🇳🇱 Ian Maatsen

[robsblubot 3,595]

52 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

Suppose people will be saying we should recall him for first 11 and sign Sancho in the summer if Dortmund score finishes this way 🙄 

no, that's not the point. The point is where the bar is with Mudryk on the wing. The point is that given our lack of options on the left (LB and WL) how on earth wasn't Poch able to use Maatsen? 

Chilwell hasn't even been fit long enough to play adequately.

Regarding Sancho, I'm the one who used him as an example to warn folks about projecting performances from different leagues and countries when these players move to the PL. He was terrible at United. On the other hand, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if he does better in a second spell in the PL.

 

Edited May 1, 2024 by robsblubot

[MoroccanBlue 5,383]

We don't know how good these players are until they actually play regularly and in a settled system. 

 

[robsblubot 3,595]

12 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

We don't know how good these players are until they actually play regularly and in a settled system. 

 

true.
And on top of that there is the which system, which is specially important when you are analyzing quirky players who are really strong in some aspects and not so much in others.

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

1 hour ago, lucio said:

both shit on chilwell and mudryk lets be real

Sure Maatsen who has never actually played properly in the PL shits on Chilwell who over the past 5 seasons has probably been one of the best fullbacks in the PL.

He hasn’t got a future here and in 2 or 3 seasons I don’t expect anyone to give a shit when he hits Tammy Abraham levels of decent career but not elite level. Because thats where he will be.

Mudryk is awful most players in his position could be named are better than him. Only signed him because Arsenal wanted him - nothing will change my mind on that.

1 hour ago, robsblubot said:

no, that's not the point. The point is where the bar is with Mudryk on the wing. The point is that given our lack of options on the left (LB and WL) how on earth wasn't Poch able to use Maatsen? 

Given how Poch has played virtually everyone, including players who have struggled immensely for consistency and performances, the likes of him, Washington and a few others haven’t. I really think that speaks volumes about how good he actually is, or isn’t.

Don’t get me wrong, a CL run with Dortmund means more £ for us and that is ultimately why we will be selling him. He has basically no chance of being involved here given he couldn’t make any real inroads in the first half of the season with Poch and we desperately need to raise funds. 

Edited May 1, 2024 by OneMoSalah

[robsblubot 3,595]

1 hour ago, OneMoSalah said:

Sure Maatsen who has never actually played properly in the PL shits on Chilwell who over the past 5 seasons has probably been one of the best fullbacks in the PL.

He hasn’t got a future here and in 2 or 3 seasons I don’t expect anyone to give a shit when he hits Tammy Abraham levels of decent career but not elite level. Because thats where he will be.

Mudryk is awful most players in his position could be named are better than him. Only signed him because Arsenal wanted him - nothing will change my mind on that.

Given how Poch has played virtually everyone, including players who have struggled immensely for consistency and performances, the likes of him, Washington and a few others haven’t. I really think that speaks volumes about how good he actually is, or isn’t.

Don’t get me wrong, a CL run with Dortmund means more £ for us and that is ultimately why we will be selling him. He has basically no chance of being involved here given he couldn’t make any real inroads in the first half of the season with Poch and we desperately need to raise funds. 

That's presuming Poch and the coaches are right in assessing both (the few) available players on the left and Maatsen. I don't share that trust tbh.

I understand the situation, and agree that that's likely the outcome, and not a terrible one. I wish the club were not in this situation tho; I'd rather see more of Maatsen and then decide, like we did with Tammy -- who would've been able to help in this freaking season given the lack of options.

I agree that Chilwell is a very good player and a competent LB, but he's been struggling with form for a while now, and that has to be taken into account when considering options. He hardly played this season and wasn't great when he did.

[lucio 5,418]

8 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

Sure Maatsen who has never actually played properly in the PL shits on Chilwell who over the past 5 seasons has probably been one of the best fullbacks in the PL.

He hasn’t got a future here and in 2 or 3 seasons I don’t expect anyone to give a shit when he hits Tammy Abraham levels of decent career but not elite level. Because thats where he will be.

Mudryk is awful most players in his position could be named are better than him. Only signed him because Arsenal wanted him - nothing will change my mind on that.

Given how Poch has played virtually everyone, including players who have struggled immensely for consistency and performances, the likes of him, Washington and a few others haven’t. I really think that speaks volumes about how good he actually is, or isn’t.

Don’t get me wrong, a CL run with Dortmund means more £ for us and that is ultimately why we will be selling him. He has basically no chance of being involved here given he couldn’t make any real inroads in the first half of the season with Poch and we desperately need to raise funds. 

0 chance Dortmund would rather have chilwell stumbling down the left , cutting back to make a basic pass. He’s a nothing player , no pace or invention, if he was foreign he’d be playing for Leicester still

[King Kante 1,643]

13 hours ago, robsblubot said:

no, that's not the point. The point is where the bar is with Mudryk on the wing. The point is that given our lack of options on the left (LB and WL) how on earth wasn't Poch able to use Maatsen? 

Chilwell hasn't even been fit long enough to play adequately.

Regarding Sancho, I'm the one who used him as an example to warn folks about projecting performances from different leagues and countries when these players move to the PL. He was terrible at United. On the other hand, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if he does better in a second spell in the PL.

 

My theory has been that the owners weren't happy with his decision to decline Burnley and told Poch to isolate him/restrict his minutes so they could get him out in January. His Father's comments also indicate this imo. 

[Reddish-Blue 2,509]

12 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

He hasn’t got a future here and in 2 or 3 seasons I don’t expect anyone to give a shit when he hits Tammy Abraham levels of decent career but not elite level. Because thats where he will be.

"Tammy Abraham levels"....almost like Tammy Abraham isn't better than our current attack combined (exception being Palmer). 

12 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

Given how Poch has played virtually everyone, including players who have struggled immensely for consistency and performances, the likes of him, Washington and a few others haven’t. I really think that speaks volumes about how good he actually is, or isn’t.

You say that but just because a player isn't picked doesn't mean they aren't good enough for the side.  If Mudryk, Cucurella among others were bought for their actual market value, they would probably be bench players at Chelsea but the price tag will always give them additional chances to show their worth. 

Also in Maatsen's case, he did decline that move to Burnley at the end of the window when the owners were actively shopping any player in the name of FFP Profit (Chalobah was as good as gone till they realised he was injured). 

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

20 hours ago, robsblubot said:

That's presuming Poch and the coaches are right in assessing both (the few) available players on the left and Maatsen. I don't share that trust tbh.

I understand the situation, and agree that that's likely the outcome, and not a terrible one. I wish the club were not in this situation tho; I'd rather see more of Maatsen and then decide, like we did with Tammy -- who would've been able to help in this freaking season given the lack of options.

I agree that Chilwell is a very good player and a competent LB, but he's been struggling with form for a while now, and that has to be taken into account when considering options. He hardly played this season and wasn't great when he did.

Chilwell has struggled for fitness. But so has Reece James on the otherside also. Two of our best players missing on a regular basis. 

9 hours ago, Reddish-Blue said:

"Tammy Abraham levels"....almost like Tammy Abraham isn't better than our current attack combined (exception being Palmer). 

You say that but just because a player isn't picked doesn't mean they aren't good enough for the side.  If Mudryk, Cucurella among others were bought for their actual market value, they would probably be bench players at Chelsea but the price tag will always give them additional chances to show their worth. 

Also in Maatsen's case, he did decline that move to Burnley at the end of the window when the owners were actively shopping any player in the name of FFP Profit (Chalobah was as good as gone till they realised he was injured). 

Maybe Tammy would be useful as a number 2. But thats it. Which is why he left here because he didn’t want to be a number 2. Now he’d maybe play every week but not the level of player you want as a number 1 if your looking to be ultra competitive.

But people banging on about Maatsen as if he’s much better than Ben and Cucu are dreaming.

Even tonight Cucurella tonight showed he can play very well at a high level. I mean needs to do it consistently though absolutely. Price tag is what it is.

13 hours ago, lucio said:

0 chance Dortmund would rather have chilwell stumbling down the left , cutting back to make a basic pass. He’s a nothing player , no pace or invention, if he was foreign he’d be playing for Leicester still

Sure and when him and Reece were absolutely flying for us under Tuchel you probably said he was the best left back on the planet…..

10 hours ago, King Kante said:

My theory has been that the owners weren't happy with his decision to decline Burnley and told Poch to isolate him/restrict his minutes so they could get him out in January. His Father's comments also indicate this imo. 

Maybe.

I do think if he was as good as people make out though Poch would have used him much much more than he did. And in his actual position. Particularly given the fact Ben’s struggled with injury/form all season and Cucurella has been inconsistent since arriving.

 

Edited May 2, 2024 by OneMoSalah

[NikkiCFC 8,325]

Maatsen played a lot in pre season and had goals and assists which makes it weirder. So theory about failed move could be right. 

[MoroccanBlue 5,383]

Owners wanted Gallagher out since January of last year despite 2 managers constantly playing him. 

I don't believe that rumor. 

[Reddish-Blue 2,509]

13 hours ago, MoroccanBlue said:

Owners wanted Gallagher out since January of last year despite 2 managers constantly playing him. 

I don't believe that rumor. 

If the offer was high enough for Gallagher, he probably wouldn't be here either.

[MoroccanBlue 5,383]

1 hour ago, Reddish-Blue said:

If the offer was high enough for Gallagher, he probably wouldn't be here either.

Didn't they accept Everton's offer Jan of last year and Gallagher refused?

[ZAPHOD2319 4,819]

 

[King Kante 1,643]

30 minutes ago, ZAPHOD2319 said:

 

Has worked out for us. Nearly went for £32m in Summer, now we have £2m loan fee and a £35m transfer that is highly likely. 

Tbh, he has played well for Dortmund but if the fee was £45m I don't think there would be many takers. The really annoying thing with him is that Poch in the early part of the season should've had us set up in a 343 as he could've played a WB role. How Poch didn't see that is what winds me up about him. Although, tbf, I do think IM may have been black balled to some extent due to the club wanting the FFP money. 

[MoroccanBlue 5,383]

He would break Dortmund's transfer record if they trigger it. They are going to be asking to pay much less. 

Hopefully Bayern come knocking to replace Davies with him. 

[Magic Lamps 11,692]

BVB are apparently unable or rather unwilling to pay the 40m euros RC. Instead they want to lowball us. Should not budge but it is the players wish to stay there. I know what Marina would have done …

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

44 minutes ago, Magic Lamps said:

BVB are apparently unable or rather unwilling to pay the 40m euros RC. Instead they want to lowball us. Should not budge but it is the players wish to stay there. I know what Marina would have done …

We will accept a lower bid just to get cash for him. But yeah knew they would lowball us. 

[Magic Lamps 11,692]

54 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

We will accept a lower bid just to get cash for him. But yeah knew they would lowball us. 

It’s stupid tho. The player is supposedly useful and surely should find someone who pays up. Pretty sure BVB would eventually cough up the money anyway  if we insist on it but clownlake is clueless 

[OneMoSalah 8,886]

2 hours ago, Magic Lamps said:

It’s stupid tho. The player is supposedly useful and surely should find someone who pays up. Pretty sure BVB would eventually cough up the money anyway  if we insist on it but clownlake is clueless 

Its pure profit regardless so if it’s 20-25m euros I’d think we will take it. I don’t think hes particularly excelled over in Germany either (despite the usual player X goes on loan, has 2 or 3 good games and everyone complains “why didn’t he get used here!?”) so they have probably got the advantage knowing we already tried offloading him in the summer.

Edited May 24, 2024 by OneMoSalah