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The Hiddink Thread


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19 minutes ago, bellion said:

Not sure if Mourinho was responsible for selling good players but how about buying good players?  Surely someone better than Papy and Hector was available? 

Well it was Jose that nailed Mata, KDB to the bench, and loaned out other players. 

 

Turns out Papy is a good player.

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2 hours ago, kiwi1691 said:

Well it was Jose that nailed Mata, KDB to the bench, and loaned out other players. 

 

Turns out Papy is a good player.

Papy was bought as a back-up player and is in no way first team material.  If the club is serious about being title and CL challengers, spend more than the likes of Palace and Bournemouth!!

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2 hours ago, bellion said:

Papy was bought as a back-up player and is in no way first team material.  If the club is serious about being title and CL challengers, spend more than the likes of Palace and Bournemouth!!

Here's my problem - big transfer fee == good player 

the Leicester team has some great players and they were purchased for less than Pappy. It's about building a good scouting network and identifying prospects and playing them once purchased, whereas we just loan them out, the loan system is so heavily flawed I can't be bothered to go into that now :(

papy is doing a decent job in the Bundesliga and from the glimpses I have seen of him, he's comparable right now to Gary and Iva...

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Well, just sw this : 

or8hs1.jpg 

Progressed two rounds in the Cup, and has a slight disadvantage midway through the Champions League last 8 but a home game to play. 

Fair to say Uncle Guus has done a pretty good job again, didn't do miracles, nobody was expecting him too, but did steady the ship, and I don't know about you, but 3rd, 2nd best attack, 4 away clean sheets in the last 10 matchs and the longest unbeaten active streak ( longest of the season for all teams actually ) is really good if you ask me, means basically that bar Southampton and Tottenham, we have done at least as good or better as the rest of the league. 

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16 minutes ago, Adnane said:

Well, just sw this : 

or8hs1.jpg 

Progressed two rounds in the Cup, and has a slight disadvantage midway through the Champions League last 8 but a home game to play. 

Fair to say Uncle Guus has done a pretty good job again, didn't do miracles, nobody was expecting him too, but did steady the ship, and I don't know about you, but 3rd, 2nd best attack, 4 away clean sheets in the last 10 matchs and the longest unbeaten active streak ( longest of the season for all teams actually ) is really good if you ask me, means basically that bar Southampton and Tottenham, we have done at least as good or better as the rest of the league. 

Lets hope he keeps on the good work. We will need some masterful planning from his since we have lost Zouma and Terry.

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19 hours ago, Muzchap said:

Here's my problem - big transfer fee == good player 

the Leicester team has some great players and they were purchased for less than Pappy. It's about building a good scouting network and identifying prospects and playing them once purchased, whereas we just loan them out, the loan system is so heavily flawed I can't be bothered to go into that now :(

papy is doing a decent job in the Bundesliga and from the glimpses I have seen of him, he's comparable right now to Gary and Iva...

Leicester's situation is the opposite of a perfect storm - everything and every player they bought has clicked under Ranieri.  Even they didn't expect such a meteoric rise especially since they were actually tipped to be one of the relegation candidate this season.

Chelsea is a different kettle of fish altogether i.e. the club has the funds (if they wish to spend) and a far wider scouting network to bring in superstars, rising stars and virtual unknowns.  I believe we all agree thatt the club doesn't need to make every single transfer to be a big money one as a mix of the above is probably the most desirable approach plus injection from the youth teams.

My beef with the Board is that they take an "income statement trumps all" approach such as enforcing a one-in one-out approach when the squad is already too small in numbers as well as faming out the  youth players in the loan market.  On top of this, the Stones debacle and the last minute panic attempts for Pogba and Marquinhos (more to placate the fans than really serious attempts) which ended with the Papy and Hector purchases made the Board to be utter transfer mugs.  Also, this pathetic transfer policy can be seen in the loans and short-term signings of has-beens like Pato and links with Lavezzi.  Some would say just play the youngsters if the Board is so obsessed with cash flow but the club doesn't even do that very much and frankly, I do think it would be foolish if our club put our high hopes on youth players heading straight into the first team without an appropriate number of top quality players already in the team. 

On a side note, Papy was never meant to be a first team player.  What we need now is a top quality centre-half and perhaps a left-back if Baba isn't trusted and also to push Ivanovic out of the first team.

 

 

 

 

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He's improved our attacking play so much it's ridiculous. Everyone was looking to pass to the runner in behind the defence and a lot of one two's combination. The players are finally practicing attacking patterns. 

The only problem is how poor our defenders are in making any decision. So many times they hoof the ball under slight pressure without passing to a free man. 

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13 minutes ago, kellzfresh said:

He's improved our attacking play so much it's ridiculous. Everyone was looking to pass to the runner in behind the defence and a lot of one two's combination. The players are finally practicing attacking patterns. 

The only problem is how poor our defenders are in making any decision. So many times they hoof the ball under slight pressure without passing to a free man. 

Remember when Chelsea couldn't score from open play? Quite the transformation.

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23 minutes ago, kellzfresh said:

He's improved our attacking play so much it's ridiculous. Everyone was looking to pass to the runner in behind the defence and a lot of one two's combination. The players are finally practicing attacking patterns. 

The only problem is how poor our defenders are in making any decision. So many times they hoof the ball under slight pressure without passing to a free man. 

At the moment, it looks pretty good given the lack of quality in centre midfield. But it would be nice if Chelsea could keep up this play for the rest of this calendar year while adding better CMs and some depth at fullback during the summer.

Now that we have SOME momentum, it will be nice to see us not shrink against real opposition in the Prem. If the PSG match is any indication though, I think our midfield will prevent us from dominating matches in the Premier League against strong opponents.

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On 2/18/2016 at 2:52 PM, Adnane said:

Well, just sw this : 

or8hs1.jpg 

Progressed two rounds in the Cup, and has a slight disadvantage midway through the Champions League last 8 but a home game to play. 

Fair to say Uncle Guus has done a pretty good job again, didn't do miracles, nobody was expecting him too, but did steady the ship, and I don't know about you, but 3rd, 2nd best attack, 4 away clean sheets in the last 10 matchs and the longest unbeaten active streak ( longest of the season for all teams actually ) is really good if you ask me, means basically that bar Southampton and Tottenham, we have done at least as good or better as the rest of the league. 

You are tying (implying causation) the late results to Hiddink, which is wrong.

Hiddink is one of the many variables, including form, fitness levels, and according to some people around here, the most important of all: the not Mourinho factor (anyone but Jose) 

Simple exercise to help determine causation: do we know how Jose would have fared had he stayed? Would the players perhaps, with time, let go of their grudges and improve their form as they have been doing? The answer is, of course, that we don't know.

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20 minutes ago, Robguima said:

You are tying (implying causation) the late results to Hiddink, which is wrong.

Hiddink is one of the many variables, including form, fitness levels, and according to some people around here, the most important of all: the not Mourinho factor (anyone but Jose) 

Simple exercise to help determine causation: do we know how Jose would have fared had he stayed? Would the players perhaps, with time, let go of their grudges and improve their form as they have been doing? The answer is, of course, that we don't know.

If Mourinho was still here, we'd be in the bottom three and Scunthorpe would have dumped us out of the cup. It is abundantly clear, in my eyes at least, that the players had a problem with Mourinho. How else do you explain the sudden transformation? 7 wins, 6 draws and only one defeat in 14 games is unrecognisable to the form we showed under Jose, let alone the style of play being totally different. 

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21 minutes ago, BlueLion said:

If Mourinho was still here, we'd be in the bottom three and Scunthorpe would have dumped us out of the cup. It is abundantly clear, in my eyes at least, that the players had a problem with Mourinho. How else do you explain the sudden transformation? 7 wins, 6 draws and only one defeat in 14 games is unrecognisable to the form we showed under Jose, let alone the style of play being totally different. 

Not so sure about bottom of the table, but agree sacking Jose immediately improved morale. However, the transformation wasn't that sudden to me at least.

But, even in your own argument, the difference is not Hiddink, but the fact that he is not Mourinho, as I pointed out earlier.

In other words, would ANY other manager be able to do similar as Hiddink, or perhaps better? We don't know.

Besides, what we need is a manager, not a coach. We need a guy who can help revamp this weak squad. Like I said before, Hiddink is a waste of time as most tampon managers are. Using a temp manager is even more baffling when you consider we don't have a target perm manager yet.

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59 minutes ago, Robguima said:

You are tying (implying causation) the late results to Hiddink, which is wrong.

Hiddink is one of the many variables, including form, fitness levels, and according to some people around here, the most important of all: the not Mourinho factor (anyone but Jose) 

Simple exercise to help determine causation: do we know how Jose would have fared had he stayed? Would the players perhaps, with time, let go of their grudges and improve their form as they have been doing? The answer is, of course, that we don't know.

Can we really 'know' anything? Can knowledge be acquired through our biologically limited senses and our subjective consciousness? If we can't turn around and see the real objects in front of the fire but can only observe the shadows they make on the wall, do the objects really exist? Does REALITY even exist?! Time is a mere trick of our perception. The tree does not fall unless someone hears it. If what we perceive as reality depends on subjective consciousness then life is nonexistent and irrelevant!! SUICIDE IS THE ONLY LOGICAL CHOICE! 

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8 minutes ago, CHOULO19 said:

Can we really 'know' anything? Can knowledge be acquired through our biologically limited senses and our subjective consciousness? If we can't turn around and see the real objects in front of the fire but can only observe the shadows they make on the wall, do the objects really exist? Does REALITY even exist?! Time is a mere trick of our perception. The tree does not fall unless someone hears it. If what we perceive as reality depends on subjective consciousness then life is nonexistent and irrelevant!! SUICIDE IS THE ONLY LOGICAL CHOICE! 

Whatever... Lol

identifying causation is absolutely possible and done all the time. That's a big part of my job actually.

folks here, and in football in general, are the ones who have a problem with it.

some times there is a direct link between cause and consequence, other times there simply isn't.

it kinda makes sense some may think Hiddink is a magician though... To each his own.

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