Popular Post! The only place to be 11,313 Posted July 22, 2013 Popular Post! Share Posted July 22, 2013 Careful Choulo, you're starting to sound an awful lot like one of those Mikel-bashers you so despise! To be fair, those 'bashers' waited 200 games before starting on Mikel in some cases.Choulo has decided to bash Van Ginkel after just two pre-season matches. Personally I think the biggest problem he has with Van Ginkel is that he plays in the same position as Mikel.... kellzfresh, bababoom, The Mak and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bleed_blue 136 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 To be fair, those 'bashers' waited 200 games before starting on Mikel in some cases.Choulo has decided to bash Van Ginkel after just two pre-season matches. Personally I think the biggest problem he has with Van Ginkel is that he plays in the same position as Mikel....Nail head.Similar issues have cropped up whenever there were talks of oscar playing in a withdrawn position, luiz playing in midfield etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leif 6,006 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 He's been great.He's clearly been told to restrict his usual box-to-box duties so that there's less pressure on Essien who obviously shouldn't just be left alone to work by himself on the pitch after his injuries, and when paired with Ramires we all know which one is going to be used in the B2B role! They can't both go forward and leave acres of space behind! This is why he's opting for holding his ground at the moment, making the more simple passes (which in fairness we were actually missing last season) and putting in defensive shifts. He does it all.I guess this is where Mikel or a new defensive midfielder (unlikely) comes in handy. Someone strong with good legs who holds their role is what's needed if we want to see this Lampard-like blueprint that is Van Ginkel. Alternatively Jose could be molding him into an Xabi Alonso type player, something he definitely has all the tools for and a bold move which would save us from splurging cash on a playmaker in the long run assuming it works out. Sometimes the very little things go unnoticed. It's the little things which Van Ginkel specialises at. yuvala 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badboy 1,526 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 There's going to be massive competition for midfield places this season. We have many players that want to play in the middle and I think we'll probably have a double pivot this season meaning there's 2 slots. I don't see anyone at the moment who is a definite pick for the double pivot ! No stand out player to be honest ! Van Ginkel has a great great chance ! Despiadado.Maleante 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vybz Kartel 1,613 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 Not sure what your issue with Van ginkel's passing is, but it's been perfectly fine these last two games. Van Ginkel is also a much more complete player. Josh has magnificent passing but it takes much more than being a great passer of the ball to make it in the premier league in Josh's position. Van Ginkel may not be as good at passing, but on everything else he's ahead of Josh imo. Same as ChalobahModric and Scholes did well without being great defenders.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueLion. 21,491 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 There's going to be massive competition for midfield places this season. We have many players that want to play in the middle and I think we'll probably have a double pivot this season meaning there's 2 slots. I don't see anyone at the moment who is a definite pick for the double pivot ! No stand out player to be honest ! Van Ginkel has a great great chance !And that is only good for us. How many posts did I read last season saying Ramires/Mikel/Lampard/Benayoun weren't good enough for those positions? I honestly can't remember, they were countless! Now we have so much competition that everyone has to give it their absolute best to even get into the team, let alone hold the place down. Badboy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Skipper 20,609 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 If we don't sign another midfielder this summer then Jose is trust Marco a lot, and I'm fine with that.Like I said when we signed him before, a lot of you will be surprised by his maturity on the pitch. If Mourinho has faith in him instead of signing a De Rossi for example then I'm okay with it. Despiadado.Maleante 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheva. 5,373 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 Van Ginkel's passing has been terrible in both games. Fist he's very slow at it and often needs an extra touch or two before releasing the ball. Second, his technique is awful, meaning even when he does make the pass it is often either behind the player or difficult for him to control; meaning the receiver often has to take an extra touch which also slows down the play. Moreover, his vision is bad; he seems only to be able to make the 'obvious' pass and when a defender blocks that angle he looks unsure what to do and often goes back to defense. And finally, he seems to struggle with passes more than 15-20 meters away and often misplaces them.Lol. Hypothetically speaking, he's trying to pass to Essien, but sees an opponent right on him, so what should he do? bear in mind it's not like he has all day to make a decision, he's been pressured by the opposition. So he makes the right decision to go back to an open man instead of losing the ball - and you criticize him for this?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHOULO19 24,332 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 I would love to say something constructive, but have to say that first paragraph is just ridiculous. Either you need to rewatch both games, or you're very confused. Van Ginkel's been the midfielder who sits and has done his job perfectly fine. Nothing spectacular, but just very tidy with the odd glimpse. You said you're not passing judgement, but have already judged that his 'technique is awful' and his 'vision is bad'. I doubt you have anything against MVG, but it sure sounds like you do.....I'm not saying he did not say he wasn't decent overall. I was just highlighting his passing (in comparison to Josh's). I have nothing against Marko. In fact, I thought his movement was a little conservative at times but overall very good. I love that he always makes himself available for the pass. His defending has been exceptionally good; yes he was a bit rash with a couple of tackles but that is something that can be easily fixed. And overall he's been decent but nothing spectacular. I was just saying that his passing has been bad. It's not that every pass he played was bad, he did play some good ones, but he's showed on several occasions in the match all of the points I pointed out and if you watch the compilations of his performance, you'll see them. Anyway, like I said to Skipper, I'm not even saying that he's a bad passer, just that his passing has been bad in those two preseason matches. Personally I think the biggest problem he has with Van Ginkel is that he plays in the same position as Mikel.... Except he doesn't. Marco is a box-to-box midfielder. If anything, he'll be playing next to the DM in our midfield. Mufassir08 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHOULO19 24,332 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 Lol. Hypothetically speaking, he's trying to pass to Essien, but sees an opponent right on him, so what should he do? bear in mind it's not like he has all day to make a decision, he's been pressured by the opposition. So he makes the right decision to go back to an open man instead of losing the ball - and you criticize him for this?!If there is another open pass to Iva or Hazard or Kevin a few meters ahead, then yes, I do criticize him for going back to the keeper. My point was that he didn't look very "adaptive" in his passing. That said, I'd much rather he passes back than try to force a pass to Essien. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The only place to be 11,313 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 Except he doesn't. Marco is a box-to-box midfielder. If anything, he'll be playing next to the DM in our midfield. Except the double pivot doesn't have to just be about that dynamic you've laid out. It doesn't have to be one DM and one playmaker or box-to-box midfielder. Increasingly the trend has been for two players who are very much all-round players to share the workload of defence and attack.Either way I'm going to support this young player and not have a pop at him to fit my agenda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mufassir08 2,400 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 He is a box to box midfielder so the i dont think he'll play as CDM once mikel is back. CHOULO19 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bleed_blue 136 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 He is a box to box midfielder so the i dont think he'll play as CDM once mikel is back.nice bit of back patting going on between choulo19 and mufassir.If your team loses more games when you start, your team concedes more goals when you start then I am afraid that CDM tag is a bit of a misnomer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bir_CFC 3,455 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 While I think he has the tools to succeed this very season, I just hope it isn't to soon for him. Even a great talent like Oscar struggled in the PL.All the best to him because I do like the look of him. dee25 and Stingray 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dee25 1,044 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 Choulo has decided to bash Van Ginkel after just two pre-season matches. Personally I think the biggest problem he has with Van Ginkel is that he plays in the same position as Mikel....Oh is that it? Because I'm seriously scratching my head here wondering what the hell is going on. The kid is 20 and has only played two preseason friendlies for us. Granted, he hasn't been the stand out player but how anyone can sit there and say (with so much certainty) that "he's vision is bad" is bewildering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mak 4,459 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 To be fair, those 'bashers' waited 200 games before starting on Mikel in some cases.Choulo has decided to bash Van Ginkel after just two pre-season matches. Personally I think the biggest problem he has with Van Ginkel is that he plays in the same position as Mikel....I didn't want to say it in those terms, but yes, I agree! The only place to be 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moros 86 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 There's nothing wrong with his vision from what I've seen him play in the Eredivisie. Of course it's probably the division where you get most space and time to do as you please. It's just the first two games he has played in pre-season, player of the level as Hazard are clearly not yet doing what they can and loosing the ball to often or not creating as much yet. And the latter had a year to learn to know the players he's playing with. Van Ginkel has vision and talent he just isn't that far yet, he's a bit unpolished, raw and undeveloped. Personally I would have given him a year on loan in a club between the level of Vitesse and Chelsea as a stepping stone. There's a big gap between both clubs you know. He's a bit like KDB two years ago, a lot of potential and a bright future but not ready yet. At least that's my opinion. I'll support him regardless and I'm quite confident he'll make it, he just needs time. The Mak and Bir_CFC 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stingray 9,441 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 The guy had talent obviously ... I bet he will get more then his share of minutes in our pivot. I like his style, very composed! The kid can only grow. I say signing him is great long term vision! yuvala 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zolayes 14,489 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 Nail head.Similar issues have cropped up whenever there were talks of oscar playing in a withdrawn position, luiz playing in midfield etc.have this nightmare of Josh and Mikel in the pivot and fighting to avoid relegation Azpinator 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDRECHO 432 Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 I have a question about him . he can play like a No. 10 ??for example the next game -----------Essien-lampard-------- hazard----van Ginkel-----Schurrle -------------------Ba--------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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