Closed Chelsea 6-0 Arsenal

[Fernando 6,467]

First thing first, ox was not even a "questionable" decision compared to the dive of neymar. It was a clear cut red and a disgraceful action. Intentionallu handling the ball dearrves a red.

Now for the last man tackle/fouls while debying clear goal scoring oppurtunity (which I think was the xase last night) , while I except that sometimes they can be harsh, but u have to accept that they do make some sense.

I mean like someone said above, say the conversion rate of a pen is 80% in the world (4 out of 5), and you just give a pen or a pen + yellow, then the defender is commiting a foul and still reducing the chances of the striker scoring fron 100% to 80%. Which is what will happen if the refs stop givng reds for denying goalscoring oppurtunities. Hence, I have to say, the rule should defo stay.

What's the point of giving a double punishment?

That's what the ref do with such rules.

In cases like chamberlain and Suárez at the world Cup, I understand.

But giving the same punishment for a foul, doesn't make any sense. You kill the game. Given a red card you already handicap the game.

Why give more?

[svajo 153]

FA says it shouldnt have been a red... http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/26711403

[LAM09 6,754]

I know mate but there is no way you can rewrite that rule without causing other problems.

Maybe they need to detail it more then, so it applies to specific moments only.

[didierforever 7,349]

What's the point of giving a double punishment?

That's what the ref do with such rules.

In cases like chamberlain and Suárez at the world Cup, I understand.

But giving the same punishment for a foul, doesn't make any sense. You kill the game. Given a red card you already handicap the game.

Why give more?

If not, then what is the ref supposed to do?

Like I said, the defender reduces the chance of scoring but still gets away with fouling. In the end, if a striker is thru on goal, a defender can foul a striker and yet the defending team is in a better position than before the tackle which is just absurd.

You have to understand that a red + a pen is given ONLY in situatiins where a defender is deemed to have stopped a clear cut goal scoring oppurtunity. Xabi was not given a red last night for a foul on iniesta and neither was alves. It is only the most obvious goal scoring oppurtunities which are generally deemed to be a red + pen offense.

[Belgiannutt 3,201]

What's the point of giving a double punishment?

That's what the ref do with such rules.

In cases like chamberlain and Suárez at the world Cup, I understand.

But giving the same punishment for a foul, doesn't make any sense. You kill the game. Given a red card you already handicap the game.

Why give more?

What if you only give a yellow card and the team misses the penalty ? The team of the player that committed the foul basically get's away with cheating.

You'd constantly see defenders and goalkeeper cynically taking down players who are in a great goalscoring position, happily take the yellow card and a chance for their goalkeeper to save the penalty.

[LAB 1,030]

Game, Set and Match Chelsea then! Fantastic result. That scoring we missed from the team the whole season, it's done on a derby.

[Special Juan 27,429]

It's a double edged sword but at the same time as the FA coming out and explaining things they need to look deeper and how their officials can be come more consistent in both their actions and decisions.

[Fulham Broadway 16,867]

Got me thinking -its not the first time mistaken identity ended in a sending off.

I remember Hasselbaink and this;

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2002/jan/26/newsstory.sport4

[Jase 43,479]

[Poudestinho_Italy 21]

Hi my friends!! How are you?
unfortunately, I lost the match of our Chelsea against Arsenal... however i saw the highlights and I'm very very happy for us, for Josè and lastly for Arsenal and for "the voyeur"

It was a fantastic result joined to a wonderful performance with a serious competitor in the Premier League Title's race

I hope that the points lost with Aston Villa will not be important in the future... Tonight, i'm going to watch on Fox Sports Channel the game between United and City and of course, we have to hope in a United's miracle... it's difficult, but I think they are able to beat Manchester City...

I would like to be present at Anfield for Liverpool Chelsea... in my opinion this match will be the crossroads for us

Filippo

[The Skipper 20,593]

Oh and what happened to the so called 'Rock' that is Per Mertesacker? Some fucking rock him and Koscielny where eh?

Don't blame them to be fair, has a lot more to do with Wenger's suicidal tactics.

Both are very good defenders IMO (especially Koscielny).

[Strike 7,218]

Oh and what happened to the so called 'Rock' that is Per Mertesacker? Some fucking rock him and Koscielny where eh?

totally exposed in these games to be fair. even cahill-terry will struggle when the opposition forwards are outnumbering them

[iceman 329]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofSvDhopRb8

[Barbara 15,149]

I. can't. stop. laughing

This is the best thing EVER!!!!!

Thanks so much for that.

can this be the match thread opened forever? There's always a good laugh we can have here. At least til the end of season then?

[ID-NOBLE CHELSEA 2]

CHELSEA 4 life

[communicate 2,703]

It has to be a red and a penalty. Looking at it from a game theory point of view:

-ball is going into net=100% goal

-opponent palms the ball off the line to save a goal

-what does the punishment have to be to make the opponent indifferent to palming or not palming the ball off the line (making the opponent indifferent being the absolute minimum, the punishment should actually be a deterrent)

Let's look at some punishments we could give:

-a penalty is given:

-this results in a goal ~85% of the time. This gives the opponent a 15% less likely chance of conceding a goal compared to the previous 100%. That's a huge win for the opponent and they should take that trade off any time.

-a penalty is given and a yellow:

-this results in a goal ~85% of the time and i couldn't even bother counting the ratio of bookings:second bookings it was so insignifant. Essentially, a yellow rarely results in seeing that same player receive another booking that match. So the opponents have shaved their chance of conceding a goal by 15% and will rarely be down a man.

The only way we even get close is by making it a red and a penalty (unfortunately I couldn't find a stastic for how often teams in the Prem concede after going down to 10 men to add up the 85% chance of pk goal + the chance of scoring with a man advantage).

The other option is to simply award the goal. It's not without precedent in sports. This happens in hockey if Team X has an empty net, Team Y gets the puck and is in all alone on the empty-net, only to be hauled down by a Team X player to prevent the empty-net goal. The goal is simply awarded in such empty-net cases rather than the usual penalty shot being awarded (which in hockey only has a roughly 33% chance of being converted). Doesn't even matter if the player got a shot off. We also see such a rule with goaltending in basketball. For goaltending to be awarded, the ball only has to have the possibility of going in, be on a downward arc, and not touching the rim. In this specific case, going with the hypothetical punishment of simply awarding the goal, I'd say it's harsh since we know the ball was going wide.

Some may argue that since the ball was going wide, it shouldn't have been a sending off. That's the only argument that holds ground here. To that, I'd argue that Ox clearly thought the ball had a high chance of going in otherwise he wouldn't have done something so drastic. He would have just let the ball go wide. So for all intents and purposes, Ox believed he was preventing a goal and palmed the ball away. Knowing that, his actions have to be considered in that light.

Actually your concept of free goal is interesting. Giving free goal (penalty without gk + yellow card) is imo the way to go. It deter opponent to deny clear goalsxoring opportunity because it is counted a goal plus you will receive a Yellow card.

[gary gordon 1,777]

Lord Arsene blaming the draw with Swansea on us!

Lol, we really fucked those boys up..

[AndersonBLUE 819]

Love how our hammering has fucked them up. Shame cause we need them to draw/win against city but if they get another ribbing I won't complain. Imagine wenger finishing his career out of the top 4 lol.