play with Cesc and Matic as for a team to play counter-attack more often than not they have to be set up from defense or at least have a high pressing system and the likelihood of small teams being successful in parking their buses and surprising our defense with pacey, lethal counter-attacks isn't that high.Now against stronger, attacking minded teams, we'll be less exposed to counter-attacks as we'll probably be the ones doing it. That's when I see Jose deploying Ramires - hopefully in the pivot instead of the wing - although the whole point of playing with Ramires in big matches is to add a defensive player in an attacking position anyway.Luiz's absence should help us here, as Ramires only moved to the wing because there was someone like Luiz in the pivot. I don't think it'd work as good with Mikel playing the Luiz role. At the same time I don't doubt for a second that Mourinho won't deploy Iva in the RB, Azpili in the LB and LuÃs in the pivot. I can already see us playing like this against City, for example. Myself 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
didierforever 7,349 Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Still hate him. Maybe not as much as before but its still there.But nonetheless, its just obvious that he will be our main man this season. He will be the player whose performances would have us winning the league or simply folding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post! BlueLion. 21,491 Posted July 30, 2014 Popular Post! Share Posted July 30, 2014 Still hate him. Maybe not as much as before but its still there.But nonetheless, its just obvious that he will be our main man this season. He will be the player whose performances would have us winning the league or simply folding.I think the "hate" was superficial. It's like I "hated" Torres because I begrudged Liverpool for having such a quality striker. Now I hate him for real because of how shit he is :lol:Everyone knows I'm joking, deep down he's still one of my favourite players, doesn't change the fact he's been shite for us besides a dozen matches! Does anyone really "hate" Cesc? If they do, they won't as soon as they watch him tear shit up this season. Rambo, Myself, WhatsTheMatic? and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel1980 1,425 Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Still hate him. Maybe not as much as before but its still there.But nonetheless, its just obvious that he will be our main man this season. He will be the player whose performances would have us winning the league or simply folding.That's a lot of pressure on one guy. In all seriousness, I hope we don't come to depend on Cesc too much. I dislike when we depend on one player. Even the best players have off-days and drops in form, especially towards the end of the season, not to mention possible injuries. I love Hazard, but I disliked how we often depended on him last season. Now I hope if Cesc has an off-day, Eden will step up, and vice versa. Best-case scenario, they both perform consistently and amazingly well, but it's highly unlikely, considering that they both suffer from inconsistency.However, I agree that a lot will depend on Cesc this season. He is an old-fashioned playmaker in the true sense of the word, and he'll be largely responsible for the flow of the team's play and creativity when he settles in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jase 43,479 Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Drogba on Fabregas..http://www.espnfc.com.sg/chelsea/story/1965435/diego-costa-backed-to-succeed-in-premier-league-by-chelsea-teammate-didier-drogba"To have Cesc with us, I think he'll understand it's better to be with us than against us. DJames and Barbara 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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