🇫🇷 Kurt Zouma

[Tomo 21,751]

28 minutes ago, the wes said:

Why is cahill technically good enough ?? I would have fully fit zouma ahead of cahill any day 

Cahill may not be Bonucci but he is far far more suited to 3 at the back, especially Antonio's 3 at the back, than Zouma ever will be.

[BlueSunshine 672]

3 hours ago, Tomo said:

Cahill may not be Bonucci but he is far far more suited to 3 at the back, especially Antonio's 3 at the back, than Zouma ever will be.

I don't mean any disrespect to your opinion, but i am really amused when people make such definitive statements about something over which they have absolutely no control.

I certainly can't predict Zouma's future, but i can tell you a fact. Zouma is 10 times the player any of Cahil, Bonucci or Chiellni were at the age of 22. Many of you forget that we are talking about a centre back who is that young. Yes, his technique is not good, but this is something that a defender can  easily work upon as he grows older, since it doesn't come in the form of dribbling or flair, like with attacking players.

If we go on to sell Zouma and he manages to stay injury free, i can easily see us regretting it, just like with De Bruyne. He has all the tools to become a very good centre back, especially under Conte's guidance.

[Tomo 21,751]

3 minutes ago, BlueSunshine said:

I don't mean any disrespect to your opinion, but i am really amused when people make such definitive statements about something over which they have absolutely no control.

I certainly can't predict Zouma's future, but i can tell you a fact. Zouma is 10 times the player any of Cahil, Bonucci or Chiellni were at the age of 22. Many of you forget that we are talking about a centre back who is that young. Yes, his technique is not good, but this is something that a defender can  easily work upon as he grows older, since it doesn't come in the form of dribbling or flair, like with attacking players.

If we go on to sell Zouma and he manages to stay injury free, i can easily see us regretting it, just like with De Bruyne. He has all the tools to become a very good centre back, especially under Conte's guidance.

But i bet those CB's were technically more refined even if they weren't better CB's overall, improvement usually comes from a tactical point, going from awkward on the ball to very good just doesn't happen. 

Our CB's are asked to repeatedly pass out of the back these days and only hoof when they are totally boxed in, the wide CB's are often asked to get forward and affect the forward play, as we see Azpi especially do. Cahill will likely lose his place because he is merely standard in those regard's so Zouma who's worse hasn't got a chance. Ofcourse the CB's need to be good at defending too but the way the game is evolving ball playing CB's and even keepers are becoming more and more crucial in a back 4 let alone back 3, and if you don't have the skillset you will be left behind no matter how good defensively you are.

[BlueSunshine 672]

1 hour ago, Tomo said:

But i bet those CB's were technically more refined even if they weren't better CB's overall, improvement usually comes from a tactical point, going from awkward on the ball to very good just doesn't happen. 

Our CB's are asked to repeatedly pass out of the back these days and only hoof when they are totally boxed in, the wide CB's are often asked to get forward and affect the forward play, as we see Azpi especially do. Cahill will likely lose his place because he is merely standard in those regard's so Zouma who's worse hasn't got a chance. Ofcourse the CB's need to be good at defending too but the way the game is evolving ball playing CB's and even keepers are becoming more and more crucial in a back 4 let alone back 3, and if you don't have the skillset you will be left behind no matter how good defensively you are.

I am sure that Cahill and Chiellini were technically just as raw as Zouma at that age. Other than that, i agree 100% with your post about the skillset of the modern centre back, though i believe that Zouma can for example work on his passing and make himself able to pass the ball forward instead of hoofing it, like he does now. All i am saying is that there is a lot of room for improvement, as long as he works really hard and stay injury free.

EDIT :

Something that i wanted to say in my original message but i forgot. We are judging a player's future with the assumption that we will play with 3 centre backs for the remainder of our life. I can easily see us going back to a formation with 4 at the back in the near future, in which case Zouma could be worth keeping around. Sending him on loan for a couple of seasons won't hurt anyone, i just want our club to show that they believe in him.

Edited September 16, 2017 by BlueSunshine

[The Skipper 20,609]

Zouma imo has the belief and work ethic to really work on making himself a good 3ATB defender. Unfortunately he can't really practice well enough at Stoke but after that injury, minutes are more important than anything, needs to get that feel of the game back. 

[the wes 7,212]

 

[the wes 7,212]

Stoke City fans: Kurt Zouma is class, he'll be in Chelsea's first team next season

http://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/stoke-city-fans-kurt-zouma-563678

Cahill next season replacement 😃

[BlueLyon 9,359]

He is doing brilliant so far.

Glad injury didnt leave any serious consequences, he seems even quicker and stroger now. 

Him, Christensen and Rudiger, Azpi...our defence is sorted for years.

[jernej93 569]

7 hours ago, BlueLyon said:

He is doing brilliant so far.

Glad injury didnt leave any serious consequences, he seems even quicker and stroger now. 

Him, Christensen and Rudiger, Azpi...our defence is sorted for years.

And with some fantastic prospects like Clarke-Salter and Tomori our central defence really looks sorted out for years  

I am really pleased with our loanees this year, especially Premier league ones .. Zouma, Abraham and Loftus Cheek are making a big impact and should be in our team next year. Both Tomori and Clarke Salter need those kind of loans next season  

Christensen and Rudiger should become regular starters within this season and Zouma will come back next year with full Premier league season under his belt. Cahill doesn't offer enough to stay here and take minutes away from them  

[Leif 6,006]

We're genuinely the worst at judging our own players, or maybe just me if i'm more honest. Regardless, Stoke City fans who see him week in week out complain about him more than praise. They say he's got awful passing and gets turned inside out against the better forwards of the league. 

When we first signed him, before he played a game for us, I was deluded into thinking he'd basically be a Terry clone. He's definitely more like Cahill, simply less experienced. Neither are better than the other IMO - but of course Zouma's vastly younger, so he should be playing if it has to be one of them.

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

Don’t think him being loaned out was a matter of if he could defend or not, it was more a matter of if he could get used to playing in a back 3 on a regular basis and learn the positioning and learning what to do with the ball. Hopefully he continues to feature for Stoke, he’s done right enough, I don’t think he has any problems physically as we all know but just technically and positionally. He could be back in the squad next year yes but would he feature regularly though?

[the wes 7,212]

Shawcross labels Zouma the 'ultimate defender

https://www.clubcall.com/stoke-city/shawcross-labels-zouma-the-ultimate-defender-1868826.html

[mccg 1,528]

Ryan Shawcross surprised Chelsea allowed 'ultimate defender' Kurt Zouma to leave on loan

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11701/11128404/ryan-shawcross-surprised-chelsea-allowed-ultimate-defender-kurt-zouma-to-leave-on-loan

[Pizy 18,908]

Still not better than any of our CB options other than Cahill. Like RLC, we were absolutely correct to send him on loan.

[Mufassir08 2,400]

12 minutes ago, Pizy said:

Still not better than any of our CB options other than Cahill. Like RLC, we were absolutely correct to send him on loan.

Even though Rudi has had a very good start to his career and is good on the ball and Christensen is like a silent but deadly assassin, I still think Kurt is our best pure defender second only to Azpi. Emphasis being on pure defending only.

[Tomo 21,751]

7 hours ago, Pizy said:

Still not better than any of our CB options other than Cahill. Like RLC, we were absolutely correct to send him on loan.

Cahill's a better option in a back 3. 

[Pizy 18,908]

19 minutes ago, Tomo said:

Cahill's a better option in a back 3. 

Probably true. Honestly, the only spot Zouma could probably play in our back 3 is on the right side. Unfortunately for him, he has the best defender in the league in Azpi to compete with there. He's not nearly comfortable enough on the ball currently to play the other two spots. Cahill already struggles on the left in possision and he's probably a bit better on the ball than Kurt.

Rüdiger offers about the same physicality and athleticism as Zouma does but is far better on the ball and can also fill in as a fullback in emergency situations.

I'm glad he's on our books long term and can definitely play for us but I don't see how he'll be a first choice CB for us any time soon. 

[Unionjack 7,531]

I really hope this loan is good for him. I like Happy. We could use that massive bonce of his to help rubberneck out

Nice write up

From the 'ghost player' to wonderkid: Kurt Zouma's journey

http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/ghost-footballer-to-getting-mentored-by-his-idol-didier/1w9ap5rovdvo41963e7dh1gemx

[Jase 43,479]

 

[whats happening 1,615]

so he's leaving then.