Frank Lampard

[DDA 9,937]

lol I suggest you look for some then and rub one out, why so agitated? lol

I just can't sleep... wait... I thought we were in the pub thread.. My bad!

[Bir_CFC 3,455]

Yes I can. I am positive that the decision not to renew Lampard's contract has nothing to do with money or skill. It's about simply wanting to move on. That's not the decision I would make, but I am not a Russian billionaire who owns Chelsea. (just checked my bank balance to make sure. No, definitely not a billionaire.). And as for Lampard's decline, yes it's obvious he's not that player he was a few years ago, but he is still one of Chelsea's better players. Last season, despite playing much of the year in the pivot, Lampard created a scoring chance every 41 minutes. Fellaini who played the same positions as Frank (central midfield and in the pivot) created a chance once every 114 minutes. Ramires, once every 93 minutes. He still scored more goals than any other midfielder, even from open play. I think Opta Stats ranked him as the 21st best player in the Premier League last season. In his last 4 starts for us, he's been a legitimate MOTM contender in three of them. For the last few years now many people want to see Lampard go (mostly because of "shiny new toy syndrome" which is a fetishization of the new and of theoretical potential, permeates fandom) and have exaggerated his decline (and ignore his quality) but he still keeps on producing.

You look at the game today and Chelsea had about 3 or 4 very good scoring chance and 4 goals and Lampard was key to all of them except the Hazard goal. He had two fantastic over the top passes to put players in on goal. One to set up Ba's chance and a sumptuous one to Mata that led to the penalty. He got himself into great positions for the two scoring chances. He was 7 for 9 in long balls and did his work defensively as well-only Ramires had more tackles than Lampard. He is clearly good enough for Chelsea and would very likely still be good enough to play a role on the team for a couple of years. I think it's silly that we're going to let him go, but I don't make the decisions and he can't stay around forever. I started supporting Chelsea before Lampard and I will support them after.

I agree with you completely. I think he def has more than enough in him to play a role for Chelsea. But I have to think it's cause of wages, no way our board would be that stupid to say no to Frank if he agreed to lower wages and a squad role. It would make no sense at all. I am sure Frank will re-assess his situation at the end of the year and if a team is willing to pay same wages as he's getting right now then he'll prolly go there otherwise I'm sure Chelsea has a deal on the table for him at lower wages for next year.

[Kieran. 6,317]

He has to get the record before the season ends, it will be his own personal "high note" to leave on. (Drogba last year)

[super_frank8 186]

Whatever you're going to say isn't going to change my opinion and I'm not trying to change yours. It's an opinion, do you know what that means? I love Lampard, I love him to death. I was crying cause of the goals he missed today because I can't wait to rub one out when he becomes our top scorer. But I'm also a realist and the simple fact to me is that financially it doesn't make sense to offer him a contract at his current wages. If anything a Chelsea fan should know what finances can really do for you. If it was upto me Drogba would still be here. And saying I'm not a Chelsea fan because I don't agree with you is down-right pathetic. That's how you take a high ground in an argument? lol

I will guarantee you that Lamps won't be going to United or any of the teams you listed because I am 100% confident (have to be) that he's only holding out for wages, otherwise the board would have already signed him up if he was happy taking lower wages and a squad role next season.

I don't think Lamps is good enough to be Chelsea first team next season. I'd love him to take a squad role but he'll have to take a squad player wages. Simple.

Well judging from everything mentioned in your last post, I hate to imagine the way you speak about the players that you don't love to death...

Anyway, I don't believe I actually mentioned anything about you not being a Chelsea fan? I've merely insinuated that you're not particularly knowledgable in purely footballing terms - which could be wrong if you really just have a personal vendetta against Frank since that would make far more sense some of these points that you are attempting to validate.

& you're going to GUARANTEE me with 100% CONFIDENCE that this whole fiasco is just about wages? Are you that delusional mate? I'm pretty sure Lamps would be more than happy to take a slight pay cut when push comes to shove - but the fact of the matter is that based on the player that he is, he really shouldn't have to in any case. & what makes you think he won't go to United or Juve when they would be more than willing to pay him similar wages to what he's getting since Fergie (along with I would imagine the majority of managers in Europe) has the brains to recognise how daft the club is being & will not even have to spend a penny on a transfer fee?

But yer so your opinion is in fact that he is just not good enough & is nothing more than a squad player? I mean don't get me wrong, you're entitled to your opinion & all, but I am just unable to fathom how anyone who actually claims to love him can actually truly believe that as the genuine truth - not when every rival & neutral supporter is both equally perplexed & enticed by the prospect of one of the best midfielders around being available for absolutely nothing in the summer. I would have to imagine such a unique situation suggests that it's more than just my opinion talking...

I mean saying that Lamps is a 'squad player' & deserves 'squad player wages' - that has to be among the most outlandish & outrageous statements I have ever heard. So forgive me if I have come to a rather hasty conclusion in similar fashion, but from that alone I can only conclude that you are not a particularly great judge of footballing ability.

Releasing a world class player like Frank on a free transfer? Isn't it enough that we're already the laughing stock of Europe at the moment for reasons irrelevant to this contract saga?

He is a first team player & once he is no longer able to earn his place on the teamsheet, then that is when we should consider moving on - not when he clearly still possesses the ability & fitness to control games & score goals against top teams in a way that few others in the game can.

[super_frank8 186]

In his last 4 starts for us, he's been a legitimate MOTM contender in three of them. For the last few years now many people want to see Lampard go (mostly because of "shiny new toy syndrome" which is a fetishization of the new and of theoretical potential, permeates fandom) and have exaggerated his decline (and ignore his quality) but he still keeps on producing.

This +10000000000000. Brilliant way to describe some of the clouded judgement & delusional beliefs held by many in this thread. Rest of the post was great too!

[BleedsBlue 1,549]

I think that he started the game only because of Cahill's absence.Also on that, congratulations to Gary on becoming a father.

[super_frank8 186]

I think that he started the game only because of Cahill's absence.Also on that, congratulations to Gary on becoming a father.

Yer it's great that Cahill got to become a parent today as well as having the peace of mind that his team won despite his last minute withdrawal. But it will be interesting to see whether he's going to start too many of the games in coming weeks with JT seemingly on the brink of being back to fitness...

But yer I reckon it was Ramires who came in for David Luiz's place in the midfield to be honest, hence why Benitez must have felt the need to play Betrand instead of Oscar/Marin since he was concerned about the vulnerability of our backline & most of all Luiz on the counter attack. Unless he really does just genuinely hate Oscar that much for whatever unknown reason...

Because if there is one somewhat redeeming & mildly admirable quality in our fat cunt of a manager - it's that he clearly still holds a considerable degree of admiration for a former opposition player who tormented his Liverpool side season after season & evidently wants to start Frank against the better teams. 6 points off Everton & Stoke away is no small feat in the middle of January when we have been sturggling for consistency - & it is impossible to deny that his performances in those two games made the difference in all reality.

If Rafa does somehow end up staying on in a more permanent role, that might just be the one potential perk that would somehow get his fat arse out of my crosshairs for a moment - because if it was up to him alone, he would without a shadow of a doubt play Lamps til his legs won't carry him any further - a point which is quite obviously closer to 2 years down the line as opposed to 6 months if his current fitness & stamina is anything to go by.

& if I'm to be honest, I highly doubt his potential successors in Pep or Mourinho or otherwise would let Frank go either if it came down to their decision & nothing else.

When world class players & managers are responding to the press with as much bemusement as many of our own fans, that's when Frank Lampard's indisputable quality would appear to seem far closer to being a universal fact throughout the footballing world, rather than a unique isolated opinion.

[Tomo 21,751]

Chelsea make a late run into the title race (been done before) and we find ourself's 2 points behind United on the last day.

United losing 3-0 to Lukaku inspired West Brom.

Chelsea drawing 1-1 with Everton.

Last minute penalty awarded to the Blues, Frank Lampard (level with Bobby Tambling on 202 goals for Chelsea) steps up.

Can't happen, can it?

[BleedsBlue 1,549]

Yer it's great that Cahill got to become a parent today as well as having the peace of mind that his team won despite his last minute withdrawal. But it will be interesting to see whether he's going to start too many of the games in coming weeks with JT seemingly on the brink of being back to fitness...

But yer I reckon it was Ramires who came in for David Luiz's place in the midfield to be honest, hence why he felt the need to play Betrand instead of Oscar since he was concerned about the vulnerability of our backline & covering for the DMs & most of all Luiz on the counter attack. Unless he really does just genuinely hate Oscar that much...

Because if there is one somewhat redeeming & mildly admirable quality in our fat cunt of a manager - it's that he clearly still holds a considerable degree of admiration for a former opposition player who tormented his Liverpool teams season after season & evidently wants to start Frank against the better teams. 6 points off Everton & Stoke away is no small feat in the middle of January - & it is impossible to deny that his performances in those two games made the difference in all reality.

If Rafa does somehow end up staying on in a more permanent role, that might just be the one potential perk that would somehow get his fat arse out of my crosshairs for a moment - because if it was up to him alone, he would without a shadow of a doubt play Lamps til his legs won't carry him any further - a point which is quite obviously closer to 2 years down the line as opposed to 6 months if his current fitness & stamina is anything to go by.

& if I'm to be honest, I highly doubt his potential successors in Pep or Mourinho or otherwise would let Frank go either if it came down to their decision & nothing else.

When world class players & managers are responding to the press with as much bemusement as many of our own fans, that's when Frank Lampard's indisputable quality would appear to seem far closer to being a universal fact throughout the footballing world, rather than a unique isolated opinion.

I am glad that Frank did start yesterday and played 90 minutes.Hope he continues to feature for us more often because his performance yesterday and in the earlier games this season showed that he has a lot to offer.

[NiclasCFC 2,582]

This is Stamford Bridge in 1998, three years before Frank Lampard signed.

Just trying to show some people that the club did exist before he came along, and it will exist after he's gone. We'll win titles after he's gone and will sign amazing new players and we'll even probably move from this stadium one day. But Lamps will go down as one of our greats and we'll tell stories of his exploits like our dads told us stories of Chopper Harris and Peter Osgood and Peter Bonetti.

But as time passes, things change. It's painful sometimes, but it's necessary for us to move on. The team that we were and what we are going to be are two different things and that means personnel will change. But the club will stay the same. The amount of tedious shit being written about us falling apart is absurd.

I got to say, I Love the Scoreboard!

[The only place to be 11,313]

For the last few years now many people want to see Lampard go (mostly because of "shiny new toy syndrome" which is a fetishization of the new and of theoretical potential, permeates fandom) and have exaggerated his decline (and ignore his quality) but he still keeps on producing.

That's an overly simplistic way of dismissing a lot of decent Chelsea supporters' views that the club aren't doing the wrong thing in allowing Frank to leave. It would be akin to me suggesting that certain 'fans' are fetishising individual players because they haven't got a fucking clue what properly supporting a football club is.

Maybe it's my age, or maybe it's the fact that I actually supported this team before Lamps was signed and have a sense of perspective on things but this whole debate is getting ridiculous. He had a decent game yesterday but we struggled for the first half hour because no-one put their foot on the ball and took control. The same thing happened at Everton. Is this honestly how we want to play against weaker opposition? The same type of performance that we had against QPR?

Nice stats by the way.

[Spike 12,049]

That's an overly simplistic way of dismissing a lot of decent Chelsea supporters' views that the club aren't doing the wrong thing in allowing Frank to leave. It would be akin to me suggesting that certain 'fans' are fetishising individual players because they haven't got a fucking clue what properly supporting a football club is.

Maybe it's my age, or maybe it's the fact that I actually supported this team before Lamps was signed and have a sense of perspective on things but this whole debate is getting ridiculous. He had a decent game yesterday but we struggled for the first half hour because no-one put their foot on the ball and took control. The same thing happened at Everton. Is this honestly how we want to play against weaker opposition? The same type of performance that we had against QPR?

Nice stats by the way.

What does that have to do with anything? I hope your not one of those types that think they are superior because they've supported the team longer...

[The only place to be 11,313]

What does that have to do with anything? I hope your not one of those types that think they superior because they've supported the team longer...

I don't think I'm superior, but I think I might have a point of view different from certain fans who only know Chelsea as the team of Lampard and Terry. We all have different relationships with the club and for me, the club comes first. It will always be there and the players will always be part of the family, but you have to step back sometimes and look at what's best for the club as a whole going forward.

I also think there's a point about Lampard's influence and standing within the squad that is not being mentioned much. The stories around the club during the AVB time suggest that Frank's presence wasn't helpful to the changes AVB was trying to make. Now I personally think he's a twat and a shitty man manager but I do wonder if Roman and the board don't think we'll have a better chance moving forward without Frank there purely for this reason.

[YouNameIt 1,511]

Guys you have to realize something.

We WILL buy a player for the double pivot now or in the summer. That will of course result in Lampard being offered less gametime. However, it would also mean that the club is probably not willing to pay wages like that for Lampard when he would probably not play so much (and considering his age).

So I belive this case is more about what Lampard would be willing to accept in terms of a contract, rather than if Chelsea wants to keep him or not. I honestly believe Chelsea want to keep Lampard (under other circumstances than the presant ones) but Lampard has to think about himself aswell.

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

That's an overly simplistic way of dismissing a lot of decent Chelsea supporters' views that the club aren't doing the wrong thing in allowing Frank to leave. It would be akin to me suggesting that certain 'fans' are fetishising individual players because they haven't got a fucking clue what properly supporting a football club is.

Maybe it's my age, or maybe it's the fact that I actually supported this team before Lamps was signed and have a sense of perspective on things but this whole debate is getting ridiculous. He had a decent game yesterday but we struggled for the first half hour because no-one put their foot on the ball and took control. The same thing happened at Everton. Is this honestly how we want to play against weaker opposition? The same type of performance that we had against QPR?

Nice stats by the way.

You are just so disingenuous about Lampard, it's ridiculous. You can't even admit when he's excellent. 2 goals against Everton? He was "pretty good". Scores both goals in a 2-1 win and you couldn't even bring yourself to vote for him as MOTM. You kept harping on about how apart from the goals he wasn't that good. Great game against Stoke where he drives our attack and is responsible for pretty much everything positive we did? He was "decent" . Even worse than that, you use a caveat. He was decent "but" as if even saying that he was decent is too much for you to admit. Yet, you keep bringing up the QPR game as if he was one of our worst players. He was poor, but he certainly wasn't among the main culprits for that loss. He's been one of our top performers in 3 of the last 4 games and the only game you want to talk about is the one he wasn't. You complain constantly about being tired of this topic, but If Lampard does anything poorly, you are the first to post about it and then exaggerate it to an insane degree and then repeat it over and over again. You post as much on this thread as anybody. You are clearly not tired of the topic, you just get tired of the topic when Lampard is playing well.

Yes, my description of shiny new toy syndrome does not apply to every single supporter who thinks that Chelsea should move on from Lampard, but it's the biggest driving force behind the majority of them. I've never seen a single supporter who wants Lampard gone who also doesn't think that our academy, which has produced zero good players in over a decade, is full of the next FIFA team of the year players. And your analogy is false. There is nobody here that is going to stop supporting Chelsea when Frank leaves. There is nobody who is singing his name at games who is not going to support Chelsea when leaves. Nobody is saying that Lampard should get 150K a week and be guaranteed to start every game or anything. We simply think that he's one of the greatest Chelsea players ever and that's he's certainly good enough to still play a role at Chelsea. Supporting a club doesn't mean supporting everything the club does. It doesn't mean supporting every single person involved in the club. You're constantly pointing out to people how you are more of a supporter as if you've been following Chelsea since 1946 and have attended every single match they've ever played or something.

[magicrico 175]

Our club is fuckng ridiculous sometimes...Watch the MOTD analysis....Unreal...He ran the fucking game. HOW can we not be giving him a contract and keep that cunt Torres. if lampard goes it's one of the worst bits of business we have ever done.

His performances alone warrant a contract. Fucking joke.

Same said about cole. Give them both two year deals. Even if they only give you one more season. You can command a fee. That covers their wages. not to mention Lamps saying he'd take a pay cut.

Unbelievable.

[The only place to be 11,313]

You are just so disingenuous about Lampard, it's ridiculous. You can't even admit when he's excellent. 2 goals against Everton? He was "pretty good". Scores both goals in a 2-1 win and you couldn't even bring yourself to vote for him as MOTM. You kept harping on about how apart from the goals he wasn't that good. Great game against Stoke where he drives our attack and is responsible for pretty much everything positive we did? He was "decent" . Even worse than that, you use a caveat. He was decent "but" as if even saying that he was decent is too much for you to admit. Yet, you keep bringing up the QPR game as if he was one of our worst players. He was poor, but he certainly wasn't among the main culprits for that loss. He's been one of our top performers in 3 of the last 4 games and the only game you want to talk about is the one he wasn't. You complain constantly about being tired of this topic, but If Lampard does anything poorly, you are the first to post about it and then exaggerate it to an insane degree and then repeat it over and over again. You post as much on this thread as anybody. You are clearly not tired of the topic, you just get tired of the topic when Lampard is playing well.

I'm not disingenuous in the slightest thank you. Goals and stats aren't the be all and end all of matches, and the performances against Stoke and Everton in the first 30 minutes left a great deal to be desired. We struggled to control the ball, and that was down to the midfield in large part. The QPR game is particularly pertinent because people keep harping on about his experience and his knowledge of local rivalries (QPR are a local rival btw). I believe I gave him the appropriate amount of credit yesterday, but I thought the MOTM was Luiz (another player I've criticised and had 'fans' accuse me of being disingenuous about).

Yes, my description of shiny new toy syndrome does not apply to every single supporter who thinks that Chelsea should move on from Lampard, but it's the biggest driving force behind the majority of them. I've never seen a single supporter who wants Lampard gone who also doesn't think that our academy, which has produced zero good players in over a decade, is full of the next FIFA team of the year players. And your analogy is false. There is nobody here that is going to stop supporting Chelsea when Frank leaves. There is nobody who is singing his name at games who is not going to support Chelsea when leaves. Nobody is saying that Lampard should get 150K a week and be guaranteed to start every game or anything. We simply think that he's one of the greatest Chelsea players ever and that's he's certainly good enough to still play a role at Chelsea. Supporting a club doesn't mean supporting everything the club does. It doesn't mean supporting every single person involved in the club. You're constantly pointing out to people how you are more of a supporter as if you've been following Chelsea since 1946 and have attended every single match they've ever played or something.

You're talking utter fucking bollocks there. The academy is important because we need to start producing our own talent rather than buying every single player. Plus we happen to have some amazing talent in it.

I'm also not constantly pointing out that I'm 'more of a supporter', simply explaining my perspective. I've seen great players come and go, but the club has been on an amazing upswing since I started attending games and I don't see that overall trend ending. So maybe try debating the actual facts rather than lying about me, okay?

[The only place to be 11,313]

Our club is fuckng ridiculous sometimes...Watch the MOTD analysis....Unreal...He ran the fucking game. HOW can we not be giving him a contract and keep that cunt Torres. if lampard goes it's one of the worst bits of business we have ever done.

His performances alone warrant a contract. Fucking joke.

Same said about cole. Give them both two year deals. Even if they only give you one more season. You can command a fee. That covers their wages. not to mention Lamps saying he'd take a pay cut.

Unbelievable.

Watch the match (and the first 30 of the Everton game and the whole of the QPR game). We really struggled in the first 30 against a really weak team and that seemed to stem entirely from the midfield. Lamps had a good game after that, but there's enough inconsistency there to suggest that he can't be the player we rely on like we used to.

Ashley on the other hand is still the best in his position in the world in my opinion and we should be doing everything we can to retain his services for next year (maybe even two), especially as young Ryan hasn't shown enough thus far.

The Torres point is beyond ridiculous. If we terminate his contract, we still have to pay him. For us to sell him (or loan him to a team who might pay his wages) another team has to make us an offer and that seems unlikely given his current form. I'd love for us to ship him on but that seems unlikely until the summer.

[Corner 456]

Watch the match (and the first 30 of the Everton game and the whole of the QPR game). We really struggled in the first 30 against a really weak team and that seemed to stem entirely from the midfield. Lamps had a good game after that, but there's enough inconsistency there to suggest that he can't be the player we rely on like we used to.

I don't want to get involved in this discussion because it's boring by now and fans are just going around in circles, saying the same things... but I'm pretty sure that for the first 30 minutes of the match at Goodison Park, we lined up with a 4-3-3. A midfield trio of Luiz, Lampard and Ramires with Mata and Hazard on the wings. This clearly wasn't working so Rafa made the switch to 4-2-3-1. Luiz and Lampard as holding midfielders, Mata pushed back into the middle and Hazard and Ramires on the wings.

I think it's fair to say that playing 4-3-3 was the main cause of our struggle to control the midfield for the first 30 minutes. As soon as Mata came back into the middle, the game changed.

[The only place to be 11,313]

I don't want to get involved in this discussion because it's boring by now and fans are just going around in circles, saying the same things... but I'm pretty sure that for the first 30 minutes of the match at Goodison Park, we lined up with a 4-3-3. A midfield trio of Luiz, Lampard and Ramires with Mata and Hazard on the wings. This clearly wasn't working so Rafa made the switch to 4-2-3-1. Luiz and Lampard as holding midfielders, Mata pushed back into the middle and Hazard and Ramires on the wings.

I think it's fair to say that playing 4-3-3 was the main cause of our struggle to control the midfield for the first 30 minutes. As soon as Mata came back into the middle, the game changed.

I thought we started the Everton game as we have done the other matches (Rami on the right, Lamps and Luiz in midfield).

Now by no means was Lamps the only bad player in that opening, but maybe I expected more because of his 'experience' (and the same goes for Cole who was way off the pace).

The problem with this whole issue is that it's dividing fans and taking so much of the focus. This was always going to be a tough move to make but the fact that it's still 5 months off is just dragging it out. It looks like it's a dead cert and we're looking to replace him, but some of the shit people are coming out with is simply hysterical and they're losing all perspective. Yes he's a great player, and I've loved watching him at the Bridge for many a year and he's contributed to more than his fair share of hangovers and missed trains, but the club is bigger than one man. We'll not be boarding up the windows when he leaves as some might have you believe.

Frank will leave in the summer and I'll still back us to win the league if we get the right manager in. He could even sign for United and I'd say we were favourites. If I can say that at the start of the season, then I count myself as a very lucky football supporter.