🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 Frank Lampard

[MoroccanBlue 5,399]

Next 3 league games will give us an idea of how the season will pan out, along the overall confidence in Lampard.

They are winnable games. If Lampard reverts back to the football we played at the start of last season, he will undoubtedly have our support.

He continues with the chopping and changing, passive possession football approach. I fear its over for him. 

 

[Atomiswave 6,120]

17 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

I fear its over for him. 

Legend or not that famous axe will chop him in half if we cant see progress by christmas, we have a few good managers looking to take over.

[killer1257 3,282]

Chelsea fans are such drama queens lol.
Winning the first game, then losing the second game against the champions due to a red card and missed penalty and now they want Lampard gone [emoji23]. I mean, without having a pre season and Puli, Ziyech, Mendy, Silva and Chilwell still to play one match, they want to sack the manager. Insane...
Patience is something only a few people have, I guess most Chelsea fans do not have patience...

The only thing I would have done different yesterday was playing CHO instead of Jorgi, so we could play with one winger at least.



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[Alabama 1,992]

42 minutes ago, killer1257 said:

Chelsea fans are such drama queens lol.
Winning the first game, then losing the second game against the champions due to a red card and missed penalty and now they want Lampard gone . I mean, without having a pre season and Puli, Ziyech, Mendy, Silva and Chilwell still to play one match, they want to sack the manager. Insane...
Patience is something only a few people have, I guess most Chelsea fans do not have patience...

The only thing I would have done different yesterday was playing CHO instead of Jorgi, so we could play with one winger at least.



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That's the TC world we live...its even so ridiculous on Twitter and our facebook page...How I wish Andrea's was not so stupid to engage in that reckless challenge...I know we could have ended up with 3 points...

Irony of it all is wanting Pochettino that has not won any single trophy yet slating Frank for inexperience..

[DANILA 290]

48 minutes ago, killer1257 said:

Chelsea fans are such drama queens lol.
Winning the first game, then losing the second game against the champions due to a red card and missed penalty and now they want Lampard gone . I mean, without having a pre season and Puli, Ziyech, Mendy, Silva and Chilwell still to play one match, they want to sack the manager. Insane...
Patience is something only a few people have, I guess most Chelsea fans do not have patience...

The only thing I would have done different yesterday was playing CHO instead of Jorgi, so we could play with one winger at least.



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I think chelsea fans have patience to play at a top level, but we aren't even playing "OK". We barely beat Brighton and was a very ugly win. We didn't even have more than 1 solid chance against Liverpool when Leeds had 5-6. Lampard doesn't know how he wants to play and its obvious; we have zero attacking plays, it's just a matter of individual talent creating things occasionally when opportunities present themselves. Even much weaker teams in other leagues have a team attack play going about them even if they don't have the individual talent...  

[YorkshireBlue 3,341]

I think some on give Frank a break, he's helped massively get good signings over the line and he's not even had chance to play 4 of them yet (including mendy in this). So we have absolutely no idea how Frank wants to play yet, chill out watch the team grow after 10 to 15 games then judge him 

[OhForAGreavsie 6,125]

I have to get out of this thread. I can't believe what I'm reading.

 

[Fulham Broadway 17,721]

3 hours ago, killer1257 said:

Chelsea  TC fans are such drama queens lol.

Fixed it for you

[Vesper 31,046]

Chelsea want a holding midfielder – Lampard does not count Kante as one

https://theathletic.com/2079386/2020/09/21/chelsea-frank-lampard-ngolo-kante-declan-rice/

With two weeks of the transfer window remaining, Chelsea now have a big decision to make. Do they carry on their spending spree and, if so, where?

Chelsea fans will be counting down the minutes until Edouard Mendy walks in the building after another day to forget in goal for Kepa Arrizabalaga. The Mendy signing will take the summer bill to well over £200 million.

Negotiations with Rennes have taken longer than anyone at the club expected. But it should finally be made official early this week and, judging by the opening two Premier League games, Mendy won’t have long to wait to make his debut once he becomes a Chelsea player.

Anyone who watched the 2-0 defeat at home to Liverpool on Sunday might think a centre-back is still the priority for Frank Lampard. The Chelsea head coach significantly left Antonio Rudiger out of the match-day squad, and it wasn’t because of an injury.

Despite an encouraging 44 minutes, Andreas Christensen was sent off for a professional foul on Saido Mane just before half-time — a crucial mistake that changed the game, giving the Dane’s critics more ammunition.

Substitute Fikayo Tomori saw his first match action since February as a result, but like Rudiger, there are question marks over his future at Stamford Bridge. Thiago Silva is among those who have been added to the ranks and once fit, he will undoubtedly feature regularly.

However, the Brazilian turns 36 on Tuesday, so fans and pundits still wonder whether Chelsea have a combination of centre-backs who can compete for titles.

Despite all this, if owner Roman Abramovich opens his chequebook again after the signing of Mendy is confirmed, The Athletic has been told Lampard wants a defensive midfielder.

As has been well-documented, the player Lampard craves above all others is Declan Rice. Initially, Rice was primarily targeted for his qualities as a centre-back, but should Chelsea somehow persuade West Ham United to sell, he would now play in his regular position in front of the defence too.

But why is this deemed necessary? N’Golo Kante is fit, and with Jorginho and Mateo Kovacic in the squad, Chelsea are well-covered there. Much depends on the choice of formation of course, on whether two are sitting in a 4-2-3-1 or just one in a 4-3-3, but it suggests Kante is no longer being considered for the “Claude Makelele role”.

Against Liverpool, Kante was back to playing to the right of the central midfielder  — Jorginho  — in a 4-3-3. That is a shift from Lampard, who used him deeper for five straight games between June 21 and July 4 before injury got in the way.

Lampard has made it clear that Kante is going nowhere, despite interest from Inter Milan. So what is the reasoning? An insider explains: “I believe the thinking is for the balance of the squad. Last season, Chelsea didn’t have a defensive midfielder with the mindset to hold.

“Kante is not a holding midfielder, he wants to leave areas, he wants to go and win the ball back. I believe Lampard wants a holder to just sit there, to break things up, to be more of a physical presence.”

Chelsea could certainly have done with someone like that against the defending champions. As Liverpool pressed high and suffocated the home side, the lack of such a player was obvious.

Former Napoli man Jorginho, who has been linked with a move back to Serie A for several months, found it difficult to disrupt Liverpool’s attacks (he made two tackles and one interception, won 38 per cent of his duels and lost possession 10 times) and did not play the kind of pass Jordan Henderson made for Mane in the build-up to Christensen’s red card.

Next to Jorginho, Kante was busy, without being spectacular. He made four tackles (only Reece James had more in a blue shirt), he was involved in a team-high 16 duels, winning 67 per cent of them, and was joint-second among Chelsea for possessions gained (six) and fifth for touches (62).

The worry from an attacking point of view was that there were no key passes, shots or blocked shots from Kante. Perhaps it was because for most of the 90 minutes he was trying to get back to help Jorginho out.

Amid all the doom and gloom from a humbling loss, it can be seen as positive that Kante looks fit and sharp. He started just 20 matches in the Premier League last season due to various injury issues.

“He’s fundamental to what I’m trying to do,” Lampard insisted before the season got underway last week. “We can obviously talk about the attacking players we have but someone like N’Golo and the work he does in midfield is important.

“It was a difficult year for him last year because of the injuries. He came into the (2019-20) season with an injury and it was probably the culmination of games he played, so I’m really excited to have him fit. He looks fresh at the moment, so he’s a big deal to me. I want to keep N’Golo.”

Chelsea have been discussing other options in case a move for Rice fails to bear fruit. West Ham’s £80 million asking price is scaring the west Londoners off, although they can offer his fellow England midfielder Ross Barkley in exchange to try to lower the fee.

West Ham will also be reluctant to sell such an asset so soon after the furore caused by Grady Diangana’s recent departure to West Bromwich Albion. For anything to take place, Rice may have to try to force the issue, a step he may be reluctant to take given his relationship with the West Ham fans.

Chelsea could do with key personnel such as Hakim Ziyech, Christian Pulisic and Ben Chilwell getting fit.

But don’t be surprised if this early setback will have them doing some more significant transfer business before the October 5 deadline.

[communicate 2,703]

23 hours ago, 0007 said:

I can't really  remember Klopp only setting up his team to nulify the opponent and not to use the opportunities to attack them. And by opportunities I don't mean relying on your best player to come up with some sort of magic or hoping that the opponent will make  a costly error like the one Mendy did. I actually mean transitions that have been trained and some sort of attacking patterns that can be seen.But even in Klopp's early seasons they had a go at every team no matter who was against them.They weren't as successful as they are nowadays  but at least didn't abandon the approach for the sake of getting the result needed. And it paid off big time. We just have this inferior complex that some teams are just better than us and we have to stop them instead of the opposite.And it's not a new thing - it has been this way since the first Mourinho stint here. In fact, I think that he instilled this mindset in a lot of our fans and they are OK with it. 

 

. 

How do you want us to approach the game? 

Who should have played? 

[0007 511]

2 hours ago, communicate said:

How do you want us to approach the game? 

Who should have played? 

I wanted us to be a bit more proactive and not relying only  on Werner because we did exactly that.Some of the posters here think that the ones not satisfied with the approach want us to go on full-atack mode but there are a lot of nuances between this and the things I want.Our full-backs were instructed to stay deep and even our wingers were chosen with the purpose of helping them.Mount is good at pressing but I didn't see us trying to press high on the pitch so basically he was there to provide enough defensive protection.Which IMO didn't give us the chance to exploit the space behind Liverpool's defence because of the lack of natural wingers.

The last part that you quoted  is the key.A large part of our fans are ok with that approach as long as it brings the results.I am not.You can change your approach but not fully abandon the way you wanna play and we did the latter.Last year we tried to be a lot more attacking than the game the other day.And it almost paid off.The midfield was the same,Mount was there and we had Willian and Abraham instead of Werner and Havertz.An year has passed and instead of seeing us progress,this game was a downgrade from the ones last year.

[communicate 2,703]

45 minutes ago, 0007 said:

I wanted us to be a bit more proactive and not relying only  on Werner because we did exactly that.Some of the posters here think that the ones not satisfied with the approach want us to go on full-atack mode but there are a lot of nuances between this and the things I want.Our full-backs were instructed to stay deep and even our wingers were chosen with the purpose of helping them.Mount is good at pressing but I didn't see us trying to press high on the pitch so basically he was there to provide enough defensive protection.Which IMO didn't give us the chance to exploit the space behind Liverpool's defence because of the lack of natural wingers.

The last part that you quoted  is the key.A large part of our fans are ok with that approach as long as it brings the results.I am not.You can change your approach but not fully abandon the way you wanna play and we did the latter.Last year we tried to be a lot more attacking than the game the other day.And it almost paid off.The midfield was the same,Mount was there and we had Willian and Abraham instead of Werner and Havertz.An year has passed and instead of seeing us progress,this game was a downgrade from the ones last year.

Let's start with cho should have started over mount. Cho is not good at tracking back,so you basically let james played against Robertson and mane 2v1 because of CHO. Just the sound of it make no sense. 

2nd our fb did not push up high, have nothing to do with Lamp tactic. You want your fb high very2 simple, keep the ball high. We absolutely could not keep the ball. If the fb play high before the ball get to opp half, you may as well give salah and mane free pass to your goal. 

Compare to last year, why we compete better it is simple. Against pressing willian and kova were our main way to get out from press, Kovacic did it multiple time on Sunday but that is it willian is gone. Can Werner do that? Nope. Havertz? Nope. Mount? Nope. So what other solution, wait till ziyech get healthy, long ball to Werner from Ziyech. 

Lamp also said in his press that 2nd half we will have more attacking chances. This is true, no team can press hard for 90 minutes, so in 2nd half we will have more chances to attack them. Similar to our game in Anfield, we brought 3 fresh attacker late game and suddenly we were absolutely buzzing. But for Sundays once the red card happen, it was impossible to do that. 

 

 

 

[Jase 43,479]

20 minutes ago, communicate said:

Compare to last year, why we compete better it is simple. Against pressing willian and kova were our main way to get out from press, Kovacic did it multiple time on Sunday but that is it willian is gone. Can Werner do that? Nope. Havertz? Nope. Mount? Nope. So what other solution, wait till ziyech get healthy, long ball to Werner from Ziyech. 

This feels like such a narrow-minded view on how to beat pressing, especially when you have been drumming it so often. Having ball carriers or players who can dribble past players is one way but it is not the only way. You can beat it through 1 touch football (see Hazard's goal vs Liverpool at home in 2018) or play long balls to a target man (definitely not Havertz!) and build the play from there or play balls in behind the defence for players to run into. Obviously, it is not easy to beat teams that press and press well but there are different ways to do so. If we keep on thinking that dribbling past players is the only way to beat the press, then we are truly fucked. 

[Tomo 21,751]

11 minutes ago, Jason said:

This feels like such a narrow-minded view on how to beat pressing, especially when you have been drumming it so often. Having ball carriers or players who can dribble past players is one way but it is not the only way. You can beat it through 1 touch football (see Hazard's goal vs Liverpool at home in 2018) or play long balls to a target man (definitely not Havertz!) and build the play from there or play balls in behind the defence for players to run into. Obviously, it is not easy to beat teams that press and press well but there are different ways to do so. If we keep on thinking that dribbling past players is the only way to beat the press, then we are truly fucked. 

Not only that, we were excellent evading the press under Sarri and Willian wasn't playing half the time.

[Tomo 21,751]

On 21/09/2020 at 3:51 PM, Jason said:

Why do I feel like you're holding back on this matter?  

Sorry for some reason i never saw this.

Basically my stance is, i will (and have) accepted more reactive football when it has us challenging for the big two, but given Klopp and Pep's presence (as far as Europe goes we can add to Bayern to that) it's a big ask right now so lets build something, have some fun while doing it and be the team primed to take advantage once their cycles decline.

[Jase 43,479]

5 minutes ago, Tomo said:

Not only that, we were excellent evading the press under Sarri and Willian wasn't playing half the time.

Yeah. Despite the boring football, there was a structure to how we play out from the back, how we beat the press etc. 

IIRC, the sequence which led to Kante's goal against Man City at home under Sarri was also another example of working around the press. 

[Jase 43,479]

11 minutes ago, Tomo said:

Sorry for some reason i never saw this.

Basically my stance is, i will (and have) accepted more reactive football when it has us challenging for the big two, but given Klopp and Pep's presence (as far as Europe goes we can add to Bayern to that) it's a big ask right now so lets build something, have some fun while doing it and be the team primed to take advantage once their cycles decline.

At the risk of provoking some people, do you think we are heading in the direction based on the football that Lampard has tried to implement over the last 13-14 months or so? Do you see a coherent idea coming into place? 

[Tomo 21,751]

24 minutes ago, Jason said:

At the risk of provoking some people, do you think we are heading in the direction based on the football that Lampard has tried to implement over the last 13-14 months or so? Do you see a coherent idea coming into place? 

Pre lockdown yes, apart from the poor run in the winter i was enjoying the season, post lockdown not so much. It's frustrating because i genuinely thought after the Liverpool/Everton games we were hitting the next level. Has he overcomplicated things since lockdown? (he would have had a lot of time to think) Did the impending signings make him feel more pressure and with it could he have become more results based? 

[Magic Lamps 11,692]

56 minutes ago, Tomo said:

Pre lockdown yes, apart from the poor run in the winter i was enjoying the season, post lockdown not so much. It's frustrating because i genuinely thought after the Liverpool/Everton games we were hitting the next level. Has he overcomplicated things since lockdown? (he would have had a lot of time to think) Did the impending signings make him feel more pressure and with it could he have become more results based? 

He wanted that 4th place at all costs and got it. He got the team playing in a way that suited our best attackers, mainly Giroud and Pulisic. playing on the counter and pumping crosses to giroud. When all the signings are fit and available, have played together for a few weeks and we still look like shit, the questions have to be asked. but there really is no use jumpng the gun. With the signings arriving this late, it would always be a struggle to seamlessly integrate them. This current, stupid hectic season is another corona write-off, basically preseason for next season were we will be expected to challenge on all fronts.

[Jase 43,479]

1 hour ago, Tomo said:

Pre lockdown yes, apart from the poor run in the winter i was enjoying the season, post lockdown not so much. It's frustrating because i genuinely thought after the Liverpool/Everton games we were hitting the next level. Has he overcomplicated things since lockdown? (he would have had a lot of time to think) Did the impending signings make him feel more pressure and with it could he have become more results based? 

I think there was an element of pressure. He basically went full Mourinho and prioritized results over anything else. Circumstances are not favorable right now but for our long term sake, hope to see some semblance of a plan, a coherent idea coming together in the coming weeks, months. We can't be going back to the kind of football we saw under Mourinho.