🇧🇪 Eden Hazard

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

1 minute ago, MrExcalibur100 said:

Saying Hazard has been extremely poor in the last 2 seasons isn't criticism. It's just trolling. But i'll live it to him to continue yapping his mouth here. His quest for attention won't last long because:

(1) Hazard won't continue to play poorly

(2) Hazard will probably leave at the end of the season.

Then @OneMoSalah will have nothing of value to contribute to this forum anymore. Once decent posters falling off the deep end to mediocrity. 

Last two seasons? Fuck me. This season and then the one with Jose/Guus. I think your at the trolling now pal.

Quest for attention? Get off your high horse I’ve seen some of your other posts in various threads. People in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones. I’ll leave it at that because I’ve made my point and if you don’t agree I couldn’t really give a fuck.

[Tomo 21,751]

I don't think i have ever seen a set of fans have such a special player and try and downplay them this way, it's really bizzare.

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

Just now, OneMoSalah said:

Last two seasons? Fuck me. This season and then the one with Jose/Guus. I think your at the trolling now pal.

Quest for attention? Get off your high horse I’ve seen some of your other posts in various threads. People in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones. I’ll leave it at that because I’ve made my point and if you don’t agree I couldn’t really give a fuck.

This season he has 15 goals and 10 assists, is our leading goalscorer (his 2nd highest goal tally at this stage of the season for us), our 3rd highest assists getter, our biggest chance creator, our highest rated player on all footballing metric sites and so on. And doing all that after recovering from a broken ankle without a preseason. Most reasonable CFC fans will say he's been pretty good this season. 

But I'm not surprised you think otherwise since most of your posts these days have descended to "HAHAHAA I told you so" codswallop on the Hazard thread. You've fallen off badly. 

[Superblue 6,372]

Just now, MrExcalibur100 said:

So what if Willian played better in those 3 games you mentioned? Why not compare all the big games both players have played in their CFC careers instead of trying to juxtapose all of Hazard's career into last few games. In some of those game you mentioned he was played out of position. This is ridiculous. The last few games are not a microcosm of what Hazard has shown in the past and its definitely not a microcosm of Willian's performances in big games.  

The evidence of Hazard's entire career suggests he definitely steps up in the big games when at least the team plays to a minimally acceptable level. To casual fans I guess you're only as good as your last few games. 

I'm not comparing, I'm merely making a point with regards to your weak excuse that the Nou Camp is 'too hard' for Hazard to perform in. 

I haven't once said that Hazard never performs in big games, but you said in an earlier post that bar Drogba he is the best big game player we've ever had. He is way too inconsistent. For every excellent game, he has a very poor game against big teams and this isn't just over the last few weeks, this is throughout his Chelsea career. But apparently supporting Chelsea since the very early 90's I'm a 'casual fan' so my opinion isn't acceptable.

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

2 minutes ago, Tomo said:

I don't think i have ever seen a set of fans have such a special player and try and downplay them this way, it's really bizzare.

Don't mind them. By the time he's gone these people will recognize how average we are and how much work needs to be done to rebuild this team. Hazard (and Kante) have helped paper over the cracks for 2 years now. 

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

6 minutes ago, Superblue_1986 said:

I'm not comparing, I'm merely making a point with regards to your weak excuse that the Nou Camp is 'too hard' for Hazard to perform in. 

I haven't once said that Hazard never performs in big games, but you said in an earlier post that bar Drogba he is the best big game player we've ever had. He is way too inconsistent. For every excellent game, he has a very poor game against big teams and this isn't just over the last few weeks, this is throughout his Chelsea career. But apparently supporting Chelsea since the very early 90's I'm a 'casual fan' so my opinion isn't acceptable.

Hazard is not inconsistent at all. He's been handsdown our most consistent attacking player since 2013. You can't do it. I challenge you to name an attacking player within that time period that has been more consistent. This is this vapid criticism that was only valid in 2012, Hazard's 1st season here. 

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

2 minutes ago, Tomo said:

I don't think i have ever seen a set of fans have such a special player and try and downplay them this way, it's really bizzare.

But really though? The most crucial part of our season in terms of the CL race, double leg ties with Barca, big games vs City, United, Spurs... he’s not shown up and looks disinterested. That’s what my point is. Along with various other players although they receive the criticism. Our season has nose dived since the turn of the year and Hazard’s form is a huge reason why. It happened that year Jose got sacked he went completely anonymous. If he goes in the summer he goes, having done well here but for me I just feel he still could of done more. 

 

2 minutes ago, MrExcalibur100 said:

This season he has 15 goals and 10 assists, is our leading goalscorer (his 2nd highest goal tally at this stage of the season for us), our 3rd highest assists getter, our biggest chance creator, our highest rated player on all footballing metric sites and so on. And doing all that after recovering from a broken ankle without a preseason. Most reasonable CFC fans will say he's been pretty good this season. 

But I'm not surprised you think otherwise since most of your posts these days have descended to "HAHAHAA I told you so" codswallop on the Hazard thread. You've fallen off badly. 

Let’s just say in the most crucial part of the season then he has done a vanishing act. How many of his goals and assists came before 2018? I bet a lot of them did.

[Superblue 6,372]

2 minutes ago, MrExcalibur100 said:

Hazard is not inconsistent at all. He's been handsdown our most consistent attacking player since 2013. I challenge you to name an attacking player within that time period that has been more consistent. This is this vapid criticism that was only valid in 2012, Hazard's 1st season here. 

You're right, he has been our most consistent attacking player and I have actually put in my posts that he is our best player and most naturally gifted player by some distance. But being OUR most consistent attacking player does not mean that he doesn't suffer inconsistency, particularly when we will finish outside the top 4 twice in the last 3 seasons.

The main thing I said in my first post before you jumped down my throat is that there are a number of big games I come away from wanting more from him and I stand by that. I didn't say every big game, but there have been more than enough. It is being highlighted recently too because we've had a boatload of big games in recent weeks and he's failed to step up when we've desperately needed him to. I can understand that he's played as a false 9 against Barca at home and City but he's played in a more favourable position against Barca away, United and Spurs and been poor in all of them.

The problem is on this forum is that Hazard, for some, is immune to criticism. He's a brilliant player, I'm not saying he's rubbish but you rarely get a 6 or 7/10 performance with Hazard. He is either 8-9/10 or 4-5/10 and that includes his record in big games too.

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

4 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

But really though? The most crucial part of our season in terms of the CL race, double leg ties with Barca, big games vs City, United, Spurs... he’s not shown up and looks disinterested. That’s what my point is. Along with various other players although they receive the criticism. Our season has nose dived since the turn of the year and Hazard’s form is a huge reason why. It happened that year Jose got sacked he went completely anonymous. If he goes in the summer he goes, having done well here but for me I just feel he still could of done more. 

 

Let’s just say in the most crucial part of the season then he has done a vanishing act. How many of his goals and assists came before 2018? I bet a lot of them did.

As you can see Hazard's form hasn't nose-dived since 2018 only since the City game when he was humiliated by Conte and made to look stupid:

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/33404/Fixtures/Eden-Hazard  (Of his 15 goals almost half of them have come in 2018.)

Hazard was poor at the Nou Camp but its hard to criticize him for the home game considering he spent more time trying to win headers vs Pique than with the ball to feet. I can't blame him for City as well for similar reasons. Hazard didn't even play so poor today, he was just too deep worrying about Son and when he got the ball in dangerous positions they did a good job of crowding him out. Alonso doesn't offer the right penetration or speed on the left side to distract teams with his runs into the box.

Anyway I'm done schooling you for now. I won't waste my time on you again as its clear you know little about Hazard or football in general.  

 

 

[Tomo 21,751]

6 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

But really though? The most crucial part of our season in terms of the CL race, double leg ties with Barca, big games vs City, United, Spurs... he’s not shown up and looks disinterested. That’s what my point is. Along with various other players although they receive the criticism. Our season has nose dived since the turn of the year and Hazard’s form is a huge reason why. It happened that year Jose got sacked he went completely anonymous. If he goes in the summer he goes, having done well here but for me I just feel he still could of done more. 

 

Let’s just say in the most crucial part of the season then he has done a vanishing act. How many of his goals and assists came before 2018? I bet a lot of them did.

You can list big games all our previous/current players have been quiet in in the past, even Drogba. Eden still created more chances today than the rest of our team put together, even in the Jose meltdown period when he was supposedly anonymous he was in the top 10 for chances created. He very rarely actually has genuine shite games, even when he's quiet for his standards he is still being productive, as that stat about today shows.

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

7 minutes ago, Superblue_1986 said:

You're right, he has been our most consistent attacking player and I have actually put in my posts that he is our best player and most naturally gifted player by some distance. But being OUR most consistent attacking player does not mean that he doesn't suffer inconsistency, particularly when we will finish outside the top 4 twice in the last 3 seasons.

The main thing I said in my first post before you jumped down my throat is that there are a number of big games I come away from wanting more from him and I stand by that. I didn't say every big game, but there have been more than enough. It is being highlighted recently too because we've had a boatload of big games in recent weeks and he's failed to step up when we've desperately needed him to. I can understand that he's played as a false 9 against Barca at home and City but he's played in a more favourable position against Barca away, United and Spurs and been poor in all of them.

The problem is on this forum is that Hazard, for some, is immune to criticism. He's a brilliant player, I'm not saying he's rubbish but you rarely get a 6 or 7/10 performance with Hazard. He is either 8-9/10 or 4-5/10 and that includes his record in big games too.

So let's focus on one thing at a time. 

(first bolded part)

Do you really think the bolded parts have less to do with Hazard and more to do with the quality of team, investment in the team and the defensive tactics of his manager(s) in such games. It's obvious to me what the problem is.

(second bolded part)

Most of Hazard's best big game performances either come at home or against teams that play a similar brand of football to us. The reason is that in any one of these 2 scenarios Hazard generally sees more of the ball and can thus have a greater influence on the game (with notable exceptions being City and Barcelona because of just how dominant those teams are in possession). If you take that into consideration Hazard drops a minumum of 7.5-8.0/10 in most big games he plays

And if you were referring to all his games in general then you're totally wrong. Weaintgotnohistory.com do a player of the match poll after every game and if I could locate their yearly summation somewhere you can see there is a great stability in Hazard's performances. It's mostly 7.5's and above 85% of a 38 game season. 

 

[MrExcalibur100 7,124]

6 minutes ago, Tomo said:

You can list big games all our previous/current players have been quiet in in the past, even Drogba. Eden still created more chances today than the rest of our team put together, even in the Jose meltdown period when he was supposedly anonymous he was in the top 10 for chances created. He very rarely actually has genuine shite games, even when he's quiet for his standards he is still being productive, as that stat about today shows.

And even Lampard. Drogba took an entire season off because he didn't see eye to eye with Scolari but no one cares about that anymore. We can't continue to hold Hazard to absurd standards when he doesn't even have anything near to the proper platform to ever live up to them. There's way to much hyper criticism and hyper analysis. "Oh why didn't Hazard play well in game "x" and "y". Reading some of this stuff you'll think this guy was playing for Brazil 1970 or Guardiola's Barca. This is far from the case. We're not even on Liverpool or Spurs' level footballing philosophy or/and playing style wise 

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,920]

This is as active as any thread has been on this forum all year.

[Superblue 6,372]

3 minutes ago, MrExcalibur100 said:

So let's focus on one thing at a time. 

(first bolded part)

Do you really think the bolded parts have less to do with Hazard and more to do with the quality of team, investment in the team and the defensive tactics of his manager(s) in such games. It's obvious to me what the problem is.

(second bolded part)

Most of Hazard's best big game performances either come at home or against teams that play a similar brand of football to us. The reason is that in any one of these 2 scenarios Hazard generally sees more of the ball and can thus have a greater influence on the game (with notable exceptions being City and Barcelona because of just how dominant those teams are in possession). If you take that into consideration Hazard drops a minumum of 7.5-8.0/10 in most big games he plays

And if you were referring to all his games in general then you're totally wrong. 

 

I actually think that is is both. He is obviously hindered when we play defensively and I'll be one of the first to question our buys in recent seasons, but I also believe that Hazard doesn't have the ruthless mentality that separates the very good players from the truly great players. There have been games where things aren't happening for him and he gives off the impression that he accepts that too. 

As I've said multiple times (because I'm actually trying to work in between this) - he has been a fantastic servant to our club, and he is a wonderful player and one of the most naturally gifted that I've seen. I'm not knocking that and he can hold up his Chelsea record against the vast majority that have played here, but the biggest problem with this forum is that if anybody dares criticise him they never hear the end of it, and at the very least he must be open to criticism in recent weeks because his performances when we've needed him the most, have been nowhere near the standard he is capable of.

[LukakutoStamford 779]

2 hours ago, Sir Mikel OBE said:

This is as active as any thread has been on this forum all year.

That’s because there are absolute weapons posting

[ccheongf 211]

Its time to CASH in on Hazard. His performance is not going to improve anymore. At least 6 of the current team got to be ship out. Conte is playing asking to be sacked. Dnt think his heart is at Chelsea anymore, since his views are not with the board of Chelsea anymore. Time to bring in youths from the academy and give them chance to shine. What do you get from buying BAKO at 40 plus million pound ?????

[Alabama 1,992]

Is he gone? Please just sell him and let him go enjoy his football somewhere else... Posters thinking without Hazard we will be in 18th or 19th position...cash on him and reinvest d money on a more ruthless attacking player....

[sutro 1,026]

Instead of getting to his so called "prime " years  i got the feeling that he's already declining.

[Superblue 6,372]

2 hours ago, Mana said:

Had to be “since Aug 2016”. Also that tweet is old. Jan this year. Aguero, Kane, Mane, Sane definitely at least bettered or equalled Hazard's record now, and after Dele's double against us - Dele is above Hazard.

Anyway, how many goals did he score against a top 6 side this season?

...1. Against Arsenal. From a pen.

Willian scored way more than him this season against top 6. Even Alonso as well.

Hazard defenders here are getting a little bit over their heads now.

How can you continue to say positive things about Hazard when he has poor game after game - especially against Spuds when he didn’t turn up?? He goes missing for the majority of the game against any big side this season! (Whoops, sorry except Atletico I guess)

If Hazard is a legend, to me he is much as a legend as... Willian. Or Costa if he didn’t leave us.

He is nowhere NEAR the legendary status as Drogba, JT, Cole, Zola or even Lampard’s.

I agree with a couple of the points but I do think that's going completely the other way now to be honest. Hazard has given much more of his career than Willian and Costa and as I was trying to make the point last night, he has been a big player for us and was very instrumental in the two recent title wins. His record holds up against most other Chelsea players and for me, he will go down as a legend.

It's the constant barracking people receive on here if they openly criticise Hazard. For me, he does have issues with consistency because he can quite easily go a month or two with near constant unplayable performances, followed by a few weeks where he is quiet and anonymous at times. In recent weeks we've needed him more than ever and he's failed to step up and kick on and I do think that should leave him open to criticism and questions being asked. Having your Chelsea allegiance questioned or being labelled a 'casual fan' I think is quite frankly pathetic and out of order.

Everybody who posts on this forum has something to say about Chelsea and are entitled to their opinion whether others agree or not. Despite what some would like to think, peoples opinions on any player are exactly that - opinions, not facts and should be treated as respectfully as possible as a result.

[Superblue 6,372]

1 minute ago, Mana said:

Very instrumental? I think Costa was very instrumental in our recent title wins as well, without his goals we wouldn't have won those titles.

Hazard came at 2012, Costa came at 2015. The only trophy Costa missed out with Hazard was the Europa League trophy.

Thats why I said if Costa didn't leave us, he is as big as a legend as Hazard. Costa was very involved in all our recent trophy wins too. If Hazard leaves for Madrid next season, Costa = Hazard in terms of legendary status to me. He didn't provide anything extra against Costa bar having the advantage of staying longer.

Purely based on trophies I can't argue with you. Hazard was also injured in the Europa League final and missed it too.

However those three years, Hazard has still produced a number of match winning performances in that time period prior to Costa and had a more than reasonable goal and assist output during that time. That extra longevity needs to be considered and whilst there may be this media flirting with Real Madrid that all the Belgian's seem to love to do, he has shown far more commitment than Costa who openly wanted to leave pretty much as soon as he walked through the door.

But it is where a balance needs to be with regards to Hazard. He can't be blamed solely for not winning trophies in some of those seasons, otherwise it could be argued that Zola wasn't as much of a legend as he didn't win the major trophies that Hazard or Costa have and he is an obvious legend. He has at times had to play with a standard of players below his level and put in match winning performances to pull us through. But on the flip side he has to be questioned when he's not performing in important games where we've needed him to step up. That has been the case recently and rightfully should be questioned as a result. Has he checked out already? Is he playing within himself before the World Cup? Has he decided to not play for Conte anymore? Is he happy to see someone like Willian putting in some big performances lately and decided he doesn't need to step up as a result?