🇧🇷 Filipe Luís

[lionsden 4,689]

In my opinion,he should leave because he deserves a chance to play regular football every week.He will not be a starter here because Azpi is simply the best LB and he deserves something better.

He loves Chelsea,but he once said that Chelsea always lied to him when it came about getting games at Chelsea.He said that the management always said to him that he will get his fair chance,but in the end,we know that he did not get his fair chance.

It is what it is.Bertrand was maybe to patient.He should have left us when he was 22 or so.

I absolutely agree with you that moving on is best for his career.

But according to some "if you are good enough, you will make it here". Bertrand's treatment has basically busted that theory.

It's more like if the manager likes/rates you, you will make it here. Jose never rated him from the start for whatever reason. Bertrand never stood a chance.

[lucio 5,418]

so now bertrand has gone from underrated to completely overrated, he did well enough, but no chance we will miss him

[killer1257 3,282]

I absolutely agree with you that moving on is best for his career.

But according to some "if you are good enough, you will make it here". Bertrand's treatment has basically busted that theory.

It's more like if the manager likes/rates you, you will make it here. Jose never rated him from the start for whatever reason hence why he bought Filipe and banished him permanently to the bench and later shipping him out on loan.

In my opinion,he was better than Ashley in his last 2 years.Ashley was nowhere near his peak and Bertrand had everything to replace him,but Chelsea did not give him enough minutes.Ashley did a lot of defense mistakes,which caused that we drpped a lot of points and offensively,he wasn´t great either.He was not the best LB in the PL anymore.Why not give Bertrand a chance,who has more stamina,is faster and better at crossing?Still Chelsea did not manage to give him a chance.Like you said,it is always about the manager.If he likes the youth,he will give you a chance.If he loves experience,you can simply leave the club.

Everytime he played,he played good.I do not remember a bad game from him.At least he won the CL and I think that he deserves that.At least he got one good memory for him at Chelsea.

Great guy,great character and he still said that he likes Chelsea,even though we treated him badly.

[The Skipper 20,609]

If you're going to get upset and not actually argue the points, then never mind, I was just looking for a decent debate. Certainly not looking for a holier than thou/patronizing "expected better from you" crap......I expected better from you, Skip!

I have argued the points that I've felt needed arguing.

[lionsden 4,689]

In my opinion,he was better than Ashley in his last 2 years.Ashley was nowhere near his peak and Bertrand had everything to replace him,but Chelsea did not give him enough minutes.Ashley did a lot of defense mistakes,which caused that we drpped a lot of points and offensively,he wasn´t great either.He was not the best LB in the PL anymore.Why not give Bertrand a chance,who has more stamina,is faster and better at crossing?Still Chelsea did not manage to give him a chance.Like you said,it is always about the manager.If he likes the youth,he will give you a chance.If he loves experience,you can simply leave the club.

Everytime he played,he played good.I do not remember a bad game from him.At least he won the CL and I think that he deserves that.At least he got one good memory for him at Chelsea.

Great guy,great character and he still said that he likes Chelsea,even though we treated him badly.

I absolutely agree with you here but to answer your question.

Reputation/perception that's why. A former world class player who some may still blindly see as world class showing increasing signs of decline and playing extremely poorly vs an irrelevant (in football circuit) LB bought from Gillingham for 125,000.

In this situation the manager has to like and rate the underdog extrmely highly before he can get a proper chance over the established player even if it's evidently clear that the underdog is outperforming the ageing and declining superstar. that's football politics and human nature sadly.

[lucio 5,418]

I absolutely agree with you here but to answer your question.

Reputation/perception that's why. A former world class player who some may still blindly see as world class showing increasing signs of decline and playing extremely poorly vs an irrelevant (in football circuit) LB bought from Gillingham for 125,000.

In this situation the manager has to like and rate the underdog extrmely highly before he can get a proper chance over the established player even if it's evidently clear that the underdog is outperforming the ageing and declining superstar. that's football politics and human nature sadly.

irrelevant lb who played 56 times for us. its not like he wasn't given lots of chances. which other youngsters can say that.

bertrand was fairly established, mourinho thought he wasnt quite good enough to play a major role. and i agree

[Tomo 21,751]

Firstly that's nothing more than your opinion that we weren't covered at LB. Even if that was true (which it isn't imo) is that a justification to spend that amoiunt for a mere squad player in a position where players generally don't cost alot. paying that much for a LB and one with such huge reputation (He was rated as the best LB in Europe last season) just to be back up is very excessive and stupid no matter how one looks at it.

If he was signed with the intention to be back up then ofcourse, but like I said the circumstance can easily change things, like those examples in my previous post.

And even with Luis we are light at the back, he's our only senior back up, after that were down to teenagers.

[didierforever 7,349]

so now bertrand has gone from underrated to completely overrated, he did well enough, but no chance we will miss him

tbh, i dont think anyone is overrating bertrand. he was a good back up and the amount of time luis has played, i think bertrand could have filled that role easily

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,920]

Im sorry but there is no comparison to PVA, Aanholt is the most tactically and positionally inept defender I have ever seen (at a high level) and considering I/we had to suffer with Bosingwa for years, that's saying something.

He can attack though, and that seems to be the only standard people are judging by when they call for Luis to start over dave.

[calculatingInfinity 1,472]

He can attack though, and that seems to be the only standard people are judging by when they call for Luis to start over dave.

I'm calling Luis to start over Ivan, who has been underperforming quite a bit recently both in defense and attack.

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,920]

I'm calling Luis to start over Ivan, who has been underperforming quite a bit recently both in defense and attack.

And this is fair. Ivanovic has been living on early goal scoring form for too long at this point. Mourinho seems to love him though.

[The Skipper 20,609]

I'm calling Luis to start over Ivan, who has been underperforming quite a bit recently both in defense and attack.

This is it. No one is asking for Azpi to be dropped.

[The Chels 2,502]

And this is fair. Ivanovic has been living on early goal scoring form for too long at this point. Mourinho seems to love him though.

Mourinho's obsession with Ivanovic is also hindering Azpi's development. He has the potential to become a complete and truly world class FB (which Ivanovic is not despite all the plaudits he somehow receives) who excels at defending and attacking but he will never reach the heights he can if he continues playing at LB, as his attacking abilities are heavily restricted. Azpi's ceiling as a RB is so much higher than Ivanovic's imo.

[Barbara 15,149]

Mourinho's obsession with Ivanovic is also hindering Azpi's development. He has the potential to become a complete and truly world class FB (which Ivanovic is not despite all the plaudits he somehow receives) who excels at defending and attacking but he will never reach the heights he can if he continues playing at LB, as his attacking abilities are heavily restricted. Azpi's ceiling as a RB is so much higher than Ivanovic's imo.

well, a lot of people agree about Iva, actually. I've seen 3 or 4 teams of the half season so far and he's figured in all of them, no exception.

I think the thing with Iva is that he isn't as reliable defensively and makes mistakes all the time and it seems Mourinho just disregards it. Filipe does too, but it's held against him. I think Mourinho wanted to clone Azpili and have him in both wings.

When Luis gets at the top of his game defensively, Iva should leave the team, not Azpi, but I honestly don't see it happening. Unfortunately.

[The Chels 2,502]

well, a lot of people agree about Iva, actually. I've seen 3 or 4 teams of the half season so far and he's figured in all of them, no exception.

I think the thing with Iva is that he isn't as reliable defensively and makes mistakes all the time and it seems Mourinho just disregards it. Filipe does too, but it's held against him. I think Mourinho wanted to clone Azpili and have him in both wings.

When Luis gets at the top of his game defensively, Iva should leave the team, not Azpi, but I honestly don't see it happening. Unfortunately.

Ivanovic is chosen in lots of teams of the (half) season because his marauding runs are very obvious but his mistakes are not. People think that because he's part of Chelsea's defence he must be amazing defensively but he is a liability imo.

I remember against United away this season, Gary Neville was commentating and he mentioned that he didn't like how Ivanovic had his hands behind his back and kept backing off. He seemed genuinely surprised that Ivanovic would do that because like most people who don't watch him closely every game, he seems to be under the illusion that Ivanovic is a great defender. Also do you remember that clever corner routine Southampton had in the first half against us? The only reason we didn't concede was because Terry maintained his concentration at the back post. I would expect Luis, Azpi and probably Cahill to do the same but Ivanovic would almost certainly switch off in that situation, as past experience dictates.

I've been wanting to see Azpi at RB and Luis at LB in the PL for a long time but that won't happen unless Ivanovic is suspended or injured.

[Blue-in-me-Veins 4,067]

As bad as this may come across, that Azpi injury was the best thing that could have happened for todays match.

Luis was running the show with Hazard and co. On that left wing the whole secons half. Ivan has been very poor of late in attack, and it kills me to see he's undroppable.

We may never see Luis-Azpi pairing at all this season on a consistent basis.

Would love to know what JM has against him, otherwise really happy with his play.

[Barbara 15,149]

Mourinho should suck it up and just start this guy in EVERY home game maybe except City and United...

We need his skills in the attack, we need someone to link up with Hazard, to offer a good cross. When he's more confident and settled I want to see him, not Iva, bombing forward in our counter attacks like a bullet.

He was very good today imo, don't remember one single mistake.

[OhForAGreavsie 6,075]

Mourinho should suck it up and just start this guy in EVERY home game maybe except City and United...

We need his skills in the attack, we need someone to link up with Hazard, to offer a good cross. When he's more confident and settled I want to see him, not Iva, bombing forward in our counter attacks like a bullet.

He was very good today imo, don't remember one single mistake.

I thought there were a few errors Barbara. I don't remember any well enough to describe them but I do remember noticing as they happened. In fact at one point my summary would have been that Luis was not having a good game, but he picked up.

[BlueLion. 21,491]

Defensively he's very easy to beat when isolated one-on-one. When he's hunting down the opposition as part of a pack he's great, but when he's targeted he is a weak link, no doubt about it.

Going forward he's a joy to watch, very exciting. Even if he did accidentally block one of Hazard's shots yesterday

[Amblève. 4,995]

I thought there were a few errors Barbara. I don't remember any well enough to describe them but I do remember noticing as they happened. In fact at one point my summary would have been that Luis was not having a good game, but he picked up.

Thought so too. Luis was anything but good IMO, I remember him being beaten countless of times and not providing any better offense than Cesar (while also being unable to play a precise passes).