Closed Chelsea vs Juventus

[Muzchap 8,966]

you people are far too harsh on the manager that won us a double last year. disgusting really. yes he made mistakes but he is human and had we taken our chances we would have won comfortably.

Disagree... Not attacking you personally, just stating my opinion on your post

1) If QPR had of taken their chances they would also have won comfortably.

2) Second half our Midfield was completely over-run

3) Yes, he did well last season - but that was with an INHERITED squad - this summer we've spent lot's of money on new players and so far we haven't integrated them (except Hazard) - these were HIS signings and we are going backwards

4) Our league form was dreadful last year

5) The only quality opposition we have faced is Atletico - if you don't think we'll get exposed with our current line-up against Juve - then it will be a long, frustrating night. RDM should have used this game + training after the Atletico Match to get Romeu or Ramires into the DP. Instead - he loaned out Essien and sold Meireless - not exactly top of the class there with 'tactical' thinking.

6) Brazil are playing Oscar in nearly every competitive match - why aren't we? How is the kid supposed to learn if he's not played? If you are 'good enough' you are 'old enough' - that's the way of the world.

So there's 6 reasons why I think unless RDM really starts to change things - we could be in trouble.

Like I have also said - I REALLY REALLY REALLY like Robbie - he was a great player for us, I love his calmness, his professionalism - BUT this all means squat, if he cannot change things on the pitch

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

Potentially but in the end we play basically a RB at RWB who will not ignore his defensive duties. We also have a CM who has made the LWB his own, he will run all day. Now you answer my question.

Potentially but we will likely play at least one defensive winger and RDM will probably ask Mata and Hazard to track back. If we don't use any defensive wingers then we can keep your wing backs and defense occupied which is another way to combat your midfield.

[nhaiduy 1]

But anyhow i predict a close match, decided by either Pirlo, Hazard, and Torres, if it's one of their days. Hopefully we can come out on top. I've watched Pirlo played a hundred times (I'm also a Milan fan *sigh*) and he does get bullied at times when the opposition midfielders can harass and isolate him. Then he'll start drifting wide and that's when he's ineffective. Easier said than done when he's protected by Vidal & Marchisio though..

Oh and another point is that their strikers are all average

[RedHotChiliPeppers 0]

Asamoah plays at LWB right?

Not really.

Asamoah is more a wing rather than a LWB.

In fact, the Juventus midfield consists of five players, Asamoah and Lichtsteiner are not part of the difense.

The game of Juve is very offensive and based on possession and quick movement of the ball.

Our slow midfielders will suffer a lot against them

[dumps 284]

The clock is ticking on RDM to actually use these new signings properly. Like many have said, Oscar is a starting player for his national team, and it's not just any old national team, it's Brazil... he SHOULD be starting games for Chelsea, he's more than ready.

We all know RDM is going to line up an unltra defensive team, I can see him deploying the exact tactics that got us through Barca and Munich... He has to understand those are tactics that rely heavily on luck! I can understand if he starts Bertrand/Ramires on the wings, for their defensive attributes, but he doesnt have to be so defensive.

I agree with the majority when they say about Lampard in that double pivot, and we all know he'll start their again. Hopefully itll be his last start there because i cant see us winning this game (or deservedly winning) with lampard there, and bertrand/Ramires on a wing. Hopefully the return of Mata will remove one of those defensive wingers.

i would love to see a change of formation in this game, it would shock Juve, and as Juve play WB's, it could be very effective, the middle of the pitch is going to be a very busy place, and im not sure Lampard is going to be able to cope with those defensive duties.

another poor performance or a loss should hopefully be a slap round RDM's face to change his style of play and throw on some of those attacking midfielders we bought, Sturrdige needs more game time. at the moment i Still prefer Torres over Sturridge. but Sturridge needs to be seen more, and be used earlier than the 85th minute!

this could be a long game for us. Having said that, It's a chmpions league match. They always tend to bring out the best in players (as long as we dont concede in the first 10minutes!) and maybe then RDM's tactics might be effective with all the players giving him 100% - of course, if we do win with these tactics, prepare to see them for a bit longer!

time will tell. Huge game for the future of our season.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

A few points from Juve's match yesterday:

- Buffon is still a beast

- Juve B is no where near as good as the starting XI

- Pirlo's form so far this season is not what it was last season

- Bonnucci is the weak link in the Juve defense

- Vucinic has been the key player for Juve this season

- We will need Iva to be in top form because Asamoah will take some stopping

[HRiver 1,512]

Cech

Ivanovic - Luiz - Terry - Cole

Oscar - Mikel - Lampard

Hazard - Mata

Torres

Oscar and Mata instead of Ramires and Bertrand will make a huge difference.

[YouNameIt 1,511]

With no Oscar?

Was mostly refering to the formation itself. Of course Oscar should be a regular starter very soon.

[DaLenny 4]

I'm both a Chelsea and a Juventus supporter, so I know both teams very well.

Juventus is a very very good team, with a solid defense and a great midfield, one of the best midfields in Europe. They play well, have very good chemistry and are very tough to beat.

But Juve has also some some issues: they lacks a top quality striker, are too Pirlo-centric, and from time to time are too offensive, and their defensive line happens to be too high. The speed and the class of Mata and Eden may be a very tough test for Bonucci, Barzagli and Chiellini, who are very strong but a little slow. RDM should play them very wide on the wing, because Juve's wings always play very high.

If our midfield manage to do a heavy pressing on Pirlo all night long I think we have a very good chance. If we let Pirlo play... Well, we're in trouble.

I think Juventus will play a 3-5-2:

Buffon

Barzagli-Bonucci-Chiellini

Lichtsteiner(Isla)-Vidal-Pirlo-Marchisio-Asamoah

Vucinic-Giovinco

In my opinion Chelsea should play like this:

Cech

Ivanovic-Terry-Luiz-Cole

Ramires-Mikel-Oscar

Mata-Torres-Hazard

But RDM will never agree with me

Ps: I'm italian, sorry for my english.

[Rmpr 8,977]

Cech

Ivanovic - Luiz - Terry - Cole

Oscar - Mikel - Lampard

Hazard - Mata

Torres

Oscar and Mata instead of Ramires and Bertrand will make a huge difference.

I'd love to see it against Juve! Although it does not provide width against english teams (wich is needed).

Cech

Azi - Cahil - Terry - Cole

Mikel

Ramires. - Mata

Sturridge - Torres. - Hazard

With Iva, Luiz, Bertrand, Romeu, Lampard, Oscar, Moses, Marin getting their chances.

[HRiver 1,512]

I'd love to see it against Juve! Although it does not provide width against english teams (wich is needed).

Cech

Azi - Cahil - Terry - Cole

Mikel

Ramires. - Mata

Sturridge - Torres. - Hazard

With Iva, Luiz, Bertrand, Romeu, Lampard, Oscar, Moses, Marin getting their chances.

Lampard, Oscar, Moses and Marin are all better than Ramires. How come you prefer him for the starting lineup?

[dumps 284]

With reports of Juve's slow defense, Sturridge And Moses sounds very appealing to me!

I think RDM should be sacked and his wage should be split between 500 of us and we can run this club ourselves!

[coolhead23 1,147]

I'm both a Chelsea and a Juventus supporter, so I know both teams very well.

Juventus is a very very good team, with a solid defense and a great midfield, one of the best midfields in Europe. They play well, have very good chemistry and are very tough to beat.

But Juve has also some some issues: they lacks a top quality striker, are too Pirlo-centric, and from time to time are too offensive, and their defensive line happens to be too high. The speed and the class of Mata and Eden may be a very tough test for Bonucci, Barzagli and Chiellini, who are very strong but a little slow. RDM should play them very wide on the wing, because Juve's wings always play very high.

Come on, mate ... last time i heard Juventus got one of the best striker (if not the best as is claimed) ....

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

The way DaLenny explains it shows us 4-3-3 would win us this game. It would nullify Juventus in just about every area. 3 against 3 in midfield with the two wings backs often being occupied with the front 3 of Mata, Torres and Hazard so meaning Juventus won't always have a midfield 5. We can bring on Moses (for Mata) at any time to trouble them at the back even more with pace.

Cech

Ivanovic Luiz Terry Cole

Oscar Mikel Ramires

Hazard Torres Mata

Mikel and Ramires would need to really get at Pirlo and stop him from playing. There is speed, defense and possession in that midfield. A nice balance which we need to try and match Juventus's midfield. I don't think 4-2-3-1 is the right formation to match a team who plays 3-5-2 really well.

There are minor weaknesses to us playing 4-3-3, like any system. That weakness is the potential that Hazard and Mata keeping the wing backs busy means that them tracking back weakens Juventus's midfield yet bolsters their defence a bit with 5 at the back against 3. However I think this is the best option as Juventus's midfield is their greatest strength. 4-3-3 has the least weaknesses against 3-5-2 and as a system in general.

[Rmpr 8,977]

Lampard, Oscar, Moses and Marin are all better than Ramires. How come you prefer him for the starting lineup?

Well, dont really know hahahaha.

Moses and Marin would be out of position.

It comes down to personal taste I guess. Lamp is old already, should be left for the big games and CL. Oscar does not know how to defend yet (not that Rami is that great either)

[dumps 284]

The way DaLenny explains it shows us 4-3-3 would win us this game. It would nullify Juventus in just about every area. 3 against 3 in midfield with the two wings backs often being occupied with the front 3 of Mata, Torres and Hazard so meaning Juvetus won't always have a midfield 5. We can bring on Moses (for Mata) at any time to trouble them at the back even more with pace.

Ivanovic Luiz Terry Cole

Oscar Mikel Ramires

Hazard Torres Mata

Mikel and Ramires would need to really get at Pirlo and stop him from playing. There is speed, defense and possession in that midfield. A nice balance which we need to try and match Juventus's midfield. I don't think 4-2-3-1 is the right formation to match a team who plays 3-5-2 really well.

a lot of time for that. A LOT of time.

My only concern is i dont think Hazard and Mata would be that effective as RW and LW. They both seem to play best when one is playing behind the striker and one is on a wing and then they mix and match when they want. they seem to be the most effective when they are allowed to do that. sticking them both permantly on a wing i dont think will be entirely effective, and i think if they were put in that position we would see them naturally drifting to the middle more often than they should which would make us very narrow. but like you said, bringing Moses on as a sub would be so useful there if it appeared to not entirely working. could even stick Sturrdige or Marin on the wing as well.

[DaLenny 4]

Come on, mate ... last time i heard Juventus got one of the best striker (if not the best as is claimed) ....

Obviously if he plays we have no chance at all.

He is a taller and more talented version of Zlatan. Or that's what he loves to say ...

[HRiver 1,512]

Well, dont really know hahahaha.

Moses and Marin would be out of position.

It comes down to personal taste. Lamp is old already, should be left for the big games and CL. Oscar does not know how to defend yet (not that Rami is that great either)

Yes, Lampard is old now and not as good as he used to be. But he still has the quality, the strength, and the intelligence, three elements which Ramires is lacking. Ramires is just so frustrating to watch. Awful first touch, and loses the ball so easily. I don't think that this will suddenly change if RDM uses him as CM, or in the double pivot.

Oscar is without a single doubt better than Ramires. Moses also seems better than him in general... he's strong, skillful. Marin is also very good from what we've seen in the preseason. I think that all of them have a lot more to offer than Ramires. Ramires is also quite predictable, you can easily tell which way he's going to go, which is why he's stopped and pushed away so easily.

[nhaiduy 1]

Obviously if he plays we have no chance at all.

He is a taller and more talented version of Zlatan. Or that's what he loves to say ...

Who are you guys talking about?

[DaLenny 4]

Who are you guys talking about?

Italians do it Bendtner