Willian

[DYC. 7,542]

Some people in this forum are weird. I mean, you see people saying every single attacking AM we have is bad compared to others all over the world. Some say our defenders are bad, some say Cesc doesn't hold a candle to the best CMs in the world and still here we are, comfortably sitting at the top of the table. Also last season we were fighting for the top spots even though we had some of our key players in REALLY bad form (Oscar) or injured for a few games (Hazard) and freaking Torres leading the line. Either we are lucky as fuck or our local rivals have it really bad then, especially because we beat pretty much every strong contender for the title consistently. Or maybe it's the Mourinho effect, but whooops, I've seen some here who think he sucks/is overrated too. And many of our players haven't even reached their peak years too, so I guess it's definitely divine providence after all.

I must admit I haven't been able to watch every single match this season but even in the worst match I've followed (Sunderland IMO) I thought we were still somewhat decent considering everything. There are still tweaks to be made (Sunderland could have used more width to stretch their defense for example) and some players can still do better (Hazard's and Willian's finishing, Oscar's creativity) that's for sure, but I definitely see significant improvement from pretty much everyone if we compare their performances right now to last season or the beginning of this one. How can people be so negative when everything has been going so well for us is baffling.

The thing that kills me the most is that certain fans obviously dislike some Chelsea players? Are you serious? Maybe it's just me but it's damn near impossible for me to dislike anyone wearing that blue shirt.

[Dion 2,476]

The thing that kills me the most is that certain fans obviously dislike Chelsea players? Are you serious? Maybe it's just me but it's damn near impossible for me to dislike anyone wearing that blue shirt.

I thought so too, but then Torres happened. He made it so goddamn hard to like him.

[DYC. 7,542]

I don't suggest we dominate possession as I know that will never be Jose's way in the big games, but with the possession we do have I'd like us not to misplace passes left, right and centre gifting the ball back sloppily. I don't think I'm asking for too much in wanting us to properly counter-attack rather than be a shambles with the ball.

I will agree that the counter-attacking is not the best and there's definitely still room for improvement. Maybe the team still needs time. It's not that bad though, scoring goals hasn't exactly been a problem.

This team is not the fastest though, I think that plays a pretty big part in the quality of the counter-attacking. When the ball is won in deep areas, it takes quite a while for the players to get forward.

[DYC. 7,542]

I thought so too, but then Torres happened. He made it so goddamn hard to like him.

To be honest with you, I don't dislike him, let alone hate him. As a person, he seems pretty decent. Still doesn't change my opinion of him being an all-time great in the world of flops.

[Dion 2,476]

To be honest with you, I don't dislike him, let alone hate him. As a person, he seems pretty decent. Still doesn't change my opinion of him being an all-time great in the world of flops.

I see where you're coming from. He's always been a professional for us and it's not entirely his fault that he can't play better. But there was just something about the way he missed all those clear cut chances, something about his personality that I couldn't get myself to like, also his price tag didn't help, which is unfair because that's entirely not his fault but I can't say it doesn't affect my judgement. And that incident when he said there was a point he didn't care whether the team won or lost, sealed the deal for me. But even though I disliked him, I rarely ever (if ever, I can't remember doing it) would go to his thread and make a post full bash-mode or anything like that. The most I did and still do is joke about it. And when he did well I would come up and admit it. It didn't occur often but it happened a couple of times. IMO as much as you dislike a player, as a supporter you should never go full retard and say things like "he only runs around and does nothing", "crap player", "sell him". Or even worse, start an argument saying player X is crap but player Y is even crappier, wtf, are you really a fan? If you really must criticize, at least do it in a constructive manner.

But enough derailment. Torres is gone.

[The Chels 2,502]

I will agree that the counter-attacking is not the best and there's definitely still room for improvement. Maybe the team still needs time. It's not that bad though, scoring goals hasn't exactly been a problem.

This team is not the fastest though, I think that plays a pretty big part in the quality of the counter-attacking. When the ball is won in deep areas, it takes quite a while for the players to get forward.

The fact that we win the ball so deep is surely a big problem in itself though. Win the ball higher up the pitch and your chances of successfully countering are so much greater. In some big games like United/Pool away we did try to press high (half heartedly) but we also maintained a low defensive block, which meant there were big gaps in midfield when the press was easily overcome. In other games like City away we didn't press at all and instead kept a low block and very defensive shape, with which it was difficult to counter attack.

The balance between strong defence and strong counter-attack is still missing, which doesn't matter half as much in the PL as it does in the CL. Another reason for this is the poor decision making on the counter (I'm looking at you Willian).

[chelseafc9010 224]

The thing that kills me the most is that certain fans obviously dislike some Chelsea players? Are you serious? Maybe it's just me but it's damn near impossible for me to dislike anyone wearing that blue shirt.

Well we all can't be the super fans that will over do the 'I love everything about Chelsea' motive, clearly there are problems in the club like every club and people point it out instead of hiding away from it.

[DYC. 7,542]

I see where you're coming from. He's always been a professional for us and it's not entirely his fault that he can't play better. But there was just something about the way he missed all those clear cut chances, something about his personality that I couldn't get myself to like, also his price tag didn't help, which is unfair because that's entirely not his fault but I can't say it doesn't affect my judgement. And that incident when he said there was a point he didn't care whether the team won or lost, sealed the deal for me. But even though I disliked him, I rarely ever (if ever, I can't remember doing it) would go to his thread and make a post full bash-mode or anything like that. The most I did and still do is joke about it. And when he did well I would come up and admit it. It didn't occur often but it happened a couple of times. IMO as much as you dislike a player, as a supporter you should never go full retard and say things like "he only runs around and does nothing", "crap player", "sell him". Or even worse, start an argument saying player X is crap but player Y is even crappier, wtf, are you really a fan? If you really must criticize, at least do it in a constructive manner.

But enough derailment. Torres is gone.

That's the worst. Really annoys me.

The fact that we win the ball so deep is surely a big problem in itself though. Win the ball higher up the pitch and your chances of successfully countering are so much greater. In some big games like United/Pool away we did try to press high (half heartedly) but we also maintained a low defensive block, which meant there were big gaps in midfield when the press was easily overcome. In other games like City away we didn't press at all and instead kept a low block and very defensive shape, with which it was difficult to counter attack.

The balance between strong defence and strong counter-attack is still missing, which doesn't matter half as much in the PL as it does in the CL. Another reason for this is the poor decision making on the counter (I'm looking at you Willian).

I hear what you're saying. I've had similar feelings. But this is not a bad position to be in, widely rated as part of the 'big 4', with all that room for improvement.

I do agree with you on the CL. I really want a CL win but I don't think that's happening. You can't rule it out though.

[DYC. 7,542]

Well we all can't be the super fans that will over do the 'I love everything about Chelsea' motive, clearly there are problems in the club like every club and people point it out instead of hiding away from it.

Super fans? Haha I'm anything but that. I said it's impossible for me to dislike Chelsea players. I don't rate certain players but I can never dislike them. They play for Chelsea. Kalou for example drove me crazy but I can't help but like the guy.

[Cescy 40]

Do you want to compare the numbers of Oscar and other players in all the world?

I know Willian should improve, I said we should buy Reus, and even before the world cup I said I would like to have Sanchez here.

I just think it's really funny that the same people says that Oscar is increadible, are here saying that Willian needs to improve a lot, and needs to have more competition, when in reality since Willian arrived at CHelsea he was a lot more consistent and played better than Oscar and this season there is no great difference between the 2. On the other hand the only attacking player in Chelsea that doesn´t have direct competition in the squad is Oscar, not Willian.

If you check the numbers of CM or CAM, or wingers all over the world with the numbers of Oscar (and WIllian of course) you can see that he is far from increadible. And the same can be said about Hazard when compared to the best players in the world. It's the truth.

Oscar has contributed 3 goals and 4 assists in his last 10 premier league games. Numbers aren't everything and don't tell the whole story, but those are nice numbers and reflect some of the good progress he is making.

Oscar has as much competition for his position as Willian does. The #10 is Willian's better position and this season he played there against Man City and during the 1st half against Maribor (a).

[Rom2013 446]

Oscar has contributed 3 goals and 4 assists in his last 10 premier league games. Numbers aren't everything and don't tell the whole story, but those are nice numbers and reflect some of the good progress he is making.

Oscar has as much competition for his position as Willian does. The #10 is Willian's better position and this season he played there against Man City and during the 1st half against Maribor (a).

Yes nice numbers, Ozil also did nice numbers last season and everyone thinks that he did nothing for Arsenal until now... Where is the increadible Oscar everyone is talking about? Some good progress...

Willian can do nice numbers also. Also a lot of players in the world and they are not increadible (maybe with exception of Hazard that strangely this season has lower numbers for what he in reality creates). All the others are ok for this kind of teams.

Saying that Willian has a lot of problems, and Oscar is increadible is a lie and many here say that. You just need read it here. There are things that are facts... last season WIllian was more important than Oscar (almost every player was more important since Oscar was completely shit for 4 months), and the difference between the players this season is almost nothing.

But in this forum people think that Oscar is increadible and Willian needs to improve a lot.

EDIT: WIllian for us is a winger, we don't have one single number 10 in the team just Oscar.

[zolayes 14,489]

To be honest with you, I don't dislike him, let alone hate him. As a person, he seems pretty decent. Still doesn't change my opinion of him being an all-time great in the world of flops.

Sutton

[Cescy 40]

Yes nice numbers, Ozil also did nice numbers last season and everyone thinks that he did nothing for Arsenal until now... Where is the increadible Oscar everyone is talking about? Some good progress...

Willian can do nice numbers also. Also a lot of players in the world and they are not increadible (maybe with exception of Hazard that strangely this season has lower numbers for what he in reality creates). All the others are ok for this kind of teams.

Saying that Willian has a lot of problems, and Oscar is increadible is a lie and many here say that. You just need read it here. There are things that are facts... last season WIllian was more important than Oscar (almost every player was more important since Oscar was completely shit for 4 months), and the difference between the players this season is almost nothing.

But in this forum people think that Oscar is increadible and Willian needs to improve a lot.

EDIT: WIllian for us is a winger, we don't have one single number 10 in the team just Oscar.

We have other #10s. They just aren't better than Oscar in that position for us. That includes Willian, which is why he plays on the wing. The gap between them isn't small or nothing. Willian's stints at #10 this season should make that even more obvious.

Willian does have problems and this thread is dedicated to him, so naturally people will both praise and criticize him here. I don't think anyone thinks Oscar is perfect or without his own problems, but to me and probably many others he is a level above Willian.

You should try letting your grudge over last season go.

[Rom2013 446]

We have other #10s. They just aren't better than Oscar in that position for us. That includes Willian, which is why he plays on the wing. The gap between them isn't small or nothing. Willian's stints at #10 this season should make that even more obvious.

Willian does have problems and this thread is dedicated to him, so naturally people will both praise and criticize him here. I don't think anyone thinks Oscar is perfect or without his own problems, but to me and probably many others he is a level above Willian.

You should try letting your grudge over last season go.

Go compare the opinions of the same people about Oscar and WIllian and you will see, waht anyone can see.

Willian is a winger. That's where he played almost all his carreer not only here but also in Shaktar and Corinthians. In reality in Corinthians I think he played as a left winger. We don't have any other number 10, we have players that can play there like Willian, Hazard or Fabregas but none of them is a number 10. Oscar is the only attacking player that don't have natural competition in the team.

You can think that he is a level or 2 above. Including 5. But in reality Willian was better than Oscar last season... but the one that needs to improve a lot is WIllian... not Oscar that last season was on vacations for 4 months.

[couris 232]

Still useless in attack. We need more than "workrate".

[iceman 329]

is it our Willian?

[OhForAGreavsie 5,776]

Sutton

Surely arranging those six letters in the way it's been done by zolayes in the quoted post is an automatic banning offence? If you don't get banned for that then what's the use of the rule book?

[lionsden 4,689]

Go compare the opinions of the same people about Oscar and WIllian and you will see, waht anyone can see.

Willian is a winger. That's where he played almost all his carreer not only here but also in Shaktar and Corinthians. In reality in Corinthians I think he played as a left winger. We don't have any other number 10, we have players that can play there like Willian, Hazard or Fabregas but none of them is a number 10. Oscar is the only attacking player that don't have natural competition in the team.

You can think that he is a level or 2 above. Including 5. But in reality Willian was better than Oscar last season... but the one that needs to improve a lot is WIllian... not Oscar that last season was on vacations for 4 months.

You have just exposed the hypocrisy and double standard on this forum which is sadly part of human nature. While I admitted that Oscar has shown improvement this season, he's still not this fantastic player who's miles better than Willian that everyone keeps referring to. In majority of the games this season, Willian hasn't been any worse than oscar but one thing I will say is that considering willian is so much more talented than oscar, he should be doing much better as He's arguably our most technically gifted player after Hazard.