Frank Lampard

[Strike 7,309]

  On 23/12/2013 at 22:52, CHOULO19 said:

His best game this season after Westham. Funny that his best two games came in 4-3-3, right?

yeah. looks very comfortable with both Mikel and Ramires around him

[didierforever 7,349]

  On 23/12/2013 at 22:04, ChelseasMessiah said:

Yes he did, but that is never the problem with him. He'll still finish well at 50, it's everything else with him that's the problem. A City midfield for us today would have ensured we would have mauled Arsenal and they were pants, down and bent over for the taking. Look at Mikel and Lampard in the starting line up and people wonder why we concede so many and don't control games on the attacking end.

YYYYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSS. BANNED ATLAST.

[dee25 1,044]

  On 23/12/2013 at 22:52, CHOULO19 said:

His best game this season after Westham. Funny that his best two games came in 4-3-3, right?

Couldn't disagree more with this. He definitely had a very good game against Arsenal and put in a great performance against West Ham. But he was also excellent against Sunderland in the league, was excellent against City, was excellent against Southampton and has had many other good games this season. He might have struggled earlier on in the season but lately he's been among our top performing players, regardless of the formation.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

  On 25/12/2013 at 14:28, dee25 said:

Couldn't disagree more with this. He definitely had a very good game against Arsenal and put in a great performance against West Ham. But he was also excellent against Sunderland in the league, was excellent against City, was excellent against Southampton and has had many other good games this season. He might have struggled earlier on in the season but lately he's been among our top performing players, regardless of the formation.

Frank one of our best performers this season? Well, that will be a largely unpopular notion to say the least.

Just go back in this thread and read what everyone was saying about his performances after every match. I think he's had some very good performances, the best two being yesterday and against Westham, but he's also had some terrible performances.

[dee25 1,044]

  On 25/12/2013 at 15:24, CHOULO19 said:

Frank one of our best performers this season? Well, that will be a largely unpopular notion to say the least.

Just go back in this thread and read what everyone was saying about his performances after every match. I think he's had some very good performances, the best two being yesterday and against Westham, but he's also had some terrible performances.

An unpopular notion to whom exactly? The enclave of fans on this forum who represent a very small minority of Chelsea supporters? That's what you're using to question the legitimacy of the point I raised? Umm, ok?

I think I'll stick to my argument that *lately* (note the emphasis on lately) he's been among the top performing players in the team. You're free to disagree or agree. That's your own business. But the reality is, his performance against Sunderland was just as good as his performance against Arsenal. West ham, Sunderland, Arsenal & Southampton - that's already four games where he was among the best players on the pitch. Besides John Terry, what other player (since November) has been able to put in a top performance across 4 games in such close succession?

[CHOULO19 24,332]

  On 25/12/2013 at 16:42, dee25 said:

An unpopular notion to whom exactly? The enclave of fans on this forum who represent a very small minority of Chelsea supporters? That's what you're using to question the legitimacy of the point I raised? Umm, ok?

I think I'll stick to my argument that *lately* (note the emphasis on lately) he's been among the top performing players in the team. You're free to disagree or agree. That's your own business. But the reality is, his performance against Sunderland was just as good as his performance against Arsenal. West ham, Sunderland, Arsenal & Southampton - that's already four games where he was among the best players on the pitch. Besides John Terry, what other player (since November) has been able to put in a top performance across 4 games in such close succession?

Well this is forum represents a diversified sample of the Chelsea fan base. And for the record, the general consensus here about Frank is the same as on other forums and on twitter. Unless you have a different means of showing that a large number of Chelsea fans think otherwise, it'll just be claims in the air.

The thing with Frank this season is that straight after the display vs Westham he went and had one of the worst performances of the season against Basel. This has been the story of his season so far. Against Sunderland and Southampton he was good but nothing special. He did what you expect a player in his position to do, nothing more. Just because he (and the rest of the pivot players) was doing less of what you expect of him most of this season does not make those performances special. 1 great game, 1 good game and two average games does not make you one of the standout performers.

Our stand-out performers lately in the past month or so? JT, Azpi, Hazard, Schurrle, Willian, I'd even put Rami ahead of Frank. On any account, those "rankings" are absolutely pointless. I just hope we see more from Frank like the last performance.

[dee25 1,044]

  On 25/12/2013 at 21:16, CHOULO19 said:

Well this is forum represents a diversified sample of the Chelsea fan base. And for the record, the general consensus here about Frank is the same as on other forums and on twitter. Unless you have a different means of showing that a large number of Chelsea fans think otherwise, it'll just be claims in the air.

smh, your post is just such a convoluted mess of incorrect claims, unsubstantiated bold statements and just nonsensical opinions. But okay, I'll bite.

1. The majority of active users on this forum are 30 and below. That is not by any stretch of the imagination, "representative of a diversified sample size of the Chelsea supporter base." Nice try.

2. Even if there does exists a general consensus about Frank on Twitter & chelsea online forums (which you haven't exactly provided any evidence to) what does that even prove? The chelsea discourse on social networking sites is not at all representative of the larger thought/opinion of chelsea supporters. You *do* know there's a whole world of fans that exists outside of the cyber universe, right?

3. Within the small minority of chelsea supporters on social networking sites, the opinion about Lampard's performances are not even uniformly consistent. You have those who think he's been shit but there are also an equal amount who think he's been good and is being 'scapegoated'.

4. This statement - "unless you have a different means of showing that a large number of Chelsea fans think otherwise, it'll just be claims in the air" is just irrationality at the very highest. You're the one that brought up the point that my claim about Frank recently being among the top performing players in the team, is a 'largely unpopular notion'. The onus is on you to prove that not me. Rather than simply admitting that it's only unpopular on *this* forum, you're trying to extend the dominant view of Frank held by a select few on ONE online forum as a representation of the larger opinion. Are you for real?

5. I repeat, Frank has *lately* (again, emphasis on the word lately) been among the top performers in the team. In his last six starts (Basel being the one exception where everyone performed poorly) his rating on whoscored has consistently been among the highest. Comparing Frank's last six starts, to the last six starts of all the players you mentioned, none of them have consistently been rated among the top performances. Whereas Frank has.

6. Against Sunderland, he scored 1 goal, made 1 assist and had the second highest rating. If that isn't 'anything special' then I want what you're smoking.

Finally, I'm gonna be perfectly up front with you. From what I've seen, you tend throw around the most exaggerated and farcical claims that are often wrong. The worst part is you try to pass these claims off as some kind of 'ultimate truth' without ever providing any sort of substantial evidence to back them up. In contrast to other mods/admins on this forum, you come across as the very definition of the arrogant, loud mouth, know it all and half the time the majority of the things you say are just plain wrong and bullshit. I actually can't believe people on here don't call you up on it more. But you know what, it's Christmas so I'll just leave it there.....

[Blue Warrior 109]

Super Frankie Lampard, won more than most teams have in there history. Records still to break in the famous blue jersey. Lets keep it civil.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

  On 26/12/2013 at 00:32, dee25 said:

smh, your post is just such a convoluted mess of incorrect claims, unsubstantiated bold statements and just nonsensical opinions. But okay, I'll bite.

1. The majority of active users on this forum are 30 and below. That is not by any stretch of the imagination, "representative of a diversified sample size of the Chelsea supporter base." Nice try.

2. Even if there does exists a general consensus about Frank on Twitter & chelsea online forums (which you haven't exactly provided any evidence to) what does that even prove? The chelsea discourse on social networking sites is not at all representative of the larger thought/opinion of chelsea supporters. You *do* know there's a whole world of fans that exists outside of the cyber universe, right?

3. Within the small minority of chelsea supporters on social networking sites, the opinion about Lampard's performances are not even uniformly consistent. You have those who think he's been shit but there are also an equal amount who think he's been good and is being 'scapegoated'.

4. This statement - "unless you have a different means of showing that a large number of Chelsea fans think otherwise, it'll just be claims in the air" is just irrationality at the very highest. You're the one that brought up the point that my claim about Frank recently being among the top performing players in the team, is a 'largely unpopular notion'. The onus is on you to prove that not me. Rather than simply admitting that it's only unpopular on *this* forum, you're trying to extend the dominant view of Frank held by a select few on ONE online forum as a representation of the larger opinion. Are you for real?

5. I repeat, Frank has *lately* (again, emphasis on the word lately) been among the top performers in the team. In his last six starts (Basel being the one exception where everyone performed poorly) his rating on whoscored has consistently been among the highest. Comparing Frank's last six starts, to the last six starts of all the players you mentioned, none of them have consistently been rated among the top performances. Whereas Frank has.

6. Against Sunderland, he scored 1 goal, made 1 assist and had the second highest rating. If that isn't 'anything special' then I want what you're smoking.

Finally, I'm gonna be perfectly up front with you. From what I've seen, you tend throw around the most exaggerated and farcical claims that are often wrong. The worst part is you try to pass these claims off as some kind of 'ultimate truth' without ever providing any sort of substantial evidence to back them up. In contrast to other mods/admins on this forum, you come across as the very definition of the arrogant, loud mouth, know it all and half the time the majority of the things you say are just plain wrong and bullshit. I actually can't believe people on here don't call you up on it more. But you know what, it's Christmas so I'll just leave it there.....

Merry Christmas. I hope you have a nice day

[Phil Driver 503]

  On 25/12/2013 at 14:28, dee25 said:

Couldn't disagree more with this. He definitely had a very good game against Arsenal and put in a great performance against West Ham. But he was also excellent against Sunderland in the league, was excellent against City, was excellent against Southampton and has had many other good games this season. He might have struggled earlier on in the season but lately he's been among our top performing players, regardless of the formation.

On the money ,forums are full of wild opinions with no substance (but nonetheless welcome) ,for example this poster thinks Mikel is brilliant in every game on the evidence if sideways passes and not a lot else !! Lampard has been superb of late and really is a victim of his own standards and goalscoring record. Thankfully the only opinion that really matters is that of Jose Mourinho .

[The_Flash 1,144]

Super Frank, WE You

[dee25 1,044]

  On 26/12/2013 at 08:03, CHOULO19 said:

Merry Christmas. I hope you have a nice day

As a matter of fact, I had a fabulous Christmas, thank you.

Phil Driver, well someone had to say it. I don't know if he thinks his football knowledge is the be all & end all, but I've noticed that he makes a lot of bold and exaggerated statements that are often factually incorrect. We're all passionate about our opinions but even when it's clear that he's wrong, this poster still carries on arguing like his opinion is the gospel or something. And for an admin, that's unfortunate.

[Blue Warrior 109]

200 plus goals from midfield, record breaker, whats to argue?

[Jase 43,479]

  Quote

Chelsea FC ‏@chelseafc 55m

Mourinho reports Lampard has a muscular injury and will miss some matches. Ivanovic's injury is painful but not serious.

[The_Flash 1,144]

poor frank

[Tomo 21,741]

I think he has been brilliant for most of the season if im honest, yes he has had his stinkers but he is 35 and playing most games due to lack of CM options, all things considered he is having a very, very good season.

I just hope we can get these CM's in by next August at the latest, then Frank can probably give us a good 2/3 years more in a lesser role giving us displays like today.

With Lampard from here on in, the motto must be, less is more.

[quickpassnmove 924]

I am posting this to see what the counter-argument might be because I, myself don't see a counter-argument.

Chelsea have not had a group of high-quality center midfielders for much of Frank's time with Chelsea. This is similar to the problem with Didier's years with Chelsea since Robben and Duff left the club; Chelsea didn't have top wingers despite the millions spent, to play alongside Didier.

Frank has done well, but even as I'm a Chelsea fan, I might have never have selected him for a top European fantasy squad outside of maybe 2005. Before any hyper-sensitive fanatics believe I'm just here to wind people up on this topic, I will just say that I like to see a squad that can play in every way possible (all passes, any tempo) and Chelsea have NOT been this kind of club for years. I like the fact that Frank can score--of course! But, in setting up a squad and starting XI, I prefer to have at least TWO top all-around center midfielders--meaning, players who can DO EVERYTHING in center midfield better than most players in the world (the best examples could be found at the biggest clubs). Looking back at Frank's time at Chelsea, I see a brief time when Chelsea could have fielded Frank with Thiago and Makelele. Essien, Ballack, and Lampard is OK, but in both of these midfields, I doubt the ability of the group as a whole to pass accurately and quickly on the ground.

Looking at some of the top sides in Europe from years past, how do you honestly rate Chelsea's midfield against the likes of Bayern, Barca, Juve (esp. 2001 with Davids, Tacchinardi, Conte, Zidane), Milan, and Liverpool.

I'm not accepting the argument: "no midfield is perfect," or, "this isn't fantasy football, Chelsea do the best with what they have." For the money spent at Chelsea by Roman, since 2003, I find it really poor that a better midfield and overall squad was not maintained during Drogba and Lampard's best years. But, back to my point about Lampard and Chelsea's midfield, how many of you who spend time countering the anti-Frank posts would put Frank in a top European fantasy squad, starting XI and which formation would you use? Why? Would you also use him alongside two strong, all-around center midfielders in a 4-3-3? Could Frank ever face a defender, and beat him with strength and speed or trickery? If so, when? Did he ever excel as a defender? Was 2005 his best year? Should Chelsea have bought better center midfielders and maybe wingers from 2005-2010 while Frank and Didier were still in their prime? And, even if you're a long-standing fan of Frank, can you tell us what his weaknesses have been even while he was younger? Where have a Frank and England fallen short with the possibility of playing a midfield of Gerrard, Lampard, and Scholes? Not good enough defensively with Scholes and Lampard in center midfield?

There were stunning moments in years past and Frank has been a top European midfielder but, for me, not the player I would select for my starting XI fantasy and IF I did select him for a squad he would have needed some very strong center midfielders alongside him which Chelsea only intermittantly provided during Frank's years at Chelsea.

[Phil Driver 503]

  On 30/12/2013 at 08:54, quickpassnmove said:

I am posting this to see what the counter-argument might be because I, myself don't see a counter-argument.

Chelsea have not had a group of high-quality center midfielders for much of Frank's time with Chelsea. This is similar to the problem with Didier's years with Chelsea since Robben and Duff left the club; Chelsea didn't have top wingers despite the millions spent, to play alongside Didier.

Frank has done well, but even as I'm a Chelsea fan, I might have never have selected him for a top European fantasy squad outside of maybe 2005. Before any hyper-sensitive fanatics believe I'm just here to wind people up on this topic, I will just say that I like to see a squad that can play in every way possible (all passes, any tempo) and Chelsea have NOT been this kind of club for years. I like the fact that Frank can score--of course! But, in setting up a squad and starting XI, I prefer to have at least TWO top all-around center midfielders--meaning, players who can DO EVERYTHING in center midfield better than most players in the world (the best examples could be found at the biggest clubs). Looking back at Frank's time at Chelsea, I see a brief time when Chelsea could have fielded Frank with Thiago and Makelele. Essien, Ballack, and Lampard is OK, but in both of these midfields, I doubt the ability of the group as a whole to pass accurately and quickly on the ground.

Looking at some of the top sides in Europe from years past, how do you honestly rate Chelsea's midfield against the likes of Bayern, Barca, Juve (esp. 2001 with Davids, Tacchinardi, Conte, Zidane), Milan, and Liverpool.

I'm not accepting the argument: "no midfield is perfect," or, "this isn't fantasy football, Chelsea do the best with what they have." For the money spent at Chelsea by Roman, since 2003, I find it really poor that a better midfield and overall squad was not maintained during Drogba and Lampard's best years. But, back to my point about Lampard and Chelsea's midfield, how many of you who spend time countering the anti-Frank posts would put Frank in a top European fantasy squad, starting XI and which formation would you use? Why? Would you also use him alongside two strong, all-around center midfielders in a 4-3-3? Could Frank ever face a defender, and beat him with strength and speed or trickery? If so, when? Did he ever excel as a defender? Was 2005 his best year? Should Chelsea have bought better center midfielders and maybe wingers from 2005-2010 while Frank and Didier were still in their prime? And, even if you're a long-standing fan of Frank, can you tell us what his weaknesses have been even while he was younger? Where have a Frank and England fallen short with the possibility of playing a midfield of Gerrard, Lampard, and Scholes? Not good enough defensively with Scholes and Lampard in center midfield?

There were stunning moments in years past and Frank has been a top European midfielder but, for me, not the player I would select for my starting XI fantasy and IF I did select him for a squad he would have needed some very strong center midfielders alongside him which Chelsea only intermittantly provided during Frank's years at Chelsea.

You say you prefer two all round midfielders who can do EVERYTHING ,but EVERYTHING includes scoring and none score as many from midfield as Lampard. And scoring is the most important thing in football ,I would argue that Lampard is one of the only midfielders in the game that can do EVERYTHNG. And as his perfromance showed yesterday where he did everything but score (nearly) ,but he did everything else and bossed the midfield. The new contract will be signed soon.