SinineUltra 1,170 Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 Really hope that the situation in Ukraine doesn't spark a war. If any of the sides makes a hasty conclusion or decision, it can quickly become a WW3. Mohammed Seif and xPetrCechx 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohammed Seif 1,451 Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Really hope that the situation in Ukraine doesn't spark a war. If any of the sides makes a hasty conclusion or decision, it can quickly become a WW3.I hardly doubt that it would get that far. Just the usual political mouth war. Russia is not the Soviet Union, the U.S is already economically hammered, and the EU is facing its own economical conflicts. It is the usual Russia vs USA ego battle mate. Nothing serious ( I think ) Rmpr 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinineUltra 1,170 Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 I hardly doubt that it would get that far. Just the usual political mouth war. Russia is not the Soviet Union, the U.S is already economically hammered, and the EU is facing its own economical conflicts. It is the usual Russia vs USA ego battle mate. Nothing serious ( I think )Ukraine have declared mobilisation according to the media. Baltic states and Poland so far have demanded a meeting on the basis of NATO article 4. Things can potentially become out of hands if any of the sides does something stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohammed Seif 1,451 Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Ukraine have declared mobilisation according to the media. Baltic states and Poland so far have demanded a meeting on the basis of NATO article 4. Things can potentially become out of hands if any of the sides does something stupid.I am no politician, but judging from history I can tell you that the scenarios are very limited,It is either going ti be the same case as with North Korea, where Russia does what it wants and the U.S and UN condemn and ask for sanctions. Or Russia would back off on some sort of an agreement that maintains Russia's interests.But no way the U.S would go into war with Russia. Not at the mean time. Remember that China is a force there and it is watching right now. If you follow, the U.S news, there is no way they would be going to war especially that they just ended one in Iraq with a lot of losses and a lot of arguments among the public opinion and media. They can't risk it at all.Things will unfold as time progresses but remember that sometime the mobilization of forces doesn't necessarily mean war is about to break. It can be only political maneuvering. If a war would break through it will be Russia vs Ukraine. Everyone will then watch an ask for sanctions on Russia. kellzfresh and Rmpr 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinineUltra 1,170 Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 I am no politician, but judging from history I can tell you that the scenarios are very limited,It is either going ti be the same case as with North Korea, where Russia does what it wants and the U.S and UN condemn and ask for sanctions. Or Russia would back off on some sort of an agreement that maintains Russia's interests.But no way the U.S would go into war with Russia. Not at the mean time. Remember that China is a force there and it is watching right now. If you follow, the U.S news, there is no way they would be going to war especially that they just ended one in Iraq with a lot of losses and a lot of arguments among the public opinion and media. They can't risk it at all.Things will unfold as time progresses but remember that sometime the mobilization of forces doesn't necessarily mean war is about to break. It can be only political maneuvering. If a war would break through it will be Russia vs Ukraine. Everyone will then watch an ask for sanctions on Russia.All in all I agree and really hope it will turn out to be a political farce. Though, if a war breaks out between Russia and Ukraine, I can't see NATO, USA, EU not interfering, because Ukraine was given a guarantee by NATO/USA back in the days taht if they give up the nuclear warheads from the Soviet era, their sovereignty will be protected. Things are complicated at the moment due to a contract that gave Russian Federation the right to lease the land on Chrime peninsula, though, if the armed forces try to overrun a Ukrainian military base or advance to the mainland, that can spark a chain reaction of events and interference from the outside world. Ukraine is a vast country and the west doesn't want it to be ruled by Russia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohammed Seif 1,451 Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 All in all I agree and really hope it will turn out to be a political farce. Though, if a war breaks out between Russia and Ukraine, I can't see NATO, USA, EU not interfering, because Ukraine was given a guarantee by NATO/USA back in the days taht if they give up the nuclear warheads from the Soviet era, their sovereignty will be protected. Things are complicated at the moment due to a contract that gave Russian Federation the right to lease the land on Chrime peninsula, though, if the armed forces try to overrun a Ukrainian military base or advance to the mainland, that can spark a chain reaction of events and interference from the outside world. Ukraine is a vast country and the west doesn't want it to be ruled by Russia.I completely understand. But with Europe in an economical bottle neck and the Euro is facing critical challenges more than ever, the total political failure of the Iraq/Afghanistan war and major U.S deficit, the hostile situation of Pakistan cause of the U.S drones, the edgy situation of Iran and great instability that is increasing in Turkey, you think defending Ukraine will be a simple decision or an automatic response from NATO, USA and EU? It is not going to be that simple mate. SinineUltra 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fernando 6,585 Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 Can someone explain to me what solution was accomplished with Iran when they will still continue with their nuclear reactors? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosmicway 1,333 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 There is an ethnic division in Ukraine, like in Jugoslavia and maybe more bitter.Crimeans are Russians really. It was only in 1954 that Krustchev named it as Ukrainian territory (like Tito he did n't care about such things - all the Soviet territories belonged to him).Making a revolution over a commerce deal with the EU sounds crazy to me. What their now exiled president was doing some years ago, spraying acid over his opponent's face is also crazy.I don't sympathize at all with either of the two Ukrainian sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellzfresh 7,229 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 The crimea parliament want to vote for their right to join russia. Massive blow to United States that. Russia have a right to protect their people after rumors of attacks on russian people in ukraine, I don't approve on how they are doing it but.... USA will definitely enter any country that is a threat to their people IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinineUltra 1,170 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 The crimea parliament want to vote for their right to join russia. Massive blow to United States that.Russia have a right to protect their people after rumors of attacks on russian people in ukraine, I don't approve on how they are doing it but.... USA will definitely enter any country that is a threat to their people IMO.Suggest you to read up on the history of Crimea. Don't blindly believe what is spoon fed to you by Russian media - the direct participant in this crisis. A little over 50% of Crimea is russians, other ethnic minorities are ukrainians and tatars. Russians deported over 200 000 people back in the day from the same peninsula to make it more 'russian minded', 80% were tatars. Hope you can now grasp the complexity of this issue a little bit better now. Not every russian wants a military intervention, let alone being united with Russian Federation. What they want is more autonomy. Those rally groups and protestants are spearheaded by the same people in every hotspot, weather it be in Harkhov, Sevastopol, Odessa or Donetsk. Can you give me direct examples of russians being discriminated on the soil of sovereign country of Ukraine so it would be justified for the current actions? Don't quote RT please. Kieran. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushman 2,043 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Rally groups in Kiev, were they not spearheaded by outsiders? Most likely, many US advisors were present during the chaos there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinineUltra 1,170 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 An accurate media coverage when it comes to Maidan in Kiev or Crimea today. It's in russian but picture speaks more than 1000 words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellzfresh 7,229 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 An accurate media coverage when it comes to Maidan in Kiev or Crimea today. It's in russian but picture speaks more than 1000 words.02I'm using my phone so I can't see videos. I'm not a political expert, But I have checked a lot of different news stations on tv (I don't hear russian so I even listen to media that dislike them) and I sense a lot of hostility there in crimea, hostility that usually leads to a split. The tartars are supposed to be the original people there but unfortunately they form just 12% in crimea. 59% are russians, while 24% are ukrainians. Like you said, they really want autonomy but what realistic chance do they have if there are different groups in the same Crimea area.(Will each group want their own autonomy?) And their former president was removed without elections. I'm not sure they have any confidence of getting autonomy and if the parliament vote I hear about that is going to take place on march 16 goes in Russia's favor? It will be a stumbling block to Ukraine and USA if that happens. That's what I was implying earlier. I don't like how russia used soldiers to get into crimea instead of negotiating something but I would accuse USA of causing huge casualties in Afghanistan, iraq, pakistan and others in their invasions. Mohammed Seif 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peppen 934 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 The Ukraine mess will most likely result in Russia annexing the Crimean peninsula, and leave rest of Ukraine alone. EU does not want to sanction Russia too much, and the US and Russia certainly don't want a war over something as minor as this. Very odd situation indeed. kellzfresh and Mohammed Seif 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rmpr 8,977 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Really hope that the situation in Ukraine doesn't spark a war. If any of the sides makes a hasty conclusion or decision, it can quickly become a WW3.Naaah, Ukraine is not that important to NATO in order for it to spark a World War. Also, the economy and political stage isnt set for another HUGE war!Not saying it wont happen, but in order for it to indeed happen, things will have to escalate A LOT still... Mohammed Seif, kellzfresh and Peppen 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushman 2,043 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 How can anyone talk about some war? Nothing will happen.Plenty of yapping from the US, meaningless sanctions & more bullshit from America.Meanwhile, EU is very reserved to apply any sanctions. Crimea will be part of Russia soon & Ukraine can not do anything to prevent it. Mohammed Seif 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohammed Seif 1,451 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Can someone explain to me what solution was accomplished with Iran when they will still continue with their nuclear reactors? Oh buddy seems like you haven't picked up on the game yet . Iran will continue with its nuclear program no matter what. Realistically speaking, if the reactors don't get blown up then Iran might have its weapon within the next 10-15 yrs. The only thing that could sop Iran is target them militarily but that ain't happening now under Obama. Iran is playing smart and says its nuclear program is for the sake of energy and not for military use. If Iran manages to save energy then it will hold back on oil consumption and being also a large oil producer makes it a potential economic threat.The U.S would love to take that away but right now they cannot rally the public opinion or the international community to strike Iran. Iran is not like Iraq or Afghanistan. Iran is going to be hell, true HELL.Similar situation to Ukraine, neither does the U.S nor its allies can economically afford a war or a strike at the mean time. Nor do they have the excuse to strike Iran since that Iran is complying well with the International Atomic Energy Agency and maneuvering politically well.So there will be no attention at the mean time, but soon the topic will open again when the U.S is ready. War requires money and make tons afterwards. When the negative public image of Iraq and Afghanistan is removed and when a scenario that makes Iran seem like a major international threat, you will see a strike. Unless another country makes a move to strike Iran first, then the U.S will be forced to back up this country in war. Meanwhile, nothing is going to happen, the U.S is not in a hurry, they still have 10-15 yrs, Iran will keep going on. Fernando and cosmicway 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinineUltra 1,170 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Naaah, Ukraine is not that important to NATO in order for it to spark a World War. Also, the economy and political stage isnt set for another HUGE war!Not saying it wont happen, but in order for it to indeed happen, things will have to escalate A LOT still...I said that a week ago when things still were developing in a rapid pace and the climax of this event had not been reached. Though, when we want to look for an analogue from the WWII, then Sudetenland was annexed exactly for similar reason as Crimea is now - to join a piece of land that in the past was owned by Germans and was ethnically populated by german majority. The West gave in on the demands. Appetite grows while eating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinineUltra 1,170 Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 An article by Garry Kasparov.http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303824204579422971651210180 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosmicway 1,333 Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Oh buddy seems like you haven't picked up on the game yet . Iran will continue with its nuclear program no matter what. Realistically speaking, if the reactors don't get blown up then Iran might have its weapon within the next 10-15 yrs. The only thing that could sop Iran is target them militarily but that ain't happening now under Obama. Iran is playing smart and says its nuclear program is for the sake of energy and not for military use. If Iran manages to save energy then it will hold back on oil consumption and being also a large oil producer makes it a potential economic threat.The U.S would love to take that away but right now they cannot rally the public opinion or the international community to strike Iran. Iran is not like Iraq or Afghanistan. Iran is going to be hell, true HELL.Similar situation to Ukraine, neither does the U.S nor its allies can economically afford a war or a strike at the mean time. Nor do they have the excuse to strike Iran since that Iran is complying well with the International Atomic Energy Agency and maneuvering politically well.So there will be no attention at the mean time, but soon the topic will open again when the U.S is ready. War requires money and make tons afterwards. When the negative public image of Iraq and Afghanistan is removed and when a scenario that makes Iran seem like a major international threat, you will see a strike. Unless another country makes a move to strike Iran first, then the U.S will be forced to back up this country in war. Meanwhile, nothing is going to happen, the U.S is not in a hurry, they still have 10-15 yrs, Iran will keep going on.When the Iran revolution took place everybody sent congratulations.Greek f.o. minister the historical Evangelos Averoff, pro-American, conservative, was among the first to congratulate. Callaghan also I should think, but I don't remember exactly. Only a handful of British f.o. experts talking to the BBC at the time said "pay attention - this is no innocent affair and danger is in the air". Two years later we had the embassy kidnappings - in which Ahmadinejad is said to have taken a part.If they have nuclear fuel enrichment installation then in that installation the plutonium is separated from the used rods and then employed as bomb material but if their nuclear fuel is processed elsewhere then they cannot have it. But when they use their nuclear plants to make the fuel rods plutonium-rich, the satelittes can spot it with infrared photography as the temperature is different in the vicinity of a plant operating normally to that in a plant operating plutonium cycle.The nuclear club has a few unwelcome members. Let's call "members par excellence" the original four, but then China, Pakistan, Israel and South Africa in the days of apartheid were not so welcome. I don't really fancy Iranians if get the bomb to start bombing other places though.Under the circumstances, peace looks utopian but war is also utopian because nobody wins. The only solution is if the peoples to become friends. Then the governments can be convinced to abandon hostile attitudes. Mohammed Seif 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.