Puliiszola 519 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Mana said: RLC is having horrid performances this season Massie, killer1257 and Jype 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon1991 233 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 4 minutes ago, killer1257 said: But he offers zero creativity and physicality. Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk  Read that a lot lately, about Mount offering no creativity whatsoever (from you and others). Just curious, where's that coming from? 6 goals 5 assists in the league this season and he has shown that's the kind of numbers he'll get you each season. Did it consistently in the dutch league and the championship, and has transitioned nicely in the PL at Chelsea. Leaving the end product aside, i find he has more than decent vision and passing range. Just on the top of my head that pass to Barkley against Watford was decisive, and there's been many more like that.  Massie, Puliiszola and ulsterchelsea 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiCFC 8,324 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 2 hours ago, killer1257 said: Ruben will leave us in winter if Havertz comes, sadly. We have 7 midfielders now. Kova, Jorgi, Kante, Gilmour, RLC, Mount and Barkley. I think Jorginho and Barkley are possible leaving. Just Havertz in and we are fine with 6 MF in this scenario. Plus if we sign Rice for CB he can always step up as DM. Â killer1257 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killer1257 3,282 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 Physicality? I disagree. I specifically remember him mugging off Vertonghen on two occasions in two different matches. He is probably our only youth product that offers this aggression. Pulisic, Havertz, Werner, and Ziyech in the side makes it less likely we will rely on Mount to offer any creativity. His job will be like it is now. Build up He wins less than 20% headers and with Kante besides him, that would be a huge risk. And only because he won once against Vertonghen does not mean he will win it against the likes of Matic or Pogba on regular basis. This season he plays as a no. 10 most of the times, so he had not have to win tackles against Fabinho, Pogba or Matic etc.We are not a physical team in the first place and Lampard says that often. Havertz may be tall, but physicality is not his strength Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artandur 939 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 6 minutes ago, Mana said: Has there been a solid source of this yet? Yes kicker is a solid source. Mana 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoroccanBlue 5,382 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 4 minutes ago, killer1257 said: He wins less than 20% headers and with Kante besides him, that would be a huge risk. And only because he won once against Vertonghen does not mean he will win it against the likes of Matic or Pogba on regular basis. This season he plays as a no. 10 most of the times, so he had not have to win tackles against Fabinho, Pogba or Matic etc. We are not a physical team in the first place and Lampard says that often. Havertz may be tall, but physicality is not his strength Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk  You sound like Mourinho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killer1257 3,282 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 Read that a lot lately, about Mount offering no creativity whatsoever (from you and others). Just curious, where's that coming from? 6 goals 5 assists in the league this season and he has shown that's the kind of numbers he'll get you each season. Did it consistently in the dutch league and the championship, and has transitioned nicely in the PL at Chelsea. Leaving the end product aside, i find he has more than decent vision and passing range. Just on the top of my head that pass to Barkley against Watford was decisive, and there's been many more like that.  His goals have nothing to do with creativity.He has assisted 2 goals from free kicks, one from a corner kick and one from a normal cross. This is not what I call creativity. KDB, Bernardo Silva, David Silva etc. are creative players who do not only do corner kicks or indirect free kicks to get assists. KDB can make crazy through balls etc.He can create chances for his players. Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killer1257 3,282 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 You sound like Mourinho [emoji38]Lampard criticised us for lack of physicality recently Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiCFC 8,324 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 9 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said: Physicality? I disagree. Now go watch SU first goal again. 4 minutes ago, Simon1991 said: Read that a lot lately, about Mount offering no creativity whatsoever (from you and others). Just curious, where's that coming from? 6 goals 5 assists in the league this season and he has shown that's the kind of numbers he'll get you each season. Did it consistently in the dutch league and the championship, and has transitioned nicely in the PL at Chelsea. Leaving the end product aside, i find he has more than decent vision and passing range. Just on the top of my head that pass to Barkley against Watford was decisive, and there's been many more like that.  5 assists? One is penalty won against Brighton. (I know, transfermarkt count it as assist). So he has 4 and 3 came after set pieces. 2 in one match for Rudiger headers against Leicester. 1 at Emirates also set piece but it was all on Leno tbh... He has only one assist all season (48 games) from open play. And even this assist is he took corner, ball come back to him he tries again with all players in the box so basically like another set piece.   killer1257 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoroccanBlue 5,382 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 6 minutes ago, NikkiCFC said: Now go watch SU first goal again. And I'll come back with watch our first goal against Leicester earlier in the year? 7 minutes ago, killer1257 said: Lampard criticised us for lack of physicality recently Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk  Liverpool and City hardly have a physical midfield Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomo 21,751 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 9 minutes ago, killer1257 said: His goals have nothing to do with creativity. He has assisted 2 goals from free kicks, one from a corner kick and one from a normal cross. This is not what I call creativity. KDB, Bernardo Silva, David Silva etc. are creative players who do not only do corner kicks or indirect free kicks to get assists. KDB can make crazy through balls etc. He can create chances for his players. Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk   Assist's are subjective, you can play the best through ball in football history yet you're still relying on someone else to do his job for it to be put on the stats. Simon1991 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killer1257 3,282 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 Liverpool and City hardly have a physical midfield Fabinho? Rodri is also not a pushoverGesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon1991 233 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 6 minutes ago, killer1257 said:   His goals have nothing to do with creativity. He has assisted 2 goals from free kicks, one from a corner kick and one from a normal cross. This is not what I call creativity. KDB, Bernardo Silva, David Silva etc. are creative players who do not only do corner kicks or indirect free kicks to get assists. KDB can make crazy through balls etc. He can create chances for his players. Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk   Delivering a good set-piece/corner is a form a creativity. We go on and on about how we cannot deliver good corners (hello Willian) and indirect free-kicks, so why wouldn't it count in terms of creativity? I won't argue that KDB or David Silva are not highly creative players, but just because they're better than Mount does not mean he is not a creative player. Also worth considering the free-flowing attacking football city plays. Mount would certainly look better in that system as well. Why do you think he is not creative then? What i see from him is he can pick a pass, plays with high tempo all the time, can beat a man with a dribble or a good first touch. Those are intangible, you can't measure that, but i would never say he's not creative when i look him play. Why do you consider he is not creative? Tomo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killer1257 3,282 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 Assist's are subjective, you can play the best through ball in football history yet you're still relying on someone else to do his job for it to be put on the stats.So you say that Mount is playing these great through balls but Tammy and Giroud do not score from his passes? Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiCFC 8,324 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 6 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said: And I'll come back with watch our first goal against Leicester earlier in the year? This is his biggest strength. Pressing. He also won penalty against Brighton in this way. He put that extra effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoroccanBlue 5,382 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 6 minutes ago, killer1257 said: Fabinho? Rodri is also not a pushover Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk  So a DM? Why not get a DM then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomo 21,751 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 16 minutes ago, killer1257 said: So you say that Mount is playing these great through balls but Tammy and Giroud do not score from his passes? Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit Tapatalk  Talk about going for the sensational headline. Let's take Pulisic for example, he's only just picked up his first assist since the restart but anyone who's anyone knows he has in the context of play had a lot more. Mount made a brilliant run past the Villa defense on the opening day back and was denied an assist because no one gambled. Watford and Spurs goals (Giroud and Alonso respectively) came about due to Mount's quick thinking to open up avenue's, he didn't technically get the assist but without his input we don't create the chance on either occasion let alone score. Mount also set up a goal for Nugent last season against Millwall but because he dummied it and didn't touch it it didn't go on record as his assist. The other extreme would be whoever made the backwards pass to Charlie Adam before he booted it in at the half way line at our place would technically have an assist on record, it wouldn't really be a proper assist though. Until the term assist gets redefined it's good for fantasy football league's but not much else, unless a player is assisting at an obscene rate like KDB I take next to no notice of it. Key passes and key dribbles are a much bigger sign of creativity. I'm not saying Mount's the most creative player to ever exist, but this "no assist from open play" thing is about as crap and misleading as the no assists by Jorginho last season or Hazard only getting something like 4/5 the season before that (that latter one alone should have triggered a reassesment on what an assist is). Simon1991 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valdo 583 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 He wins less than 20% headers and with Kante besides him, that would be a huge risk. And only because he won once against Vertonghen does not mean he will win it against the likes of Matic or Pogba on regular basis. This season he plays as a no. 10 most of the times, so he had not have to win tackles against Fabinho, Pogba or Matic etc.We are not a physical team in the first place and Lampard says that often. Havertz may be tall, but physicality is not his strength Gesendet von meinem VOG-L29 mit TapatalkThat's still 20% more then our entire back line when defending set pieces and corners [emoji23]Verstuurd vanaf mijn F5121 met Tapatalk Vesper and killer1257 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiCFC 8,324 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 5 minutes ago, Simon1991 said: Delivering a good set-piece/corner is a form a creativity. We go on and on about how we cannot deliver good corners (hello Willian) and indirect free-kicks, so why wouldn't it count in terms of creativity? And yet Willian has most assists in our team this season If Kepa take all corners and set pieces he would have a few assists as well. New season it will be Ziyech so that means Mount would have zero. He has two or three things I like in his game but creativity is definitely not one of them.  killer1257 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon1991 233 Posted July 16, 2020 Share Posted July 16, 2020 12 minutes ago, NikkiCFC said: And yet Willian has most assists in our team this season If Kepa take all corners and set pieces he would have a few assists as well. New season it will be Ziyech so that means Mount would have zero. He has two or three things I like in his game but creativity is definitely not one of them.  I am not saying he's the most creative player aka KDB or lionel Messi, but stating Mount has no creativy is just not right, i am sorry. Mount's intangibles are part of his creativity. The spaces he creates for his teammates, the urgency with which he plays, the breaking pass before the assist, all of those are intangibles but it must be accounted for when we discuss creativity. Just to give a comparison point, when Hazard was pulling 3 players down the left, hence creating space and then picking up a teammate, that was creativity. Not showing in numbers but clear for everyone to see if you watched him play. That's the creativity Mount offers. I wonder why Frank plays him week in week out if he's not physical, not creative, is it just for the pressing? come on..  Tomo and Miguelito 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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