8. Enzo Fernandez

[Thor 2,361]

2 minutes ago, Superblue said:

This isn't a situation that is going to simply blow over and nor should it.

Enzo is going to be the fall guy amongst this due to being the moron streaming it, but this actually goes way beyond him and is particularly a significant problem in parts of South America, and very much Argentina.

The culture is so different, and what the West in particular may find offensive/racist/homophobic, etc they simply don't. I don't think the large majority of them are naturally racist people, including Enzo and the Argentina football squad, but ultimately they are coming over to European football and as a result greater consideration needs to be taken into how their culture successfully adapts within our own.

I don't think this is necessarily the end for Enzo at Chelsea, but it comes down to him being prepared to learn a real hard lesson about his actions. The fact that he's released an apology is at least a starting point, but it is literally the start of him having to rebuild bridges and mend relationships. The French/African/black players at the club have every right to be angry right now and expect apologies, actions, sanctions put in place. 

The club actually have an opportunity here to come out of this situation quite well if they can deal with it appropriately.

I tend to agree with this. 

Culture plays a big part in this. Something that is open and free to talk about somewhere is not necessarily the case elsewhere. A lot of these footballers haven't experienced real life, nor life in other parts of the world until their adult life begins. They carry their upbringing with them. 

I don't think Enzo is racist. I think he is stupid. Dumb and young. 

Saying that though - who knows what happens from the situation. Him leaving may be the only option - but I agree that the club could come good from this and a learning moment could arise. Obviously down to our players internally as well. Him leaving may be for the best, but it could be a teaching for him and others internally as to how to make things better moving forward. 

[Duppy Conqueror 1,494]

I only have one Argentinian friend.he's a photographer for live events,sports and concerts etc... i've yet to see him lock the door when he takes a shit..i guess they are just wired differently.

I wouldn't suspend him,just send him to our french sister club indefinately.

[Thor 2,361]

13 minutes ago, Duppy Conqueror said:

I only have one Argentinian friend.he's a photographer for live events,sports and concerts etc... i've yet to see him lock the door when he takes a shit..i guess they are just wired differently.

I wouldn't suspend him,just send him to our french sister club indefinately.

Your friend or Enzo? 

[ZAPHOD2319 4,405]

 

[Superblue 6,370]

17 minutes ago, Thor said:

I tend to agree with this. 

Culture plays a big part in this. Something that is open and free to talk about somewhere is not necessarily the case elsewhere. A lot of these footballers haven't experienced real life, nor life in other parts of the world until their adult life begins. They carry their upbringing with them. 

I don't think Enzo is racist. I think he is stupid. Dumb and young. 

Saying that though - who knows what happens from the situation. Him leaving may be the only option - but I agree that the club could come good from this and a learning moment could arise. Obviously down to our players internally as well. Him leaving may be for the best, but it could be a teaching for him and others internally as to how to make things better moving forward. 

I think two things need to come from this.

From Enzo's end, he must take responsibility and be willing to learn and understand the culture in this part of the world and that understanding and consideration extends to when he's back home too. He must ultimately also show he's prepared to face up to this and deal with the players and people he has upset in person, and show a want to build those relationships. Actually keeping him away I don't think solves anything. 

And from the players end such as Fofana, Disasi, etc, they should be willing to forgive IF Enzo is genuine and takes steps to learning from this. I'm obviously talking from a place where I haven't suffered racism or discrimination, but I've always believed that discrimination requires education, and if somebody makes that mistake and is willing and readily wants to be educated to understand why they've caused upset and how they can improve themselves as humans to be kinder and thoughtful to everyone, then surely that person deserves a second chance.

It's easy to forget here too, that the FA could and probably will punish Enzo and the other Premier League players involved in that video. 

[NikkiCFC 7,884]

37 minutes ago, Arlen Correa said:

 

In the case of some of their players, fans and journalists, something happen that is very hard to explain to europeans. Many times they will say or do things that are obvioulsly racist to us, but they apparently are not aware of how serious things are. And is not like if the person is really racist on his/her normal life.  For example, when they talk about races and nationalities, they dont see it as a big deal. In general they will insult everybody, from germans to africans. Is not because some specific race. 

 

20 minutes ago, Superblue said:

 but this actually goes way beyond him and is particularly a significant problem in parts of South America, and very much Argentina.

The culture is so different, and what the West in particular may find offensive/racist/homophobic, etc they simply don't. I don't think the large majority of them are naturally racist people, including Enzo and the Argentina football squad, but ultimately they are coming over to European football and as a result greater consideration needs to be taken into how their culture successfully adapts within our own.

This is all true but not only in parts of South America but in general in 'one race' countries. People in Serbia, Russia, China, Argentina can do racist thing and if you point it out to them they will not understand why that is racist. Obviously these countries don't have multicultural background and history of diversity like for example USA, UK, France who are now decades into education and trying to make things better because of the dark history they have themselves about racism. They are now very sensitive regarding this topic as they should be because this is their daily life. But Argentina, Serbia and countries like that are 100 years away from this because this is not topic at all. Only black people you will see are some sport players here for example. I lived in USA and Amsterdam so learned how perspective is completely different. It's just incomparable. When Cavani used word 'negro' nobody in South America cared because this is daily talk there until someone in England made a fuss about it. Same here. French are angry this is big issue but Argentinians don't understand what is the problem. Completely different cultures and it's very hard to explain to someone in France or UK this. Like you said, I don't believe anyone in Argentinian squad is racist. Hopefully they understand each other and move on. 

[bluesman2610 1,337]

2 hours ago, NikkiCFC said:

Any lawyers here? Does this have legs on court? Because apparently French federation wants to take it there. What if they defend with: we were celebrating diversity, we like them for their origin, it's factual song, we don't know why they are offended? 

 

No one else finds it weird that the song they are signing is about the French when they played Colombia in the final another predominantly black team.

[NikkiCFC 7,884]

 

[bluesman2610 1,337]

3 minutes ago, NikkiCFC said:

 

And this is the problem. When you see nothing wrong with Enzo and the Argentines actions you are a part of the problem.

[whats happening 1,517]

i would ban him for at least 5 games. if we gets mad about that send him to the reserves until sold.

[LAM09 6,683]

4 hours ago, NikkiCFC said:

Is this going to be a issue only in Chelsea? Looks like full squad singing that song. Liverpool, Inter and Atletico also have players in both national teams. Will Thuram be angry with Lautaro? Konate with AMA? Griezmann is white tho and already had racist history so no issues in Atletico. 

 

[Thor 2,361]

9 minutes ago, LAM09 said:

 

Ah of course. Coincidentally all the biggest players. 

[Vesper 28,291]

1 hour ago, NikkiCFC said:

 

so many of those are trolls trying to shit stir

fuck social media randos

[Vesper 28,291]

We are insane if we sell Enzo over this 

fine him, sure

but have him meet with the players and work it out

[LAM09 6,683]

11 minutes ago, Thor said:

Ah of course. Coincidentally all the biggest players. 

Martinez (the United one) was on a video call in the background while Alvarez was sat next to Enzo.

It goes to prove that the players on that list are more sensible.  

7 minutes ago, Vesper said:

We are insane if we sell Enzo over this 

fine him, sure

but have him meet with the players and work it out

A number of players have already unfollowed him, making their feelings known indirectly. How does any "bad blood" magically disappear & not cause friction amongst sections of the squad?

Edited July 17 by LAM09

[Vesper 28,291]

3 minutes ago, LAM09 said:

A number of players have already unfollowed him, making their feelings known indirectly. How does any "bad blood" magically disappear & not cause friction amongst sections of the squad?

through talking it out

they are professionals

 

also, related, look at this Villa RW jew trying to shit stir (about Fofana)

 

[Vesper 28,291]

2 hours ago, ZAPHOD2319 said:

 

why did he use the Comic Sans font?

ffs, lololol

[Thor 2,361]

It’s probably best he leave. 
 

To be honest - his actions here are probably less racist than what Sam Kerr did recently and she stayed at the club. 
She actually acted on her own and berated a taxi driver racially. Yet she’s still at the club. 
 

Could be a case of far less eyes on the women’s game but still - if they could get past one thing then this is surely something they consider?