David Luiz

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

Not sure what is hypocritical, what I know is you are a poster that is saying Lampard should stay and you even insulted a poster days ago who said Lampard wasnt missed by the time he was injured. You are part of the group 2, perhaps, and the fact you are talking about Lampard here only proves it. Stats and more stats, and only a die hard Lampard's fan would say he was better than Luiz in that Aston Villa game. Only an idiot would say Luiz was shit in game that even the motm (Mata) had only a timid peformance, if Luiz was shit, so 80% of the team were.

No, Luiz was shit. Luiz performance in central midfield has nothing to do with Lampard for me. Lampard is likely gone and there is almost no way Luiz lasts in central midfield next year anyway. He's good as a defender, and he has a lot of problems in midfield.

And I insulted someone who made an idiotic comment about Lampard. One of the people on here who has no sense of history and treats Chelsea like their FIFA13 team There are plenty of people who don't think Lampard should be back, but to show no respect for him, to treat him like he's Boswingwa or Ben Haim, means you don't deserve respect.. And yes, Luiz was shit. And yes, Lampard was fantastic in the Villa game but he's not Brazilian so I doubt you'd notice.

@Sheva, but that's because Luiz was playing the Mikel role when Mikel went off. Lampard has never played that role so Lampard is always supposed to get forward. Early this year, he was probably making a run or two too many a game, but even his worst game being out of position, his positioning was much better than Luiz's yesterday. You can't complain about players A doing something then when Player B does it much worse, say it's good.

[Sheva. 5,373]

@Sheva, but that's because Luiz was playing the Mikel role when Mikel went off. Lampard has never played that role so Lampard is always supposed to get forward. Early this year, he was probably making a run or two too many a game, but even his worst game being out of position, his positioning was much better than Luiz's yesterday. You can't complain about players A doing something then when Player B does it much worse, say it's good.

And there is my point really. If he's instructed to play in the "Mikel role" then he will go forward less and there will be less discussion about his positioning.

He was asked to play a more forward role and perhaps went a bit more forward, but this is too be expected - this is the same player who leaves his CB position to join in the attack.

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

And there is my point really. If he's instructed to play in the "Mikel role" then he will go forward less and there will be less discussion about his positioning.

He was asked to play a more forward role and perhaps went a bit more forward, but this is too be expected - this is the same player who leaves his CB position to join in the attack.

I thought he was much better in the Mikel role to be honest. As I said, I don't think this means anything for his future. I don't think he's going to be a midfielder for us, but I don't want to really judge any player for at least 10 games at a position and a variety of different opponents both in quality and style. Maybe he'll be good next game, maybe he'll develop beautifully in the midfield, one game does not determine a players' fortune but he was poor this last one.

[JDY 1,290]

It's going too far saying he was 'shit' or had a 'terrible game'. The entire team didn't get into second gear, they didn't even need to. Norwich offered nothing going forward except the odd set piece. Their main threat was down the flanks and we defended that well with Cole & Azpil. At the end of the day we did what we needed to do and nothing more, anyone can look at the stats and form an opinion on a performance. Atleast apply a bit of common sense before doing so.

[Tomo 21,733]

"He isn't a midfielder."

Well he started his professional career as a midfielder... is currently playing as a midfielder...

He started his career as a midfielder but nearly got realized due to poor performances in that position.

I actually think Rafa has been clever putting him in against teams who won't attack us that much, but there was a reason he wasn't put there against Corinthians. CB is still is best position for me.

[JDY 1,290]

He started his career as a midfielder but nearly got realized due to poor performances in that position.

I actually think Rafa has been clever putting him in against teams who won't attack us that much, but there was a reason he wasn't put there against Corinthians. CB is still is best position for me.

Benítez started David Luiz in midfield against Monterrey in the Club World Cup semi-final but he moved him back to centre-half, where supporters have grown accustomed to seeing him, for the final against Corinthians. He said the reason was because it would have been too physically demanding to ask the 25-year-old to play twice in four days in midfield. His fitness programmes have been geared to his use at the back and Benítez and his staff feared he "would not have the same fresh legs and it would be more difficult" for him in midfield against Corinthians.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/dec/21/john-terry-david-luiz-midfield-chelsea

[BLionheart 516]

Tomo-91 is correct , i too think CB is his best position and he is our best CB.

However , he is still an upgrade over Mikel in midfield .

[killer1257 3,282]

Tomo-91 is correct , i too think CB is his best position and he is our best CB.

However , he is still an upgrade over Mikel in midfield .

He is one of the worst CB I have ever seen in my short life .He is nothing compared to Terry ,when he was in best form.In the pivot I can see that he has talent and he can become a world class midfielder,if he works on his skills.I am convinced that every team would have problems facing Luiz in midfield,because David is a good tackler,he can pass the ball very well and he is able to score.I can´t understand,why everyone is seeing him as a CB.Every game I saw a lot of stupid mistakes,when Luiz played as a CB.He is one of the reasons,why we lost against Corinthians and the other reason was Torres,but that isn´t the topic right now.

He has everything to be a good,maybe very good midfielder and i am sure that he can play against big teams there as well.The chance is higher to win with Luiz as a midfielder than as a CB against good teams.He always gives me headaches,when he plays with Cahill as a CB.

All in all,I think that Luiz is a terrible CB,because he runs too often forward and then loses the ball.Mourinho would have killed him,if he did that under him.Luiz is a player,who always wants to score goals and as a defender you should know that it is your task to defend .I love Luiz as a person,but I hate him,when he plays at CB.In the pivot he plays like a god,so in that position I love him too

Sorry for my english.I am still learning it in school,so don´t kill me,when I did some grammar mistakes or something like that

[Kojo 4,676]

Can we speak about Barry's tackling ability, how he gets bullied in the air, how his only way to recover the ball is to knock down the opponent with a late tackle?

WHAT THE?, IS THAT A LINE?, NO STATISTICS OR HUGE ANALYSIS?. Why i must say I'm surprised, and Barry is very average in those departments.

By the way please point out where i said Barry was good at that?, i was insisting on Barrys good work for the City team and the understanding he has. His technical abillities such as tackling especially isn't good. But he is clever for taking one for the team.

But shit i have just unleashed the Seb haven't i, NO PLEASE DON'T POST THE ALMIGHTY STATISTICS.

QUICK CHILDREN RUN, RUN FOR YOUR FUCKING LIVES.

[Kojo 4,676]

Seriously I think people make a meal of Ramires' so called average passing range. He's not Xavi or Modric but you should look at Dembele... both him and Ramires are really similar in their way to carry the ball up, penetrate, recover the ball, cover a lot of ground...

But be sure of one thing: Ramires' horizontal play is far better than most think, when we look at Dembele who often does the wrong choice: coming back to the closed side of the play, passing again in a dense zone whereas he should play to Sandro then let him pick the other side.

Ramires has the intelligence to play backwards and horizontally at times, given his usual box to box and vertical play that's rather outstanding.

That's not said enough in my opinion. Ramires really is underrated; not only his incredible creative eye at the end of his runs to give great last deliveries. But also his quality as a midfielder, his passing range given his main playing style.

Most of the average/good box to box can't vary as much as Ramires does, most rush their last deliveries because they think the hardest thing was to beat 3 opponents and that nobody will care about the last choice

Shit i knew it, from a line to this, it's only a matter of time.

[TrippingStep 336]

Seriously I think people make a meal of Ramires' so called average passing range. He's not Xavi or Modric but you should look at Dembele... both him and Ramires are really similar in their way to carry the ball up, penetrate, recover the ball, cover a lot of ground...

But be sure of one thing: Ramires' horizontal play is far better than most think, when we look at Dembele who often does the wrong choice: coming back to the closed side of the play, passing again in a dense zone whereas he should play to Sandro then let him pick the other side.

Ramires has the intelligence to play backwards and horizontally at times, given his usual box to box and vertical play that's rather outstanding.

That's not said enough in my opinion. Ramires really is underrated; not only his incredible creative eye at the end of his runs to give great last deliveries. But also his quality as a midfielder, his passing range given his main playing style.

Most of the average/good box to box can't vary as much as Ramires does, most rush their last deliveries because they think the hardest thing was to beat 3 opponents and that nobody will care about the last choice

For me Ramires and Dembele are not very similar.

They may cover a lot of ground but that's all. Ramires is excellent in counter-attacking, has more pace and can press quickly.

Dembele is stronger on the one on one challenge with his stronger body and the way he can hold the ball.

But I'm not a big fan of Dembele and our midfield in national team. All superb ball-holder with Witsel, Dembele, great ball tackler but no pace going forward. All resulting in passing the ball horizontally in front of the box, no space for speedier and trickier player to drive and causing more havoc in the opposing defence.

But it must be said that our coach is not very experienced lol. Our gameplan seems like the out-dated german way of playing when there was many one on one all over the pitch. We were a bit lucky against Serbia when they out-numbered us and combined quickly on the side as there is chaos when one player is beaten.

A mix of old-school german and british with a heavy focus on powerplay. The "wingers" starting the matches having often very average game with our bad fullback, slow buidl-up play of central midfield and are often isolated if they stay wide, only option being a cross with all the players already around the box with not many movements.

[Madmax 9,219]

WHAT THE?, IS THAT A LINE?, NO STATISTICS OR HUGE ANALYSIS?. Why i must say I'm surprised, and Barry is very average in those departments.

By the way please point out where i said Barry was good at that?, i was insisting on Barrys good work for the City team and the understanding he has. His technical abillities such as tackling especially isn't good. But he is clever for taking one for the team.

But shit i have just unleashed the Seb haven't i, NO PLEASE DON'T POST THE ALMIGHTY STATISTICS.

QUICK CHILDREN RUN, RUN FOR YOUR FUCKING LIVES.

This made me laugh, haha.

I need to get out more.

[DDA 9,690]

Don't read it then. No one is forcing you to. We're just voicing our opinions (what a form is for).

I know what a forum is for you doughnut.. and in the same sense that also means I can voice my opinions. Think before you speak in future, you can come accross as rather contradicting when opposing my post.

[Kojo 4,676]

This made me laugh, haha.

I need to get out more.

I don't care what you think Max, what matters is, is that i love you.

[Muzchap 8,966]

This whole positioning argument...

Someone show me the 'blueprint' for success - show me that if Luiz had been in position X instead of Y we would have done ABC

Luiz was closing down higher up the pitch and stopped Norwich passing as much, relying on longer balls or putting themselves under pressure - when was the last time we had a player do that!!!

I don't buy it - I don't buy he's as bad as some of you make out, he's dominating the midfield and doing everything he can to get the ball back... He created at least 1 goal scoring opportunity - I'm sure there was a second too!

Ok his shots were very wayward, but it shows confidence and if one had crept in, people's reactions would be so different.

Can we just agree to hold the 'venom' for a little while and give him at least 10 games

[BlueLion. 21,491]

It's sensible. You play the dynamic, attacking 'defensive' midfielder against the shit teams. You then have an extra attacker and are bound to win handsomely. Just like what happened against Villa.

Then you play the defensive midfielder in the big games against the good teams, where you need positional discipline.

Ergo, against the Villas of this world we'll see Luiz in midfield. When Manchester United come knocking, he can warm the bench and Mikel can have a game.

[The Skipper 20,593]

It's sensible. You play the dynamic, attacking 'defensive' midfielder against the shit teams. You then have an extra attacker and are bound to win handsomely. Just like what happened against Villa.

Then you play the defensive midfielder in the big games against the good teams, where you need positional discipline.

Ergo, against the Villas of this world we'll see Luiz in midfield. When Manchester United come knocking, he can warm the bench and Mikel can have a game.

Or you could play him CB. Just because he's had a few good games in the pivot doesn't mean he's now useless as a CB.

[BlueLion. 21,491]

Please quote me when I said he is useless as a centre-back.

For the record, he's useless as a centre-back. Ivanovic and Cahill are our best pairing.