🇮🇹 Jorginho

[Magic Lamps 11,692]

As good as he is for italy ( he was average today but sublime in almost all other games), he can never replicate this form fully. For italy he has 2 somewhat creative-ish players around him who also run a lot in Barella and verrati/locatelli. For us he only has kante whose attacking output is erratic but who runs for 3. so defensively we usually look good if he does not make his 1 every 7 games stupid mistake. But offensively we will never be threatening from midfield with him and Kante there. We could work around that if we had real goalscorer up front but currently we don't so he gets a lot of slack. But given their age, Kante Jorginho is not a long term solution and I sure as hell would like to have a more offensive and athletic midfield for our next great team. Jorginho has his perks and i had to watch a lot of italy games to fully appreciate them but for us I just don't see him giving enough both in terms of athleticism and creativity/attacking output to make us serial title winners again.

[NikkiCFC 8,324]

1 hour ago, Jas said:

@NikkiCFC If England win the Euros, are you gonna champion for Mount to win the Ballon d'Or, like you do with Jorginho? 😆

We were joking about Chris, Emerson, Mount winning it if their NT win EURO so that is in that category.

With Jorginho is serious. And there are many who think the same... Definitely in top10. Today Barella and Verratti both got replaced and 3 attackers but not only Jorginho.

 

[NikkiCFC 8,324]

 

[Jase 43,479]

6 hours ago, NikkiCFC said:

We were joking about Chris, Emerson, Mount winning it if their NT win EURO so that is in that category.

Am asking a hypothetical question. What if England win the Euros and suddenly there's calls for Mount to win it? Are you gonna support it like you do with Jorginho? 

6 hours ago, NikkiCFC said:

With Jorginho is serious. And there are many who think the same... Definitely in top10. Today Barella and Verratti both got replaced and 3 attackers but not only Jorginho.

I have only seen the calls for Jorginho to win it coming from the Italy camp (what a surprise!) and his "father". Otherwise, I've not seen this being a universal call.

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

Struggled to influence the game as much as he would usually want to but he was up against Busquets, who again, is still one of the very best in that position and was excellent throughout. As posted above though, still made a lot of interceptions v Spain, which tbf the defensive side of his game has been excellent all tournament and its always one he’s criticised for. 

I mean if Italy go all the way and win the Euros and he plays excellently in another match, there will still be people saying we should get rid of him despite him showing he is clearly Italy’s most important midfielder in that group and showing exactly how good he is in most of the games.

I can’t wait to see whoever they play in the final, which it’ll probably be England, so we can see how much of a superior player he is to Declan Rice and Kalvin Phillips tbf. 

The Ballon d’Or thing is gaining traction will be interesting to see where he ranks 😂 I just hope he continues his form here when he comes back as he’s playing at such a high level because he will be the first name on the team sheet if so if he maintains that level of performance, really can’t think of many MFers who have played as well as he has at the Euros. 

Edited July 7, 2021 by OneMoSalah

[Tomo 21,751]

4 hours ago, Jas said:

Am asking a hypothetical question. What if England win the Euros and suddenly there's calls for Mount to win it? Are you gonna support it like you do with Jorginho? 

I have only seen the calls for Jorginho to win it coming from the Italy camp (what a surprise!) and his "father". Otherwise, I've not seen this being a universal call.

It would be absolutely hilarious if Jorgi or Mount won it.

So many bitter rants will be unleashed.

[Clockwork 1,794]

5 hours ago, Jas said:

Am asking a hypothetical question. What if England win the Euros and suddenly there's calls for Mount to win it? Are you gonna support it like you do with Jorginho? 

I have only seen the calls for Jorginho to win it coming from the Italy camp (what a surprise!) and his "father". Otherwise, I've not seen this being a universal call.

Mount has not been arguably the best player in the tournament, Jorginho has.

[Jase 43,479]

1 hour ago, Clockwork said:

Mount has not been arguably the best player in the tournament, Jorginho has.

As I mentioned, "club and country". Jorginho may have been the player of the tournament so far but he certainly wasn't the best player of the season for us last season. 

And doesn't the Ballon d'Or award take place later in the year or early next year? Still plenty of time for perceptions to be changed.

[Jase 43,479]

2 hours ago, Tomo said:

It would be absolutely hilarious if Jorgi or Mount won it.

So many bitter rants will be unleashed.

For entertainment purposes, Mount winning would be more hilarious.

And IF either one wins, it would be something considering we had thought Hazard would win it in the past with us. 

[Tomo 21,751]

16 minutes ago, Jas said:

For entertainment purposes, Mount winning would be more hilarious.

And IF either one wins, it would be something considering we had thought Hazard would win it in the past with us. 

On here would be the Mount rants, The Shed will have the Jorginho one's. 

[NikkiCFC 8,324]

Incomparable. Mount is favourite player for 90% of Chelsea fans. Only 10% are bushing him. With Jorginho is opposite. 90% of Chelsea fans think he is semi pro player and should be sold. This is my impression. 

[Tomo 21,751]

10 minutes ago, NikkiCFC said:

Incomparable. Mount is favourite player for 90% of Chelsea fans. Only 10% are bushing him. With Jorginho is opposite. 90% of Chelsea fans think he is semi pro player and should be sold. This is my impression. 

Largely because Tuchel coming in and picking him (aswell as Mourinho and Sarri both saying/strongly implying they would pick him if he was their player) has destroyed the narrative he was only playing because he was a pet of Lampard and Southgate. 

Jorginho is a vocal minority that genuinely think he's rubbish, a few more jumped on the bandwagon because they needed someone to take their frustrations on Lampard's sacking out on.

[Jase 43,479]

40 minutes ago, Tomo said:

On here would be the Mount rants, The Shed will have the Jorginho one's. 

And places like Twitter, you get both. 😆

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

2 hours ago, Tomo said:

Largely because Tuchel coming in and picking him (aswell as Mourinho and Sarri both saying/strongly implying they would pick him if he was their player) has destroyed the narrative he was only playing because he was a pet of Lampard and Southgate. 

Jorginho is a vocal minority that genuinely think he's rubbish, a few more jumped on the bandwagon because they needed someone to take their frustrations on Lampard's sacking out on.

Even then, the Jorginho bashing from our fans now is probably still the same individuals who bashed Sarri for playing him because it meant “playing Kante out of position” and whatever other nonsense 😂

The irony is all that shit came from idiot pundits on TV who questioned Sarri using Ngolo as a RCM in a 3 man MF despite the fact 1) they’d probably rarely seen Ngolo play in a 3 man MF in the PL and 2) have probably never seen him play as an actual number 6 who holds his position in any team. The likes of Gary Lineker, Alan Shearer, Jermaine Jenas, Rio Ferdinand and whatever/whoever else were great players (except Jenas he was shite) but clear examples of being a great player (or a shite one for Jermaine Jenas) doesn’t mean they know a great deal about football to same depth that coaches do.

Him and Mason have definitely proved a lot of people wrong and perhaps unfairly they’ve had to. 

Edited July 7, 2021 by OneMoSalah

[Tomo 21,751]

27 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

2) have probably never seen him play as an actual number 6 who holds his position in any team.

Actually that's wrong, Conte tried it and it went so well he overhauled the entire system.

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

11 minutes ago, Tomo said:

Actually that's wrong, Conte tried it and it went so well he overhauled the entire system.

Aye thats right. First however many games before he switched to 3421/343. Forgot about those. 

Edited July 7, 2021 by OneMoSalah

[NikkiCFC 8,324]

1 hour ago, OneMoSalah said:

Even then, the Jorginho bashing from our fans now is probably still the same individuals who bashed Sarri for playing him because it meant “playing Kante out of position” and whatever other nonsense 😂

The irony is all that shit came from idiot pundits on TV who questioned Sarri using Ngolo as a RCM in a 3 man MF 

The same pundits who criticised Sarri for that later praised Frank for doing the same. Jamie Redknapp also. 

[Vesper 30,186]

9 hours ago, NikkiCFC said:

Incomparable. Mount is favourite player for 90% of Chelsea fans. Only 10% are bushing him. With Jorginho is opposite. 90% of Chelsea fans think he is semi pro player and should be sold. This is my impression. 

Jorginho has won me over under Tuchel. I am not ashamed to admit I was wrong as fuck about him and about Kante (in my defence about Kante, it really WAS just a matter of getting him healthy again, after Sarri ran him into the mud.)

We just need to keep in strengthening with younger players to both augment and eventually replace them in a few years or so. We need an actual physical beast DMF as well, as we have none on the roster, and a creative CMF.

[Vesper 30,186]

9 hours ago, NikkiCFC said:

Incomparable. Mount is favourite player for 90% of Chelsea fans. Only 10% are bushing him. 

A fair chunk of that 10% seem to have a nest here.

 

[Tomo 21,751]

10 minutes ago, Vesper said:

Jorginho has won me over under Tuchel. I am not ashamed to admit I was wrong as fuck about him and about Kante (in my defence about Kante, it really WAS just a matter of getting him healthy again, after Sarri ran him into the mud.)

We just need to keep in strengthening with younger players to both augment and eventually replace them in a few years or so. We need an actual physical beast DMF as well, as we have none on the roster, and a creative CMF.

I actually blame Lampard more for Kante's problems (and I said as much even when I was largely content with his work early on).

He was shoehorning him into every single game he was available for despite the fact we were playing well in his absence (especially vs the lesser sides) and not only was it bad for Kante it buggered our momentum three times. I know Tuchel has utilised a formation better suited to his strengths but I think adequete rotation based on opponents has played just as big a part in his revival, if not more so.

Edited July 7, 2021 by Tomo