🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 Frank Lampard

[Tomo 21,751]

21 minutes ago, communicate said:

It is pretty obvious what is our problem after 3 games, defensive transition. The solution is pretty simple, either we play Willian to slow our offense down, play another destroyer next to Kante (Bakayoko) or pray that our forward line will be clinical. 

I disagree, while it may be a ok ish short term option these sticky plaster solutions is a big part of why we're in this shit in the first place. With Pep about the league is out of reach for the next 2/3 years so we need to turn that negative into a positive and build something to compete in the long run (pragmatic quick fixes just won't cut it now).

If this is the vision Lampard has for us i'd rather go full steam ahead and take the teething process.

[Supermonkey92 1,428]

'It's like watching a basketball game... they have got no organisation in possession': Jamie Carragher critical of Chelsea's style under Frank Lampard
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-7372829/Jamie-Carragher-SLAMS-Chelseas-start-season-singles-shocking-Willian.html

I somewhat agree.

But my main problem against Leicester was the midfield 2. They had no organisation when we had possession so when we lost it there was no barrier to Leicester waltzing up to our defence. Kante spent so much time in positions he would take last season in a three man midfield - almost on the right wing. We can't have that in a 4231.

Some defensive improvements have happened since old Trafford. Azpi for instance is staying back whilst Emerson goes forward. But that's a much more straightforward change than getting the double pivot to work well in and out of possession.

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[Supermonkey92 1,428]

I think frank solves much of the problems by choosing the same formation as last year but by continuing to give players license to get forward which cesc was clear in saying sarri stopped after that arsenal home game.

Against Liverpool we were great. Mainly because we were *balanced*.

The problem is Frank's seems pretty set on the 4231 being his style, or the formation he wants this year with these players at least. If that's how it is top 6 is in trouble, I just hope this season is sacrificed for actual progression in the next. I'm actually a bit more chipper about Frank's chances on changing things though, he's a smart guy. Get that pivot working or drop it mate!!

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[communicate 2,703]

1 hour ago, Tomo said:

I disagree, while it may be a ok ish short term option these sticky plaster solutions is a big part of why we're in this shit in the first place. With Pep about the league is out of reach for the next 2/3 years so we need to turn that negative into a positive and build something to compete in the long run (pragmatic quick fixes just won't cut it now).

If this is the vision Lampard has for us i'd rather go full steam ahead and take the teething process.

What is Lampard vision? If he want to play frenetic pace and end to end then may as well try Bakayoko. There is 0 reason to play Jorginho if he want to play that way. 

 

 

[!Hazard! 3,394]

Lampard might have to do what Sarri and Conte did as well, play false 9 to give us more control and compactness in midfield. It's hardly a risk considering how shit our strikers are and Mason Mount might just be a better goalscorer than any of them

[communicate 2,703]

1 minute ago, !Hazard! said:

Lampard might have to do what Sarri and Conte did as well, play false 9 to give us more control and compactness in midfield. It's hardly a risk considering how shit our strikers are and Mason Mount might just be a better goalscorer than any of them

False 9 was used not because of compactness, it was simply because Hazard is useless defensively. There is no reason to play false 9 with Puli and Pedro 

[manpe 10,861]

3 hours ago, Vesper said:

Anyone, and I am going to be blunt as hell on this, anyone who would say that 5th place with this team is not a success for a first year ever topflight manager, simply, and let me be clear as crystal, does not know SHIT about football.

We lost our best player, a top 5 or so in the world talent, have a 2 window transfer ban, have pure shit for strikers, crazy injuries, and have one of the worst boards (over the last 5 years) of a top 20 team, who positively FUCKED us with shit buys, horrid sales, worse non-sales, rotten cock-ups on attempted buys, AND GOT US THE FUCKING BANS in the first place.

Every top half of the table team is improved in the EPL except us. The top 6, 7 are improved dramatically, save for the dippers. 5th place would be a success, and hopefully we can nick a trophy (League Cup or FA Cup or even better, drop down via 3rd place CL group stage and win the EL again, which gives us CL footie guaranteed next year and another shot at the Super Cup.)

Preach! Your best post in my eyes. I will not blame Frank for anything this season (unless he literally comes to training naked and foaming from mouth), enough blaming the managers, everybody will lose their shit with a toxic criminal mob incompetently running the workplace.

 

11 minutes ago, !Hazard! said:

Lampard might have to do what Sarri and Conte did as well, play false 9 to give us more control and compactness in midfield. It's hardly a risk considering how shit our strikers are and Mason Mount might just be a better goalscorer than any of them

I'd rather try this with RLC than Mount. He is strong enough to offer a long hold-up option, quick enough to make runs in behind and good enough technically to create for others and himself.

[!Hazard! 3,394]

14 minutes ago, communicate said:

False 9 was used not because of compactness, it was simply because Hazard is useless defensively. There is no reason to play false 9 with Puli and Pedro 

You are completely right, it was used mainly because of Hazard's lack of defensive effort in wide areas but I think it also gave us more presence and compactness in midfield due to the extra man and that's exactly what it would do in our current team as well. Of course Hazard, even in that false 9 position, didn't contribute much defensively in central areas but Mount certainly would and it could be a temporary solution until we sign a real striker and figure out a proper balance for that midfield. Mount and Barkley/Loftus-Cheek as false 9 and number 10 could be similar to how Tadic and Van de Beek play for Ajax in their (not that different from ours) system.

[communicate 2,703]

Realistically what is our future starting 11

Striker

CHO - Mount - Puli

Ruben - Kante

Emerson - Rudi - Zouma/Chris - RB

Kepa

That look tasty on paper but it means Our rb has to be really2 good defensively. It is a shame we lost awb to united.

Ruben also need to be brilliant because, basically he will have to play pogba role. 

 

[MoroccanBlue 5,382]

Not convinced Ruben can be effective playing that deep. Not the type to lead a transition 

[communicate 2,703]

Just now, MoroccanBlue said:

Not convinced Ruben can be effective playing that deep. Not the type to lead a transition 

 

Just now, MoroccanBlue said:

Not convinced Ruben can be effective playing that deep. Not the type to lead a transition 

I agree, he is better of playing higher. It mean we can only play either mount or ruben 

[MoroccanBlue 5,382]

4 minutes ago, communicate said:

 

I agree, he is better of playing higher. It mean we can only play either mount or ruben 

Not bad options to have as CAM

[Jase 43,479]

24 minutes ago, !Hazard! said:

Lampard might have to do what Sarri and Conte did as well, play false 9 to give us more control and compactness in midfield. It's hardly a risk considering how shit our strikers are and Mason Mount might just be a better goalscorer than any of them

Oh god. Can we stop with this False 9 nonsense? As @communicate mentioned, we only played False 9 in the past because Hazard wasn't the greatest at his defensive work and we needed players to cover the wide areas. While that made defensively sound in the past, it got us nowhere going forward. And right now, we need Lampard to choose a settled system and XI so that we can get consistent performances out of players. This constant chopping and changing, especially when you consider the type of our last 2 managers, isn't going to help us.

[Tomo 21,751]

31 minutes ago, manpe said:

I'd rather try this with RLC than Mount. He is strong enough to offer a long hold-up option, quick enough to make runs in behind and good enough technically to create for others and himself.

I could see it working with Mount more than RLC tbh, Mount will have a better understanding of that role tactically (when to press, when to drop back, drift wide etc), he could potentially be Firminho lite if given a run there. Furthermore playing Ruben there will neglect his biggest strength's of darting attacking runs turning a midfield situation into dangerous attack.

That said i'd rather we not tried it atall, but if we did the role should either go to Mason or Callum in my opinion.

[communicate 2,703]

22 minutes ago, !Hazard! said:

You are completely right, it was used mainly because of Hazard's lack of defensive effort in wide areas but I think it also gave us more presence and compactness in midfield due to the extra man and that's exactly what it would do in our current team as well. Of course Hazard, even in that false 9 position, didn't contribute much defensively in central areas but Mount certainly would and it could be a temporary solution until we sign a real striker and figure out a proper balance for that midfield. Mount and Barkley/Loftus-Cheek as false 9 and number 10 could be similar to how Tadic and Van de Beek play for Ajax in their (not that different from ours) system.

I don't think striker is our biggest problem. Giroud is perfectly fine for now.

Defensively, I think right now transition defense is my biggest concern and set pieces. It won't be fix by playing a false 9.

 

 

 

[Vesper 30,190]

12 minutes ago, communicate said:

I don't think striker is our biggest problem. Giroud is perfectly fine for now.

[Atomiswave 6,117]

4 hours ago, Vesper said:

Anyone, and I am going to be blunt as hell on this, anyone who would say that 5th place with this team is not a success for a first year ever topflight manager, simply, and let me be clear as crystal, does not know SHIT about football.

We lost our best player, a top 5 or so in the world talent, have a 2 window transfer ban, have pure shit for strikers, crazy injuries, and have one of the worst boards (over the last 5 years) of a top 20 team, who positively FUCKED us with shit buys, horrid sales, worse non-sales, rotten cock-ups on attempted buys, AND GOT US THE FUCKING BANS in the first place.

Every top half of the table team is improved in the EPL except us. The top 6, 7 are improved dramatically, save for the dippers. 5th place would be a success, and hopefully we can nick a trophy (League Cup or FA Cup or even better, drop down via 3rd place CL group stage and win the EL again, which gives us CL footie guaranteed next year and another shot at the Super Cup.)

You fucking preach sister......awesome stuff right there and spot fucking on, my view to the bone.

51 minutes ago, communicate said:

I don't think striker is our biggest problem. Giroud is perfectly fine for now.

Defensively, I think right now transition defense is my biggest concern and set pieces. It won't be fix by playing a false 9.

 

 

 

Sorry mate but if there is one area we are lacking BIG TIME compared to practically any epl team is indeed strikers. The board has utterly neglicted that area for years and took everything for granted. Its borderline negligence what we are seeing, they didnt even have a slight foresight and vision what we need and might need in the future, hence we have been striker-less since Costa.

[milka 3,393]

 Olivier Giroud - Quintessential Targetman. Excellent at hold-up play, linking with the AMs & creating chances.

Tammy Abraham - more of a poacher; doesn't link attacks enough

Michy Batshuayi - plays off the shoulder meaning players behind him will struggle to get in behind

[Vesper 30,190]

31 minutes ago, Atomiswave said:

Sorry mate but if there is one area we are lacking BIG TIME compared to practically any epl team is indeed strikers. The board has utterly neglicted that area for years and took everything for granted. Its borderline negligence what we are seeing, they didnt even have a slight foresight and vision what we need and might need in the future, hence we have been striker-less since Costa.

let's see

buy a 23 yo striker well on his way to scoring 30 goals (he got there) and OWN him outright for £31m (Piątek) who is on a little less than £60k PW wages as well

OR

spend £15m on a SIX MONTH LOAN (fees plus wages) for a washed up 30-something Higuain, with a buy option that would put his overall cost for 2 and a half years (on his current wages of £270K PW plus loan fees and the redemption fee) AT £81m (counting all loan/transfer fees and his ridiculous 35 million quid in wages for the 2 and a half years)

Piątek's entire current 4 year contract is less than Higs makes in 11 months, wage wise (I assume we would, TBF, pay him a lot more than £60K PW, but NOWHERE near the insane £270K PW Higs was/is stealing)

In Euros

all that

KNOWING THE BANS ARE COMING (if little me knew, the bloody board certainly knew)

that is us in a nutshell

[Atomiswave 6,117]

20 minutes ago, Vesper said:

let's see

buy a 23 yo striker well on his way to scoring 30 goals (he got there) and OWN him outright for £31m (Piątek) who is on a little less than £60k PW wages as well

OR

spend £15m on a SIX MONTH LOAN (fees plus wages) for a washed up 30-something Higuain, with a buy option that would put his overall cost for 2 and a half years (on his current wages of £270K PW plus loan fees and the redemption fee) AT £81m (counting all loan/transfer fees and his ridiculous 35 million quid in wages for the 2 and a half years)

Piątek's entire current 4 year contract is less than Higs makes in 11 months, wage wise (I assume we would, TBF, pay him a lot more than £60K PW, but NOWHERE near the insane £270K PW Higs was/is stealing)

In Euros

all that

KNOWING THE BANS ARE COMING (if little me knew, the bloody board certainly knew)

that is us in a nutshell

I have no word for that. There is no language, no tongue that can explain such utter incompetence. Thats again because we have no footy folks taking the crucial decisions. This is what you get end of. I see Marina as cancer when it comes to getting players, she is good with sponsors etc, that she is. But getting players in, going for the kill and get quality additions.....its just not her forte. I dont care if its a man or woman, or an alien, as long as they know what they doing ........look at arsenal now, they brought in a couple of experienced heads, look at their buys since then, good additions, acts fast. We have none of that.