Chelsea Transfers

[OhForAGreavsie 6,057]

GCSE History Paper A June 2045

1. David Cameron - Grade A, class 1, certified twat. Discuss.

[OhForAGreavsie 6,057]

Multiple post

[OhForAGreavsie 6,057]

Multiple post.

[Tomo 21,751]

6 hours ago, OhForAGreavsie said:

GCSE History Paper A June 2045

1. David Cameron - Grade A, class 1, certified twat. Discuss.

The most criminal thing about the whole Brexit farce is the referendum passed through without the need for a big majority.

52% is simply not a big enough majority for such a life changing decision!

[Magic Lamps 11,692]

21 hours ago, Tomo said:

The most criminal thing about the whole Brexit farce is the referendum passed through without the need for a big majority.

52% is simply not a big enough majority for such a life changing decision!

And it was started completely needlessly in the first place.

however Brexit could still turn out to be a smart move in the Long haul even if it is almost suicidal in the short term. With populism and dictatorship returning to EU countries, their stupid constitution may well cripple the EU as evident by what Poland and Hungary are now doing. 

[Vesper 30,091]

here are the players we would have been unable to sign under the new rules

AC (too young)

Zouma (probably not enough points, he might have went to the exception committee, not sure if that would have worked, Think we would have had a strong case even if he did not have enough points)

Charly Musonda (too young)

Kenedy (not enough points)

Ian Maatsen (too young)

Xavier Mbuyamba (not enough points)

Matt Miazga (not enough points)

Lucas Piazon (too young)

Mario Pasalic (not enough points)

Pierre Ekwah Elimby (too young)

Marc Guehi (perhaps would have never come to England, as his parents may have not been allowed in under the new immigration points system for regular folk (he was born in the Ivory Coast), and if so, then he was far too young to sign)

Marco van Ginkel (not enough points) (btw I just found out he is exactly 1 day older than I am, lolol)

Danilo Pantić (not enough points)

Karlo Žiger (too young)

Thierno Ballo (too young)

Bryan Fiabema (too young)

Lucas Bergström (too young)

Sami Tlemcani   (too young)

Aleksi Heino (too young)

Jimi Tauriainen  (too young)

Edwin Andersson (too young)

Ashley Akpan (too young)

[Vesper 30,091]

Of the top 100 under 18yo players (non Chels, two are ex Chels, the 2 at Bayern now) on the planet ranked by value

we could have signed FIVE under the new rules, all the other 95 are not eligible

let that sink in

you will never again (at least for the foreseeable future) see a great young foreign player on an EPL club who was trained and raised up by that club (other than the ones currently in the system as I assume they are grandfathered, if they are not grandfathered in, we are fucked even harder)

those born in 2002 will be the youngest ones eventually left, 2003 and on are SOL

[Blues Forever 1,232]

Twomey: "When Haaland does decide to leave every Elite club in Europe will be lining up to make their pitch and I’m sure Chelsea will think about it because they are up there trying to compete for the best trophies going."

 

[R2D2 368]

1 hour ago, Blues Forever said:

Twomey: "When Haaland does decide to leave every Elite club in Europe will be lining up to make their pitch and I’m sure Chelsea will think about it because they are up there trying to compete for the best trophies going."

 

Is this guy reliable? Think Haaland or Sancho really is the last missing puzzle in our attack, would be incredible to pull off either of them.

[King Kante 1,643]

14 hours ago, R2D2 said:

Is this guy reliable? Think Haaland or Sancho really is the last missing puzzle in our attack, would be incredible to pull off either of them.

I am not so sure we need Sancho at this moment in time as I am still hopeful Puli will sort his injuries out and CHO will step up, while I see Werner as a LWF/SS. For me, he will only be needed if Werner goes to CF and/or the other two don't step up. 

As for Håland he surely has to be someone we're targeting. At the moment, our CF's are Giroud and Tammy. Giroud for me is great as a squad player going forward and I would actually like him to sign for another year. As for Tammy I do think he has a long term future at the club but as a CF2 and not a CF1. Imo, CF is actually the position after CB and DMF I think we need to sort out most in the next 18 months. 

[Vesper 30,091]

Saturday December 5 2020 Matt Law's Chelsea briefing

Success of expensive left-back will help convince club to support Lampard in future transfer windows By Matt Law, Football News Correspondent Ben Chilwell could be key to Frank Lampard’s hopes of landing his long-term midfield target Declan Rice. Rice remains at the top of Lampard’s Chelsea wish-list, although a January move looks unlikely given West Ham United’s strong start to the season. Chelsea did not end up making a bid for Rice in the summer transfer window after West Ham put an £80 million price tag on the England midfielder’s head. That price is unlikely to drop and there remains significant caution within Chelsea over spending such a large fee on a player the club let go as a 14-year-old. There was similar reticence from some quarters over paying £50million for a left-back in Ben Chilwell but Lampard rejected all the potential alternatives. Lampard believed that Chilwell would offer Chelsea value for money by giving them a long-term solution to a problem that had re-emerged almost every season and that looks to be a wise move. Given that he personally pushed so hard for the signing of Chilwell for such a high price, the success or failure of the 23-year-old was always going to be an important factor for Lampard moving forwards. So it is particularly significant that Chilwell has started his Chelsea career so encouragingly and appears to have finally solved the club’s problem over trying to properly replace Ashley Cole. Should Chilwell continue his excellent form, then Lampard will be in a much stronger position to urge the Chelsea board to spend big on Rice. Lampard was prepared to sign Thomas Partey as a cheaper alternative to Rice, but he eventually joined Arsenal. And it now seems likely that Lampard, as he did with Chilwell, will push against any suggestions to go for a cheaper option to Rice and try to convince Chelsea that he too can make a big impact at Stamford Bridge. N’Golo Kante has rediscovered his best form, but the France international will celebrate his 30th birthday next year and there must be some concern that his incredible stamina cannot last forever. Jorginho is also in his late 20s and it still seems likely the Italy international will at some stage return to Serie A, particularly if former Chelsea manager Maurizio Sarri returns to work. Chelsea do not have a natural defensive midfielder coming through their ranks who would be ready to step straight into the first team, meaning Lampard will push hard again for Rice and hope Chilwell’s good form convinces the board to trust his judgement once again.

[Vesper 30,091]

Bayern Munich contract rebel’s agent hoping to strike January agreement with Chelsea

https://www.caughtoffside.com/2020/12/02/david-alabas-agent-hoping-to-strike-chelsea-agreement/

The latest edition of Fabrizio Romano’s ‘Here We Go Podcast‘ featured Bild reporter Christian Falk – and there’s some interesting nuggets of information for Chelsea fans.

Christian Falk tends to be one of the most reputable journalists in the game when it comes to all things Bayern Munich. You get the feeling that Bild, being the number one news outlet in the German game, get briefed directly by the Bavarian giants.

That’s why his comments on Fabrizio Romano’s ‘Here We Go Podcast’ will provide plenty of excitement for Chelsea fans. He’s fuelled speculation linking Bayern Munich contract rebel David Alaba with a move to Stamford Bridge.

Speaking on the ‘Here We Go Podcast’, Falk claimed that Alaba’s agent, Pini Zahavi, is looking forward to holding discussions with the Blues when January comes around, with his intention to strike an agreement with them to sign Alaba from Bayern.

[Vesper 30,091]

I disagree with some of this (especially for us, as I showed above) but I am posting it for information's sake

Fabregas is a red herring. Brexit transfer rules won’t damage the Premier League

https://theathletic.com/2239555/2020/12/04/brexit-fabregas-transfer-rules/

 

Nicklas Bendtner still recalls the sudden sense of shock and unease. He was halfway up an escalator at Copenhagen Airport with a one-way ticket to London in his hand when he turned around to wave goodbye to his parents and saw they were both in tears. At 16 years old, he wasn’t prepared for that.

He had spent the previous days, weeks and months counting down to this moment, when he would be free to chase his dream — to go to London, to join Arsenal, to conquer the Premier League. And now, however fleetingly, he felt what he called “a shade of sadness of some kind, that a good chapter in my life was ending”. And he knew that, even if he was certain this was the right thing to do, his parents were having doubts. “Is sending their boy away really the right thing to do?”

In the summer of 2004, Bendtner was sure it was. He was heading for the big time at Arsenal. On top of that, he was going to get rich. He might not earn much at first — £290 a month in the first year, £390 a month in the second — but then there was the promise of a £100,000 lump sum when he turned 18, at which point the club would also offer him his first professional contract. Even he did not imagine that this deal, when it came just after his 18th birthday, would see him take home £35,000 a month after tax.

You are probably familiar with Bendtner’s story . He went on to score 47 goals at Arsenal and 30 for Denmark, but his career soon fell into decline and, now 33, unsure whether he has retired or not, he accepts he is known as a victim of English football’s “too much too soon” culture — the celebrity lifestyle, the riotous nights out in the West End, an infamous night when he was briefly £400,000 down in a casino — rather than as an inspiration for the many other youngsters who have left their homeland and their families at 16, seeking fame and pretty much guaranteed to earn a fortune when they sign for a Premier League club.

There is a reason why, when the Premier League, EFL, FA and Home Office finally came to an agreement this week over new entry requirements for overseas players in this post-Brexit world, Bendtner’s former team-mate Cesc Fabregas was referenced in every media report. Fabregas made his Arsenal debut barely a month after arriving from Barcelona at 16. At 17 he was a regular starter. By 21 he was captain and firmly established as one of the league’s outstanding players. By the time he returned to Barcelona at 24, feeling he was destined to go full-circle, few in Catalonia doubted the highly unpopular decision he had made eight years earlier.

Fabregas is an outlier, though. Among the dozens upon dozens of boys who have been lured from overseas to sign for Premier League clubs before their 18th birthday, the number of success stories is disconcertingly small. “Of the many players who have left Holland at an early age, I would say only Tim Krul, Nathan Ake and Patrick van Aanholt,” Art Langeler, the Dutch FA’s director of football development, tells The Athletic. “And it took a lot of time for them to work really well in England. Most of the time, the boys who go over to England aren’t getting any real chances. I always think it’s better to develop in Holland, make 100 appearances in the Dutch league and then move to a bigger league after that.”

Like Virgil van Dijk, then. Or his Liverpool team-mate Georginio Wijnaldum. Or the foursome of Matthijs de Ligt, Frankie de Jong, Donny van de Beek and Hakim Ziyech, who helped Ajax reach the Champions League semi-final last year and have now moved on to Juventus, Barcelona, Manchester United and Chelsea respectively. Or Stefan de Vrij, now at Internazionale, or even Memphis Depay, who struggled after joining Manchester United at 21 (still too early in the view of many in Holland) but has thrived at Lyon.

So many highly-rated youngsters have left Dutch academies to chase the dream in the Premier League over the past couple of decades. From Ajax to Manchester United alone, there has been Gyliano van Velzen, Timothy Fosu-Mensah, Millen Baars and Tahith Chong. Fosu-Mensah, 22, made an early breakthrough under Louis van Gaal but has long since drifted to the fringes of the squad; Chong (below), 21, made a handful of appearances early in Ole Gunnar Solskjaer’s tenure but fell from the picture last season and is now on loan at Werder Bremen. Van Velzen, 26, was released after three years at Old Trafford and, after spending last season at Crawley Town and Aldershot, is now back in the Dutch second tier with Telstar. Baars, 20, was released after two years and is now in AZ Alkmaar’s second team.

Of the 14 Dutch players who have appeared in the Premier League this season, Ake and Van Aanholt did so via the Premier League academy route — joining Chelsea at 16 and ultimately progressing to Manchester City (via Bournemouth) and Crystal Palace respectively. So did Ki-Jana Hoever, who went from Ajax to Liverpool at 16 before being sold on to Wolverhampton Wanderers at 18. Hoever is widely regarded as one of the most promising youngsters in European football, but that was already the case at 16, which is why Liverpool fought so hard to sign him in the first place. It is too early to say whether leaving Ajax so early was the right decision for his long-term progression.

“Moving to England at 16 is a good opportunity to get experience of living and playing in another country and to earn lot of money,” Langeler says. “It works as a kind of life insurance because you’re made for life, even if you break your leg. But if you ask me as a youth developer, I would say it is a bit of a strange step to go there at such a young age. Not a lot of players who go to England at 16 succeed.”

They have been making this argument in Holland for years — often far less diplomatically than Langeler here. In 2011, when a 16-year-old Karim Rekik left Feyenoord for Manchester City, Eric Gudde, the Dutch club’s general manager, called the transfer “stupid for all involved”, saying, “In most cases these moves do not work out, especially for the boy himself. When they are just 16, it all seems great, but if you look at the statistics the majority end in huge disappointment for the player. It’s hard and it’s not just about being a good player. They’re so young and the stats are clear — most of these kids are developed badly. Then they came back (to Holland) and they have actually lost progress. The fact that Holland develops (young players) better than England should be a reason for the English clubs to leave them here.”

Rekik is actually one of those rare success stories, as is Jeffrey Bruma, who also left Feyenoord at 16, in his case for Chelsea. Both made only a handful of appearances before being sold on, but they have had solid careers in top European leagues — Bruma is now at Wolfsburg, Rekik at Sevilla. Angeler cites both of them as rare exceptions to the rule, along with Ake and Van Aanholt.

These successes are far outweighed by failures, though. And these are players who were tipped for even greater things than they have achieved. All four of them had higher reputations at youth level than Van Dijk, for example, as indeed did Fosu-Mensah. Van Dijk did not play for his country until under-19 level, by which time he was playing first-team football for Groningen.

The point Langeler makes is that all players have different pathways, but also that those pathways are far less clear in the Premier League than they are elsewhere. “You can’t predict at 15/16 that they’re going to be a star,” he says. “At 17/18 Frenkie de Jong was still struggling at Willem II. Then he made big steps at Ajax and is now at Barcelona. If you stay in the Dutch league, then the club is so focused on your development. I think that’s the way to do it, though I can fully understand why some players and their families want to move to England at the first chance.”

It is not just a Dutch grievance. If anything, youngsters from Holland have found it easier than most to adapt to life in England. For every Fabregas, there are dozens more highly-rated Spanish youngsters who have moved to England at the age of 16, only to stagnate in those late-teenage years that were so crucial to their development.

Barcelona lost Fabregas and Gerard Pique in the same summer of 2004 due to loopholes in their contracts. They ended up re-signing both — Fabregas at 24 having thrived at Arsenal, Pique at 21 having concluded that heading home was the best move both professionally and on a personal level — and they have tried to do likewise with Bellerin. They have even tried to re-sign Eric Garcia, 19, barely three years after he left them for Manchester City, even though, like Pique at Manchester United, he has found it hard to establish himself at first-team level.

If nothing else, this should tell us that Barcelona, so committed to preserving a Catalan soul to their team, forgive — and don’t forget — those who are lured elsewhere at a young age. Rather than anger, there is sadness when La Masia graduates go elsewhere and struggle. Fran Merida has had a good career in La Liga but Jon Toral (below) and Julio Pleguezuelo are now at Birmingham City and FC Twente respectively, which, while more than respectable, were not the hoped-for destinations for when they were at Barcelona or when they left for Arsenal, where the promise of first-team football did not materialise.

Then there is Dani Pacheco, who joined Liverpool from Barcelona amid great fanfare in 2009. He went on to star at the European Under-19 Championship finals a year later but barely got a look-in at Anfield and is now without a club at the age of 29. Gai Assulin left Barcelona for Manchester City but didn’t come close to the first team and is now, at 29, playing in Romania for Politehnica Iasi. There is more optimism over Sergi Canos, 23, who, having made a solitary appearance for Liverpool, has re-emerged impressively at Brentford.

Twenty-two Spanish players have appeared in the Premier League this season. But only three (Bellerin, Garcia and the Brighton reserve goalkeeper Robert Sanchez) have done so via the “Fabregas route” among the dozens upon dozens of Spanish youngsters who have left for English clubs before their 18th birthday.

Twenty-six French players have appeared in the Premier League this season. The only one to do so via that route (let’s call it the “Anelka route” this time) is Paul Pogba, who left Le Havre for Manchester United at 16, moved on to Juventus at 19, having barely kicked a ball at Old Trafford, and then returned in a world-record transfer four years later. Some might say those first three years in Manchester made him the player he is (or the player he was in 2016) but, again, it probably underestimates the potential that brought him to the club’s attention in the first place.

Yes, there are exceptions — and one that never gets mentioned is Gylfi Sigurdsson, who left his Icelandic club Breidablik at 16 to join Reading before moving on to Hoffenheim, Tottenham, Swansea and Everton. But 17 years after Arsenal signed Fabregas from Barcelona, 23 years after they signed Nicolas Anelka from Paris Saint-Germain, there is hardly an abundance of evidence to suggest that joining a Premier League club at 16 is good for your career. It is good for your bank balance, certainly, as Langeler points out, and most certainly for your agent’s, but the overseas players who survive and thrive in the Premier League are very rarely those who come over at a young age.

Kevin De Bruyne left Genk for Chelsea at 20 and quickly concluded that it was not the right environment for him. He was single-minded enough to force his way out to Wolfsburg, where he flourished before returning to England, with Manchester City at the age of 24. We will never know how his career would have mapped out had he joined Chelsea at 16, but it is fair to imagine it would have involved a lot of loans and a lot of frustration.

In the post-Brexit world, as of January 1, it will no longer be possible for English clubs to sign overseas players under the age of 18. This is widely regarded as a bad thing. But a bad thing for whom? For the Premier League? In the eyes of many, yes, but these clubs, while excellent at identifying and recruiting young talent, have — with the exception of Arsenal in the mid-to-late 2000s — not exactly excelled when it has come to helping that potential to flourish, which is probably why we, even now, we find ourselves talking about the impact on “the likes of Fabregas”.

Langeler, playing devil’s advocate, cites Ake, Van Aanholt, Bruma and Rekik as others who have built good careers even having not made the grade at the big Premier League clubs they joined as teenagers, but he remains convinced it is the wrong career path for a young Dutch footballer. And while, like most of Holland, he finds it hard to fathom why the United Kingdom voted to leave the European Union in 2016, he is not exactly shedding tears about the consequences for football. “And maybe Brexit can be a good thing for the English players too if there aren’t so many kids coming into their academies,” he says.

Well, that’s a different question and one that will take years for any of us to be able to answer with any confidence. Some feel that homegrown talent has been stifled due to the influx of overseas players at all age groups but particularly at academy level. Others feel that the arrival of top-class talent from France, Germany, Holland and Spain has dramatically raised the quality and the intensity of the Premier League “finishing school”. It seems likely that both of these things are true. It is just a shame that so few homegrown players, while local or imported, make it to first-team level at most Premier League clubs.

Let’s take Brexit out of the conversation for a moment. Let’s imagine that, rather than the result of a vote that continues to divide the country more than four years on, the new restrictions on signing young players from overseas had been introduced for different reasons: to protect young players and to allow them to develop in their own environment, at their local club, rather than being enticed by the financial incentives offered to them via agents looking to make a fast buck.

This is precisely what Michel Platini pushed for during his time as UEFA president. He wanted international transfers banned for those under the age of 18 — “not to create an obstacle to the free movement of labour”, he said, but as “an urgent matter relating to helping youngsters in danger.” He referred to “a phenomenon whereby children aged 12 or 13 are torn away from their environment and culture to join a business in return for payment”. Even pre-Brexit, British clubs were not allowed to sign players until the age of 16, but Platini felt the age limit should be 18, by which time players and indeed clubs might be able to make such judgments with a clearer perspective.

There was a time when just about everything Platini said or did was interpreted as an attack on the Premier League. There was considerable schadenfreude among some clubs when he lost the UEFA presidency in disgrace and was banned from football. A wonderful footballer in his pomp, he had some terrible ideas as an administrator. But as a principle, was a restriction on the international transfer of young players such a bad one?

Whatever else he might be, Platini was an idealist. He pined for a world in which the best players were still spread among many clubs, across many leagues, rather than being lured to one of the biggest English, French, German, Italian or Spanish clubs before they were out of their teens. As a Frenchman who had the best years of his career at Juventus, he was far from opposed to testing yourself in other countries. He just objected to the ethical aspect and also felt, from a football perspective, that it would be a desirable if, for example, an outstanding player from Amsterdam had two or three years in the Ajax first team, maybe more, before being sold on for a multi-million-pound sum — rather than leaving for a Premier League club at 16, for a small compensation payment, with all of the riches and all of the uncertainty that such a career path might involve.

Again, is that such a bad principle? Or do we imagine, despite years of evidence to the contrary, that a big Premier League club is a better place for a 16-year-old to develop than Ajax, Lyon, Schalke,  Stuttgart or even Barcelona? Yes these new post-Brexit laws will stop Premier League clubs picking up the best prospects in Europe for a pittance, but some of them have stockpiled players so indiscriminately over the years, hedging their bets in the hope that one or two might make the first team (and the rest can be sold for profit) that the practice has long felt unedifying. For far too long, certain Premier League clubs have traded teenagers as assets rather than regarding them as players and human beings to develop and plan a future with.

And now we have come to the end of that — not because of a UEFA president who was commonly accused of being anti-English but because of a political movement that was anti-European. It has conjured up certain alarmist suggestions of what the post-Brexit football landscape might look like: a Premier League that will be more Kevin Drinkell than Kevin De Bruyne, more Terry Hurlock than Thierry Henry, much shaking of heads and gnashing of teeth as we sit, socially distanced, eating our chlorinated chicken pies.

In reality, the difference to the quality of the Premier League is likely to be almost imperceptible. There are many reasons some people dread the possible consequences of Brexit but the impact on football is not among them. It is not one of those industries that cannot operate without overseas workers doing the jobs that the domestic workforce cannot or will not do. It is an industry where the biggest budget attracts the best talent. The biggest budgets are in the Premier League and so too, for the foreseeable future, will be a great proportion of the best talent.

English football, though, is an industry which at times has imported talent — particularly young talent — indiscriminately in the worst sense of the word. A more regulated approach should bring just a little more balance to the European transfer market and to the game in a wider sense, allowing players to develop in their own countries for a year or two rather than rushing to leave for clubs where in many cases the only reward is financial.

Bendtner can recall every contract he signed. He is less sure whether he can remember every car he bought. He wouldn’t change his experiences for the world but he cannot say with any certainty that joining Arsenal at 16 was the best move for his long-term development. It probably wasn’t. But at least he got an opportunity at Arsenal. At least he scored goals in the Premier League. At least he is well-known in England — and not only for the wrong reasons. For so many, moving to England at 16 has marked the beginning of the end of their top-class football career. Those sunlit uplands they were told about just never materialised.

 

 

 

[ulvhedin 525]

Wonder if Ziyech injury will be serious (2-3 months) whether we will be looking to bring some winger as depth? Anyone watching Sarr in Watford, how is he looking this season?

[Vesper 30,091]

my newest, most up to date sell/let go list (only way I see selling AC and Rudiger is if we are go all out for José Giménez  or Marquinhos this coming summer, and I think we get a full, WC 2021-22 season out of Thiago, so not vexed if we keep them, or keep one and then make the big move in 2022 summer window) Alaba is lurking out there too, and he prefers CB, although he is perfect to allow us to dump the two dregs LB's we have, PLUS we have Malang Sarr as well, and I think he has great upside)

in bold are the most important to dump

total intake from the bolded should be around £180-200m or so
    
Kepa   
Willy Caballero
Marcos Alonso   
Emerson   
Abdul Rahman Baba  
Jorginho  
Danny Drinkwater 
Charly Musonda Jr.
Jamal Blackman    
Michy Batshuayi    
Ross Barkley    
Davide Zappacosta  
Tiemoué Bakayoko  
Victor Moses    
Kenedy   
Matt Miazga    
Nathan  
Lewis Baker  
Danilo Pantic 
Marco van Ginkel    
Izzy Brown 
Lucas Piazon