Victor Moses

[Beepu 1,714]

You're not answering my original question. I said why 2 CF's? We have Torres and Sturridge. You want us to have 4 strikers fighting for one spot?

I think maybe what they meant was if sturridge leaves and lukaku goes on loan. Maybe....

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

And I answered your question. None of us know sturridge's situation

Sturridge hasn't left. So getting 2 CF's makes no sense. For some odd reason you also don't want a RB...

[HNKS 508]

Sturridge hasn't left. So getting 2 CF's makes no sense. For some odd reason you also don't want a RB...

If Torres gets injured I cant help but feel we will get fucked with Sturridge starting. Torres can at least assist when not scoring, Sturridge even scores or keeps shooting. Hope he leaves.

[themightyblue 443]

Yes but the club may want him gone this summer or used in a deal. He's only got a year left as everyone knows. The club wouldn't sign a player all willy nilly. There'd be a reason why we go for hulk and Moses if we are. And of course I want a RB. Another assumption....,

[zolayes 14,489]

You're not answering my original question. I said why 2 CF's? We have Torres and Sturridge. You want us to have 4 strikers fighting for one spot?

2 strikers is not sufficient for a season of over 60 games ,,, Sturridge is unproved as a CF as is Lukaku...

but you are so fixed in your own ideas I won't bother with you further

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

As has been said so many times before, If we sign Hulk he can play CF. So that's 3 CF's right there. No need to buy an out and out Striker. Also, Sturridge is unproven as a striker? That is truly rich as he has played CF his entire life...It's also obvious he has Talent. We shouldn't give up on him just yet.

[SeB 1,281]

No way will we do the 4-6-0 thing. A. it wont work in the premier league, and B, we we dont really have the players for it. And IMO its an awful system.

Moyes implemented it with success at Everton with Tim Cahill

And I do think it's the best system to play teams who park the bus. If you play a 4-6-0 with a player such as Rooney as a false nine, he aspires the defenders by leaving his position and a winger can cut inside. If the defender don't follow the Rooney, then he can turn around and shoot and score (like against us at SB). And if the defender is tempted to come out, a winger can run into the space.

What Spain does is very smart because they even play with 3 players with specific roles between the lines. Fabregas is the false nine and leaves his position whereas Iniesta and Silva ay be higher than Fabregas. Silva and Iniesta are really fixing the defenders, they make them focused on another thing by standing where they are.

4-6-0 means a lot of players between the lines because the false nine allows two support players to insert into spaces he creates. And it's way to counter teams parking the bus.

You can play a quite direct way with 4-6-0, the only thing that changes with Spain is that they decide to play possession. If you ask your offensive players to shoot and put the CK under pressure, there's no reason not using the 4-6-0.

Ancelotti already used it at Old Trafford when we won in 2010, Drogba was surprisingly benched (because he is regarded as a player who weighs on the defense line and makes them staying deeper) to play Anelka. Anelka left his position and Malouda and Joe Cole were higher than him, running into space created by Anelka

But you hardly can play a similar way of 4-6-0 away because you have to be very high and keep possession, what's more difficult considering that you're "not supposed" to play when you play away. It's better to play it at home against a team who will only defend. Because that way of playing does not really plan the defensive duties of the between the lines players (tracking full backs by example)

[Kojo 4,676]

2 strikers is not sufficient for a season of over 60 games ,,, Sturridge is unproved as a CF as is Lukaku...

but you are so fixed in your own ideas I won't bother with you further

Unproven? 8 goals in 12 games for Bolton was enough for me. Our top scorer the season after with 11 goals. Two strikers isn't enough you say? who where the only two forwards to play last season as striker? Torres and Drogba. We have more games now yes, but two forwards is all what we need and should anything happen we will be able to recall Lukaku.

fixed in his own ideas is he... ahhhh ignorance.

[zolayes 14,489]

the Spain I watched seemed to play 2 3 5 ...with 5 attackers swarming round the the opponents box. The fact that none were traditional strikers is totally

irrelevant.

[Pizy 18,368]

The ONLY way I wouldn't be upset with Studge leaving is if it involved Modric coming in.

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

Unproven? 8 goals in 12 games for Bolton was enough for me. Our top scorer the season after with 11 goals. Two strikers isn't enough you say? who where the only two forwards to play last season as striker? Torres and Drogba. We have more games now yes, but two forwards is all what we need and should anything happen we will be able to recall Lukaku.

fixed in his own ideas is he... ahhhh ignorance.

You sexy beast

[zolayes 14,489]

Unproven? 8 goals in 12 games for Bolton was enough for me. Our top scorer the season after with 11 goals. Two strikers isn't enough you say? who where the only two forwards to play last season as striker? Torres and Drogba. We have more games now yes, but two forwards is all what we need and should anything happen we will be able to recall Lukaku.

fixed in his own ideas is he... ahhhh ignorance.

how many times has sturridge led the line as a lone striker???

[Ollie 4,400]

I don't think so. There was two players I really appreciate at Palace for some years, Moses and Nathaniel Clyne. Though their young ages and the weaknesses inherant to it, I though they have a really impressive maturity in their play. I don't find that with Zaha, he seems technically good and he's very quick but I'm not convinced by the content of his games. After all he doesn't manage to make the difference that often on the ball, I mean a lot of player can't do neither but Zaha's play has too much stepovers and useless things

Players such as Clyne, Bertrand, Moses aren't that inconsistent in their play, they lack presence but they don't do lows and highs. For the handle of times I watched Zaha play, when he manages something great he starts then to try even harder things (that he often missed) whereas the best thing to do to prove you're mentally ready is to continue playing at the same level whatever happens.

And I remember the double confrontation with Cardiff in League Cup, though they have the same age, Clyne and Zaha were opposed on the pitch. The first one was captain and made two impressive and consistent performances, the second one was inconsistent (but also alone because Palace stayed deep) and got more and more nervous as the game went (was booked, and if I remember well it was McNaughton playing with his nerves)

I easily see a bright future for Clyne and Moses. I'm not that optimistic about Zaha

Otherwise I completely agree with the second part of your message !

Without trying to 'derail' the thread, with Wilfried Zaha i do think he can have a big future because when i've seen him, he seems to show no fear and raw talent. He has every trick in the book and so much pace and seems strong too, very often brushes off challenges and keeps going but also can be a bit theatrical and go down easy too but if he wants to stay up, he will. As a guy who is only 19, a top club could do wonders with him improving him with elements of play with what he already has. In the 2nd leg of the Carling Cup semi with Cardiff, he was like the lone ranger, he tried so hard to do something but tired a lot from around the 75th minute. Maybe a bit greedy but i can see him going up to the next level in the not too distant future to maybe a Wigan or a Sunderland and then we'll see him improve and maybe go to a bigger team a few years later.

To end back on topic with a point on Moses, as i've said i'm all for the transfer but i am wondering too what formation we'll be adopting and what are we trying to do. We do seem to have a lot of players and aiming for more with the same types of qualities, i hope we don't end up making 3 or 4 quality talented players rot and their careers accumulate to fuck all.

[Kojo 4,676]

how many times has sturridge led the line as a lone striker???

He did it a few times at Bolton when Elmander worked behind him, and he just used to work really hard.

Then he did it twice last season, once against Sunderland had a good game scored, had a half against blackburn as one. Should've had a penalty that game when Samba had to push him from behind, he had a decent game then, just couldn't get a goal because there was no creativity, as usual...

[themightyblue 443]

As has been said so many times before, If we sign Hulk he can play CF. So that's 3 CF's right there. No need to buy an out and out Striker. Also, Sturridge is unproven as a striker? That is truly rich as he has played CF his entire life...It's also obvious he has Talent. We shouldn't give up on him just yet.

All I've said is that rather than shunning the idea of Moses and hulk if that's what the club wanna do then there's gonna be a reason behind it. There's no guarantee that Danny is staying. We wanted giroud and hulk, so clearly something is up

[zolayes 14,489]

He did it a few times at Bolton when Elmander worked behind him, and he just used to work really hard.

Then he did it twice last season, once against Sunderland had a good game scored, had a half against blackburn as one. Should've had a penalty that game when Samba had to push him from behind, he had a decent game then, just couldn't get a goal because there was no creativity, as usual...

At Bolton he played in a two with Kevin Davies.. To my mind a handful of starts as the main striker means unproven

[BlueLyon 9,359]

Was Evra top class when he came to United? How about Vidic, Valencia, Chicarito, Park,...?

We should buy such player and he has to PLAY regulary then. Not just to be squad player or sub...Slowly he has to start and yes, we would have one shit season, but next year we would have very strong team consisted with young players WE made superstars. Instead of spending milions on already made superstars...

I dont see why we couldnt have United style, they have some own players, and mostly young cheap players that they turned into class players.

If Dortmund, Porto, Arsenal, United, Barca, Real can have at least few players they bought for cheap and now they are class or they are part of their youth academies, then so can we have such players. Moses would be good, maybe first two months as begginer and then regular starter after october.

If we will keep buying top prospects just to be our 'squad players', 'bench warmers', talents,...they will NEVER become good. As soon some player comes, you give him few games, then more and more. Bertrand is fine example, but if we had Zhirkow or whoever else also in the team, Bertrand would never be that

good for us.

At one point you want Lukaku to get chances, at other point to get another world class striker. Now tell me how the fuck is Lukaku going to be good if Falcao or whoever will play as our striker? If you are sub, you will never become good...Lukaku needs to start games and constantly play, i we get Falcao he wont have smallest chance to play regulary. On loan in Netherlands, you gain nothing but lose years. Xavi, Iniesta or such players would never be good if Barca wouldnt keep playing them.

Getting such exciting talent as Moses is great thing, but has to be used properly. If we will think of him as a sub now, he will always be sub. If we will play him enough to start regulary, he could be world-beater. And RDM will do it, if Moses comes.

[Kojo 4,676]

At Bolton he played in a two with Kevin Davies.. To my mind a handful of starts as the main striker means unproven

Not all the time he didn't. I remember watching one match against West Ham when he scored twice. Elmander and Kevin Davies where playing behind him, Davies was next to him on paper but not in a match. It's the same thing, only a little unproven but not unproven. And we cannot go off and buy some forward for 20 million. We need to use our players otherwise whats the point, i want Sturridge to develope but how will he if we buy a striker.

He's confident and he has a responsibility, but if we buy another striker he wont get any games.