Man City 1-0 Chelsea

[ZAPHOD2319 3,882]

PRE/POST-MATCH DISCUSSION, LIVE CHAT AND ANALYSIS

Saturday 20th April 2024
FA Cup
Wembley Stadium
5:15pm UK

[NikkiCFC 7,595]

They play Madrid tomorrow night, maybe even overtime. High intensity game... Pep will rotate a bit... Make a use of this situation. 

[Fulham Broadway 16,410]

Play like we did last night and all will be fine

[robsblubot 3,247]

1 hour ago, Fulham Broadway said:

Play like we did last night and all will be fine

Heh, except that we played like we did last night *because* of the opposition, so this will be a VERY different endeavor.

We will need to play a hell lot better than we did yesterday to get anything out of this. We will need a very special game and rely on them being disinterested enough to have a poor game.

[Fulham Broadway 16,410]

5 minutes ago, robsblubot said:

Heh, except that we played like we did last night *because* of the opposition, so this will be a VERY different endeavor.

We will need to play a hell lot better than we did yesterday to get anything out of this. We will need a very special game and rely on them being disinterested enough to have a poor game.

Pretty certain they wont be disinterested, but playing as we did last night *regardless* of the opposition we will prevail. Outstanding performance all round.

Being Chels, things will doubtless get pear shaped

[robsblubot 3,247]

1 hour ago, Fulham Broadway said:

Pretty certain they wont be disinterested, but playing as we did last night *regardless* of the opposition we will prevail. Outstanding performance all round.

Being Chels, things will doubtless get pear shaped

Agreed with the first part as Pep is a master of that.
100% disagree with the latter: in my view the opposition is literally everything in a football match. Otherwise the standings wouldn't make sense; nor would the money involved at this level. We are underdogs and City is the clear favorite every time they will play us.

What the opposition does, or does not do, directly determines what your team can do. There is a lot of nuance to that tho, like even stronger teams can be easier or harder to face depending on the style in which we play, as well as tactics.

However! It is still a single game though, which means shit can happen, and it's more likely we can pull off an upset.

I actually think we weren't that great in the first few minutes against Everton losing a lot of 50/50s and conceding set pieces until Cole started nut megging players, and finally scoring. That changed their demeanor because they could not contain Cole.

[Fulham Broadway 16,410]

33 minutes ago, robsblubot said:

Agreed with the first part as Pep is a master of that.
100% disagree with the latter: in my view the opposition is literally everything in a football match. Otherwise the standings wouldn't make sense; nor would the money involved at this level. We are underdogs and City is the clear favorite every time they will play us.

What the opposition does, or does not do, directly determines what your team can do. There is a lot of nuance to that tho, like even stronger teams can be easier or harder to face depending on the style in which we play, as well as tactics.

However! It is still a single game though, which means shit can happen, and it's more likely we can pull off an upset.

I actually think we weren't that great in the first few minutes against Everton losing a lot of 50/50s and conceding set pieces until Cole started nut megging players, and finally scoring. That changed their demeanor because they could not contain Cole.

Disagree, apart from Citeh will be a totally different ball game. End of the day you can only beat whats in front of you, last night we had a great mentality - ie we will score more than the opposition, and attack is the best form of defence. I honestly believe we would have beaten anyone. Question is can we keep up the momentum....

[robsblubot 3,247]

30 minutes ago, Fulham Broadway said:

Disagree, apart from Citeh will be a totally different ball game. End of the day you can only beat whats in front of you, last night we had a great mentality - ie we will score more than the opposition, and attack is the best form of defence. I honestly believe we would have beaten anyone. Question is can we keep up the momentum....

It's a bit reductionist to think mentality is all there is.
I think the fortunes the elite clubs spend chasing skill actually proves mentality isn't everything.

Regarding our side you obviously see a lot more quality in players I consider completely insufficient. I can't imagine the likes of Madueke and Mudryk playing a big part in beating any good team. The best teams like City have a lot better players in their positions (that includes Jackson). Speaking of which, Mudryk had a pretty poor game despite the poor opposition.
 

[Fulham Broadway 16,410]

7 minutes ago, robsblubot said:

It's a bit reductionist to think mentality is all there is.
I think the fortunes the elite clubs spend chasing skill actually proves mentality isn't everything.

Regarding our side you obviously see a lot more quality in players I consider completely insufficient. I can't imagine the likes of Madueke and Mudryk playing a big part in beating any good team. The best teams like City have a lot better players in their positions (that includes Jackson). Speaking of which, Mudryk had a pretty poor game despite the poor opposition.
 

To me it is very simplistic to say ''the opposition is literally everything in football''. What you do as a team has a huge bearing on the result.

[Laylabelle 9,304]

We have a chance...if make the final however....less likely to win.. 

Drawn with them twice...we are oddly capable of sometimes getting surprising results in a good way..not too often but be nice

[robsblubot 3,247]

4 minutes ago, Fulham Broadway said:

To me it is very simplistic to say ''the opposition is literally everything in football''. What you do as a team has a huge bearing on the result.

Hmm the quality of the opposition involves a lot of different aspects: mentality, skill, tactical, fitness... while mentality only involves mentality. Often strong fitness levels can be perceived as strong mentality: easier to win 50/50s if you get to the ball first.

Standings prove that the opposition is everything in football. As does the usual group of quarter-finalists in every CL. Not very different in the WC with a select group. It's the same clubs/countries with different teams. 

How would you rate the chances of a lower division side that wins every match in their division (strong mentality) when playing against City? Don't we see that in the cups often? Aside from that rare upset here and there, the big teams usually go through.

[Fulham Broadway 16,410]

24 minutes ago, robsblubot said:

Hmm the quality of the opposition involves a lot of different aspects: mentality, skill, tactical, fitness... while mentality only involves mentality. Often strong fitness levels can be perceived as strong mentality: easier to win 50/50s if you get to the ball first.

But to say that everything depends on the opposition seems quite naive. Imagine a boxer going into the ring with that mindset.

 

24 minutes ago, robsblubot said:

Standings prove that the opposition is everything in football

That doesnt seem to be true, surely the protagonist has a bearing on standings, not just how the opposition performs.

Bottom line, our team isnt 'lower league' we have a lot of quality, I am doubling down on my original assertion, that if we play the way we played last night (maybe without the bickering over the penalty 😃) we will beat them. But it depends which Chelsea turns up

 

[robsblubot 3,247]

51 minutes ago, Fulham Broadway said:

But to say that everything depends opposition seems quite naive. Imagine a boxer going into the ring with that mindset.

 

That doesnt seem to be true, surely the protagonist has a bearing on standings, not just how the opposition performs.

Bottom line, our team isnt 'lower league' we have a lot of quality, I am doubling down on my original assertion, that if we play the way we played last night (maybe without the bickering over the penalty 😃) we will beat them. But it depends which Chelsea turns up

 

I think exactly the opposite: considering the opposition is the most realistic take one can have. After all, it's 11 players on each side of the pitch, so the opposition represents at least half of the equation.

A random good player, with strong mentality, playing Djokovic would still be a huge underdog. Because Novak is just better than everyone else, which is why he is #1.
The best Chelsea turn up against an average City and they would still be the favs IMO. Even their bench is a lot stronger than ours, so if they need to tweak something during the match, they are more likely to get something out of it than we do. Freaking Kova is a bench warmer for them! 

Sorry, I see us as huge underdogs for this one. Even more so than against Liverpool (due to their absences).

Edited April 16 by robsblubot

[Fulham Broadway 16,410]

8 hours ago, robsblubot said:

it's 11 players on each side of the pitch, so the opposition represents at least half of the equation.

Yes, my point exactly. No way is it ''the opposition is literally everything'' 👍

[robsblubot 3,247]

1 hour ago, Fulham Broadway said:

Yes, my point exactly. No way is it ''the opposition is literally everything'' 👍

Agreed to disagree here then esp when the opposition happens to be one of the best teams in the world--their performance kinda matters (a lot) more than ours IMO.

That's also why I don't read too much into the Everton game; it's a championship and we played the big expensive teams as well as the shitty teams. The standings show what they show.

back to this game, contrary to the Everton match, when our players had a. lot of time on the ball, City are master pressers. We've got to move the ball a bit faster or they will steal it from us. While I don't see how we aren't going for a low block, I also don't want us pinned in our own half for 90 freaking minutes.

[Reddish-Blue 2,226]

11 hours ago, Laylabelle said:

Drawn with them twice...we are oddly capable of sometimes getting surprising results in a good way..not too often but be nice

I think if City want it badly enough, they will take the game out of our hands.   

It really is a shame that we had momentum in the other cup leading up to the final and then we couldn't get over the line and just played into Klopp's farewell tour. 

[lluubbeenn 117]

City will be up for this. There are two options:

1 - They beat Real and are on for the treble

2 - They lose to Real and are out for revenge

It will be a huge achievement to knock them out and make the final. Winning the Fa cup will make this season a success in my eyes. COYB! 

[Magic Lamps 11,457]

5 hours ago, Reddish-Blue said:

I think if City want it badly enough, they will take the game out of our hands.   

It really is a shame that we had momentum in the other cup leading up to the final and then we couldn't get over the line and just played into Klopp's farewell tour. 

This is why I don’t think this squad has it in them to get it over the line when it matters. Lost their head vs Arsenal after being 2 up and dominating the game, lost a 2 nil lead vs a poor Manure side after completely outplaying them. On both occasions the assist to the first goal they got back came from a Chelsea player . In the league cup final we had 4 golden chances to put it to bed and fluffed the lines. This team is afraid of winning. Even if we somehow make it past city I am 100% sure we will cave vs Manure in the final.