Eden Hazard

[DDA 9,934]

3 hours ago, Tomo said:

I disagree, i can't think of many other players who could have carried us the way Eden has. Apart from Messi, who can change direction at full speed and still have the ball firmly planted at their feet like Eden can? Who ( again apart from Messi) can change speed while running with the ball like Eden can? All these players who supposedly are much better (Neymar, Suarez, Bale, even Ronaldo) waste possession so much more than Hazard does. Literally everything has been set up for him to fail with us,

He gets clattered numerous times every single game.

Doubled and sometimes tripled up on, 1 on 1? Forget it, not even the likes of Azpi and Alderwierld could live with him 1 vs 1.

Playing with limited team mates, the only players during his time here clever enough to link up with him are Mata, Cesc, Eto'o and Morata and the first three were/are limited by either lack of athleticsm or ageing.

Playing under coaches like Benitez and Mourinho who are hardly reknowned for developing attacking talent, Conte isn't as bad as those two, but equally he isn't Pep or Klopp in the attacking football stakes either.

He has been successful swimming against a tide for his whole time here and those other players have been playing in a lot more favourable conditions that pander to their talents, Hazard has hit the heights he has playing in a team with a lot of limitations. Also in the 15/16 season he was undeniably in the worst form of his career AND had a hip injury (for perspective Eric Lamela has just returned from a year absence due to a hip injury) yet still averaged 2.4 chances created a game, that is ridiculous, and he doesn't even take set pieces, i can't think of many other players who would touch such a positive stat while injured, off form and the club in the worst moment for over 2 decades, Messi probably would, anyone else? Forget it.

If he could add more goals then ofcourse, nobody will be complaining but if he does i want it to be natural evolution, not forced (ala him taking 10 low percentage shots just to score 1) and it shouldn't be used as a deal breaker for him to be a top 3 player, he comfortably is for me and not only that, the best player we have ever had.

I still think it is close between Zola and Hazard for who is the best player to have ever played here.

[manpe 10,861]

10 minutes ago, DDA said:

Listen, again Salah and Sterling have nothing to do with this debate! Why would I even consider mentioning those two names in the same breath as Eden? Because they have scored more goals this season? That is like me saying anyone who has scored more goals than Eden this season is better than him! No, just no. We all know Eden is one of the best players if not the best player in his position in England. I am with everyone here when we wax lyrical about how Eden has carried us single handendly at times. I get extremely frustrated that he has to play alongside a crop of limited professionals. Neymar is without a doubt considered a more effective footballer than Eden at this current point in time. Yes, he has played in extremely attacking teams that cater specifically to his abillities. Yes, if Eden was to play in that Barca team or the current PSG team he would undoubtably be scoring far more goals and assisting far more too but he isn't.. There is a reason why PSG have paid soo much money for him and he is talked about leaving Barca to acheieve the Balon Dor. I know you can't meassure a players ability simply on goals and assists but comon, you seriously believe if Eden started scoring a bag load of goals and assists whilst winning the biggest trophies, he wouldn't start being considered for the highest of awards such as the Balon Dor? 

Ah, I think I finally see your point. You are saying that the global audience would rate him more if he was more prolific, hence the 3rd best player thing being sung only by those who watch English football. Neymar is ahead in popularity contest (Eden isn't even trying to compete tbf) and it's being unjustly translated into him being the better player, but no way anybody can convince me he is better than Hazard, for me he's an overrated possession wasting donkey. I wouldn't take anybody over Hazard in his position, not even Messi or Ronaldo. Love that guy.

[DDA 9,934]

5 minutes ago, manpe said:

Ah, I think I finally see your point. You are saying that the global audience would rate him more if he was more prolific, hence the 3rd best player thing being sung only by those who watch English football. Neymar is ahead in popularity contest (Eden isn't even trying to compete tbf) and it's being unjustly translated into him being the better player, but no way anybody can convince me he is better than Hazard, for me he's an overrated possession wasting donkey. I wouldn't take anybody over Hazard in his position, not even Messi or Ronaldo. Love that guy.

That is exactly what I am saying! I haven't articulated my point well enough lol. I have to say though, I do rate Neymar. You can't deny the lads ability and he does perform on the big stage. Would i rather him than Eden at our club? Hell no. He wouldn't last 2 minutes playing in the Prem. I love Edens character also. Neymar is a little girl.

[manpe 10,861]

Just now, DDA said:

That is exactly what I am saying! I haven't articulated my point well enough lol. I have to say though, I do rate Neymar. You can't deny the lads ability and he does perform on the big stage. Would i rather him than Eden at our club? Hell no. He wouldn't last 2 minutes playing on the Prem. I love Edens character also. Neymar is a little girl.

Neymar is obviously a good player, I don't deny that. But he's overrated so much and I don't like his face.  Hazard is a warrior, he is strong and doesn't mind people kicking the shit out of him. Neymar would eat grass for 80 mins per game than actually do anything, diving champ that he is.

[Leif 6,006]

Players from history who played a similar position/role for their teams, to the same consistently high standard, with the same 1 goal every 3 games output: Ribery, Ronaldinho
Include players who tick those boxes, but have scored more than 1 goal every 3 games: Messi

So using this layman logic he's somewhere around or between those 3. 

[robsblubot 3,595]

On talk chelsea he is indeed top 3, elsewhere he’s top 5-10... lists come up from pundits and players all the time some include Eden, while others do not.

For me the causality cannot possibly be established as easily as some around here claim: too many variables and all the supposition around what he would be able to do in a more attacking side is just that, supposition and wishful thinking from his most ardent fans.

But for the sake of argument, let’s assume we know that he would indeed become top 3 player (Messi shouldn’t be in the mix imo). Then the question I have is why does Eden play for a club that does not make him a better player? A defensive side team instead of attacking minded? Why is he satisfied having to play with these “donkeys” (personally find the idea that he carries a bunch of donkeys nonsense)?

PSG paid Neymar’s release clause and took him increasing his wages... the transfer market is pretty competitive and the best players draw the best wages. So, why is hazard stuck at chelsea? Does he lack ambition? If so, Wouldn’t that also affect his game at chelsea? Does he love chelsea so much? (hope folks aren’t that naive lol)

Finally, he needs to show up at the international stage. It’s usually KDB pulling the strings and Eden pretty subdued in WC/important games.

[Belgiannutt 3,201]

2 hours ago, Robguima said:

On talk chelsea he is indeed top 3, elsewhere he’s top 5-10... lists come up from pundits and players all the time some include Eden, while others do not.

For me the causality cannot possibly be established as easily as some around here claim: too many variables and all the supposition around what he would be able to do in a more attacking side is just that, supposition and wishful thinking from his most ardent fans.

But for the sake of argument, let’s assume we know that he would indeed become top 3 player (Messi shouldn’t be in the mix imo). Then the question I have is why does Eden play for a club that does not make him a better player? A defensive side team instead of attacking minded? Why is he satisfied having to play with these “donkeys” (personally find the idea that he carries a bunch of donkeys nonsense)?

PSG paid Neymar’s release clause and took him increasing his wages... the transfer market is pretty competitive and the best players draw the best wages. So, why is hazard stuck at chelsea? Does he lack ambition? If so, Wouldn’t that also affect his game at chelsea? Does he love chelsea so much? (hope folks aren’t that naive lol)

Finally, he needs to show up at the international stage. It’s usually KDB pulling the strings and Eden pretty subdued in WC/important games.

Hazard improving in a more attacking side is just logical. Sure it's a hypothetical because he hasn't left us for one (yet) but it's based on logic. A more attacking side + more quality will no doubt help attacking players.

Especially if they've been playing for one of the most pragmatic top teams in the world before and still managed to perform at a high level.

 

.Because Hazard doesn't have a release clause. Hazard is our best player. Aslong as Hazard isn't pushing for a move himself i don't think we could be persuaded to sell for any kind of money. 

 

Now why hasn't he pushed for a move himself ? Well there are a number of reasons.

His personality is one. He's a laid back, family man type of guy. He's not a money grabbing a'hole. He's not a diva looking to be in the spotlights all the time.

There's also the fact that even if he'd push for the move it would still take a considerable amount of money to make it happen. Most teams don't have the money to buy Hazard.

He's also not interested in leaving to any other club but Real or Barcelona.(mostly Real though) PSG have been wanting Hazard for years but Hazard himself doesn't want to go back to the french league. 

The german and Italian leagues don't interest him at all. 

So the amount of clubs that can afford him and that Hazard would want to go to are just 2.

People can complain about wanting Hazard to be more ambitious but if Hazard were more ambitious i don't think he would have stayed with us for as long as he has.

About it affecting his game. Look people have different personalities. Not every football player in the world has to be as driven as Ronaldo to succeed. 

Hazard is who he is. His primary goal is to enjoy his football (his life). Considering he's making millions and is widely viewed as one of the top players in the world i'd say it's working for him.

 

Have you actually been watching us ? During and since the European Cup KDB has been the one who's been subdued while Hazard has been the one that performs.

KDB is actually going through a considerable goal drought for our NT. The last time he scored dates back to the 26th of march 2016 against Switserland before the EC.

20 games without a goal.  Hazard on the other hand has 8 goals and 9 assists in 16 games since the EC (including the EC)

 

[robsblubot 3,595]

2 hours ago, Belgiannutt said:

Hazard improving in a more attacking side is just logical. Sure it's a hypothetical because he hasn't left us for one (yet) but it's based on logic. A more attacking side + more quality will no doubt help attacking players.

Especially if they've been playing for one of the most pragmatic top teams in the world before and still managed to perform at a high level.

 

.Because Hazard doesn't have a release clause. Hazard is our best player. Aslong as Hazard isn't pushing for a move himself i don't think we could be persuaded to sell for any kind of money. 

 

Now why hasn't he pushed for a move himself ? Well there are a number of reasons.

His personality is one. He's a laid back, family man type of guy. He's not a money grabbing a'hole. He's not a diva looking to be in the spotlights all the time.

There's also the fact that even if he'd push for the move it would still take a considerable amount of money to make it happen. Most teams don't have the money to buy Hazard.

He's also not interested in leaving to any other club but Real or Barcelona.(mostly Real though) PSG have been wanting Hazard for years but Hazard himself doesn't want to go back to the french league. 

The german and Italian leagues don't interest him at all. 

So the amount of clubs that can afford him and that Hazard would want to go to are just 2.

People can complain about wanting Hazard to be more ambitious but if Hazard were more ambitious i don't think he would have stayed with us for as long as he has.

About it affecting his game. Look people have different personalities. Not every football player in the world has to be as driven as Ronaldo to succeed. 

Hazard is who he is. His primary goal is to enjoy his football (his life). Considering he's making millions and is widely viewed as one of the top players in the world i'd say it's working for him.

 

Have you actually been watching us ? During and since the European Cup KDB has been the one who's been subdued while Hazard has been the one that performs.

KDB is actually going through a considerable goal drought for our NT. The last time he scored dates back to the 26th of march 2016 against Switserland before the EC.

20 games without a goal.  Hazard on the other hand has 8 goals and 9 assists in 16 games since the EC (including the EC)

 

Well I happen to think that Hazard improving in a more attacking side is just wrong and illogical  

why? Because the personal stats, the ones that count when comparing players at the top don’t necessarily increase and often actually decrease...

While the collective attacking output of an attacking side may be higher, the individual stats are divided amongst all attacking players! 

There are only so many assists to be made or only so many goals to be scored. Will a team double the number of goals by sticking a second striker up front? Won’t a single striker score more goals individually if being the focus of the team?

anyway, the (attacking) point is at the very least, debatable.

Yeah you gave me a: he’s a nice guy and loves Chelsea and his life and won’t force a move. Which for me is precisely the reason he will never really compete with the other top players. And I have to confess I don’t particularly buy it: when a top side really wants a player they ultimately get him. 

yes he could force a move like Coutinho is doing right now even when He plays well. It sucks but players do that all the time.

fair enough on the NT but I will refrain my judgement after Russia. 

[Jase 43,479]

 

[Jase 43,479]

8 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

 

 

[Mufassir08 2,400]

Although no player is greater than the club and this move has been on the cards for years now, it would still be heartbreaking to see Eden leave in his prime especially to those arrogant bastards who would boo him at the first given opportunity. Those pricks think it is their god given right to have all the best players in their team and they can treat them however the way they want. Fucking Real!

[BlueLyon 9,359]

Ronaldo and Messi completely ruined balon dor competition. Its all about goals now.

Or I should say the media and "fans" who dont see beyond goals.

Ronaldinho wasnt great goalscorer but he is among the best ever.

Eden could score 10 per season, as long he plays the way he plays now, he is one of finest players out there.

But media and "fans" wont see it unless he bangs 30 every season or joins real/barca. 

[Jase 43,479]

9 minutes ago, Mufassir08 said:

Although no player is greater than the club and this move has been on the cards for years now, it would still be heartbreaking to see Eden leave in his prime especially to those arrogant bastards who would boo him at the first given opportunity. Those pricks think it is their god given right to have all the best players in their team and they can treat them however the way they want. Fucking Real!

Yup...but if the latest quotes from his dad are right, then not sure how to feel that the only reason he'll stay is if Real don't bid for him. Makes this nothing more than a marriage of convenience. And it's these constant links and flirtation with Real that makes it kinda hard to get emotionally connected with Hazard, unlike with Terry, Lampard for instance. Will miss his quality and talent if he does leave but not sure if there's much else besides that.

[It's too big 625]

27 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

 

18 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

 

Two contrasting statements there. One says he sees himself at Real, the other says he's open to options and is waiting to extend contract. Hmm, this is why twitter is unreliable. 

[It's too big 625]

27 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

 

18 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

 

Two contrasting statements there. One says he sees himself at Real, the other says he's open to options and is waiting to extend contract. Hmm, this is why twitter is unreliable.