Vesper 31,181 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 27 minutes ago, Pizy said: We need a tall, powerful, commanding CB who can dominate in the air and has a no-nonsense approach to defending. Someone who doesn't make silly mistakes. I put Ake in the same category as AC & Tomori. Short for a CB, good on the ball, good mobility. But they aren't the Terry/VVD/Ferdinand on-pitch General we need. Ake is the type of CB you buy when you have that sort of CB next to him. Clearly if we wanted him back we could've done so. Which tells you Frank is looking for a CB like the ones I mentioned instead. AC is 8cms (and in reality probably 10) taller than Ake AC is one CM taller than John Terry, he is just weak as shit even Tomori is 4 to 6ms taller than Ake atm (I am open to changing my mind on Tomori) I do not rate all 3, especially AC Fernando and Atomiswave 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fernando 6,743 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 I agree with @Vesper Ake is not what we need. We got many players like him in Zouma, AC and Tomori. We need a real leader of a CB, not someone like Ake. Atomiswave and Vesper 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pizy 19,380 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 22 minutes ago, killer1257 said: Ricardo Carvalho was also the same size as Ake. He still was one of the best CBs I have seen. His football IQ was above Terry's and that is why despite lack of height and physicality, he made it easily in PL and he made Chelsea into a wall. People only talk about Terry, but forget the mastermind Carvalho was. The positioning, how to put the body towards opponents to win tackles, when to jump and when to throw yourself into a tackle, how to block tackles etc. He belonged to the old school defenders that had football IQ. These days it is all about physicality or technique, but the defending skills are forgotten. Ake has an amazing football lQ and he would easily be better that Tomori, AC and Rüdiger. Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk What I'm saying is we already have CB's of a similar profile as Ake. If we already had the commanding CB then Ake would make sense as a compliment. What we need is a direct upgrade on Zouma. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper 31,181 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 1 minute ago, Fernando said: I agree with @Vesper hope you have on your fireproof knickers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alabama 1,992 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 How about Filipe Luiz Ramos of Lazio or Ruben Dias though the former will cost shit loads of money... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pizy 19,380 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 I want to see Chelsea sign a man mountain of a CB who is also good on the ball. Like Koulibaly or Ginter. Someone who will never be pushed around and someone who devours anything through the air that gets near them a la VVD. lucio 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper 31,181 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 13 minutes ago, Pizy said: I want to see Chelsea sign a man mountain of a CB who is also good on the ball. Like Koulibaly or Ginter. Someone who will never be pushed around and someone who devours anything through the air that gets near them a la VVD. Koulibaly is in decline and is not a man mountain, he is shorter than AC (Napoli lied for years and claimed he was 1.95m, when he is only 1.87m) KK was (other than one superb tackle) really poor v Inter, Lukaku just blew him away multiple times, broke him with pure pace Ginter is 4cms taller than KK (1.91m) I think we might be able to geta steal price (due to hsi hip flexor muscle injury) on Konate he is a man mountain (1.94m) and is good on the ball https://www.bundesliga.com/en/bundesliga/news/ibrahima-konate-who-is-the-rb-leipzig-and-france-defender-nextgen-10647 He has the pace to match the quickest of attackers and the physique to bully – rather than be bullied by – muscular strikers much more experienced than he is. The Leipzig No. 6 wins 66 per cent of all tackles, a well-above-average quota that even rises to 81 per cent in the air. (my add, Ake wins 51%) He can dribble out of defence or ping accurate long balls forward – averaging a 95 per cent accuracy rate. Even Liverpool stalwart Van Dijk would be pleased with those numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiCFC 8,529 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 Fernando 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrenshah 186 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 4 minutes ago, NikkiCFC said: Now lets watch De Bruyne mk2 and see him become like the new Gullit... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper 31,181 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 8 minutes ago, shrenshah said: Now lets watch De Bruyne mk2 and see him become like the new Gullit... Ake is so not De Bruyne MKII and he couldn't shine Ruud Gullit's boots (who also didn't even remotely play the same position) Gullit won the Ballon d'Or as an AMF in 1987 they only thing they have in common is the hair, their home football nation, and they were both Chels for a spell Fernando 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strike 7,854 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 What are the options in the man-mountain CB market? killer1257 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superblue 6,372 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, Vesper said: Ake is so not De Bruyne MKII and he couldn't shine Ruud Gullit's boots (who also didn't even remotely play the same position) Gullit won the Ballon d'Or as an AMF in 1987 they only thing they have in common is the hair, their home football nation, and they were both Chels for a spell The hair and Dutch connection are obvious factors, but Gullit did play sweeper in a back three at Chelsea so for Chelsea fans who watched Gullit here there is probably a bit more of a comparison as they are similar positions on the pitch. I do think comparing Ake to Gullit though is a ridiculous reach. I think it's understated just how good Gullit was during his short stint at Chelsea. That first season before he transitioned to player manager he came into the league supposedly too old and washed up with two duff knees and made everything look so easy. He was easily one of the best players in the league still and could have comfortably played for a better team than Chelsea at the time. Having started watching Chelsea for maybe 2-3 years before Gullit joined, I can only assume for me suddenly watching Gullit in Chelsea's team was like people moving from a black and white to a colour TV. Top player and as a side note I love his affection for the club despite a relatively short stay in the twilight of his career, particularly given the enormous success he enjoyed. Fernando 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper 31,181 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 22 hours ago, Fernando said: Ferran Torres to City for 20 million is a good deal. FUCK just saw this a STEAL for the cheaters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killer1257 3,282 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 disagree, although I wish we had gotten more OR put in a sell on clause he is too short for our style he was a starting CB on a team that just got relegated and it wasn't like he was some godlike talent on a team with literally nothing else but pure dregs (there are players like that all over Europe) You think that prime Ricardo Carvalho is also too short for our style of play?At the end, it is the defending skills that matter the most.Yesterday, I watched Brentford vs Swansea and Guehi, who is 182 cm, won aerial duels against the 194 cm tall CB of Brentford in set pieces. How? Guehi's timing and body positioning in aerial duels were the reasons why he can do such things.Ake has brilliant football IQ and can play three positions. DM, CB and LB. Why can he play so many positions? Because of his football IQ and his technical abilities, he can play many different positions and Ake is the perfect player for every squad. There are not many players out there that are this versatile Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk Puliiszola 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killer1257 3,282 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 What are the options in the man-mountain CB market? Only Milenkovic and Konate. I do not think that Milenkovic is ready yet, because in his last match, he seemed clueless what to do. Based on his performance against Rom, I did even though what position he was playing. Sometimes DM, sometimes LB, sometimes LCB, RCB etc. Konate was injured most of the season and only played 8 matches in Buli. So who knows how good he is right nowGesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk Vesper 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper 31,181 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 8 minutes ago, killer1257 said: You think that prime Ricardo Carvalho is also too short for our style of play? At the end, it is the defending skills that matter the most. Yesterday, I watched Brentford vs Swansea and Guehi, who is 182 cm, won aerial duels against the 194 cm tall CB of Brentford in set pieces. How? Guehi's timing and body positioning in aerial duels were the reasons why he can do such things. Ake has brilliant football IQ and can play three positions. DM, CB and LB. Why can he play so many positions? Because of his football IQ and his technical abilities, he can play many different positions and Ake is the perfect player for every squad. There are not many players out there that are this versatile Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk he is poor at LB, i watched him intently in both his matches there this year also, as posted before, his aerial duel winning rate is poor you will not change my mind (not that my opinions matte for shit)) nor will you change the minds of Lampard and the rest of the club/board/organisation we had all the chances in the world to re-grab him and definitively said nej, nein, no, nyet Fernando 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superblue 6,372 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 57 minutes ago, killer1257 said: You think that prime Ricardo Carvalho is also too short for our style of play? At the end, it is the defending skills that matter the most. Yesterday, I watched Brentford vs Swansea and Guehi, who is 182 cm, won aerial duels against the 194 cm tall CB of Brentford in set pieces. How? Guehi's timing and body positioning in aerial duels were the reasons why he can do such things. Ake has brilliant football IQ and can play three positions. DM, CB and LB. Why can he play so many positions? Because of his football IQ and his technical abilities, he can play many different positions and Ake is the perfect player for every squad. There are not many players out there that are this versatile Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk I don't think anybody would dispute how good a player Carvalho was. But the leadership of Terry was critical for our success defensively. We won premier league titles and multiple cups with Terry as the back bone of the side. Whether it was Carvalho, Gallas, Alex, Cahill the common trend was Terry. I always felt that when Terry was in his prime we would almost always have a solidity in the defence no matter the partner he had alongside him. I would look currently at that Liverpool defence and in my opinion if you cherry picked any of Gomez, TAA or Robertson and put them in our side i don't think it would make much difference to our team as a defensive unit. Put Van Dijk however in our team to lead the defence and it would automatically raise the game of the rest. Honestly I struggle to give transfer targets for centre back currently because I think so few nowadays offer that (Van Dijk is an excellent player but i think he's lauded even more so because the pool of world class centre backs around now is not what it was 10-20 years ago). But we need someone to lead and organise our defence. Ake for me, may be an upgrade on Christensen or Zouma, etc but he's still the secondary centre back that they are. We need a primary centre back to come in and elevate everyone around them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puliiszola 519 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 2 hours ago, Vesper said: disagree, although I wish we had gotten more OR put in a sell on clause he is too short for our style he was a starting CB on a team that just got relegated and it wasn't like he was some godlike talent on a team with literally nothing else but pure dregs (there are players like that all over Europe) Cahill was a player in a relegated pl team. Helped us win a CL. killer1257 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper 31,181 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 1 hour ago, Puliiszola said: Cahill was a player in a relegated pl team. Helped us win a CL. Cahill was also 13 to 15cms taller than Ake and a better CB, a 3 time PFA first team all EPLer Ake will will never be on an EPL first team, I will just be shocked if he was anyone reading this (not just you) can give up trying to convince me we should drop £41m on him even if somehow we do match and get him, I am not happy about it sorry Magic Lamps 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puliiszola 519 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 1 minute ago, Vesper said: Cahill was also 13 to 15cms taller than Ake and a better CB, a 4 time PFA first team all EPLer Ake will will never be on an EPL first team, I will just be shocked if he was anyone reading this (not just you) can give up trying to convince me we should drop £41m on him even if somehow we do match and get him, I am not happy about it sorry Was just putting up a point to debunk the "he was on a relegated team" point. As for height he is 2cm taller than Puyol and 5cm taller than cannavaro. Ake is already an EPL first teamer, a main stay for Bournemouth, what are yiy even saying. A CB who ole went upto after the game and said, we need a left footed CB. A player who is bought by one of the best teams in Europe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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