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Captain Ahmed

9. Tammy Abraham

Started by Captain Ahmed,

1,405 posts in this topic
On 13/07/2020 at 10:40 AM, Mana said:

Yep he hasn’t. Abraham could be a one season wonder. 11 goals scored during his purple patch. Did Kane ask for a pay rise immediately after getting in the first team?

Eh no, asking just for more money is not a mercenary, that’s not being said here. This is about Abraham having the cheek, for his poor performances to ask for 130k or more, which sucks more money out of our club - which could lead to more performances like these.

As I said earlier I don’t mind if Abraham asked for a slight pay rise. Even if £100k I will swallow. But 130k or more? Feck out of here! We can use that money for things better. Improve first, then we will quickly renew your contract with a higher wage ASAP.

Slow down we haven’t got Havertz yet. It’s all rumours. We don’t know exactly how much money we have spent on Kai.

Also you do know Chelsea had money in the bank before the Hazard money right? (even though we suffered a major loss due to us being in the Europa League that year) We couldn’t buy anybody last season because of the ban. Don’t forget about our player loans plays a huge part of our income.

Well CHO not so much now with that big wage of his (and it’s only going to get way bigger in his next renewal)
 

Look, IF we get top 4, I like to thank them for their service. The players you just listed I don’t have any huge problems with (bar CHO) regarding money at the very least. They are good enough as backups anyway. 

But these players becoming our main players will not help us compete with Liverpool and City. Even United next season. We need BETTER.
 

Gilmour, Tomori and maybe RLC I am willing to give them another chance in the starting XI for next season.

In the season Kane played regularly at Spurs they renewed his contract in February, on improved terms. They have had a wage structure in place which suited them better because they didnt have consist revenue and bonuses from the CL which they have done for a while now. 

Lets not forget that regardless of what you, me or anyone thinks of Tammy he is in a position where he can ask for these wages. Firstly because he will probably point to his goals this season and go well without them where would we be? Which for me they have been absolutely vital in some games and I would hate to think if we would even be in the top 6 or 8 without them because conversion has been a problem as much as anything this season and as badly as Tammy is playing and as good as Giroud is doing, Giroud has always been a streaky player throughout his career. You cannot count on him to score every week but then he will go on a run for 5 or 6 games before going back to the same inconsistent streaky form.

Secondly what he has done this season, particularly up to December warrants a similar deal to what Callum got based on the fact we gave in and gave somebody who really was in a position to negotiate favourably for himself in the long run despite having done nothing of real note. If you cannot see that is why Tammy is asking for a pay packet more in line with these figures and maybe other senior players around the club, then I do not know. Lets not forget the club went to him after the start of the season where he had been scoring for fun to discuss new terms, what did they expect? I dont get your point about you'd be willing to grudgingly accept giving him 100k a week but not 30k more? Its just incredibly stupid in my opinion because in terms of the club and the money they have another 30k a week is hardly a huge hit when you consider the wages Luiz and Gaz freed up leaving, what Willian and Pedro will free up leaving, what some of the loan players who are sold will free up.... its not a huge difference in the eyes of a club of Chelsea’s stature and even then this scenario is what we have created giving Hudson Odoi, Drinkwater, Barkley near 100k+ a week or Baba Rahman who’s played maybe 10 games in 5 years and is apparently on over 80k a week. You cannot say that Tammy hasnt done more than those guys in half a season than what they have done throughout their entire careers here?

Thirdly this wouldnt be Abrahams first contract extension here. It would be his 2nd. Since signing the first one he has scored 50 goals. It may be at different levels but the progressions clearly there and despite his struggles since 2020 started, lets be honest who hasnt struggled bar Pulisic, its not uncommon for younger CFs to struggle with consistency yet alone championship players who make the jump to a top 10 team, never mind a team competing for third or forth. He was never going to be a top top player in my eyes or he might never reach the levels of a Drogba or Aguero or Torres at Liverpool but he has surprised me this season at the beginning and will probably surprise us again next season at some point.

I mean I get the whole pay quality for quality but you also have to reward people who have been key to the cause when you review this season. Its like a business, do you think they dont give bonuses or pay rises to people who have done well over a period of time?

I get the clamouring for Kai Havertz but if you think that saving 30k a week over the duration of a 4 or 5 year contract is going to make a huge difference in the longrun when we have just given Werner a 200k a week deal, Ziyech a 100k a week deal, allegedly we will offer Havertz 200k a week as well... again, they may be quality players but whats to stop us saying 6 months down the line it was far too much either the fee or wages? Like with Kepa? Or Tammy wanting these wages? Or Callums wages that have added more expectation to what he should be capable of for me as it is a huge pay compared to Tomori, Mount, Abrahams current contract and a collection of first team players. Football fans are as fickle as anything else these days and it is true for all of us who support whatever team, it is the truth. Kepa could have had a blinder this season but someone would say he still isn’t worth 71mn. Someone could say CHO isnt worth that wages even if he scored 20 goals this season. 

As much as youd want to see more consistency from Mount, Tomori, James and Tammy lets not forget they were all Championship players last year. Its not their performances that have cost us as deeply this season as much as anything. The senior heads have been equally as inconsistent and the coaching hasnt been fantastic either in the defensive side of things. 

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13 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

I get the clamouring for Kai Havertz but if you think that saving 30k a week over the duration of a 4 or 5 year contract is going to make a huge difference in the longrun when we have just given Werner a 200k a week deal, Ziyech a 100k a week deal, allegedly we will offer Havertz 200k a week as well... again, they may be quality players but whats to stop us saying 6 months down the line it was far too much either the fee or wages? Like with Kepa? Or Tammy wanting these wages? Or Callums wages that have added more expectation to what he should be capable of for me as it is a huge pay compared to Tomori, Mount, Abrahams current contract and a collection of first team players. Football fans are as fickle as anything else these days and it is true for all of us who support whatever team, it is the truth. Kepa could have had a blinder this season but someone would say he still isn’t worth 71mn. Someone could say CHO isnt worth that wages even if he scored 20 goals this season. 

As much as youd want to see more consistency from Mount, Tomori, James and Tammy lets not forget they were all Championship players last year. Its not their performances that have cost us as deeply this season as much as anything. The senior heads have been equally as inconsistent and the coaching hasnt been fantastic either in the defensive side of things. 

I will be very surprised if Ziyech is on £100k a week. Him being Ajax POTS and been one of their top players in domestic and Europe, and likely to be a key player here, he defo would be requesting more than that. Kepa came on what £190k p/w. Ziyech came for a much smaller fee, so you would think he would demand much higher wages. That is the kind of wages we give to our young players who have broke through. For the players who are more experienced like Ziyech, I would think the starting point is £150k p/w. That means he would be on less wages than Hudson-Odoi and roughly on same wages as Reece James. Pulisic is on about £150k p/w too.

If that is Ziyech wages, then he is really generous :D

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21 minutes ago, Stats said:

I will be very surprised if Ziyech is on £100k a week. Him being Ajax POTS and been one of their top players in domestic and Europe, and likely to be a key player here, he defo would be requesting more than that. Kepa came on what £190k p/w. Ziyech came for a much smaller fee, so you would think he would demand much higher wages. That is the kind of wages we give to our young players who have broke through. For the players who are more experienced like Ziyech, I would think the starting point is £150k p/w. That means he would be on less wages than Hudson-Odoi and roughly on same wages as Reece James. Pulisic is on about £150k p/w too.

If that is Ziyech wages, then he is really generous :D

Just going by what was reported by several

papers. 
 

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I know he only came on for 10 minutes (plus 6 added), but within those minutes I forgot he was on the pitch.

This is such a constant thing with him now. 2020 Abraham is a massive drop off from the 2019 Abraham.

Abraham should be better or on par with aging Giroud, but it’s clear he is far from that.

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5 hours ago, Mana said:

Abraham should be better or on par with aging Giroud, but it’s clear he is far from that.

To be fair Giroud has been excellent, especially since the restart.

Always liked Giroud, even when he was at Arsenal.

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1 minute ago, Jype said:

To be fair, Giroud has been excellent especially since the restart.

Always liked Giroud, even when he was at Arsenal.

He has been decent even before the restart. Which baffles me why we were trying to force him out last January. Thank the heavens that didn't come to fruition.

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12 hours ago, Mana said:

I know he only came on for 10 minutes (plus 6 added), but within those minutes I forgot he was on the pitch.

This is such a constant thing with him now. 2020 Abraham is a massive drop off from the 2019 Abraham.

Abraham should be better or on par with aging Giroud, but it’s clear he is far from that.

Tbf in a cup semi when your 3-1 up and comfortable I don’t know what you expect. I thought his link up play was actually decent enough when he came on. Never really got any shooting chances when he came on but the game was settled.

I think next season with a bit of time off he will come back and ready to do better. He will have to with the arrival of Timo Werner.

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13 hours ago, Mana said:

I know he only came on for 10 minutes (plus 6 added), but within those minutes I forgot he was on the pitch.

This is such a constant thing with him now. 2020 Abraham is a massive drop off from the 2019 Abraham.

Abraham should be better or on par with aging Giroud, but it’s clear he is far from that.

Closed United down, ran his heart out in 10 mins. The same ten minutes where we were only looking to close out the game rather than extend the 3-0 lead, so obviously had very less of the ball. 

Even in that he played that wonderful 1-2 with CHO down the wing which ultimately led to Tammy releasing CHO. 

But let all of that not interfere with your agenda.

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1 hour ago, OneMoSalah said:

Tbf in a cup semi when your 3-1 up and comfortable I don’t know what you expect. I thought his link up play was actually decent enough when he came on. Never really got any shooting chances when he came on but the game was settled.

I think next season with a bit of time off he will come back and ready to do better. He will have to with the arrival of Timo Werner.

 

I agree his link up play was decent, but yeah that's about it.

36 minutes ago, Puliiszola said:

Closed United down, ran his heart out in 10 mins.

This is sort of a lie. Maguire and Lindelof dealt with him most part in attacking areas.

Quote

The same ten minutes where we were only looking to close out the game rather than extend the 3-0 lead, so obviously had very less of the ball. 

Even in that he played that wonderful 1-2 with CHO down the wing which ultimately led to Tammy releasing CHO. 

 

That 1-2 is practically the only thing he has done though apart from doing safe passes. He didn't win any fouls either, he's just 'there'.

My question is, when are we going to see Abraham at his best again? Next season?

Quote

But let all of that not interfere with your agenda.

Lol.

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2 hours ago, Mana said:

 

This is sort of a lie. Maguire and Lindelof dealt with him most part in attacking areas.

What? I said, he closed them down. To which your reply is this, that United defenders "dealt with him". Well, it makes perfect sense.

 

2 hours ago, Mana said:

That 1-2 is practically the only thing he has done though apart from doing safe passes. He didn't win any fouls either, he's just 'there'.

My question is, when are we going to see Abraham at his best again? Next season?

Lol.

That 1-2 was probably the only time we had the ball or tried to play forward.  Again, can you get me the possession stats from the last 10 mins.

Given that he is going through a dry spell which even the likes of lacazette go through. And that Giroud is olaying well, and Tammy is down to sub appearances, then yes, we will get to see the best of him next season. If he can get another 15 goals next season as a 2nd striker, then it will be "ANoTHER" successful season, just like this one 

 

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I want to see him loaned out again, that long injury layoff has taken it's toll, he's nowhere EPL quality atm let him go to a Championship he's no better than that.

Then i want us to try to get a top quality striker, 'cos apart from a CB and a LB/LWB, it's what we need

 

 

 

 

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28 minutes ago, bigbluewillie said:

I want to see him loaned out again, that long injury layoff has taken it's toll, he's nowhere EPL quality atm let him go to a Championship he's no better than that.

Then i want us to try to get a top quality striker, 'cos apart from a CB and a LB/LWB, it's what we need

I feel we need to keep Tammy, loan wouldnt help at this time with we already revamping big time and a decent striker would cost big... Giroud and Batshui would be gone. With Wener in there will be competition for places and that will tell if Tammy has the ambitious to fight for his place. If yes, then with the new 5 subs rules we have a great headache on our hands .... If not then we can sell him next season. 

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Just now, coolhead23 said:

I feel we need to keep Tammy, loan wouldnt help at this time with we already revamping big time and a decent striker would cost big... Giroud and Batshui would be gone. With Wener in there will be competition for places and that will tell if Tammy has the ambitious to fight for his place. If yes, then with the new 5 subs rules we have a great headache on our hands .... If not then we can sell him next season. 

We will still have Giroud for next season.

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Just now, Jason said:

We will still have Giroud for next season.

I doubt ... feel he would move but if he doesnt then great ... more the merrier and more competition within that position ... feel it is win-win both ways

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1 minute ago, coolhead23 said:

I doubt ... feel he would move but if he doesnt then great ... more the merrier and more competition within that position ... feel it is win-win both ways

He signed a new 1-year deal recently and from our perspective, it makes no sense to sell him even with Werner coming in. 

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3 minutes ago, Jason said:

He signed a new 1-year deal recently and from our perspective, it makes no sense to sell him even with Werner coming in. 

Let see, not saying we will sell him it would be more if he wants to continue with 2 other strikers  ... 1 year deal could be to safeguard our asset ... Like i mention the more the merrier

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16 hours ago, Mana said:

He has been decent even before the restart. Which baffles me why we were trying to force him out last January. Thank the heavens that didn't come to fruition.

and also WHY was Lamps trotting out Batshit over him before???????

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1 hour ago, bigbluewillie said:

I want to see him loaned out again, that long injury layoff has taken it's toll, he's nowhere EPL quality atm let him go to a Championship he's no better than that.

Then i want us to try to get a top quality striker, 'cos apart from a CB and a LB/LWB, it's what we need

 

 

 

 

no way he accepts a loan back to the Championship meat grinder

loan him (IF we loan him) to Sheffield United, he will get bags of playing time and Wilder is a great manager

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23 minutes ago, Vesper said:

and also WHY was Lamps trotting out Batshit over him before???????

It’s a question nobody can answer. Like I said, it’s a moment you think Lampard was taking drugs.

As for next season with Werner, this will be tough. Giroud or Abraham as 2nd striker?

Giroud has done a lot more than I expected since we got him. It makes BIG sense why Giroud always starts for World Champs France. The worry is, he is getting older. He could be finished anytime.

Abraham is the future, but he isn’t ready (yet). If Werner needs rest or gets injured (or simply a change of game plan) I am worried Abraham won’t be an attacking threat like he is since the turn of the year. 

I am so disappointed on how big the drop off is when Abraham isn’t even having shots towards the goal. Even coming back from the lockdown has not reenergised him at all.

Next season is massive in terms of Abraham’s future with this club. If he continues to play like this during that season, he’s going.

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