Oscar

[Muzchap 8,966]

Before he completed 7-10 tackles per game and his pressing was visibly seen and he was everywhere on the pitch.

That's what he's lost significantly imo. He just lost all his energy and I don't see the tackles he wins to get the ball to hazard early anymore. When he's not tackling and we know he isn't as creative as mata, he then looks so average and that's exactly what is happening.

Just hope he's not carrying an injury and forcing himself through pain or something like that.

It's burn out - the guy needs a break....

Think back to the Oscar first 15-20 games of the season and now look at him...

It's nothing but our gruelling hardcore schedule.

He will come good and learn to pace himself physically and mentally.

A summer in Rio is just what he needs!!!

[bethos1 802]

Chelsea face Eden Hazard or Oscar transfer to fund swoops for "real strikers" Diego Costa and Mario Mandkuzic

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/footba...hazard-3362879

If he doesn't step it up I'd consider it to sell Oscar.

[bushman 2,043]

To sell Oscar?

Whom are you kidding? Lol

Oscar may not be built like a brick house, but he makes up for it by his skills. Where are you, those who saw Oscar before January?

Was he not playing well, then? Subsequently he died down a bit, but he must not be sold for any money.

[Reddish-Blue 2,504]

To sell Oscar?

Whom are you kidding? Lol

Oscar may not be built like a brick house, but he makes up for it by his skills. Where are you, those who saw Oscar before January?

Was he not playing well, then? Subsequently he died down a bit, but he must not be sold for any money.

He's died down more than a bit.... He's not even half the player he was before January.

I would put him next to Ramires in the below-par category in terms of recent performances

[Reddish-Blue 2,504]

I will start with the last part I balded. I don't remember I saw that either. I don't also remember having an Egyptian in a top team like Chelsea. Sorry to talk about Salah, but we came to agree about some things. That he is young, needs time and under Jose, he can be moulded into the player Jose wants. How much he succeeds depends on him and how hard he works. Now I will use that to jump to my first balded statement you made, Oscar's age. Oscar born 1991, Salah 1992. Any significant difference? Nope. I can argue that the foundation of Oscar is better than Salah's easily, but is that gap of any significance? Maybe SLIGHTLY. But the fact is Oscar can too be moulded to whatever Jose wants. His defensive game changed A LOT this season and is better than last season. Did it effect him offensively?Yes. But it is only part of a player's development curve and the tasks that Jose gives. I think him being a Brazilian is just part of the pressure he gets currently and raises expectations out of proportion. That is expected coming from the top nation in football but unrealistic at his age. I think Willian will improve if he haves that heart to fight and prove himself, but not as much as Ocar will improve if he too has that fighting heart. Simply because of the age factor. Willian style is more or less defined, but Oscar still has a few years ahead that will shape his style. I haven't seen any young Brazilians in the EPL in early development stages at AM to say he can't make it. I have seen DEVELOPED Brazilians in the EPL who were good but their DEFINED style of play did not suite the EPL. It can turn out either way, but objectively speaking, I think he has much more chances to succeed than fail in the EPL. I would rather see him (like, Salah, Schurrle, Hazard, Azpi, Zouma, Willian and other youngsters) develop slowly and steadily, than have him rise so fast and drop even quicker. Robinho, and Adriano are two examples I can think of in Brazil. There are many more I could mention around the world. They will make it. I can see it in their characters.And I am going to enjoy it as they do make it step by step .

Wasn't Mido one of the first Egyptian's to play at a relatively big EPL club (Tottenham) back in 2005/2006?

[Mohammed Seif 1,451]

True. But come on man it Spurs

[Joe Ay 66]

If Mata wasn't the answer, and now the feel is that Oscar isn't too, who then in world football can fit Mourinho's vision of a Chelsea no. 10? He needs to be able to press high and constantly run, have pace, power, and aggression, and release the ball quickly and with incision...and must be equally adept at transitioning from attack to defence and vice versa...

[bushman 2,043]

He's died down more than a bit.... He's not even half the player he was before January.

I would put him next to Ramires in the below-par category in terms of recent performances

Despite of it, just maybe Jose overworked the poor chap? Mata was benched & Jose worked him, excessively.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

I may be coming to the conclusion he isn't that much suited for English football.

I may be coming to the conclusion England is the antitheses for attacking Brazilian players. While I think it requires a lot of reality adaptation for midfielders and defenders, I think it may just not suit attacking players. It's the same old story. As Brazilians we're used to a lot of space, very big pitches and that pretty much formats the way you attack. It's like you're programmed for it. Oscar seems to be feeling more and more everything about England: bad weather on winter, lack of space, too much physicality. It may be too much about him.

I haven't come to the right conclusion yet, but I'm starting to think maybe he should have gone somewhere else and maybe English teams should stop trying to get Brazilians AMs. It seems a misfit.

Thats just wrong. He is idealy best possible #10 that Mourinho could have, but needs to fullfill his potential. I dont think he is only one who plays ''average'', the whole attack is average. Thats certainly something to do with Mourinho, because last year, our attack was more fluid. It has stagnated since Mou arrival. Defence got better, but attack, not so sure. I dont think its on Oscar to be guilty for his bad form, but also on Mourinho for 1.) not rotating him more 2.) giving him extremely big defensive duties.

I still think Oscar will improve, but definately even next year he wont be consistant. He will reach that level at age 25 or sth when he spends few full seasons in PL and completely understands his role. You have to undertand that first few months, Mou was just watching our players play and Oscar was brilliant. Then Mou (when he finaly knew his players better) started giving team very specific orders on how to play and Oscar's role got very limited.

I think Oscar, to some extent even Hazard and Willian will never realy fullfil their potential here as they might in RM, Barca, Bayern (who are all very offensive teams), but they still can become best as a team and world class individuals, should Mou give them at least a bit of freedom. As they say, once you are scoring goals for fun, defence isnt as important anymore. I remember few years ago, Bayern was in similar position, some big talents, but missing players on several areas, trying to play counter attacking football etc. Ribery needed to completely adapt to his new defensive duties and people were already moving him to big clubs in spain, england,,,,because they thought he wont realy fulfill his role in Bayern. Look what happened, few years of patience, some new players in the team and Ribery is world class winger. Oscar is different role obviously, but the point is same. Give him few years and he will definately become what everyone wants him to be; world class.

As there is a lot of talk about Mou selling Oscar/Hazard to fund striker, I think its just BS, but I realy hope we wont sell most important players; we already need 3 new starters to buy in 1st eleven, selling more players will completely reshape our 11 and we wont win nothing next year. Team needs to play together for some time, you forget that when Mou came to Chelsea (or inter) for first time, he had players in their peak, now he got half of team with bunch of young apples and oranges, required of being put in basket. When he makes complete team, when players will play together for some time, then judge whole project.

There is a great song that says what we need to do, wait:

[BlueLyon 9,359]

If Mata wasn't the answer, and now the feel is that Oscar isn't too, who then in world football can fit Mourinho's vision of a Chelsea no. 10? He needs to be able to press high and constantly run, have pace, power, and aggression, and release the ball quickly and with incision...and must be equally adept at transitioning from attack to defence and vice versa...

I think Mou idealy would have 4:3:3

--RB---CB---CB---LB--

Vidal-Matic-Gundogan

--Willian-ST-Hazard--

But for the best of development, keep it as it is, to fit Mou style, you dont only need inteligence, but also energy/stamina that comes in few seasons. Oscar will come good, he showed it already, give him time.

[BloodIsBlue 291]

I think Mou idealy would have 4:3:3

--RB---CB---CB---LB--

Vidal-Matic-Gundogan

--Willian-ST-Hazard--

But for the best of development, keep it as it is, to fit Mou style, you dont only need inteligence, but also energy/stamina that comes in few seasons. Oscar will come good, he showed it already, give him time.

[Eligius 121]

I think Mou idealy would have 4:3:3

--RB---CB---CB---LB--

Vidal-Matic-Gundogan

--Willian-ST-Hazard--

But for the best of development, keep it as it is, to fit Mou style, you dont only need inteligence, but also energy/stamina that comes in few seasons. Oscar will come good, he showed it already, give him time.

While your at it, we should replace hazard with cristiano and willian with bale and bring in cavani as well.

[Barbara 15,149]

Thats just wrong. He is idealy best possible #10 that Mourinho could have, but needs to fullfill his potential. I dont think he is only one who plays ''average'', the whole attack is average. Thats certainly something to do with Mourinho, because last year, our attack was more fluid. It has stagnated since Mou arrival. Defence got better, but attack, not so sure. I dont think its on Oscar to be guilty for his bad form, but also on Mourinho for 1.) not rotating him more 2.) giving him extremely big defensive duties.

I still think Oscar will improve, but definately even next year he wont be consistant. He will reach that level at age 25 or sth when he spends few full seasons in PL and completely understands his role. You have to undertand that first few months, Mou was just watching our players play and Oscar was brilliant. Then Mou (when he finaly knew his players better) started giving team very specific orders on how to play and Oscar's role got very limited.

I think Oscar, to some extent even Hazard and Willian will never realy fullfil their potential here as they might in RM, Barca, Bayern (who are all very offensive teams), but they still can become best as a team and world class individuals, should Mou give them at least a bit of freedom. As they say, once you are scoring goals for fun, defence isnt as important anymore. I remember few years ago, Bayern was in similar position, some big talents, but missing players on several areas, trying to play counter attacking football etc. Ribery needed to completely adapt to his new defensive duties and people were already moving him to big clubs in spain, england,,,,because they thought he wont realy fulfill his role in Bayern. Look what happened, few years of patience, some new players in the team and Ribery is world class winger. Oscar is different role obviously, but the point is same. Give him few years and he will definately become what everyone wants him to be; world class.

As there is a lot of talk about Mou selling Oscar/Hazard to fund striker, I think its just BS, but I realy hope we wont sell most important players; we already need 3 new starters to buy in 1st eleven, selling more players will completely reshape our 11 and we wont win nothing next year. Team needs to play together for some time, you forget that when Mou came to Chelsea (or inter) for first time, he had players in their peak, now he got half of team with bunch of young apples and oranges, required of being put in basket. When he makes complete team, when players will play together for some time, then judge whole project.

There is a great song that says what we need to do, wait:

very good points. My only doubt is that I don't remember Brazilian attacking players succeeding that, so maybe the style is overwhelming to them. Maybe not. Brazilians aren't that much common in England to start with and the few there are more often than not defenders or pivot midfielders. Robinho was a flop (there and everywhere else), Anderson isn't an attacking player, nor is Lucas. Rafael is a defender, currently there are again tons of pivot players (in addition to those two, Sandro, Fernandinho, Paulinho, etc) we had a few defenders like Alex, Belletti but the only AM that comes to mind is Robinho and nothing should be said about him.

I don't maybe the style takes too much away from their qualities. You just can't compare Oscar playing for NT and for Chelsea and I don't believe at all he has motivation issues like some believe Luiz has. It seems just that the winter sucks the life of him and he ran out of gas. Maybe for match accumulation or maybe just because it's too much for him to handle. Willian doesn't look much better, despite being on his peak age already (although still transitioning).

As I said it was only a thought, maybe it's not only about those players succeeding in Spain, Italy, Portugal, France, Germany more than in England, but about England really taking away from their quality because of the style. Brazilians aren't much physical in general, but even less so attacking players. They're light, work better with a lot of space and even is Oscar himself isn't the exact profile of a Brazilian attacking player, he suffers just the same.

I'm willing to wait, I'm more than willing to wait. Oscar is one of my fave players in the world and I love the boy too much. I've always been a fan of his since he was at Inter and even Sao Paulo (a team I hate). So I want him to succeed here a lot, but I also want him to fulfill his potential and live up the expectations, maybe English football will kill his career as I think it may be killing Mata's... I worry about Chelsea and I worry about Oscar. I have no doubt this kid has potential to be one of the very best players of his generation, but if he's not what we need, if he can't offer what we need from him because he can't overcome the difficulties playing in England presents to him... then what's the point of keeping him? But I wouldn't jump to that conclusion now. I'd wait more a year, if not two. I want it to work, but there's a possibility among many, of it not working for him or even other Brazilians. Brazilian footie is almost symmetrically the opposite of English football. Polar opposites.

But I'm not writing him off as many do. I'm not thinking he isn't talented as many do. I'm not losing my patience with him as many do. I'm just pondering about what could be a deeper problem. But like Hazard he's very young, even younger, it's nearly idiotic not to wait a little bit more.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

While your at it, we should replace hazard with cristiano and willian with bale and bring in cavani as well.

hah, I didnt mean we should get those or even think we have any realistic chance of getting them, but just point out what type of players Mou would idealy want in his team. With no real #10, but Gundogan type player instead...

And Eligius, read this again, if you missed it:

''But for the best of development, keep it as it is, to fit Mou style, you dont only need inteligence, but also energy/stamina that comes in few seasons. Oscar will come good, he showed it already, give him time.''

No need for sarcasm...

[BlueLyon 9,359]

very good points. My only doubt is that I don't remember Brazilian attacking players succeeding that, so maybe the style is overwhelming to them. Maybe not. Brazilians aren't that much common in England to start with and the few there are more often than not defenders or pivot midfielders. Robinho was a flop (there and everywhere else), Anderson isn't an attacking player, nor is Lucas. Rafael is a defender, currently there are again tons of pivot players (in addition to those two, Sandro, Fernandinho, Paulinho, etc) we had a few defenders like Alex, Belletti but the only AM that comes to mind is Robinho and nothing should be said about him.

I don't maybe the style takes too much away from their qualities. You just can't compare Oscar playing for NT and for Chelsea and I don't believe at all he has motivation issues like some believe Luiz has. It seems just that the winter sucks the life of him and he ran out of gas. Maybe for match accumulation or maybe just because it's too much for him to handle. Willian doesn't look much better, despite being on his peak age already (although still transitioning).

As I said it was only a thought, maybe it's not only about those players succeeding in Spain, Italy, Portugal, France, Germany more than in England, but about England really taking away from their quality because of the style. Brazilians aren't much physical in general, but even less so attacking players. They're light, work better with a lot of space and even is Oscar himself isn't the exact profile of a Brazilian attacking player, he suffers just the same.

I'm willing to wait, I'm more than willing to wait. Oscar is one of my fave players in the world and I love the boy too much. I've always been a fan of his since he was at Inter and even Sao Paulo (a team I hate). So I want him to succeed here a lot, but I also want him to fulfill his potential and live up the expectations, maybe English football will kill his career as I think it may be killing Mata's... I worry about Chelsea and I worry about Oscar. I have no doubt this kid has potential to be one of the very best players of his generation, but if he's not what we need, if he can't offer what we need from him because he can't overcome the difficulties playing in England presents to him... then what's the point of keeping him? But I wouldn't jump to that conclusion now. I'd wait more a year, if not two. I want it to work, but there's a possibility among many, of it not working for him or even other Brazilians. Brazilian footie is almost symmetrically the opposite of English football. Polar opposites.

But I'm not writing him off as many do. I'm not thinking he isn't talented as many do. I'm not losing my patience with him as many do. I'm just pondering about what could be a deeper problem. But like Hazard he's very young, even younger, it's nearly idiotic not to wait a little bit more.

Yup, only one thing to add; there is Coutinho who is doing pretty well this season IMO.