🇧🇷 Oscar

[bababoom 4,478]

He's also a bit hit and miss on the ball, sometimes he looks so good on the ball and is able to dribble past a few players, other times he over runs the ball and gets tackled with ease. Same with his first touch. I cant be the only one who has noticed this?

[BlueLyon 9,359]

Offense wise, he was much much better last year. Together with Hazard and Mata, he was more dynamic, they passed between each other more and played as a team.

Mourinho realy fucked up our attacking trio IMO, it was much nicer to watch it last year.

The video shows it clearly:

[Mohammed Seif 1,451]

I may be coming to the conclusion he isn't that much suited for English football.

I may be coming to the conclusion England is the antitheses for attacking Brazilian players. While I think it requires a lot of reality adaptation for midfielders and defenders, I think it may just not suit attacking players. It's the same old story. As Brazilians we're used to a lot of space, very big pitches and that pretty much formats the way you attack. It's like you're programmed for it. Oscar seems to be feeling more and more everything about England: bad weather on winter, lack of space, too much physicality. It may be too much about him.

I haven't come to the right conclusion yet, but I'm starting to think maybe he should have gone somewhere else and maybe English teams should stop trying to get Brazilians AMs. It seems a misfit.

Too early Barbara. Gotta disagree with you on this one. I think it is too early to judge. First season under Jose, he adapted well to his defensive duties for sure. He is yet to combine that with his offensive ability that most people know he has from his performances with Brazil. I would give it till winter break of next season to get to that conclusion. You may be right at the end, but it is too early to make that decision. Not to mention that most of the time the problem is not with Oscar individually. Most of the fans agree that our offensive approach as a whole is still not quiet there yet. We are playing without a striker too that would force creativity from Oscar and Willian. We praise Schurrle because of his runs and space creation, but he too is inconsistent. Also no body seems to be doing that as often as they should. If Oscar was always the "weakest link" I would agree. I don't think that is the case. We have seen a lot of inconsistencies from our midfielders as a whole. They are still young, adapting like you said and playing under a VERY demanding coach who requires exceptional work rate. Mourinho acknowledges that we are not offensively in the shape he would like. I see him working on this during preseason. I see a diffrent Chelsea next season as far as Oscar, Willian, Hazard, Schurrle and our offensive approach is concerned. Don't give up yet. All in good time.

[Barbara 15,149]

Such a sad post.

As much as I love Oscar, and I really, really do, I wish we still had Mata as our #10. I miss the little guy.

I don't miss him at all when I think the package that he came with. No, thanks.

Oscar might not the answer as much as Mata wasn't. If Oscar isn't, let's move to the next guy that can be, not go back to a clear mistake imo.

Mata isn't more suited for English football - when you take into account the liabilities - any more than Oscar might be. I think Mata should go back to Spain and shine there. He might be one of the best footballers in the world if he does that.

He's also a bit hit and miss on the ball, sometimes he looks so good on the ball and is able to dribble past a few players, other times he over runs the ball and gets tackled with ease. Same with his first touch. I cant be the only one who has noticed this?

What did you expect from a 22yo under development? You can't be the only one not to have noticed his age...

Too early Barbara. Gotta disagree with you on this one. I think it is too early to judge. First season under Jose, he adapted well to his defensive duties for sure. He is yet to combine that with his offensive ability that most people know he has from his performances with Brazil. I would give it till winter break of next season to get to that conclusion. You may be right at the end, but it is too early to make that decision. Not to mention that most of the time the problem is not with Oscar individually. Most of the fans agree that our offensive approach as a whole is still not quiet there yet. We are playing without a striker too that would force creativity from Oscar and Willian. We praise Schurrle because of his runs and space creation, but he too is inconsistent. Also no body seems to be doing that as often as they should. If Oscar was always the "weakest link" I would agree. I don't think that is the case. We have seen a lot of inconsistencies from our midfielders as a whole. They are still young, adapting like you said and playing under a VERY demanding coach who requires exceptional work rate. Mourinho acknowledges that we are not offensively in the shape he would like. I see him working on this during preseason. I see a diffrent Chelsea next season as far as Oscar, Willian, Hazard, Schurrle and our offensive approach is concerned. Don't give up yet. All in good time.

I didn't come to a conclusion yet.

I'm pondering about it.

If Mata with all his flair didn't fit because he lacked everything else that is required to play in England, then it may be more difficult for a guy with way too less flair. Oscar has the work rate, but he looked battered for two whole months. He may overcome all those things, my point is that he may not. Willian seems to struggle a lot too. I don't remember a Brazilian AM well succeeded in England. Sometimes you just don't fit. I'd rather to be otherwise, I'm not sure it is.

I'll agree with you about giving him more time (as well as to Willian), but I think the possibility of it becoming true is there imo.

[LAM09 7,051]

I seems like the majority of attacking Brazilians if not all of them, haven't really succeeded in recent times in the Prem.

[Roquila 1,335]

What has happen'd to you boy ?

[Mohammed Seif 1,451]

I don't miss him at all when I think the package that he came with. No, thanks.

Oscar might not the answer as much as Mata wasn't. If Oscar isn't, let's move to the next guy that can be, not go back to a clear mistake imo.

Mata isn't more suited for English football - when you take into account the liabilities - any more than Oscar might be. I think Mata should go back to Spain and shine there. He might be one of the best footballers in the world if he does that.

What did you expect from a 22yo under development? You can't be the only one not to have noticed his age...

I didn't come to a conclusion yet.

I'm pondering about it.

If Mata with all his flair didn't fit because he lacked everything else that is required to play in England, then it may be more difficult for a guy with way too less flair. Oscar has the work rate, but he looked battered for two whole months. He may overcome all those things, my point is that he may not. Willian seems to struggle a lot too. I don't remember a Brazilian AM well succeeded in England. Sometimes you just don't fit. I'd rather to be otherwise, I'm not sure it is.

I'll agree with you about giving him more time (as well as to Willian), but I think the possibility of it becoming true is there imo.

I will start with the last part I balded. I don't remember I saw that either. I don't also remember having an Egyptian in a top team like Chelsea. Sorry to talk about Salah, but we came to agree about some things. That he is young, needs time and under Jose, he can be moulded into the player Jose wants. How much he succeeds depends on him and how hard he works. Now I will use that to jump to my first balded statement you made, Oscar's age. Oscar born 1991, Salah 1992. Any significant difference? Nope. I can argue that the foundation of Oscar is better than Salah's easily, but is that gap of any significance? Maybe SLIGHTLY. But the fact is Oscar can too be moulded to whatever Jose wants. His defensive game changed A LOT this season and is better than last season. Did it effect him offensively?Yes. But it is only part of a player's development curve and the tasks that Jose gives. I think him being a Brazilian is just part of the pressure he gets currently and raises expectations out of proportion. That is expected coming from the top nation in football but unrealistic at his age. I think Willian will improve if he haves that heart to fight and prove himself, but not as much as Ocar will improve if he too has that fighting heart. Simply because of the age factor. Willian style is more or less defined, but Oscar still has a few years ahead that will shape his style. I haven't seen any young Brazilians in the EPL in early development stages at AM to say he can't make it. I have seen DEVELOPED Brazilians in the EPL who were good but their DEFINED style of play did not suite the EPL. It can turn out either way, but objectively speaking, I think he has much more chances to succeed than fail in the EPL. I would rather see him (like, Salah, Schurrle, Hazard, Azpi, Zouma, Willian and other youngsters) develop slowly and steadily, than have him rise so fast and drop even quicker. Robinho, and Adriano are two examples I can think of in Brazil. There are many more I could mention around the world. They will make it. I can see it in their characters.And I am going to enjoy it as they do make it step by step .

[Barbara 15,149]

I will start with the last part I balded. I don't remember I saw that either. I don't also remember having an Egyptian in a top team like Chelsea. Sorry to talk about Salah, but we came to agree about some things. That he is young, needs time and under Jose, he can be moulded into the player Jose wants. How much he succeeds depends on him and how hard he works. Now I will use that to jump to my first balded statement you made, Oscar's age. Oscar born 1991, Salah 1992. Any significant difference? Nope. I can argue that the foundation of Oscar is better than Salah's easily, but is that gap of any significance? Maybe SLIGHTLY. But the fact is Oscar can too be moulded to whatever Jose wants. His defensive game changed A LOT this season and is better than last season. Did it effect him offensively?Yes. But it is only part of a player's development curve and the tasks that Jose gives. I think him being a Brazilian is just part of the pressure he gets currently and raises expectations out of proportion. That is expected coming from the top nation in football but unrealistic at his age. I think Willian will improve if he haves that heart to fight and prove himself, but not as much as Ocar will improve if he too has that fighting heart. Simply because of the age factor. Willian style is more or less defined, but Oscar still has a few years ahead that will shape his style. I haven't seen any young Brazilians in the EPL in early development stages at AM to say he can't make it. I have seen DEVELOPED Brazilians in the EPL who were good but their DEFINED style of play did not suite the EPL. It can turn out either way, but objectively speaking, I think he has much more chances to succeed than fail in the EPL. I would rather see him (like, Salah, Schurrle, Hazard, Azpi, Zouma, Willian and other youngsters) develop slowly and steadily, than have him rise so fast and drop even quicker. Robinho, and Adriano are two examples I can think of in Brazil. There are many more I could mention around the world. They will make it. I can see it in their characters.And I am going to enjoy it as they do make it step by step .

I don't mind mentioning Salah I just did talking about Hazard I think people are hasty to look to the flags and label people as biased towards their compatriots, but we can talk better about what we know better.

As I said, I'm just pondering. Maybe that's the case, maybe it's not. It's just I never thought about it, which is why I shared my thoughts. I have no doubt for example, Mata could be one of the best players in the world in Spain. Silva has sort of the same limitations as Mata to play the PL, offers sort of the same exposition, but somehow it works on City because the way the whole team is setup, but especially because City only have players older than 25 in their starting XI - which means players in their prime and well experienced. Mata had to deal with a 21yo and a 22yo by his side, a bad pivot, an inconsistent striker. so while City found ways to make up for what Silva exposes with their experienced and prime-time players, we exposed Mata even further with our limitations. But how many teams in the world are like City? It isn't easy to be able to assemble all those players at their peak together. Even RM, Barça, United, Bayern have a couple of younger players playing consistently for them. City only have mature players at their peak. It's a feat on itself imo.

Maybe Oscar will overcome all those things. Maybe we'll be the first successful Brazilian AM in recent English football. Maybe he'll be an exception, maybe it's not an exception and others can be just as successful. I'm not giving up on him - sorry if that's how it sounded - I'm just thinking that something like that may happen (perhaps semantics failed me again and I shouldn't have used the word 'may'. I wanted to stress it as a possibility, among many, not something that is likely to happen). If that's the case 1-2 years from now, I'll happily have him gone. I will happily send him away the same way I did with Mata because if it doesn't work completely, then it doesn't. But I'm definitely willing to give it time. I wouldn't give up on him right now at all. I guess all my posts defending his potential are a testament to that.

[FabHazard 655]

Recently even lallana has moved ahead of him in offensive display...perhaps too much emphasis on defensive duties has stagnated our attacking potential...mourinho must give instructions on how to attack....make them train harder in terms of attack in final third....i like him so much and mourinho should guide him

[kellzfresh 7,229]

Before he completed 7-10 tackles per game and his pressing was visibly seen and he was everywhere on the pitch.

That's what he's lost significantly imo. He just lost all his energy and I don't see the tackles he wins to get the ball to hazard early anymore. When he's not tackling and we know he isn't as creative as mata, he then looks so average and that's exactly what is happening.

Just hope he's not carrying an injury and forcing himself through pain or something like that.

[Muzchap 8,966]

Before he completed 7-10 tackles per game and his pressing was visibly seen and he was everywhere on the pitch.

That's what he's lost significantly imo. He just lost all his energy and I don't see the tackles he wins to get the ball to hazard early anymore. When he's not tackling and we know he isn't as creative as mata, he then looks so average and that's exactly what is happening.

Just hope he's not carrying an injury and forcing himself through pain or something like that.

It's burn out - the guy needs a break....

Think back to the Oscar first 15-20 games of the season and now look at him...

It's nothing but our gruelling hardcore schedule.

He will come good and learn to pace himself physically and mentally.

A summer in Rio is just what he needs!!!

[bethos1 802]

Chelsea face Eden Hazard or Oscar transfer to fund swoops for "real strikers" Diego Costa and Mario Mandkuzic

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/footba...hazard-3362879

If he doesn't step it up I'd consider it to sell Oscar.

[bushman 2,043]

To sell Oscar?

Whom are you kidding? Lol

Oscar may not be built like a brick house, but he makes up for it by his skills. Where are you, those who saw Oscar before January?

Was he not playing well, then? Subsequently he died down a bit, but he must not be sold for any money.

[Reddish-Blue 2,504]

To sell Oscar?

Whom are you kidding? Lol

Oscar may not be built like a brick house, but he makes up for it by his skills. Where are you, those who saw Oscar before January?

Was he not playing well, then? Subsequently he died down a bit, but he must not be sold for any money.

He's died down more than a bit.... He's not even half the player he was before January.

I would put him next to Ramires in the below-par category in terms of recent performances

[Reddish-Blue 2,504]

I will start with the last part I balded. I don't remember I saw that either. I don't also remember having an Egyptian in a top team like Chelsea. Sorry to talk about Salah, but we came to agree about some things. That he is young, needs time and under Jose, he can be moulded into the player Jose wants. How much he succeeds depends on him and how hard he works. Now I will use that to jump to my first balded statement you made, Oscar's age. Oscar born 1991, Salah 1992. Any significant difference? Nope. I can argue that the foundation of Oscar is better than Salah's easily, but is that gap of any significance? Maybe SLIGHTLY. But the fact is Oscar can too be moulded to whatever Jose wants. His defensive game changed A LOT this season and is better than last season. Did it effect him offensively?Yes. But it is only part of a player's development curve and the tasks that Jose gives. I think him being a Brazilian is just part of the pressure he gets currently and raises expectations out of proportion. That is expected coming from the top nation in football but unrealistic at his age. I think Willian will improve if he haves that heart to fight and prove himself, but not as much as Ocar will improve if he too has that fighting heart. Simply because of the age factor. Willian style is more or less defined, but Oscar still has a few years ahead that will shape his style. I haven't seen any young Brazilians in the EPL in early development stages at AM to say he can't make it. I have seen DEVELOPED Brazilians in the EPL who were good but their DEFINED style of play did not suite the EPL. It can turn out either way, but objectively speaking, I think he has much more chances to succeed than fail in the EPL. I would rather see him (like, Salah, Schurrle, Hazard, Azpi, Zouma, Willian and other youngsters) develop slowly and steadily, than have him rise so fast and drop even quicker. Robinho, and Adriano are two examples I can think of in Brazil. There are many more I could mention around the world. They will make it. I can see it in their characters.And I am going to enjoy it as they do make it step by step .

Wasn't Mido one of the first Egyptian's to play at a relatively big EPL club (Tottenham) back in 2005/2006?

[Mohammed Seif 1,451]

True. But come on man it Spurs

[Joe Ay 66]

If Mata wasn't the answer, and now the feel is that Oscar isn't too, who then in world football can fit Mourinho's vision of a Chelsea no. 10? He needs to be able to press high and constantly run, have pace, power, and aggression, and release the ball quickly and with incision...and must be equally adept at transitioning from attack to defence and vice versa...

[bushman 2,043]

He's died down more than a bit.... He's not even half the player he was before January.

I would put him next to Ramires in the below-par category in terms of recent performances

Despite of it, just maybe Jose overworked the poor chap? Mata was benched & Jose worked him, excessively.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

I may be coming to the conclusion he isn't that much suited for English football.

I may be coming to the conclusion England is the antitheses for attacking Brazilian players. While I think it requires a lot of reality adaptation for midfielders and defenders, I think it may just not suit attacking players. It's the same old story. As Brazilians we're used to a lot of space, very big pitches and that pretty much formats the way you attack. It's like you're programmed for it. Oscar seems to be feeling more and more everything about England: bad weather on winter, lack of space, too much physicality. It may be too much about him.

I haven't come to the right conclusion yet, but I'm starting to think maybe he should have gone somewhere else and maybe English teams should stop trying to get Brazilians AMs. It seems a misfit.

Thats just wrong. He is idealy best possible #10 that Mourinho could have, but needs to fullfill his potential. I dont think he is only one who plays ''average'', the whole attack is average. Thats certainly something to do with Mourinho, because last year, our attack was more fluid. It has stagnated since Mou arrival. Defence got better, but attack, not so sure. I dont think its on Oscar to be guilty for his bad form, but also on Mourinho for 1.) not rotating him more 2.) giving him extremely big defensive duties.

I still think Oscar will improve, but definately even next year he wont be consistant. He will reach that level at age 25 or sth when he spends few full seasons in PL and completely understands his role. You have to undertand that first few months, Mou was just watching our players play and Oscar was brilliant. Then Mou (when he finaly knew his players better) started giving team very specific orders on how to play and Oscar's role got very limited.

I think Oscar, to some extent even Hazard and Willian will never realy fullfil their potential here as they might in RM, Barca, Bayern (who are all very offensive teams), but they still can become best as a team and world class individuals, should Mou give them at least a bit of freedom. As they say, once you are scoring goals for fun, defence isnt as important anymore. I remember few years ago, Bayern was in similar position, some big talents, but missing players on several areas, trying to play counter attacking football etc. Ribery needed to completely adapt to his new defensive duties and people were already moving him to big clubs in spain, england,,,,because they thought he wont realy fulfill his role in Bayern. Look what happened, few years of patience, some new players in the team and Ribery is world class winger. Oscar is different role obviously, but the point is same. Give him few years and he will definately become what everyone wants him to be; world class.

As there is a lot of talk about Mou selling Oscar/Hazard to fund striker, I think its just BS, but I realy hope we wont sell most important players; we already need 3 new starters to buy in 1st eleven, selling more players will completely reshape our 11 and we wont win nothing next year. Team needs to play together for some time, you forget that when Mou came to Chelsea (or inter) for first time, he had players in their peak, now he got half of team with bunch of young apples and oranges, required of being put in basket. When he makes complete team, when players will play together for some time, then judge whole project.

There is a great song that says what we need to do, wait:

[BlueLyon 9,359]

If Mata wasn't the answer, and now the feel is that Oscar isn't too, who then in world football can fit Mourinho's vision of a Chelsea no. 10? He needs to be able to press high and constantly run, have pace, power, and aggression, and release the ball quickly and with incision...and must be equally adept at transitioning from attack to defence and vice versa...

I think Mou idealy would have 4:3:3

--RB---CB---CB---LB--

Vidal-Matic-Gundogan

--Willian-ST-Hazard--

But for the best of development, keep it as it is, to fit Mou style, you dont only need inteligence, but also energy/stamina that comes in few seasons. Oscar will come good, he showed it already, give him time.