Juan Cuadrado

[MrBlueGuy 1,552]

Look like the transfer is reaching its ending in the end as Jose said, no one is going anywhere haha

[Jase 43,479]

Look like the transfer is reaching its ending in the end as Jose said, no one is going anywhere haha

Imagine the furore here...

[MrBlueGuy 1,552]

Imagine the furore here...

Meh would have been a good signing as I think he is a good player, but doesn't matter if we wait until the summer and go for the likes of Reus...etc or him again, getting 5 more months to pass judgement. Doubt many are that desperate either, some are talking as if he is from Urganda and never played football before . What I hope though is that we don't go for Costa for 20m+, that would be madness.

[The Mak 4,459]

EDIT: @The Mak

1. Actually fair market value

2. We do not know anything about that. Some players take to the league right away, others don't. In other words speculation.

3. Opinion and speculation, that kind of analysis should be left for the people who make a living out of it. Stats point towards him being enough of an improvement though.

4. What is the resell value of Fabregas or Costa? We can not only buy players with selling them in mind. The idea is for them to play well, improve the team and then leave when they have reached a point where they cant earn their keep. Unless they fail right away the time of that usually occurs with higher age.

5. Opinion

Not trying to sound like an ass, but those aren't exactly striking arguments. A forum thrives when people come in with opinions based on at least some sort of facts rather than just saying "he sucks", "no THX" etc.

Thinking that Cuadrado is the wrong player is fair enough, but its hard to know what you in this instance is basing this opinion on.

1. Not if he is shit it's not.

2.. How did Salah adapt since last January then? You can't deny that the time for adaption makes this transfer the potential to be yet another waste of everyone's time.

3. As a statistician, i'll tell you that stats like that don't point to shit unless they are under the same conditions. Kezman had fantastic stats in Eredivisie didn't he?!

4. This is probably one of the most ridiculous things I have read on this forum; you are comparing Fabregas & Costa to Juan Cuadrado? Lets compare then shall we?

Fabregas: a proven WC player with multiple honours and PL proven.

Costa: scored 36 goals in 52 appearances last season and was the driving force behind Atletico winning their first league title in 19 years and reaching their first CL final.

Vs.

Juan Cuadrado: a 26 year old who was completely anonymous to the majority of the footballing world until he was seen at the WC, in a team that was carried by James Rodriguez no less.

In case you didn't notice, what I was getting at was that we are expected to pay a price that is indicative of a guaranteed success when Cuadrado is far from. At least with Salah and Schurrle they were cheaper, young, and would've kept a lot of their resale value (which they have obviously); but with Cuadrado, if he flops we will not be able to sell him for anywhere near the price we paid. Not only could it be a big fat waste of time, but also money; these are the things that must be thought about with FFP and a title on the line.

Point is, if we are paying that money for a player these days we should have a 90% confidence in his ability to adapt and succeed, if not, he should at least still have the age and potential to improve elsewhere if he does not succeed so we can get our money back or make a bit of a profit - Cuadrado currently falls into neither category.

Besides, if (God forbid) something happens to Hazard I would much prefer to have Schurrle here than sticking square pegs in round holes by putting Willian on the left or a new player who is not only uncomfortable in the position, but is also adapting to a new team, new style, new league, new life etc. Something like that has the potential to seriously disrupt a title challenge...

[Spike 12,049]

So according to WhoScored Cuadrado's defensive contribution is weak and he is dispossessed a lot. So he may have impressive overall workrate but contributes little to defence. They also state he is stong at passing, finishing and key passes. So his offensive output is quite solid. I'm liking this transfer a little more now, Cuadrado as an Offensive Winger and Willian as a Defensive Winger. That will cover the right hand side nicely. But it also must be noted that Cuadrado has scored all of his goals this season from the Centre Attacking Midfield position.

http://www.whoscored.com/Players/44868/

http://www.whoscored.com/Players/29463/

[The Skipper 20,609]

1. Not if he is shit it's not.

2.. How did Salah adapt since last January then? You can't deny that the time for adaption makes this transfer the potential to be yet another waste of everyone's time.

3. As a statistician, i'll tell you that stats like that don't point to shit unless they are under the same conditions. Kezman had fantastic stats in Eredivisie didn't he?!

4. This is probably one of the most ridiculous things I have read on this forum; you are comparing Fabregas & Costa to Juan Cuadrado? Lets compare then shall we?

Fabregas: a proven WC player with multiple honours and PL proven.

Costa: scored 36 goals in 52 appearances last season and was the driving force behind Atletico winning their first league title in 19 years and reaching their first CL final.

Vs.

Juan Cuadrado: a 26 year old who was completely anonymous to the majority of the footballing world until he was seen at the WC, in a team that was carried by James Rodriguez no less.

In case you didn't notice, what I was getting at was that we are expected to pay a price that is indicative of a guaranteed success when Cuadrado is far from. At least with Salah and Schurrle they were cheaper, young, and would've kept a lot of their resale value (which they have obviously); but with Cuadrado, if he flops we will not be able to sell him for anywhere near the price we paid. Not only could it be a big fat waste of time, but also money; these are the things that must be thought about with FFP and a title on the line.

Point is, if we are paying that money for a player these days we should have a 90% confidence in his ability to adapt and succeed, if not, he should at least still have the age and potential to improve elsewhere if he does not succeed so we can get our money back or make a bit of a profit - Cuadrado currently falls into neither category.

Besides, if (God forbid) something happens to Hazard I would much prefer to have Schurrle here than sticking square pegs in round holes by putting Willian on the left or a new player who is not only uncomfortable in the position, but is also adapting to a new team, new style, new league, new life etc. Something like that has the potential to seriously disrupt a title challenge...

Hear, hear. Rationality.

[robsblubot 3,595]

So according to WhoScored Cuadrado's defensive contribution is weak and he is dispossessed a lot. So he may have impressive overall workrate but contributes little to defence. They also state he is stong at passing, finishing and key passes. So his offensive output is quite solid. I'm liking this transfer a little more now, Cuadrado as an Offensive Winger and Willian as a Defensive Winger. That will cover the right hand side nicely. But it also must be noted that Cuadrado has scored all of his goals this season from the Centre Attacking Midfield position.

http://www.whoscored.com/Players/44868/

http://www.whoscored.com/Players/29463/

because he's got no discipline switching off often. He's also physically weak and lacks determination.

Can't imagine a more Unmourinho player.

No, I am not a fan of Cuadrado. Stupid name too: Cuadrado means square in spanish (quadrado in Portuguese).

Would rather keep Salah who has a chance to become a good player one day; Cuadrado's ship might have already sailed.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

Funny that. Mourinho may have been thinking about upgrading our RW but in this window and situation, the impression seems to be that we are only buying Cuadrado to replace Schurrle/Salah as opposed to replace either one of them with Cuadrado to strengthen our RW. After all, there were no signs of us doing anything until suddenly Wolfsburg and Roma expressed their interest in Schurrle and Salah respectively. We are trying to improve yes, but is Cuadrado really the answer? Is he really THAT good and better than Salah, Schurrle or Willian? Not convinced. May end up being a 27m bench warmer.

Considering how highly rated Schurrle is in Germany, I don't see our bargain would weaken a lot, even if there'll be more options for clubs to choose. He's one of the better players around and if teams like Wolfsburg, Dortmund etc want to get even better, then Schurrle would be pretty high on that list.

We may aspire to be one of the best teams around but the idea of having world class players in the starting XI and on the bench is totally nonsense. We live in reality, not in the world of Football Manager or FIFA. It's nearly impossible to be having that. Barcelona under Guardiola did not have high quality players on the bench but what they did have was good and reliable players to come in and do the job. It was the same thing with Ferguson's United as well.

You have no way of knowing what the club's intentions are. What we do know is that we have to sell before we buy so naturally we hear about the offers coming in first before we hear of player purchases. We have no way of knowing how good he can be in our set up. We have a need because neither schurrle or salah have provided us with that in injection on the right. The club will have identified cuadrado as a replacement, not me, so clearly they think he is an upgrade. I don't know much about him as a player to make a fair assessment maybe you do. 27m for a high quality bench player isn't bad.

You make schurrle sound like he's a world beater. There are tons of players that are in his bracket of players, and it's a fact that if teams have other targets available at a number that our bargaining position is weakened, doesn't matter how much you think he's highly rated in Germany, if we price him out of the market value teams will look at secondary targets.

Nobody said anything about world class. The words I used were HIGH QUALITY squad players.

[Pizy 18,866]

I....really want us to sign him now.

I need a shiny new toy to fawn over. Just thinking about the possibility of wingers on both sides of the pitch being able to blaze past a defender and play aggressively gets me excited. You see even average wingers in this league can be very effective, so the prospect of adding a potentially top class one sounds good to me.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

1. Not if he is shit it's not.

2.. How did Salah adapt since last January then? You can't deny that the time for adaption makes this transfer the potential to be yet another waste of everyone's time.

3. As a statistician, i'll tell you that stats like that don't point to shit unless they are under the same conditions. Kezman had fantastic stats in Eredivisie didn't he?!

4. This is probably one of the most ridiculous things I have read on this forum; you are comparing Fabregas & Costa to Juan Cuadrado? Lets compare then shall we?

Fabregas: a proven WC player with multiple honours and PL proven.

Costa: scored 36 goals in 52 appearances last season and was the driving force behind Atletico winning their first league title in 19 years and reaching their first CL final.

Vs.

Juan Cuadrado: a 26 year old who was completely anonymous to the majority of the footballing world until he was seen at the WC, in a team that was carried by James Rodriguez no less.

In case you didn't notice, what I was getting at was that we are expected to pay a price that is indicative of a guaranteed success when Cuadrado is far from. At least with Salah and Schurrle they were cheaper, young, and would've kept a lot of their resale value (which they have obviously); but with Cuadrado, if he flops we will not be able to sell him for anywhere near the price we paid. Not only could it be a big fat waste of time, but also money; these are the things that must be thought about with FFP and a title on the line.

Point is, if we are paying that money for a player these days we should have a 90% confidence in his ability to adapt and succeed, if not, he should at least still have the age and potential to improve elsewhere if he does not succeed so we can get our money back or make a bit of a profit - Cuadrado currently falls into neither category.

Besides, if (God forbid) something happens to Hazard I would much prefer to have Schurrle here than sticking square pegs in round holes by putting Willian on the left or a new player who is not only uncomfortable in the position, but is also adapting to a new team, new style, new league, new life etc. Something like that has the potential to seriously disrupt a title challenge...

1. So we're not supposed to buy players unless without a shadow of a doubt they are fantastic? How do you know until you see them with our set up? That is just silly.

2.how did matic adapt? Depends on the player it's not a reason not to buy

3. So did Suarez. You're looking at the information one sided. For every kezman there are 100s of players who worked out.

4. Apples and oranges no transfer comes without inherit risk. No one knew how costa would adjust to life in the prem. the club took a chance and it paid off, you know why? Because when you wait till players are "known quantities" their price tag doubles. You gamble, much like how we gambled that schurrle would come good here after having a paltry conversion rate of 9.1% or on salah who quietly burned us twice.

If you don't like Cuadrado that's all fine and good but don't paint a picture like what the club is doing is completely out of the ordinary and carries too much risk. The risk vs reward is high since salah and schurrle haven't been anywhere near consistent enough for this club. If cuadrado comes in with willians work ethic and better finishing in the final 3rd we win big.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

I dont think Cuadrado is better than Reus but no one can say Reus would be better than Cuadrado here...

[Rekin 835]

1. Not if he is shit it's not.

2.. How did Salah adapt since last January then? You can't deny that the time for adaption makes this transfer the potential to be yet another waste of everyone's time.

3. As a statistician, i'll tell you that stats like that don't point to shit unless they are under the same conditions. Kezman had fantastic stats in Eredivisie didn't he?!

4. This is probably one of the most ridiculous things I have read on this forum; you are comparing Fabregas & Costa to Juan Cuadrado? Lets compare then shall we?

Fabregas: a proven WC player with multiple honours and PL proven.

Costa: scored 36 goals in 52 appearances last season and was the driving force behind Atletico winning their first league title in 19 years and reaching their first CL final.

Vs.

Juan Cuadrado: a 26 year old who was completely anonymous to the majority of the footballing world until he was seen at the WC, in a team that was carried by James Rodriguez no less.

In case you didn't notice, what I was getting at was that we are expected to pay a price that is indicative of a guaranteed success when Cuadrado is far from. At least with Salah and Schurrle they were cheaper, young, and would've kept a lot of their resale value (which they have obviously); but with Cuadrado, if he flops we will not be able to sell him for anywhere near the price we paid. Not only could it be a big fat waste of time, but also money; these are the things that must be thought about with FFP and a title on the line.

Point is, if we are paying that money for a player these days we should have a 90% confidence in his ability to adapt and succeed, if not, he should at least still have the age and potential to improve elsewhere if he does not succeed so we can get our money back or make a bit of a profit - Cuadrado currently falls into neither category.

Besides, if (God forbid) something happens to Hazard I would much prefer to have Schurrle here than sticking square pegs in round holes by putting Willian on the left or a new player who is not only uncomfortable in the position, but is also adapting to a new team, new style, new league, new life etc. Something like that has the potential to seriously disrupt a title challenge...

1. He isnt shit. To say that points towards a personal bias against him as he was one of the best players in serie A last season.

2. The point was that some players need time to adapt, others dont. How long did Costa need? How long did Hazard need? They might be better players, but it is still nothing you can generalize to the point of assuming that he wont add anything to the team for a long time.

3. As a person working in finance I can tell you that stats are a tool to support decisions. You use them to remove unknown variables. Costa had good stats in La Liga right? We are not low on players who were good in their domestic leagues and continued being good in CFC.

4. Im glad that Im amusing you, but you are again not really getting the point. If Cuadrado is deemed to improve team for a few years, than that is what matters, not what we can sell him for when he isnt good enough anymore.

You are honestly making me laugh when you keep claiming that no one knew about him before the world cup, as if he was some random who had 5 good games. Maybe the problem is that your knowledge of players dont extend far enough?

[The Mak 4,459]

1. So we're not supposed to buy players unless without a shadow of a doubt they are fantastic? How do you know until you see them with our set up? That is just silly.

2.how did matic adapt? Depends on the player it's not a reason not to buy

3. So did Suarez. You're looking at the information one sided. For every kezman there are 100s of players who worked out.

4. Apples and oranges no transfer comes without inherit risk. No one knew how costa would adjust to life in the prem. the club took a chance and it paid off, you know why? Because when you wait till players are "known quantities" their price tag doubles. You gamble, much like how we gambled that schurrle would come good here after having a paltry conversion rate of 9.1% or on salah who quietly burned us twice.

If you don't like Cuadrado that's all fine and good but don't paint a picture like what the club is doing is completely out of the ordinary and carries too much risk. The risk vs reward is high since salah and schurrle haven't been anywhere near consistent enough for this club. If cuadrado comes in with willians work ethic and better finishing in the final 3rd we win big.

1. You clearly did not read my post properly, I'm not explaining it again.

2. Maybe it has something to do with him being at the club before? Speaking English or having a friend/living in London before? Anyway, players hitting the ground running like Matic did are very rare indeed.

3. And you are looking at the information arseways! You're making it seem like Kezman was a freak 1/100 accident and that players adapt perfectly 99% of the time, when it couldn't be further from the truth! Case and point, Schurrle and Salah!

Jesus Christ, Schurrle's stats were almost identical to Cuadrado's before the came to Chelsea except he was younger, and Salah's weren't far off either. And what happened? Stats mean fuck all unless you are in freak territory like 30+ goals a season like Costa was.

4. How can you say the risk/reward is high simply because Salah and Schurrle have contributed so little? What makes you so sure? It is because Fiorentina stuck on a couple of extra million than Schurrle? Is that 100% indicative of a player's quality? Torres?! LOL, THIS IS NOT FOOTBALL MANAGER. Did you ever think that Cuadrado could just be an even bigger, more expensive flop than Salah or Schurrle?!

Did you ever think of this simple fact: if Cuadrado was good, even if Cuadrado was on Mourinho's wish list, he would already be in the team.

Because when it comes down to it, the signing of Cuadrado is a singing of circumstance, not of necessity or a want or a need.

We will sign him if a player wants to leave, that's it, not because he was always wanted. Compare with other Mourinho signings:

Matic: Need

Salah: Circumstance

Fabregas: Need

Costa: Need

Willian was needed because clearly Mourinho was planning on ousting Mata but whether he is the best for the team, I don't know; the fact that he wants to spend big money (not just 'Salah' money) on another RW tells me he isn't 100% confident in Willian. As far as Schurrle, maybe he is just a signing that just didn't go right as he never found consistency. But you can easily spot the signings that were 110% wanted and needed for the structure of Mourinho's team.

Cuadrado, no matter how you want to look at it, is a signing that is a result of a set of circumstances rather than a player Mourinho has identified from the beginning. I would rather wait until the summer when the market is more open.

[The Mak 4,459]

1. He isnt shit. To say that points towards a personal bias against him as he was one of the best players in serie A last season.

2. The point was that some players need time to adapt, others dont. How long did Costa need? How long did Hazard need? They might be better players, but it is still nothing you can generalize to the point of assuming that he wont add anything to the team for a long time.

3. As a person working in finance I can tell you that stats are a tool to support decisions. You use them to remove unknown variables. Costa had good stats in La Liga right? We are not low on players who were good in their domestic leagues and continued being good in CFC.

4. Im glad that Im amusing you, but you are again not really getting the point. If Cuadrado is deemed to improve team for a few years, than that is what matters, not what we can sell him for when he isnt good enough anymore.

You are honestly making me laugh when you keep claiming that no one knew about him before the world cup, as if he was some random who had 5 good games. Maybe the problem is that your knowledge of players dont extend far enough?

1. I said IF.

2. Hazard and Costa had vastly superior records (this includes trophies). Hazard had a lot to do with Lille winning the league in 2011 and Costa drove Atletico to win La Liga and into the CL final, so I still do not know what your point is. They also had an entire summer and preseason to adapt to their new team, get settled in etc. They were also specifically targeted by the club and not simply a result of a set of circumstances.

3. I suppose everyone in finance thought the economy was hunky dory before 2008?! See what I've just said about stats.

4. Yes, because I desperately want him to fail. I want him to fail and the club to suffer because I want to be proven right...I fucking hope to baby Jesus that I am wrong if we sign him, but because of the reasons I have already outlined in my previous post, excuse me if I am not full of confidence in a player who is close to 27, has won nothing, has no CL experience, has an average record in a poor league and who we are only signing just because, basically, we have to sign a replacement.

[Strike 7,477]

I don't like how the squad keeps changing every few months